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Posted: 4/26/2014 7:40:43 AM EDT
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I finally received my Nodak XM16EI lower yesterday and spent the morning putting everything together. Hope to get outside and shoot later today or tomorrow.
Overall, I lost my excitement over the Nodak. Not really disappointed but not excited about it after the build First off, I was expecting a closer color match to the upper I had. It looks OK outdoors in the direct sun but inside or in the shade you can see a BIG difference. Same with the charging handle. I'm wondering if a Scotch Brite will help with that? Next, the buffer retainer I had in a parts kit would not fit in the Nodak. First time I've had a buffer retainer not fit. I robbed a retainer off another rifle and it fit fine. The retainer that would not fit in the Nodak worked just fine in the other rifle. Odd. The take down pins are about the hardest to release I've ever had. The pins slide freely in the receiver but the detents don't seem to want to release. Those last two issues could be parts kit issues. It's been so long since I ordered the parts kit, I don't remember where I got it from. I was going for the worn look so everything but the lower receiver and charging handle have a nice worn finish.....because they are well used of course. I've got to work on getting the lower and charging handle to match. Suggestions? 
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I finally received my Nodak XM16EI lower yesterday and spent the morning putting everything together. Hope to get outside and shoot later today or tomorrow. Overall, I lost my excitement over the Nodak. Not really disappointed but not excited about it after the build First off, I was expecting a closer color match to the upper I had. It looks OK outdoors in the direct sun but inside or in the shade you can see a BIG difference. Same with the charging handle. I'm wondering if a Scotch Brite will help with that? Next, the buffer retainer I had in a parts kit would not fit in the Nodak. First time I've had a buffer retainer not fit. I robbed a retainer off another rifle and it fit fine. The retainer that would not fit in the Nodak worked just fine in the other rifle. Odd. The take down pins are about the hardest to release I've ever had. The pins slide freely in the receiver but the detents don't seem to want to release. Those last two issues could be parts kit issues. It's been so long since I ordered the parts kit, I don't remember where I got it from. I was going for the worn look so everything but the lower receiver and charging handle have a nice worn finish.....because they are well used of course. I've got to work on getting the lower and charging handle to match. Suggestions? http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f240/drail14me/393013b9-2544-4587-94d1-fa77b6196454.jpg http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f240/drail14me/21e9ab3b-f2e9-4091-a594-d72f9bd7d241.jpg http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f240/drail14me/90630978-d917-4aa1-a95e-ada67b918335.jpg I'll gladly take it off your hands! 
The pins will loosen up with use. The color difference is not a big deal. Look at the Real Deal thread. Light over dark. Dark over light. Think the Big Green Weenie cared? Seriously I'll give you two bills for it plus shipping right now! What's your PPal address? 
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| Looks great! Most of what you describe sounds like the parts kit from what I've seen. I've had these type of issues that followed the part kit between lowers. They work great in one lower, like shit in the other. Normally after break in they work anywhere. BTW, I don't own a NoDak lower yet... |
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Something that may not be discussed here often enough is that we talk about "XM Gray" as if it's an actual color on a Pantone color wheel.
It is not. I guarantee that whatever dyes or chemicals Colt was using in their anodizing process in the '60's changed at least a little from batch to batch. Then take those parts and send some to a police station where they'll spend most of their life in a storage rack, others to Vietnam where they'll be bled on, and still others to an AF base to get bleached in the Texas sun, and over the next, oh, half-century of handling and cleanings, we have to accept that they are NOT all one color. So when NDS sells a lower in "XM Gray," the best we can expect is that the color will be "appropriate" for a retro rifle of that period--not an actual match. Fortunately, as others have said, we don't need a perfect color match to build a "correct" clone. The original rifles commonly had color differences between the upper and lower. Looking at yours (nice rifle, by the way!), I think the colors are actually quite good! The bigger difference is the textures and wear. One piece is brand new and the other has been handled for decades. Soak 'em good in CLP and shoot the heck out of the thing. The lower will start to pick up minor scratches and wear and before long it'll look like the ones in the Real deal photos. Much more important to getting the "right" look will be replacing the selector switch with a "no-tic" and finding a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Other than those little details, she's looking good !! Oh, and if anyone really IS focused on an exact color match, the easiest solution is to but both the upper and lower from Nodak. Nodak-to-Nodak will be much closer than Nodak-to-Fifty-Year-Old-Colt. The other option (more expensive and time consuming) is to send the upper and lower to US Anodizing and pay them to match the color. But again, that's more important to a wall-hanger than to an "authentic" looking clone. OP, congrats on the new build! We'll be waiting for the range report! |
| OP, very nice 604 build. As stated letting some CLP sit on the two pieces together will help with the blend but I think I'd concentrate on getting the upper a little darker. Appears to have been brake cleaned or such. Colt battle rifles never matched because they weren't done together at same time and they really didn't care. All that mattered was it met milspec repeatedly. Color matching is a civillian weapon thing but becomes more important when one considers the coins and effort to complete a clone build. You have a couple parts that actually don't blend and a little finess / wear can help if not interested in spending more coins. Scotchbrite comes to mind or a light fine wet sand with CLP. I hope it shoots great. |
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What O'lgunner says is correct. Remember,your upper,being a square forge, has been around since about 1965-67. Lot's of handling,cleaning,exposure to ??? over the years. As for parts not fitting into the NDS lower,that's typically because of new anodizing buildup. Most all of us have had that happen and the solution is very simple. Go to CNCgunsmithing web site. They sell jigs for 80% lowers. Read what drill bits are needed,and what taps are needed to complete an 80%er.Then simply "chase" any and all holes,threaded holes ect that are too tight. YOU DON'T NEED TO USE A DRILL AT ALL,just use your fingers to gently twist the bit or tap.
I'm "partial" to partial fence lowers.Your "recreation" of a period 604 looks fantastic...Nice job. Enjoy it.
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RobB I think it's an early 604 or that's what caught my eye. Very nice regardless of tag and thanks M1 for sharing literature. That possibly explains the black paint I've found on import M-16 pieces. I really should copy it to a folder. Corrected it,was too busy admiring it and didn't notice it's a slickside.  
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I think the only other perfect way to match would be to spray finish as discussed elsewhere. I would try the other methods mentioned above first because spraying is a nuclear option but has the advantage of covering up failed attempts. Building a retro is a labor of love, so I'd be patient and just keep messing with it (which is really the fun part anyway). Put a small drop of penetrating oil where the detents are and just work the pins back and forth while watching TV. BL is you're off to a great start....Congrats! |
| The take-down pins from the surplus M16 kit operated smooth as butter in my first build. I opted to use a DPMS lower parts kit in my second build and found I couldn't budge the pins without some "help" until I oiled them - a little LSA worked wonders. If you put them in dry maybe that is the issue... |
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What others have said... Hardcoat anodizing is thicker than the thin black coating on modern uppers. The old 1980s Essential Arms cast lowers with XM gray anodize would have the same problem. Using a correct size drill bit with your fingers and it will only take a few seconds. As for the pins not releasing, yhat is probably a pin issue. The detent divet is too deep.
BTW, VERY nice build! |
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Much more important to getting the "right" look will be replacing the selector switch with a "no-tic" and finding a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Other than those little details, she's looking good !! Thanks for all the comments and advice guys! I finally remembered where the LPK came from. It's a Sarco Inc parts kit. I'd like to find a "no-tic" selector and a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Any idea where to look? |
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What others have said... Hardcoat anodizing is thicker than the thin black coating on modern uppers. The old 1980s Essential Arms cast lowers with XM gray anodize would have the same problem. Using a correct size drill bit with your fingers and it will only take a few seconds. As for the pins not releasing, yhat is probably a pin issue. The detent divet is too deep. BTW, VERY nice build! If you're referring to the hole in the hump that the front pin spring and detent fits into,,a # 40 aircraft bit is used for that hole. The bit is about 6 inches long. |
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Quoted:
Thanks for all the comments and advice guys! I finally remembered where the LPK came from. It's a Sarco Inc parts kit. I'd like to find a "no-tic" selector and a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Any idea where to look? Quoted:
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Much more important to getting the "right" look will be replacing the selector switch with a "no-tic" and finding a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Other than those little details, she's looking good !! Thanks for all the comments and advice guys! I finally remembered where the LPK came from. It's a Sarco Inc parts kit. I'd like to find a "no-tic" selector and a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Any idea where to look? Gray mag button and selector,try GB seller MX56 (member PrivateSnafu) trigger guard try member boywonder777 buffer tube try member Cdenmark,http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_7_159/1304823_Colt_M_16A_1_retro_parts___M_16_FA_LPK_s__BCG_s__externsions____625_FSB_s.html if not,then GB seller Rodgravy |
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Nice build! I really like the rifle. I can help you with a grey mag button. If you IM your mailing address I will send you one (as long as I am not breaking any rules here?). I cannot have it here in Kalifornia so would like to send it somewhere where it will be appreciated  Todd Quoted: Thanks for all the comments and advice guys! I finally remembered where the LPK came from. It's a Sarco Inc parts kit. I'd like to find a "no-tic" selector and a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Any idea where to look? Quoted: Quoted: Much more important to getting the "right" look will be replacing the selector switch with a "no-tic" and finding a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Other than those little details, she's looking good !! Thanks for all the comments and advice guys! I finally remembered where the LPK came from. It's a Sarco Inc parts kit. I'd like to find a "no-tic" selector and a gray mag button, trigger guard and buffer tube. Any idea where to look? |
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The take down pins are about the hardest to release I've ever had. The pins slide freely in the receiver but the detents don't seem to want to release. Mine were like this too when I did my first assembly...so much so that I thought something had gone badly wrong. I hit them with some Vaseline and just worked them over and over. They're good to go now. |
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OP, love the build.....604 is a favorite of mine, I shoot my 604 more than prolly all of my other retros put together. Don't sweat the color match so much, you got a worn upper on a minty new lower, after a lube job and some blasting your not gonna care about it anymore because it's so fun to shoot. Have Fun!
Is it just my eyes playing tricks on me or do the current batch of NDS lowers appear to be slightly darker? I bought all my NDS lowers in one shot back in 2010 and they vary very little in color from each other but are lighter than the Current XM16E1 and A1 lowers I'm seeing. This isn't a bad thing, I actually wish I had a darker 601 lower for my 602 upper, it's a deep dark gray which is much darker than the lower. |
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