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Posted: 12/22/2005 10:21:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/2/2006 9:45:20 PM EDT by MartytW]
This design takes parts from other designs and is mainly meant for .500 Phantom rifles, but could also be used for .50AE and .50 Beowulf.

As drawn, it is 2.5" long, 1.25" OD, and thread is not yet set. Was thinking of threading it 15/16 x 24 and offering adapter bushings for those who already have threaded barrels with a different thread.

Stainless of CrMo would end up about the same price and looking at about $50 per piece. I would need at least 5 sold to warrant firing up the machine, if more orders come in, the price can come down.

I am open to design suggestions, so let's hear them.

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:26:19 AM EDT
looks intresting but how well will it perform?
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:50:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 5:01:35 AM EDT by twl]
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:58:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 4:58:42 AM EDT by SakoM92S]
What do you guys think, how does this Beowulf muzzlebrake look? http://www.hunt101.com/img/357322.jpg

Bigger picture: www.hunt101.com/img/357322-big.jpg

http://www.hunt101.com/img/357320.jpg

Bigger picture: www.hunt101.com/img/357320-big.jpg
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 8:47:13 AM EDT
Marty,

FWIW, Bill at AA said they are using 29/64-20 on their LE barrels and his new M4 style will be threaded the same.

Tony

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 11:00:11 AM EDT
Maybe I'm wrong but if I remember correctly, Bill Alexander wrote to 50AE muzzlebrake thread, that thread sizes 3/4"-28 and 49/64"-20 are acceptable thread sizes for Beowulf barrels.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 5:48:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 5:50:26 PM EDT by UmlautArms]

Originally Posted By SakoM92S:
Maybe I'm wrong but if I remember correctly, Bill Alexander wrote to 50AE muzzlebrake thread, that thread sizes 3/4"-28 and 49/64"-20 are acceptable thread sizes for Beowulf barrels.



There is a post by Bill here... It confirms that he states 49/64"-20

50 Beowulf Post

Link Posted: 12/23/2005 8:55:40 PM EDT
Based on TWL's input, made some changes.



While the top vents may seem not that crucial, please note the design of the JP Bennie Cooley brake (LINK) and the MSTN QDB

The thread choice of 15/16 x 20 is 1) it is UNEF 2) any 0.936 barrel can have it done 3) barrels with smaller threads can take an adapter and make it fit.

Tom, this what you had in mind?
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 9:42:37 PM EDT
are you trying to reduce muzzle climb or felt recoil
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 10:31:14 PM EDT
Looks loud

Hijack: When do you expect to be attaching these to some uppers for the 500 phantom and sending them out? I need to get one of those things
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 4:23:52 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/24/2005 5:16:49 AM EDT by twl]
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 8:52:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/24/2005 8:53:31 AM EDT by eklikwhoa]
i think that making the o.d. behind the ports a bit wider like fins would acclomplish what twl is trying to get at with the "fender washer" and actually help a bit.


somwhat similar to the tank brake on .50 bmg's but not so aggressive. just slight walls on the sides behind the ports


i have made something with paint, dont have nice cad programs and such but i tried to do the best i can.



somewhat like this but a lot smoother looking and like twl stated slight bumps would change the angle greatly to the shooter.
Link Posted: 12/25/2005 4:16:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/25/2005 7:10:11 PM EDT
So should I go ahead and make a bunch of these? I may need some for some .500 Phantom uppers that we hope will come to fruition. Any .50 AE or Beowulf takers? Might even work for some .500 S&W shooters ....

Randall, roger on the thread, forgot about some of the 0.92 folks. 7/8 x 20 would be best as that would allow some adapters for a few 3/4 x 20 and 3/4 x 28 barrels I have sent out previously.

Tom, Belleville washers would be ideally suited for this, as they function to maintain torque as is. What arfcommers call a crush washer is more or less a Belleville washer and one of the standard sizes is 0.880 hole with 1.750 OD and it will have a slight angle to it. It would work ideal. Regular steel they are about $1 a piece, SS they are about $5 a piece .... Can likely pick them up a local hardware store (maybe even Lowe's or Home Depot)

So, takers for the brake at $50 in stainless?
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 6:07:10 PM EDT
I would like a muzzle break for my .50 Beowulf that is like the Barret 50 Cal Muzzle Break. Can you do this?
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 7:45:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jcovercash:
I would like a muzzle break for my .50 Beowulf that is like the Barret 50 Cal Muzzle Break. Can you do this?



While it could be done, it would be costly and quite frankly, not sure how effective. The Barrett brake is large (and heavy) and designed for the copious gas volume of the 12.7 x 99, as opposed to the much smaller gas volumes of the Beowulf and Co. The brake we show (as well as the one from SakoM92S) would be far better suited for these smaller rounds.

But for a price and lots of waiting, I am sure the Barrett brake could be duplicated. You might even look into an adapter that allows mounting the Barrett brake on a Beowulf barrel. Just a thought.
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 11:09:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jcovercash:
I would like a muzzle break for my .50 Beowulf that is like the Barret 50 Cal Muzzle Break. Can you do this?



Isnt the Armalite brake very similar?
Probably easier to get a hold of one of the these, but the weight would be tremendous and IMHO screw up balance of firearm.

Is recoil that much worse than the 458 SOCOM?
Link Posted: 12/27/2005 6:06:28 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/27/2005 9:11:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By munyguru:
I would be in for one for my .50 Beuwolf. I would prefer it in the same finish as the barrel though instead of stainless. Is this possible?

Also, my barrel will need to threaded, can you help with this and what would the cost be?



We can always take the SS version and coat it to match parkerizing, we have done so before (color matched an SP-1 even)

For threading, I would get with Tony at Tromix as I am so far behind on stuff. These brakes would be a matter of submitting the programming to the machine and standing back and letting it do the job while we tend to other stuff, so the brakes are not that much of a problem.
Link Posted: 12/28/2005 2:42:59 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/28/2005 6:23:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/28/2005 6:27:22 PM EDT by Randall_Rausch]
Link Posted: 12/28/2005 6:33:43 PM EDT
What about the Armalite brake design?
Link Posted: 12/28/2005 8:01:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Randall_Rausch:

Originally Posted By MartytW:

Randall, roger on the thread, forgot about some of the 0.92 folks. 7/8 x 20 would be best as that would allow some adapters for a few 3/4 x 20 and 3/4 x 28 barrels I have sent out previously.



Oh come on, don't take the easy route and make adapters...
Just make a few brakes with the smallest threads they would ever be used on and make the rest of them to the thread spec you choose for future builds.
Then you can take those small ones and open them up on a case-by-case basis as required for the past customers who end up wanting them.

Not to Hijack work from Tony, but I can certainly thread barrels for you guys as well...



By making it one run on the big machine it gets to be a bit cheaper. If I I do two for the small 3/4 thread and the rest for the other thread it kills those economics. Also by going to the larger thread, suppose someone has a prethreaded Beowulf barrel but wishes to install this brake. A skilled machinist could then make an adapter for that person and install the brake. The use of the adapter also makes it easier to time the brake .... I am doing this with you in mind, Randall, trying to make life easier

And yes, Randall can do threading too ... sorry about that ....

Here is version 2A, I changed it a little bit to enlarge the rear ports a bit and place the top vents on the front section, this allows for a little room on top for a logo or some engraving ....



Lest there are objections, I will make a run of about 15 of these in SS with the 7/8 x 20 thread.
Link Posted: 12/28/2005 9:30:26 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/29/2005 12:07:45 AM EDT
Randall,

I think that angled front surface looks quite cool.

Just came to my mind that maybe angle should be other way around so that brake is longer on lower side.

Think about how AK- spoon shaped compensator was orientated. hat

Just my 2 cents.
Link Posted: 12/29/2005 2:43:08 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/29/2005 6:51:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/29/2005 6:52:55 AM EDT by SHIVAN]
While interested I'm not sure I want to be the beta tester...

Tromix 50AE barrel has what thread already on it? Or is that muzzle device integral to the barrel?

ETA: I would be interested in something that cuts muzzle climb as a PRIMARY function. Recoil reduction would be a secondary concern.
Link Posted: 12/29/2005 7:09:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/29/2005 5:42:57 PM EDT
Cut em Marty. I will take the one for the 500P upper (LR308) that I already have from you and would be interested in an extra one for one of the other uppers we have.
Link Posted: 12/29/2005 8:11:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/29/2005 8:38:08 PM EDT by MartytW]
Randall - the angled design looks interesting but I would have to agree with Sako, as shown the design would INCREASE muzzle lift. If you add large vents on top the gas jet would serve to force the muzzle down and it would work.

I can make the front bevel far less pronounced and maybe add a reverse (target) crown or counter bore instead ....

Last revision, I think this might actually be the best looking one ...





I had a moment of clarity (or was that a bottle of Claret) and realized Ned over at MichiGunshas done several brakes like this. Look under Rifle, Shotguns, etc as well as AR-15s, and also his photo album. I love Neds work, especially his alternate approaches to checkering and stippling. Some day when I have lots of time I will try and build my next 1911 and have him do the surface work.

Link Posted: 12/29/2005 9:03:19 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/29/2005 9:14:01 PM EDT
What isn't visible in my design is the back. It is actually made with a 7/8 x 20 thread and then a 0.940 counter bore. This is done so you can put a Viton O-ring over the thread and torque the brake against the O-ring (or leave it out and torque against the shoulder) to get the desired timing. It should make timing the brake a LOT easier, my main complaint with the JP brakes. Admittedly, it will leave a small step from the barrel to the brake, but to me that step is really not out of place on the AR, similar to the step from barrel to flash hider ....
Link Posted: 12/30/2005 2:05:00 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/30/2005 3:59:41 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/30/2005 6:21:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/30/2005 4:30:06 PM EDT by Big-Bore]
Marty, I don't claim to know crap about brake design but I can tell you about one that works great. The 4 port fish gill brake that SSK uses on their Handcannons works very well. I shoot a .50 Alaskan which will toss 450 to 750 gr. bullets out of a 4 pound, 12 inch barrel at between 1300 and 2000 fps. The recoil of this pistol is very stiff as one can imagine and without the brake, well, you wouldn't find me shooting it. The brake may not be very tactical looking but by God it works.
ed to add: No ports on top or bottom.
Link Posted: 12/31/2005 6:39:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Big-Bore:
Marty, I don't claim to know crap about brake design but I can tell you about one that works great. The 4 port fish gill brake that SSK uses on their Handcannons works very well. I shoot a .50 Alaskan which will toss 450 to 750 gr. bullets out of a 4 pound, 12 inch barrel at between 1300 and 2000 fps. The recoil of this pistol is very stiff as one can imagine and without the brake, well, you wouldn't find me shooting it. The brake may not be very tactical looking but by God it works.
ed to add: No ports on top or bottom.
img.photobucket.com/albums/v318/BiggBore/50AK.jpg



The fish gill is considered more or less the standard in 50BMG shooting, but most of the 50BMG version are WAY too big for the ARs in 50 B, 50AE and 500P. I looked around for a smaller version (diameter and thread wise) but found none. Looks like JD has a source or makes his own. If he would be willing to share that source...
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 3:01:19 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 6:55:31 AM EDT
Since I carry my Beuwolf more than I shoot it I would like to know how much weight the muzzlebreak adds and what percentage of recoil reduction is actually felt. As a brown bear carry gun all those ports make nice alder collection points when you are in the uglys. I could see it as a means to stay on target for repeat shots but don't consider the Beuwolf recoil a problem in field shooting. Off the bags on the bench I think its no different than a 12 guage slug gun.
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 12:54:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By munyguru:
Any word on these brakes? Just wondering when I should make arrangements to get my .50 Wolf barrel in for threading.



The order is beinf processed and it should take about 4 weeks so I would guess 3 more weeks? When they come in I will post a picture including one on a scale to show how much weight they add.
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 1:32:08 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 11:43:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By munyguru:

Originally Posted By MartytW:

Originally Posted By munyguru:
Any word on these brakes? Just wondering when I should make arrangements to get my .50 Wolf barrel in for threading.



The order is beinf processed and it should take about 4 weeks so I would guess 3 more weeks? When they come in I will post a picture including one on a scale to show how much weight they add.



Please make sure one is reserved for me. Still good for the parked finish to match the barrel also?

Thanx!



roger willco!
Link Posted: 1/16/2006 1:17:24 AM EDT
Marty.....bring one to SHOT!!!
Did you consider doing a pepperpot brake?

Simon
Link Posted: 1/16/2006 6:58:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SimonTan:
Marty.....bring one to SHOT!!!
Did you consider doing a pepperpot brake?

Simon



One will be mounted on the 500Phantom in the NIC booth, but I can bring an extra. Will also bring you dummy versions of 458 SOCOM, 338 Spectre and the 500 Phantom.

Pepperpot - like the Shrewd and Vais? Was trying to avoid dust signature in prone position.
Link Posted: 1/17/2006 7:20:51 AM EDT
As Marty noted, the Michiguns site has some interesting examples that resemble the final design here. Check out the bowling pin gun page at michiguns.com and especialy the compensator on the revolver in the bottom right hand corner of the page. Spooky.hock.gif
Link Posted: 1/18/2006 12:33:38 PM EDT
Is this brake being created because other brakes on the market are not working well? I'm also interested in a brake for a Beowulf and was ready to have my barrel threaded by Tromix. I cant help but wonder why or how this brake is better then what Tromix is selling. Maybe I should hold off on my puchase.
Link Posted: 1/18/2006 3:57:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By capitol:
Is this brake being created because other brakes on the market are not working well? I'm also interested in a brake for a Beowulf and was ready to have my barrel threaded by Tromix. I cant help but wonder why or how this brake is better then what Tromix is selling. Maybe I should hold off on my puchase.



Other brakes on the market will perform just fine, the Shrewd brand brake for the .50 Beowulf and the .458 SOCOM is one of the more common choices and folks report that it does indeed work. This brake was designed more for use with the .500 Phantom, which is a bit more powerful than the .50 Beowulf and runs at significantly higher pressure. While the Shrewd (or even the JP Recoil Eliminator) will work for that application, we wanted a more "trademark" version that set it apart from others out there.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:47:31 PM EDT
They came in today (just in time for SHOT) and I like they way they turned out. Will put one on the USPS scale tomorrow but feels like about the same weight as the Shrewd brake in my uncalibrated hands.

Shown on a SS heavy bull barrel. One will be mounted at SHOT on the 500Phantom on display in the NIC booth

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