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Posted: 8/28/2010 5:15:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/11/2010 12:20:30 PM EDT by flatdarkmars]
I had a black arsenal refinished 603 upper receiver. It had Colt proofs, no forge code, and a counter-bored front lug (1968-1970). I sent it to US Anodizing in early July (with a bunch of other assorted parts) to be re-anodized gray. I received my parts back today. They are beautiful. The upper is beautifully refinished. And the front lug is not counter bored (1971).

Before:



After:



I haven't decided yet if I think this is really worth being bothered by. But my rifle was going to be completely correct for 1969. Or '68 if I use the early-bend gas tube that came with the upper.

On the "new" upper, the "L" in the rear sight markings looks more like an "I". It's missing the horizontal line. I wonder if anyone recognizes it as theirs?

I e-mailed Victor to ask if my original receiver might still be in the shop. I suspect that because I sent a variety of parts my order may have taken a little longer than typical and my receiver may already have flown the coop. We'll see what he can tell me.

It occurs to me that I am probably being way too anal about this...
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 5:18:46 PM EDT
At least the new one has round forging like the old one.
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 6:39:23 PM EDT
They are pretty when they are freshley refinished though, aren't they?
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 6:43:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By flatdarkmars:
I had a black arsenal refinished 603 upper receiver. It had Colt proofs, no forge code, and a counter-bored front lug (1968-1970). I sent it to US Anodizing in early July (with a bunch of other assorted parts) to be re-anodized gray. I received my parts back today. They are beautiful. The upper is beautifully refinished. And the front lug is not counter bored (1971).

Before:
http://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx332/flatdarkmars/US%20and%20OPFOR%20rifles/603upper02.jpg


After:
http://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx332/flatdarkmars/US%20and%20OPFOR%20rifles/603upper04.jpg


I haven't decided yet if I think this is really worth being bothered by. But my rifle was going to be completely correct for 1969. Or '68 if I use the early-bend gas tube that came with the upper.

On the "new" upper, the "L" in the rear sight markings looks more like an "I". It's missing the horizontal line. I wonder if anyone recognizes it as theirs?

I e-mailed Victor to ask if my original receiver might still be in the shop. I suspect that because I sent a variety of parts my order may have taken a little longer than typical and my receiver may already have flown the coop. We'll see what he can tell me.

It occurs to me that I am probably being way too anal about this...

You are DEFINITELY NOT being too anal.You sent one item and received a different one.Mistakes are made.But I would sure follow up on it.

Link Posted: 8/28/2010 6:53:03 PM EDT
Bro' you are defintitely not being anal. You should get your item back. If you got someone else's item, then someone else has your item. Hurry up and contact USAnodizing and get this thing sorted out!
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 7:06:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/29/2010 6:01:57 AM EDT by neilage66]
I don't have your upper, but it is fortuitous that you are a photographer.
Hope you get it sorted out to your satisfaction.

eta: proofreading is fundamental
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 7:34:52 PM EDT
Front lug isn't counter bored either.
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 7:50:44 PM EDT
Man, that sucks. Hope you get it back...
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 7:54:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By flatdarkmars:


It occurs to me that I am probably being way too anal about this...


No way. I would freak out if this happened. I would have been on the phone 30 seconds after I opened the box.
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 8:16:59 PM EDT
I think my girlfriend used it as a hammer.
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 9:03:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/28/2010 9:06:37 PM EDT by flatdarkmars]
Originally Posted By isplice:
Front lug isn't counter bored either.

Yes, that was essentially the point of the original post...


Originally Posted By m1sniper:
You are DEFINITELY NOT being too anal.

Originally Posted By Beel:
Bro' you are defintitely not being anal.

Originally Posted By neilage66:
Hope you get it sorted out to your satisfaction.

Originally Posted By VAAR:
Man, that sucks. Hope you get it back...

Originally Posted By DB2:
No way. I would freak out if this happened. I would have been on the phone 30 seconds after I opened the box.

Thanks for the kind words everyone. Glad to know I am not overreacting. At first I thought to myself, I could have sworn this thing was counter-bored... was I imagining that? I know it's been like 2 months since I last saw this receiver... But then I remembered I had pictures of it and looked and convinced myself I wasn't going crazy. Anyway, like I said I e-mailed Victor and we'll see what he says. Will keep you all posted.

In fairness, I must also stress that the work is all very well done. I also had two A2 uppers, 4 delta rings, 1 slip ring, 4 magazine release buttons, and a carbine receiver extension re-anodized, and all are perfect. Also had a bolt carrier reparked. Top notch work all around.
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 9:17:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/28/2010 9:19:36 PM EDT by m1sniper]
Victor is a man of Honesty and Integrity which is why I mentioned "mistakes happen" I am confident he will do EVERYTHING in his power to make this right.Hopefully the other person who received yours will see this post and step up to the plate and make contact with you.Hopefully yours is in fact still with Victor which will make things easier.Good luck! Keep a level head,give him a chance,don't lose your cool over it and all will work out in the end.I know he has a box of parts he sent to me yesterday and when it arrives I will be sure to check the upper.Hopefully everyone else who has stuff coming to them will do the same.
Oh,PS, did you recheck your stash of parts to be 100% sure you sent him the counterbored one? May sound dumb,but I admit,I've done dumber......
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 9:56:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By m1sniper:
Oh,PS, did you recheck your stash of parts to be 100% sure you sent him the counterbored one? May sound dumb,but I admit,I've done dumber......

Heh. Well, I only have three 603 uppers to my name. One is an NDS (obvious NDS forge code) that will be used for my XM177E2 (which I can now assemble thanks to having a gray delta ring!). The second one is a CH forge code which is eventually going to become a 653 carbine. Both of those are sitting here with me. So yeah by process of elimination the only upper I could have sent was my counterbored no-forge-code Colt. But thanks for asking... I would have felt silly if I had sent the wrong receiver.
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 10:05:37 PM EDT
I really hope you get your 603 receiver back promptly.

By the way, I thought your origional receiver looked great already. I assume you wanted a better match for your NDS lower?
Link Posted: 8/28/2010 10:10:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By cda97:
By the way, I thought your original receiver looked great already. I assume you wanted a better match for your NDS lower?

Yes. It's hard to tell by the picture, but it was really quite black. I considered just building an all-black "arsenal rebuild" rifle, but ultimately I decided that since I only plan to build ONE model 603 (ha!), I wanted to make it gray like the originals.

In this picture, you can better see the difference in colors, where there is an edge to the arsenal refinish around the back of the receiver.

Link Posted: 8/29/2010 4:41:30 AM EDT
The same thing happened to me earlier this summer, I sent in an original Colt M16A2 upper for a HP/22lr practice build, and received back someones 601. Victor made good on it including shipping costs. I was frantic tho as it IS hard to reach him via telephone. I sent a fax to him written in thick black sharpie saying what happened, he called me right back. A week later, I had my upper. Let's hope the fellow who received yours could tell the difference, and didn't assemble it already!! (mine was pretty obvious to even the neophyte RBR'er.)
Mike B
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 5:27:33 AM EDT
It's just excess anodizing built up in the counter bore area.

Link Posted: 8/29/2010 5:45:00 AM EDT
Originally Posted By RLR350:
It's just excess anodizing built up in the counter bore area.





Really, that does suck, but I'm sure Victor will make it right somehow. It must be really tough keeping all those parts straight - I mean, it's not like you can leave the tag on them when they go into the tank...

Link Posted: 8/29/2010 9:50:51 AM EDT
I believe I have your upper.

Email Sent
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 10:25:13 AM EDT
Yay!
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 11:02:57 AM EDT
Originally Posted By North_Dallas:
I believe I have your upper.

Email Sent


**UPDATE**
Your upper will be shipped back to Victor Monday. I received the upper Friday night and did not get much chance to look it over because I just got back from a 10 Day Training Mission, saw flatdarkmars posting and looked over the receiver sent to me, compared the wear and tear marks still visible after anodizing and the counter bore and realized this was not the upper I sent. I talked to Victor this afternoon and he told me that we need to be very specific i.e "601, 602, or 603 etc." when sending him our orders. Anyway, just FYI. Hopefully flatdarkmars will now be reunited with his 603 ('68-'70) upper and I with my 603 ('71) upper for my XM177E2 build. Thank you flatdarkmars for the old photo to reference your receiver.

Good Luck with your build,

SSG. Greg Spencer
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 11:46:10 AM EDT
Once again this forum proves to be the absolute BEST there is..Guys watching out others. God I love this place!
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 12:08:00 PM EDT
Originally Posted By m1sniper:
Once again this forum proves to be the absolute BEST there is..Guys watching out others. God I love this place!


+1
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 1:12:30 PM EDT
I guess it wasn't built up anodizing. I was way off on that one. That reply usually works in "Build it Yourself" when people have problems - that and "it's out of spec."

Victor must have been a busy man this past week because I got a 604 upper and a bunch of small parts from him yesterday, too. I checked my upper as soon as I read the thread and it did have the counter bored hole, but I was pretty confident it wasn't FLATDARKMARS' unless his F/A was removed during the process.

Actually, the only thing I really checked close was the dimpled A1 sight screw to make sure I got the same one back.

Anyway, nice job guys. Funny how things work out sometimes. Looking forward to the "Reuinion Thread".
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 1:17:37 PM EDT
...and who doesn't like a happy ending once in awhile?
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 1:26:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Morg308:
Originally Posted By m1sniper:
Once again this forum proves to be the absolute BEST there is..Guys watching out others. God I love this place!


+1


Nothing else needs be said! Glad it got worked out guys!
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 1:35:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By North_Dallas:
Originally Posted By North_Dallas:
I believe I have your upper.

Email Sent


**UPDATE**
Your upper will be shipped back to Victor Monday. I received the upper Friday night and did not get much chance to look it over because I just got back from a 10 Day Training Mission, saw flatdarkmars posting and looked over the receiver sent to me, compared the wear and tear marks still visible after anodizing and the counter bore and realized this was not the upper I sent. I talked to Victor this afternoon and he told me that we need to be very specific i.e "601, 602, or 603 etc." when sending him our orders. Anyway, just FYI. Hopefully flatdarkmars will now be reunited with his 603 ('68-'70) upper and I with my 603 ('71) upper for my XM177E2 build. Thank you flatdarkmars for the old photo to reference your receiver.

Good Luck with your build,

SSG. Greg Spencer


sound like Victor should be offering some free services to a couple of guys here, and revamping the way they keep track of their customers parts......not saying "we need to be very specific i.e "601, 602, or 603 etc." when sending him our orders"
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 5:02:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/29/2010 5:03:56 PM EDT by flatdarkmars]
Maybe US Anodizing can implement some better procedures for tracking parts, but in the future I will be very specific when making up the parts list to send along with a shipment. This time, my parts list said "A1 upper receiver". If I were doing this again, I would say "Colt M16A1 (Model 603) upper receiver, no forge code, counter-bored front lug." If I had done that the first time I probably would not be enjoying this excitement.

I am indebted to North_Dallas for his speedy response which greatly aided in the resolution of this situation. I am sending North_Dallas's upper back to Victor so everyone can be reunited with their correct parts. I'll update with pics of mine once I have it back (just to prove that it happened, you know).

Now, who can recommend me a good torque wrench for barrel installation?
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 5:20:13 PM EDT
Holy mixed up uppers Batman, what a relief!

Originally Posted By crackedcornish:
Originally Posted By North_Dallas:

**UPDATE**
Your upper will be shipped back to Victor Monday. I received the upper Friday night and did not get much chance to look it over because I just got back from a 10 Day Training Mission, saw flatdarkmars posting and looked over the receiver sent to me, compared the wear and tear marks still visible after anodizing and the counter bore and realized this was not the upper I sent. I talked to Victor this afternoon and he told me that we need to be very specific i.e "601, 602, or 603 etc." when sending him our orders. Anyway, just FYI. Hopefully flatdarkmars will now be reunited with his 603 ('68-'70) upper and I with my 603 ('71) upper for my XM177E2 build. Thank you flatdarkmars for the old photo to reference your receiver.

Good Luck with your build,

SSG. Greg Spencer


sound like Victor should be offering some free services to a couple of guys here, and revamping the way they keep track of their customers parts......not saying "we need to be very specific i.e "601, 602, or 603 etc." when sending him our orders"


I agree, especially considering in this case both uppers were the same model. But, Victor does great work, and sometimes despite anyone's best efforts, shit happens.
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 5:34:36 PM EDT
I prefer the beam torque wrench over the click ones. I like this one for several reasons. It gives you the measurement you need, it has a nice long handle, it's cheap and it's one of few they have that are still guaranteed forever. I use it in conjunction with the rectangular military barrel wrench. On a side note, I got a Schuster gas tube alignment pin/tool. Although it's not needed, the thing takes all the guess work out of aligning the barrel nut. It either fits and you are good or it doesn't fit and you need to adjust the nut.


Link Posted: 8/29/2010 7:35:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/29/2010 7:39:30 PM EDT by flatdarkmars]
Just heard back from Victor to confirm the good news. He was very professional and polite throughout the process and has offered to reimburse me for my expense in return shipping North_Dallas's upper.

victor@unanodizing.com wrote:

Hi Jason,

Sounds good, please mail the receiver you have to us. We will ship your receiver, as soon as we receive it from Greg. I spoke to Greg today, I take it he told you he had your upper. When I ship your upper back, will include a check for the shipping cost. Again, I apologize for the mistake. I hope that asking folks to note better details on uppers, can prevent this in the future.

Thank you very much.

Victor

I think we are stuck with needing to provide detailed descriptions, at least for now. Just thought I would reiterate this for the benefit of others. Overall I am pleased with the outcome.
Link Posted: 8/29/2010 8:06:02 PM EDT
That was easy enough. Seems like most the retro refinishing will be done by retro forum members only. Not a very big market for A-1 rifles anywhere else. Glad it all worked out in a very timely manner. Bet initially you were shocked. Get the Craftsman wrench as stated above. Nice tool to have in the chest. Great for those aluminum mags and rotors on the vehicle also.
Dave
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 8:00:15 AM EDT
So,I was out cutting the lawn and this whole oooppps was on my mine and started me thinking.(A BAD thing) In the 2 years I've known about Victors services,I have not heard of any problems happening.There probably have been,but seems they get rectified.I am however bothered but some of the comments made here in regards to him requesting that we should write down what it is we sent in to him. Have members become so damn lazy that this request is too much to do? I think it 's an incredibly small request on his part.And by doing this may actually help speed up his jobs allowing parts to be returned quicker.His service is incredible as we all know,so why not make his job a bit easier? See what "thinkin time" does to me?? I'm just saying
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 8:21:53 AM EDT
Originally Posted By m1sniper:
So,I was out cutting the lawn and this whole oooppps was on my mine and started me thinking.(A BAD thing) In the 2 years I've known about Victors services,I have not heard of any problems happening.There probably have been,but seems they get rectified.I am however bothered but some of the comments made here in regards to him requesting that we should write down what it is we sent in to him. Have members become so damn lazy that this request is too much to do? I think it 's an incredibly small request on his part.And by doing this may actually help speed up his jobs allowing parts to be returned quicker.His service is incredible as we all know,so why not make his job a bit easier? See what "thinkin time" does to me?? I'm just saying


m1sniper I agree that it's not a lot to ask, but it's pointless. If a bunch of us guys send in parts and we all write down that we sent in 604's what's to say I'm still getting my 604 back.

were all human and mistakes happen, but Victor has to figure out a foolproof way to identify each individual part as it goes through each stage of the finishing process so everybody gets their original parts back.

my
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 9:00:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/30/2010 9:00:58 AM EDT by SSeric02]
Originally Posted By m1sniper:
So,I was out cutting the lawn and this whole oooppps was on my mine and started me thinking.(A BAD thing) In the 2 years I've known about Victors services,I have not heard of any problems happening.There probably have been,but seems they get rectified.I am however bothered but some of the comments made here in regards to him requesting that we should write down what it is we sent in to him. Have members become so damn lazy that this request is too much to do? I think it 's an incredibly small request on his part.And by doing this may actually help speed up his jobs allowing parts to be returned quicker.His service is incredible as we all know,so why not make his job a bit easier? See what "thinkin time" does to me?? I'm just saying


I agree it's not too much at all to expect anyone sending something to them to properly fill out a work order (or whatever they're using) and identify what they're sending.

But, it's also not too much to expect them to maintain accountability of customers' items.
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 9:03:04 AM EDT
Well,perhaps.One email he sent me was something to the effect that when he opens a box of parts,that box basically stays with that lot of parts from beginning to end.Ever notice you get the same box you shipped your stuff in back? Least every time I send,I get the same back I was under the impression that Victor had a staff of folks working for him which could contribute to mistakes,but a comment made by Mike NDS makes me believe he is a one man show.
Hey cracked,I really like those 2 pennies icon.Wheredya find that one?
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 9:08:44 AM EDT
Originally Posted By m1sniper:
Well,perhaps.One email he sent me was something to the effect that when he opens a box of parts,that box basically stays with that lot of parts from beginning to end.Ever notice you get the same box you shipped your stuff in back? Least every time I send,I get the same back I was under the impression that Victor had a staff of folks working for him which could contribute to mistakes,but a comment made by Mike NDS makes me believe he is a one man show.
Hey cracked,I really like those 2 pennies icon.Wheredya find that one?


I probably swiped it from one of the Jeep forums...I did just find a bunch of neat animated .gifs the other day, maybe you've seen a couple of the ones I've used already.

here's one that works for the topic of this thread
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 9:11:56 AM EDT
Luvin it!
Link Posted: 8/30/2010 9:32:07 AM EDT
I sure wouldn't think the comments in this post would be cause for concern. Any vendor worth doing business with will take any input they get, good and bad, (especially the bad) and use it to tune their business to meet their customers needs and to help do better in their day to day operation.

While it would be helpful for customers to make detailed notes about the product they send in, this event also shows a need at the other end that more attention is needed. I'm certain U.S. Anodizing is the kind of vendor that has taken these comments and is re-evaluating what he has going on at his end to make sure this doesn't happen again. It's a "learning experience"

We've seen here recently what happens when vendors let too much business get ahead of them, and the value of having enough help. Hopefully, Victor will take the steps necessary to properly control and document his customers' property. (He's a pretty sharp guy. I kinda think he will)
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 12:20:19 PM EDT
Got my upper back today. Counter-bored front lug and all. Thank you again to Victor and North_Dallas.




Now to buy more lowers, and start assembling. I have my work cut out for me...



603, 629, 653, 645, 723, 727, 920 (done), 945. Still have some parts yet to go.
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 1:25:13 PM EDT
Your wife hates you, I know she does.
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 2:03:16 PM EDT
Originally Posted By cda97:
Your wife hates you, I know she does.

But... but... the towels will keep any oil or grease from getting on the carpet... I just don't see the problem.
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 2:44:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By flatdarkmars:
Originally Posted By cda97:
Your wife hates you, I know she does.

But... but... the towels will keep any oil or grease from getting on the carpet... I just don't see the problem.


Glad everything worked out.

Are those *people towels* ?
My wife provides me with *dog towels*...
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 2:51:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By neilage66:
Originally Posted By flatdarkmars:
Originally Posted By cda97:
Your wife hates you, I know she does.

But... but... the towels will keep any oil or grease from getting on the carpet... I just don't see the problem.


Glad everything worked out.

Are those *people towels* ?
My wife provides me with *dog towels*...

They're gun towels now.
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 9:18:33 PM EDT
I'm glad everything worked out for you and North Dallas. Now get your butt to work building!!
Link Posted: 9/12/2010 2:32:42 AM EDT
Good lord... Are those A2 pistol grips?
Link Posted: 9/12/2010 6:14:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/12/2010 6:35:43 AM EDT by flatdarkmars]
Originally Posted By MarkRSims:
Good lord... Are those A2 pistol grips?

Well, they're correct for an A2 rifle, 723, 727, and A4 rifle. Granted the latter is not in any way retro, and the first three marginally so. But the goal here is to complete the timeline that currently begins with my 1873 Springfield trapdoor and 1896 Krag. Once I finish off the modern end of the line, then I can go further back still, into muzzle-loading territory!
Link Posted: 9/12/2010 10:35:44 AM EDT
Originally Posted By flatdarkmars:
Originally Posted By MarkRSims:
Good lord... Are those A2 pistol grips?

Well, they're correct for an A2 rifle, 723, 727, and A4 rifle. Granted the latter is not in any way retro, and the first three marginally so. But the goal here is to complete the timeline that currently begins with my 1873 Springfield trapdoor and 1896 Krag. Once I finish off the modern end of the line, then I can go further back still, into muzzle-loading territory!


I used to be like you flatdarkmars...
Link Posted: 9/12/2010 12:02:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By flatdarkmars:
Originally Posted By MarkRSims:
Good lord... Are those A2 pistol grips?

Well, they're correct for an A2 rifle, 723, 727, and A4 rifle. Granted the latter is not in any way retro, and the first three marginally so. But the goal here is to complete the timeline that currently begins with my 1873 Springfield trapdoor and 1896 Krag. Once I finish off the modern end of the line, then I can go further back still, into muzzle-loading territory!

Some are sicker then others

Link Posted: 9/12/2010 12:30:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/12/2010 12:31:36 PM EDT by North_Dallas]
Got my upper as well and got it all together and added a little wear and tear and now my XM177E2/629 is complete. What do you retro brothers think?


Link Posted: 9/12/2010 12:32:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By flatdarkmars:
Got my upper back today. Counter-bored front lug and all. Thank you again to Victor and North_Dallas.

http://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx332/flatdarkmars/US%20and%20OPFOR%20rifles/603upper05.jpg

Now to buy more lowers, and start assembling. I have my work cut out for me...

http://i769.photobucket.com/albums/xx332/flatdarkmars/US%20and%20OPFOR%20rifles/arparts01.jpg

603, 629, 653, 645, 723, 727, 920 (done), 945. Still have some parts yet to go.


Umm...flatdarkmars...you do know, don't you, that you can build them...one.at.a.time?
There's no rule that says you have to collect all the parts for the entire family before putting the first one together!

I'm just saying.

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