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Posted: 10/23/2002 12:48:37 PM EDT
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Can this be done, and if so, what must be removed and replaced? Also, anyone ever try modifying STEN mags to be used in a Colt system? Thanks! |
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I'll take a "stab" at this one,,,,,,remove the Oly upper and replace it w/ a Colt style upper... Probably not the answer your looking for, but I tried. As to the modify the Sten mag for the Colt system, start at the top of the page with the "tack" and over 100 views. There was another thread (don't recall) that blurbed off into a photo album that had 3 fellas different workings of the Colt style block to accept Sten mags. I copied select photos to disc from fellas' album. They say it works like a charm.. just involves machining a $150+/- part. |
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The Oly bolt carrier group, barrel and ejector group will have to be replaced with the colt equivalent parts. You also will need buy and install a colt mag adapter. Since you would be using a colt carrier group you would have to install the modified hammer. BTW, after you remove the ejector group you will have holes in your upper. No biggie, but they will be noticeable. There is a way to make your Oly work like a colt, but you might as well buy a colt system cause the cost is about the same to buy it as it is to modify the Oly system. |
What if I replaced just the Oly bolt carrier with a Colt carrier--but keeping the Oly bolt--and the Oly ejector with the Colt one (which IIRC is part of the mag block)? Would that work? (I'd also modify the Colt mag block to use STEN mags like few guys on this board have done.)
OK, got it on that one. Just doing some prelim thinking right now, trying to figure out what would work and what would not. If I had a Colt-style upper next to my Oly one, it'd take me just a few minutes to figure it out. Bit tougher sans the one upper. Thanks! |
First off, I'm not sure if the colt style bolt is two piece. If you can insert the oly bolt into the colt carrier, you would have to machine the oly bolt to align and function with the colt style ejector. Since you already have an Oly, here's my idea which allows the use of the standard mag catch with sten mags. I have long since bolted my SOCOM block into the lower. This works out great cause the block wont accidently drop out and I can use the cheap stens. Next I'm going to have the SOCOM chopped off flush with the mag well[and beveled for positive insertion], and a new 1/2 inch longer mag catch fabricated and installed in my lower. After that is done, all I will have to do is notch my stens and I will have a dedicated 9mm lower that works like a colt. Since I'm leaving the Oly ejector group alone, I can still use the 9mm upper on another lower. All I have to do is use the few $65 Oly mags I have. Even the newly dedicated lower can be converted back for use with a .223 upper; just unscrew the modified SOCOM(or filler block) and replace the elongated mag catch with a standard mag catch. It may look ugly but it would work in a pinch. The great thing about this conversion is you wont have to monkey with making the two piece mag block work. All you have to do with the SOCOM(or filler block) is put it in, make sure it's where you want it, drill and tap it then screw it in. No feed ramps to mess with or tune, etc. The Oly is already feed tuned because it is set up to run with the magazine in the forward part of the mag well. What'd ya think? Edited to add: In your case you wont need a SOCOM, just have the machine shop that's doing the work make a filler block for you. If I had known I was going to do this I wouldn't have gotten the SOCOM block, yet without it I wouldn't have gotten this idea(that's how I justify butchering it up!  )Price comparisons: Total cost out of my pocket is $60 for the SOCOM, plus $100 to have the rest done. Notching all my stens is another cost, but I have yet to get that job price quoted. For us present Oly owners, thats $550 for the upper, plus $200 for the modification. That's $750 total. With 30 sten mags at $4 each thats another $120. Thats $870 total. In contrast, an RRA Colt style upper with mag block and a few used uzi mags (15 used un-notched 25rd uzi's at $11ea.) is $675 total. Thats $195 shy of this modified Oly set up. Man this is a pricey hobby, BUT I LOVE IT! 
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Yep, I found a picture of the Colt bolt carriers last night, and I know what you are saying. I'd have to actually examine one to tell, but it does look like it doesn't even use a conventional style bolt in the carrier, let alone something like what Oly makes.
Great idea! I just looked at my setup, and I can see how that would probably work just fine. The only possible issue that might come up is that the new longer mag catch may not push out enough to release the STEN mag. But that probably could be tweaked to work right.
Yes, I can see what you are talking about. But I gotta say, at least in my setup, I'm not sure I'd want to cut a hole in my lower. I have my 9mm upper on a very nice Pre-Ban Oly lower that was not cheap. I don't think I'd want to put a hole in it.
Yes, it would not be too work intensive, provided you don't mind grinding on your lower. Now, related to what you just said above, here's something I was looking at last night that may work as well. What do you think about installing a Colt-style (two-piece) mag block (with all the required tweaking you mentioned) in the lower and use it with the Oly upper? I was doing some measurements, and it looks like a STEN mag inserted into the modified two-piece block would just barely clear the cross bar that holds the Oly ejector, especially if all thickness modifications to the block are done only to the front block. What'd ya think about that? |
A few counter-clock wise turns will extend the mag release button for a more positive disengagement.
I don't blame you! This is definitely a post-ban lower project.
The only problem I can foresee is the blocks feed ramp being non-compatible with the Oly bolt face. I think the feed ramp can be detached from the block and a new one created to work, but I'd have to have one to see. Yes, the Oly will feed from a sten in the center of the mag well with no problem. The ejector folds down nicely next to[but not touching] the sten feed lips! I think your on to something with this!  We just need to know if the Oly bolt will work with the feed ramp! BTW, do you have any measurements for the basic dimensions of the block pieces? Edited to add: I'm just not familiar with the colt style block. Is the bolt group suppose to pass over the top of the feed ramp altogether, or through? If it passes over, then we have a winner! How's the retention on those blocks I wonder? I'm looking at it here. Even if the tip of the Oly ejector hits the top of the sten(it CLOSE) when it folds down, a deeper trough can be made in the under side of the bolt for it to travel in. |
There is a whole butt-load of discussion of Colt block dimensions in one of the permanent threads at the top of the line. I think it's the thread titled something like "Magazine Block" or some such title. Check inside: there are measurements and links to great pictures. In fact, it was that whole discussion thread that got me to thinkin' about this new STEN placement idea. Check it out and lemme know what you think. I looked at my mag catch and your longer catch idea is quite workable. In fact, you could do it for pretty cheap. Buy two mag catches ($5) and have a machinist cut one and add some from the other one to it, weld it back together, buff it down even, finish, and your'e all set. But, as you said, definitely a Pre-ban project. |
Boom, this could be the rub. I got this little tidbit off Kurt's Website. During a discussion of possible .45ACP mags, Kurt said this:
So, my concern over this info is that there may be feeding problems (or impossibilities) regarding the distance the cartridge would have to travel to the chamber once it is picked up by the bolt. The distance is only what?, 1/2 inch or maybe a bit more, but it may cause it to not work. I've e-mailed Kurt for his opinion. Hmm...thinking your long catch idea might be the easiest way to go, at least with a post-ban beater receiver. |
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Yeah, Kurts indicating that the barrel extension has everything to do with mag placement. Since Oly's barrel extension functions as the feed ramp, the 2pc block would be incompatible and cost inefficient to incorporate. I'm going to go ahead and have the SOCOM and mag catch modifications made to my lower. I'll post some pictures when I get it back! |
Spot on. Kurt posted this today on his discussion board:
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I'll be really interested to see your results! I'll be especially interested in what sort of a mag catch you come up with.  You know, Kurt is in the middle of designing his own block that would somehow utilize the AR mag catch with STEN mags in an Oly upper. He's not sure when it will be done, though.  |
That will be interesting to see! He's definitely going to have to cross the barrier to dedicated lower. I cant wait for Kurt to put out that dedicated .45 lower. He and Cav Arms have been tinkering and talking about it, but neither have announced as to what mags or uppers(theirs or Olys) they will design their lower around. Kinda frustrating, but by the time they commit to the project I'll be ready to buy. I just wish I knew for certain what mags he is going to use. That way I can get ahead by buying some up!  |
I have my own .45ACP project in the works as well. When I have enough $$ saved up (probably by December), I'll be moving on it. This is a work in progress, so I'm not sure what direction I'll go as far as mags. But, I know it will be a dedicated lower topped with an Oly upper, and your 1/2" longer mag catch idea will most likely be present as well. More on the top-secret .45 project as it develops!  |
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