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Posted: 8/24/2003 2:14:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2003 3:36:10 PM EDT by Yojimbo]
Last week I ordered a Vltor Carbine Clubfoot Modstock and 5 position tube from Wes at MSTN. As I expected my order arrived only two days after it was shipped! You got to love that MSTN service, THANKS Wes!

I've been eyeing the Modstock for a while and I've been going back and forth between the standard and clubfoot versions. After much thinking I decided to go with the clubfoot because it offered and addtional grip for precision shooting and I also thought it looked better with the SIR handguards. Standard or clubfoot you can't lose with the Vltor!

The Vltor kit came with the new 5 position tubes that are now being made by Vltor. I've heard that LMT makes them for Vltor but so far it's just a rumor...

The tube was well made and had a nice uniform flat black finish and had the Vltor logo on the end. I removed my old carbine tube and replaced it with the Vltor unit, the swap was easy and without incident. Fit to my pre-ban lower was excellent and I was able to use all my existing mounting hardware, buffer and buffer spring.

The Modstock came neatly packaged with the major components in separate plastic bags. Included were the stock, battery compartment side attachments, panel side attachments, battery compartment plugs, mounting hardware and a 1.25" QD side sling mount.

I installed the battery compartment attachments in the full forward postion. I then installed the compartment plugs and tested them. The plugs go on tightly and the rubber seal will keep everything nice and dry. The plugs were a bit difficult to remove but it got easier after using it several times. These plugs will not fall out or open accidentally!

Next I installed the stock to the buffer tube and was pleased to find a nice tight rattle free fit. The action was nice and smooth when adjusting to the differnt positions.

Due to the stance and grip I use I prefer to have the carbine stock in the fully collapsed or first position. I found the cheekweld to be excellent and the feel was just like the one piece stocks. Another bonus with the excellent cheekweld was it made single armed shooting a breeze. Once you mount the stock it was easy to lock it on you shoulder compared to the skinnier standard stock I had before.

The butt of the stock is also set at a slight angle which makes it lot more comfortable and natural for the higher toe to upper chest/shoulder mount I use.

Overall an excellent product and upgrade for my carbine! I give it two thumbs up!

Here's a quick summary of the advantages of the Vltor modstock.

1. Provides excellent cheekweld.

2. Waterproof battery compartments will each store one AA and one DL-123 battery or two DL-123 batteries.

3. Battry compartment can be accessed without removing the stock from the buffer tube.

4. Tight no-rattle fit.

5. Makes the carbine easier to use for single handed shooting, the great cheekweld lets you easily lock the stock to your shoulder.

6. Clubfoot gives you addtional stock surface to grip which aids in precision shooting.

Now for the pics!



My package arrives!



The nice Vltor box.



Vltor 5 position tube!



Vltor logo.



Tube threading looks well machined.



The Modstock packaging.

Below are some comparison shots of the modstock my older aluminum carbine stock.



Left side.



Right side



Front view.



Top view.



The battery compartments.



On my carbine!



Closeup.



Ready to rock!

Finally the #1 reason to get the clubfoot version...it has an excellent spot for the "Peace through superior firepower." pin!



Link Posted: 8/24/2003 2:17:48 PM EDT
Very nice, great post!
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 2:21:17 PM EDT
very nice pics! that buffer tube with the vltor logo on it is a nice touch. cheers, MM
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 2:33:55 PM EDT
Two days!? I emailed Wes one night and it was on my door step the next day [:d] I don't know how he does it. I keep kicking myself for having bought a Colt tube from Brownells for $120 something..[buttkick]
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 2:42:11 PM EDT
Vltor is making buffer tubes for their stocks now?!? Thats really great news? How much for their tube? I may have to sell off my Colt stock and tube to replace it with the Vltor insignia edition!!! [:D] I got the Clubfoot for the same reason you did. I actually like the way the club foot looked less than the standard, but I did appreciate the added functionality it offers. I put mine on a RAS II gun though. Haha I like the peace pin on the stock! See that, yet another useful inovation possible only with the modstock [;)] The cheek weld is second to none, I agree. But I have not tried to see how that helps keeping the rifle shouldered with one hand. I'll have to give it a try! [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid73/pb9a8826a39adc69c4579dc4b70252027/fb694672.jpg.[/img]
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 2:47:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2003 2:50:32 PM EDT by Duffy]
New arguy I think the pin says Peace through superior firepower, no hippies here [:)] On another note, anyone knows what the skunk works at Vltor is working on? Wes won't say... Or was it released already like the A1 length stock? I'd like to see new development on the modularity aspect of the stock.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 3:05:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2003 3:06:55 PM EDT by Lumpy196]
Vltor rules. Yojimbo is right on about the cheek weld helping with one handed shooting. Locks the gun right into your shoulder. Its everything Ive wanted in a CAR stock. Ive GOT to get one of their buffer tubes. That logo is hella-cool.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 3:12:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2003 3:19:55 PM EDT by Wipeout]
I really like that stock. Now, I just need a pre-ban that I could put it on.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 3:28:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Wipeout: I really like that stock. Now, I just need a pre-ban that I could put it on.
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Haha, that reminds me when I bought a HK USP .40 one day because I found a box of .40 ammo in my drawer somewhere.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 3:32:23 PM EDT
Wow, when did they start coming out with their own buffer tubes?
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 4:13:06 PM EDT
Yojimbo, Hope you don't mind if I add some of my own POV, I promised Eric over at Vltor, I would post a few words, when I ordered mine. Also, my pics are nowhere near the quality of yours, but they are simply more pics, pretty much already covered by you, but figured it couldn't hurt. 1. The fit/ finish is flawless w/ the lower. I did have some trouble w/ clearance of the center pin on the KAC sling swivel mt. A file to the center pin cured that w/ plently pin left to center the tube/plate. 2. The black is a slight shade off of Colt's, but a nice full black, nonetheless, and a near identical match to "BM" black. Even and deep color. Excellent. 3. The fit w/ the Vltor stock is 100%, snug, rattle free, smooth, no sticking, when sliding. Excellent. 4. The Vltor emblem? A beautiful touch Eric. 5. The stock itself, has been often reviewed so I won't beat a dead horse, here, but, let it be known, I love both of mine, and require nothing more from a carbine stock. Haven't tried a rifle length on a long gun, but for "Car"s, I can't see what more I'd need, unless it hasn't been invented yet. I would like to ask Eric, if he could see his way through to making a rifle length, or longer than "Car" length batt. tube for the "Car" stocks. I know a mod. can turn the rifle lengths into usable "car" length tubes, but I'd like a factory finish and a second mounting attachment point on the batt. tubes. I'm paranoid I know, but hey, that's me. In total, Vltor's tubes surpass Colt's in that they have a 5th pos. and in every other way are identical in quality and workmanship. They are much less expensive by the way. Vltor's tube/stock combo are virtually the same price as Colt's setup w/ many more features and options. Colt!, get out of the way. Vltor's reps/owners are gentlemen, 100% IMB, they went the extra mile, or two, to get me my stock. They bent over backwards, when they didn't have to. Their company, their people are what this industry should be about and they deserve our business. Thank you Eric, thank you Chen. Enjoy guys. S2.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 4:41:21 PM EDT
I have to join S2 in complimenting Eric's fine products and outstanding customer service. This week I ordered an A1 rifle clubfoot for a project gun and asked Eric for a clubfoot carbine to T&E on our issue M4s. Two days later, the stocks arrived. They weren't out of the box 5 minutes before Hilton, our team's gear guru, was on the phone with Eric ordering himself one. Talk about shiny kit syndrome [:)]. I haven't broke it to him yet but I don't think Eric will be getting the other stock back. My M4 wouldn't forgive me. Looks like I'll be ordering one of his new buffer tubes so I can use both stocks on my project gun.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 5:33:19 PM EDT
I predict that Vltor will far eclipse anything that [b]might[/b] happen with the fabled Crane stock, and at a substantially lower price.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 5:38:06 PM EDT
Do I have to buy a buffer tube or can I just use the regular M4 tube? Thanks FREE
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 5:43:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By FREEFALLE6: Do I have to buy a buffer tube or can I just use the regular M4 tube? Thanks FREE
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Freefall, If you have the Colt sized mil-spec tube it will work with the Vltor. If you have a third party such as RRA, Bushmaster, Armalite, etc. you will need to get a the Vltor or Colt tube. Hope this helps! BTW, welcome home and thank you for the great job![:D]
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 5:44:25 PM EDT
You need a COLT mil-spec tube. Aftermarkets wont fit.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 5:46:50 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 5:46:52 PM EDT
So how much does that assembly cost ??
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 5:52:44 PM EDT
Excellent post! A Vltor is definitely on my list of gear for a carbine I'll be building soon. Yojimbo - What pistol grip is that on your carbine? It looks like a nice grip plus it has the "duckbill" that fills the finger-eating gap.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 6:16:34 PM EDT
Jimbo and Sulaco- You both wrote an excellent write-up. 6-months ago, I wrote a similar and very positive write-up of the Rifle Modstock on my SR25. I'm a firm Vltor believer. I feel like I part of the [i]Vltor Army[/i]. They Rock! Now I have two Vltors and I can't wait to see what Eric and the boys have planned next. When I saw Eric at the Seattle gunshow back in May, he said that "wonderful things are coming". Great, we look forward to them. I will need to contact Wes. The tube (Colt) I bought from him is showing some wear, I guess I need to get the credit card ready and buy a Vltor tube. ls
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 6:33:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2003 6:38:45 PM EDT by MSTN]
Link Posted: 8/25/2003 4:44:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/25/2003 4:50:30 AM EDT by Hawkeye]
For New-arguy.... [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid73/pb9a8826a39adc69c4579dc4b70252027/fb694672.jpg[/img] Good choice. I absolutley LOVE the VLTOR rifle Modstock I got from MSTN. Was everything I wanted and more. My only regret is not getting the clubfoot, simply because I think it "might" have looked a bit cooler, but, the standard one I got works just fine. [:D] [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid74/p7d63d044d4e22b18ad668eab65dc1bc7/fb62cd77.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid75/p38db7af7f67e16311f8258436b93f356/fb570a04.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid75/p0386eed4dd64e4e64275348b45f38b4c/fb570a0a.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid73/p6286f008eb905a89507196c697fbb3c8/fb6f79a8.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid74/pd11b22bea6b7168c0c6b43a53505227c/fb6516f9.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 8/25/2003 9:22:14 AM EDT
Nice looking rifles. I've got an A1 length Clubfoot however I'm awaiting an reciver extension so I can mount it. I'll post up a picture of it once I do so. I only wish they made a post-ban carbine stock version.
Link Posted: 8/25/2003 9:39:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/25/2003 9:45:42 AM EDT by Yojimbo]
Thanks guys, for all nice comments! I'd like to add that I agree with Sulaco2 and I'd like to see a full length carbine battery storage attachment. I'd like to be able to store three DL-123's or two AA's in each compartment! I don't think you need to be able to open the battery compartment from both sides so just going through the front would be fine by me. Wes, Thanks for setting the record straight on LMT not manufacturing the tubes. I talked to a guy who had a buch of 5 position buffer tubes from LMT. Since that was the only company we've ever saw making 5 position tubes we thought they muse be making them for Vltor. What do I know...[;)] DBerryhill, The pistol grip is the Battlegrip by Tangodown. Yes it has the duckbill and it works great! Very ergonomic and stores two AA batteries form my EOTech 552! Hawkeye, Love that Dissy![:D]
Link Posted: 8/25/2003 10:06:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/25/2003 10:07:32 AM EDT by LordStoner]
Originally Posted By Yojimbo: I'd like to add that I agree with Sulaco2 and I'd like to see a full length carbine battery storage attachment. I'd like to be able to store three DL-123's or two AA's in each compartment!
View Quote
Jimbo- I agree with you guys. I couldn't wait, I did my own conversion. I used my rifle Modstocks for the conversion. Now I have more then enough room for the batteries. When I called Vltor to order more rifle Compartments, I told them what I've done. Eric (Vltor GM) replied that Vltor will be doing a similar modification, for their production version. So be patient, bigger tubes are on there way! ls [img]http://www.gunsnet.net/album/data/500/18991stockmod2-med.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 8/25/2003 12:13:10 PM EDT
The Vltor tube looks l=nice, looks like I will have to buy me a couple. does anyone l=know if the tube is machined or forged?? really doesn't matter to me, but the Colt factory tube is a forged piece.
Link Posted: 8/25/2003 1:39:24 PM EDT
Lordstoner, That's good news, thanks for the update. Way to be Eric, responsiveness to customer input keeps companies alive. Glad to see it, thanks. S2
Link Posted: 8/28/2003 12:15:56 PM EDT
You've already done a great amount of work, but do you have measurements of the stock completely collapsed and fully extended?
Link Posted: 8/28/2003 12:58:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/28/2003 1:16:40 PM EDT
Wes, I know some details of manufacturing, like forging's better than casting, but "hammer extrusion"? So, in simpler tongues: "...Vltor good, Colt bad..." I get it right? Thanks, as usual -S2
Link Posted: 8/28/2003 1:57:45 PM EDT
Any constant profile cross section can be produced by extrusion, basically forcing molten metal through a die under pressure with a ram or hammer. Just like a pastry bag or toothpaste tube. Aluminum and thermoplastics ae the most commonly extruded materials. Since the bottom rail needs to be sloped and the holes drilled, there is some post-extrusion machining required. Not to mention welding on the end caps and cutting the threads. I don't like to doubt Wes, but if these tubes are machined from a billet they would cost more than the stock.
Link Posted: 8/28/2003 4:30:51 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/29/2003 10:23:27 AM EDT
Is the Colt/Milspec tube one of the patented Colt M4 improvements? Is it different than the original XM177/CAR15 tube? And where did everyone else get their differing dimensions?
Link Posted: 8/29/2003 2:02:02 PM EDT
Heres a picture of my A1 length Clubfoot on my M4. Just got it mounted after not realizing I needed a receiever extension [:)] [img]http://home.comcast.net/~gtcrispy/vltorar15_5.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 8/29/2003 5:19:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By gtcrispy: Heres a picture of my A1 length Clubfoot on my M4. Just got it mounted after not realizing I needed a receiever extension [:)] [url]http://home.comcast.net/~gtcrispy/vltorar15_5.jpg[/url]
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Looks Great! What happen to your other receiver extension? ls
Link Posted: 8/29/2003 5:38:47 PM EDT
I think the VLTOR is a great addition to the AR world! I was amazed at how tight and solid it feels. No rattle at all and the batt. compartments make for great cheek welds! Yep, I know this has all been stated b'fore but I gotta keep an eye on this thread[:D]
Link Posted: 8/29/2003 8:57:56 PM EDT
I never had the extension because the lower came with the postban CAR stock...Unfortunately I didn't realize this till I had the stock in my hands and no way to mount it [:D]
Link Posted: 8/29/2003 10:46:43 PM EDT
Originally Posted By gtcrispy: I never had the extension because the lower came with the postban CAR stock...Unfortunately I didn't realize this till I had the stock in my hands and no way to mount it [:D]
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I never heard of Stinger Arms. Is it a good quality lower? Were is Stinger Arms located? Horik- Yes, I totally agree, it is a great addition to the AR world. [:)] Which version do you have? ls
Link Posted: 8/30/2003 5:40:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/30/2003 5:42:50 AM EDT by gtcrispy]
Originally Posted By LordStoner: I never heard of Stinger Arms. Is it a good quality lower? Were is Stinger Arms located?
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The lower is made up in Tumwater, WA. They're sold here on the board by Iblis. Theres the Mega lowers and Stinger Arms. Basically the same thing except a different logo and the Mega comes with a gator grip on front of the magwell. Everytime I've read a comment by someone who bought one, it has been very positive. He sells them for around $89 stripped and I bought mine for about $200 complete.. [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=21&t=153544&w=myTopicPop[/url] is his thread.
Link Posted: 8/30/2003 7:03:12 AM EDT
Originally Posted By gtcrispy:
Originally Posted By LordStoner: I never heard of Stinger Arms. Is it a good quality lower? Were is Stinger Arms located?
View Quote
The lower is made up in Tumwater, WA. They're sold here on the board by Iblis. Theres the Mega lowers and Stinger Arms. Basically the same thing except a different logo and the Mega comes with a gator grip on front of the magwell. Everytime I've read a comment by someone who bought one, it has been very positive. He sells them for around $89 stripped and I bought mine for about $200 complete.. [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=21&t=153544&w=myTopicPop[/url] is his thread.
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Thanks. That's in my neck of the woods. I'll have to give them a call. ls
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