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Posted: 10/13/2008 6:04:33 PM EDT
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I bought this BCG of another member here on AR15.com. I paid $225 for it and was told I was getting a "correct" Chrome BCG for an early 604 build. When it came it had some chrome parts and some parkerized parts. Is this normal? I must admit I am kinda new at this and am a little confused. I was expecting everything to be chrome? Is this how its supposed to be for a 604? BTW the seller has been great to deal with!!! and I am not pointing any fingers his way!......just looking for a little clarity for a correct 604 buildhanks! Ignore the charging handle as I know that supposed to be parkerized http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k258/matter_daddy/604010.jpg |
Please explain more....."h."???? |
So what does that mean? Was it pieced together? Is it safe to fire? |
matter_daddy, Pretty sure he's being a spelling Nazi (it's a General Discussion thing) to your spelling of chrome.  Another-Bill, this isn't General Discussion, we don't care if he spelled chrome w/o the "h", we & you know what he meant.  matter_daddy you may be able to find some info on your BCG in this thread: transitional bolt groups |
Please explain more....."h."????
Nah, that won't help. I've been trying to scare up info on these and all I've got so far is fragmentary, at best. Some nice pics, but nothing as to what actually happened, when, and in what order. These seem to be a bit of a black hole, unless people are just holding out.  Which is what I hope. I expect 6-8 posts in the next few days to explain EVERYTHING.
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| the stakes on gas key dont look right. the holes seem to be right inbetween the screw and the key. it should be on the key displacing metal into the screw. i have never seen a transitional parked key on a chrome carier. i have seen chrome keys on parked carriers though. what are the markings on the bolt? |
Here are some pictures of the staking. The dimples in the key don't match up with the dimples in the screws? The arrows point to where the dimples are (two arrows show where they are located on the key the other two show where they are located on the screws) They definitely don't match up? Is this thing safe to shoot? Maybe it was pieced together? Please give me some clarity on this stalking thing. Mainly is it unsafe as is? Also I can't find any markings on the bolt, where would I look? http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k258/matter_daddy/bcg001.jpg http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k258/matter_daddy/bcg003.jpg http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k258/matter_daddy/bcg002.jpg |
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The bolt is a later Colt part, no less than 6 years younger than the carrier. I can't positively ID the fp. Is the back edge of the head squared off or radiused like a newer fp? Who did you get this from? You overpaid by at least $50-$75, maybe more since no collector would tough this stuff. It is time to point fingers. |
According to www.retroblackrifle.com it might technically look "correct." but it is not what I would expect, or sell as "correct." From www.retroblackrifle:
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Problem is that they dropped the chrome carrier by early '64. They continued with a chrome bolt until at least '65. All of the '64-'65 SP1s Ive seen have a parked carrier and a chrome bolt. The MPC marking on the bolt is from the 70s-80s. |
I would rather not name any names. I think i will just ask the seller for a refund, much easier.
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It is easier that way. I hate to see people get burned on purpose though. I know of someone else who got burned on a barrel in the last couple of weeks that is a regular here. I saw it in person and was apaulled at the description of it when I saw it on the EE. It was a $50 barrel and the seller hooked someone for 4x that |
I just got an email from the seller saying he will give me a full refund. I think that he is being fair. But now I need a "correct" BCG. Where is a good place to find one? I figure the EE is a start. Do I have any other options? Also what would be the "correct" BCG for and early partial fence 604 build? What markings would I look for? |
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The best fit is probably the most expensive option: Parked slickside carrier $200+ chrome bolt $75 parked machined fprp ? I've never seen one for sale flat headed fp $50 + Cheaper options: A chrome carrier is still going to be $150+ but easier to find same chrome bolt any machined fprp is rare though there are some chrome repros out there flat headed fp is still $50 but a regular one will function for $10 Later SP1s just had a serrated carrier and a later bolt and fprp and you can find this style for $100-$150 total. It depends on how correct you want to be and how much you want to spend. Just doin't pay too much for each piece. |
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matter_daddy, Young Manufacturing does repro slickside chrome and parked carriers and groups. Check your IMs. Young Manufacturing Bolt Carriers - bottom of the page |
This is good info. I'm bookmarking Young's page. A while back, somebody had a nice selection of chrome and parkerized carriers in the EE starting at $100 - I'm still kicking myself for passing them up. I've got a C marked forward assist bolt carrier that's going in my in-progress carbine build, but the chrome MP bolt that's in it now will need a new home when I get around to building a 601 or 602... 
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| I'm talking to YM about doing some parked slickside M16 carriers with chrome keys...we'll see how that works out...they thought I was crazy when I asked about it...I'm not necessarily saying they're wrong...I think it was a vapor or some spores that were in the package I got with a 16" slickside upper in it... |
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I am thinking of ordering one from Young's which one of these would be a better fit for an early 604 partial fence build? I know that neither one of them would be 100% correct but which one would be more correct? AR-15 or M-16 I chose those two because they didn't have the forward assist groves, if not either of those which ones would you recommend from their supply? www.newriverarms.net/store.php?Bolt_Carriers-pg1-cid38.html |
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I'm planning on running a new chrome bolt with a parked Colt serrated carrier in my Xm16E1 build. I know there's a slight step in the later carrier, but I'm going with it...that is unless I find an older carrier in my stash. Hmmm. Now you've got me wondering. I know that the solid bolt retaining pins are still available - I think DPMS makes them - now I have to remember where I saw them online... |
The originals were M16 but maybe you should go for the semi. You save $10 and don't have to worry about legal issues. You don't want forward assist teeth with a slickside upper. I know Colt did it towards the end but they were just being cheap |
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I bought a chromed slickside bolt carrier w/black key and black bolt a few months ago from Fulton Armory; they're still listed there at ~$175 complete (carrier w/bolt assembly). Looks just like yours; has a small "D" on the carrier body. Slick Side Bolt Carrier Group, Complete, Includes Hard Chrome Carrier and Bolt, Complete $174.95 (about a third of the way down; no picture I like it. Doesn't have to be original for me. I just like the looks of it. (And it's AR-15, not M16) 
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Thats what they said to me about the slick side parked carriers. Then he called me and said I better order one becuase the batch they did was nearly sold out. Great guys to deal with and good products. I just got DPMS machined chromed firing pin retaining pins for 3 bucks to finish it off. I have had both the DPMS and the Young and the Young is by far nicer compared to the DPMS and the price is close. 604 = Air Force and the AF is the masters of mix mastering guns. Carrier keys get dented and replaced. Then the first staking job gets F#%^ up by the new guy and then the Sup comes by and shows him how to do it. The bolt may have failed headspace and a new bolt allowed it to pass so it went on through the system. Almost anything can be explained either cause you have done it or seen it. |
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