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Posted: 10/23/2011 10:06:07 PM EDT
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First off, I love this 652! this thing is light & shoots like a Ferrari on steroids...I Love this rifle!!! Big thanks to those who helped make it possible.
Ok back to the Hiccup, after calling the line "Safe" I placed my little 652 on the rack, as soon as the butt touched wood the bolt slammed home. Needless to say a few heads snapped my way with some disapproving glares. So whats with the sensitive bolt catch, was this an issue for the 601 catches? |
| Don't think it was ever an issue. Guessing something isn't quite right there. You could put a little more spring in it (possibly the wrong spring). Sometimes hard to tell if catch/well is a little screwed up. Possibly a lot of dry fires while unassembled previously over the years. Is it definately authentic or possibly homebrewed? Shouldn't be a hard fix if you can duplicate the problem. Have noticed over the years that my 16" carbine stuff seems to wear a little more in this area (top of catch on right side) like the bolt hit's it pretty hard at empty mag. No problems to date but I am gonna stay conscious of this also. |
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Most AR's will release the bolt with a good tap on the butt, assuming the bolt is locked back and no mag in the well. If parts are in-spec (not always the case with Brand X lowers and Cheapest-Possible-parts and pins) it might be very sensitive. But on all my issued A1s a regular bonk, like lifting the weapon three inches and bringing it down on the buttplate, would do that. I don't recall it happening on any of the carbines or M4s, but I barely remember the early "retro" fixed-carrying-handle carbines. Actually, I'd forgotten them entirely till I found some pictures of us zeroing them when we first got them.
One more thing –– technically, a roll pin is supposed to be a use-once part. A badly worn roll pin can let the bolt catch move more than spec. I can't see how it causes a bolt release, though, more likely a premature catch. |
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As long as the bolt face goes more than an 1/8th inch past the BHO you are good.
I've had several customers call with a similar issue and that was the culprit. Edit out silly comment; I had a brain cramp 
What I meant to say is make sure the BHO is able to go up through its full range of motion. |
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On both my carbine and my rifle I tried putting the bolt catch on with no magazine in gun and smacked the end of the stock and the bolt snapped forward. I would say the same. I open hand smacked it.
It seems reasonable that it would do this under these conditions. I hadnt done it before or even thought about it. There is no notch on bolt catch or bolt to prevent it from happening. There is only so much pressure that little bolt catch spring could deliver... The whole event is interesting. |
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You know how people feel about A2's around here?! That they love A2s & think they should have a forum all there own? That they are officially Retro & need a forum all there own? That an A2 on a 601 lower is perfectly acceptable & will bridge the gap between the 2 forums? Hold on I think there's an angry mob gathering out front with pitch forks & torches.... 
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The physics is siple. When the butt hits the ground, the inertia of the bolt keeps going when the stock stops, ever so slightly, and that releases the bolt catch. Presented as a non-recommended alternative to tossing your rifle down the drive-way to get the battlefield pick-up look. Don't none of y'all try this at home. I guess this falls under the "I don't believe I'd a told that, if-n it was me" category, but..........if you drop a M16E1 rifle out of a 20' guard tower in a country that no longer exists, butt first and straight down with the chamber empty but a loaded magazine inserted, "when the butt hits the ground, the inertia of the bolt keeps going when the stock stops" with sufficient inertia and "simple physics" that the bolt carrier group can/may/might/damn-sure-did go back far enough to strip a round from the magazine and chamber the sumbitch. Do not ask me how I know this. Ya follow? At least the disconnector worked, and nothing went "bang". Of such consolations is happiness wrought. |
| The bolt catch spring is designed to RETRACT the bolt catch, not to apply it. The spring which actives the bolt catch is the magazine spring! If there is no magazine in the rifle, the only thing keeping the bolt held open is the friction between the bolt face and the bolt catch; the bolt catch spring is actually trying to pull the bolt catch out of engagement. When you bump the stock with no mag in the rifle, the bolt and bolt catch momentarily break contact, the bolt catch spring pulls the catch out of engagement, and the bolt slams shut. All perfectly normal. |
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For added fun, if you do this to an M16 with the bolt closed and the selector in AUTO it will go "click" from the hammer dropping. If this happens on an M16, the hammer should drop from the auto sear onto the trigger sear (the normal "cocked" position). If the hammer drops "clicks" all the way forward, you've got a big problem! |
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The physics is siple. When the butt hits the ground, the inertia of the bolt keeps going when the stock stops, ever so slightly, and that releases the bolt catch. Guess it's safety Flag time, can't see those gents being happy with a sensitive BHO feature. I''l be more aware when handling it off the line. again , thanks for the help, great crew here. |
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As long as the bolt face goes more than an 1/8th inch past the BHO you are good. . I made a gage to check this gap when developing my M231 project. YF I think the 601 bolt catch was changed becase its hard to get your thumb on the thing to press it in enought secure the bolt. I have to stop and watch myself do it on a 601.... not so on the regular AR... |
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The fact that I've never used a 601 bolt catch probably has something to do with it as well.
First time I messed with the catch it took some getting used to, you really have to feel for the tension when engaging it manually. At this point I believe it's just the way it is, & for the record I did the same test on my A2 tonight & it snap shut as well. |
| I checked the six AR's I had laying around and couldn't make any of them drop the bolt without hitting the bolt catch manually and never remember one dropping by itself or by hitting the weapon stock either. As far as I know I've only used Colt/FN USGI surplus, Colt, J&T and RRA commercial lower parts. If it's normal for a 601 bolt catch think I might pass on one even though I only use the catch when my mag is empty or changing out a mag. I kinda like to be in control of what happens with my weapons and if I hadn't read it here wouldn't have believed it could happen unless the mag was screwed up or something was put together wrong. |
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Quoted:
I checked the six AR's I had laying around and couldn't make any of them drop the bolt without hitting the bolt catch manually and never remember one dropping by itself or by hitting the weapon stock either. As far as I know I've only used Colt/FN USGI surplus, Colt, J&T and RRA commercial lower parts. If it's normal for a 601 bolt catch think I might pass on one even though I only use the catch when my mag is empty or changing out a mag. I kinda like to be in control of what happens with my weapons and if I hadn't read it here wouldn't have believed it could happen unless the mag was screwed up or something was put together wrong. You've just got to butt-stroke it down a little harder, and it'll release the bolt, unless the bolt catch is binding in the lower receiver. Any AR-15 type rifle will do it; it's just a result of how the bolt catch is designed that makes this happen. The only thing keeping the bolt catch engaged is the magazine follower pushing up on it, which obviously only happens if a magazine is inserted. If you remove the magazine, the bolt catch spring is actually trying to disengage the bolt catch from the bolt. The only thing keeping the bolt locked back at that point is the friction between the bolt catch and the bolt. If you bump the stock down with enough force, it will move the bolt rearward just a bit (inertia), and the bolt catch spring will push the bolt catch out of engagement. The bolt will then slam shut. |
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