AR Sponsor
Posted: 5/29/2015 6:18:56 PM EDT
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i'm kind of a newb to the AR game. i built my rifle about a year ago, and other than frequent dry fires, i haven't been able to shoot but around 1000 rds or so since then. i joined the army in 2006 and besides two deployments totalling less than 300 rds, the only real trigger time i got was semi annual quals. those quals were probably where i shot the most though. i would happily request opportunities for more zero time or requals (i would probably fire over 300 rds per qual day, just trying for nickel size groups or an expert qual, ammo was free so why not, right?). the triggers were typical milspec, a bit of grit in the take up, and an inconsistent break. so knowing my experience level...
i built my rifle on a budget, taking full advantage of cyber monday and black friday deals wherever i could find them. i picked up an ALG ACT for my first build and actually really like it. it's worlds better than any trigger i touched in the mil, but i find myself wanting less creep now that i've had some time with it. the break is pretty consistent, but i find it just a bit heavier than i'd like, but i'm not sure if it's just the take-up that's making me feel like it's too heavy, like i expect it to break earlier than it does... idk. if i haven't made it clear yet, i dry fire a lot, on all my firearms. i'm used to some take-up, but i'm wondering if maybe a crisp single-stage would help me control some minor trigger jerking and help shrink some groups. so that's really why i'm looking for input. i've looked at timney, CMC, and geissele. right now, CMC seems like the best bang for the buck (literally and figuratively), geissele seems like the canned arfcom suggestion, but i'm not seeing where the added value is, timney seems like a decent contender too, but just kind of a ho-hum trigger upgrade. i don't have any preference for drop-in units, but i like what i'm seeing from CMC. does anybody have any experience with two or more of these that can give an unbiased comparison? anybody have anything else that they'd suggest i look at? |
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It'll really depend on what you do with the rifle.
If you ask me, the new Larue MBT is a slam dunk. I especially love it for precision shooting, but it's comfortable all around with its wide surface area and buttery smooth pull. If you aren't a fan of the Larue, then Geissele. SSA for a combat style rifle or SSA-E or the SD-E (Depending on if you like flat or curved triggers) are great for precision. CMC triggers are nice, don't get me wrong. But I really feel like the Larue triggers or Geissele are a step above. You'll notice it in build quality, spring choices, warranty should you ever need to use them, and if you decide you don't like them, they retain their values well. Everyone will have their own opinion on this, but I personally feel like, go big or go home. Go with something you know will never let you down and just oozes quality. Plus they have the support to back them JUST in case you need it. Drop in trigger units are nice, but they are one unit. If something goes wrong you can't trouble shoot them much or anything. Again, just my 2 cents. Buy once, cry once. |
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It'll really depend on what you do with the rifle. If you ask me, the new Larue MBT is a slam dunk. I especially love it for precision shooting, but it's comfortable all around with its wide surface area and buttery smooth pull. If you aren't a fan of the Larue, then Geissele. SSA for a combat style rifle or SSA-E or the SD-E (Depending on if you like flat or curved triggers) are great for precision. CMC triggers are nice, don't get me wrong. But I really feel like the Larue triggers or Geissele are a step above. You'll notice it in build quality, spring choices, warranty should you ever need to use them, and if you decide you don't like them, they retain their values well. Everyone will have their own opinion on this, but I personally feel like, go big or go home. Go with something you know will never let you down and just oozes quality. Plus they have the support to back them. Drop in trigger units are nice, but they are one unit. If something goes wrong you can't trouble shoot them much or anything. Buy once, cry once. thanks for the input. warranties were something i hadn't even considered. and larue is now on the list. most of my shooting is just punching holes. looking for the tightest groups i can possibly achieve. i know nickel sized holes are possible with factory ammo, i've seen them and done them, but it seems like my groups have opened up some since leaving the mil. it could be attributed to barrel choice or trigger or any number of things, but my groups seem to spread out horizontally on the average and i think it's due to a heavier than normal (for me) trigger. ETA: and when i refer to nickel size groups, i'm talking about the 25m zero targets with iron sights. |
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Learn NPOA if you're getting horizontal stringing, that or you're shooting in inconsistent wind and need to mind the wind call.
No experience with LaRue for triggers, but Geissele is a known good trigger, and gets recommended often for good reason. ALG is Geissele'd more budget brand and should be a good choice too. In all honesty, with triggers (unlike barrels) I feel that pretty good is good enough. A good shooter can shoot a reasonably light weight gritty inconsistent trigger well, and a good trigger (although more pleasant) isnt a huge advantage, while an great trigger is more helpful/necessary for a poor shooter who hasnt mastered the trigger pull. I run RRA march two stage triggers in a couple of rifles. They're more affordable than a geissele and do the job well. Any decent two stage or crisp breaking 1911 style single stage at 5lbs or less should work well for accuracy. |
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How to trigger units/packs even keep themselves locked into the receiver? Isn't that how a traditional type trigger stays locked in a AR15 is tension from it's own springs acting on the pins? But you don't any tension on those pins when it's all in one unit. There are two set screws on the bottom of them that push down forcing the unit upwards against the pins. The Timney has a second screw that keeps the first ones in place. Mine have stayed rock solid. |
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I have Timney's on my pistol and carbine and a SSA-E on my 300BLK SBR. I went to my shop and they had test jigs with different ones installed so I could try them out and get what I liked best. The Timney seems like a lighter strike than a mil spec or Giselle but has never FTF once with a shit ton of different ammo.Timney has done good by me in my 10-22, Rem 700 and 2 AR's, I love their break. Giselle is a high quality trigger and I really like mine but they are not magical.
No experience with CMC but they are spoken pretty highly of. |
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http://geissele.com/triggers.html?cat=14 the value trigger from geissele I have one im my AR now and its great. All the perks of the SSA at a cheaper price I would agree with this. The Geissele G2S is a great trigger for the price. I have a couple of them and a SSA. Mine measured at 4.5lb weight. Look around and you can find them for around $149 shipped when on sale. ETA...when in stock..... $140 shipped |
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http://geissele.com/triggers.html?cat=14 the value trigger from geissele I have one im my AR now and its great. All the perks of the SSA at a cheaper price i like that both stages add up to around 4.5lbs. i'd get the take-up that i'm used to and a nice light break. worthy of consideration for sure. thank you. |
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Learn NPOA if you're getting horizontal stringing, that or you're shooting in inconsistent wind and need to mind the wind call. No experience with LaRue for triggers, but Geissele is a known good trigger, and gets recommended often for good reason. ALG is Geissele'd more budget brand and should be a good choice too. In all honesty, with triggers (unlike barrels) I feel that pretty good is good enough. A good shooter can shoot a reasonably light weight gritty inconsistent trigger well, and a good trigger (although more pleasant) isnt a huge advantage, while an great trigger is more helpful/necessary for a poor shooter who hasnt mastered the trigger pull. I run RRA march two stage triggers in a couple of rifles. They're more affordable than a geissele and do the job well. Any decent two stage or crisp breaking 1911 style single stage at 5lbs or less should work well for accuracy. NPOA is something that's always at the front of my mind when i get down into the prone. i might need to pay some extra attention during the course of firing though. i'm not a great shot, but i'm far from the worst. i guess i'm an average marksman. shooting expert was always a challenge for me. i could do it, but it always took a couple tries. so which would be the better route? a great trigger for someone like me that apparently hasn't yet mastered the trigger pull? or should i keep what i have an master the fundamentals totally? |
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NPOA is something that's always at the front of my mind when i get down into the prone. i might need to pay some extra attention during the course of firing though. i'm not a great shot, but i'm far from the worst. i guess i'm an average marksman. shooting expert was always a challenge for me. i could do it, but it always took a couple tries. so which would be the better route? a great trigger for someone like me that apparently hasn't yet mastered the trigger pull? or should i keep what i have an master the fundamentals totally? Quoted:
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Learn NPOA if you're getting horizontal stringing, that or you're shooting in inconsistent wind and need to mind the wind call. No experience with LaRue for triggers, but Geissele is a known good trigger, and gets recommended often for good reason. ALG is Geissele'd more budget brand and should be a good choice too. In all honesty, with triggers (unlike barrels) I feel that pretty good is good enough. A good shooter can shoot a reasonably light weight gritty inconsistent trigger well, and a good trigger (although more pleasant) isnt a huge advantage, while an great trigger is more helpful/necessary for a poor shooter who hasnt mastered the trigger pull. I run RRA march two stage triggers in a couple of rifles. They're more affordable than a geissele and do the job well. Any decent two stage or crisp breaking 1911 style single stage at 5lbs or less should work well for accuracy. NPOA is something that's always at the front of my mind when i get down into the prone. i might need to pay some extra attention during the course of firing though. i'm not a great shot, but i'm far from the worst. i guess i'm an average marksman. shooting expert was always a challenge for me. i could do it, but it always took a couple tries. so which would be the better route? a great trigger for someone like me that apparently hasn't yet mastered the trigger pull? or should i keep what i have an master the fundamentals totally? Buy a set of JP Enhanced Reliability springs (red hammer yellow or bronze color trigger). That should drop the weight you have now down to about or a hair under 5.5lbs. I have that combo on one of my ACT and my Spike's Battle Trigger and that's about what I was measuring. |
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Buy a set of JP Enhanced Reliability springs (red hammer yellow or bronze color trigger). That should drop the weight you have now down to about or a hair under 5.5lbs. I have that combo on one of my ACT and my Spike's Battle Trigger and that's about what I was measuring. Quoted:
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Learn NPOA if you're getting horizontal stringing, that or you're shooting in inconsistent wind and need to mind the wind call. No experience with LaRue for triggers, but Geissele is a known good trigger, and gets recommended often for good reason. ALG is Geissele'd more budget brand and should be a good choice too. In all honesty, with triggers (unlike barrels) I feel that pretty good is good enough. A good shooter can shoot a reasonably light weight gritty inconsistent trigger well, and a good trigger (although more pleasant) isnt a huge advantage, while an great trigger is more helpful/necessary for a poor shooter who hasnt mastered the trigger pull. I run RRA march two stage triggers in a couple of rifles. They're more affordable than a geissele and do the job well. Any decent two stage or crisp breaking 1911 style single stage at 5lbs or less should work well for accuracy. NPOA is something that's always at the front of my mind when i get down into the prone. i might need to pay some extra attention during the course of firing though. i'm not a great shot, but i'm far from the worst. i guess i'm an average marksman. shooting expert was always a challenge for me. i could do it, but it always took a couple tries. so which would be the better route? a great trigger for someone like me that apparently hasn't yet mastered the trigger pull? or should i keep what i have an master the fundamentals totally? Buy a set of JP Enhanced Reliability springs (red hammer yellow or bronze color trigger). That should drop the weight you have now down to about or a hair under 5.5lbs. I have that combo on one of my ACT and my Spike's Battle Trigger and that's about what I was measuring. seems like a cheap middle ground. i'll give it a shot. this one? |
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Learn NPOA if you're getting horizontal stringing, that or you're shooting in inconsistent wind and need to mind the wind call. No experience with LaRue for triggers, but Geissele is a known good trigger, and gets recommended often for good reason. ALG is Geissele'd more budget brand and should be a good choice too. In all honesty, with triggers (unlike barrels) I feel that pretty good is good enough. A good shooter can shoot a reasonably light weight gritty inconsistent trigger well, and a good trigger (although more pleasant) isnt a huge advantage, while an great trigger is more helpful/necessary for a poor shooter who hasnt mastered the trigger pull. I run RRA march two stage triggers in a couple of rifles. They're more affordable than a geissele and do the job well. Any decent two stage or crisp breaking 1911 style single stage at 5lbs or less should work well for accuracy. NPOA is something that's always at the front of my mind when i get down into the prone. i might need to pay some extra attention during the course of firing though. i'm not a great shot, but i'm far from the worst. i guess i'm an average marksman. shooting expert was always a challenge for me. i could do it, but it always took a couple tries. so which would be the better route? a great trigger for someone like me that apparently hasn't yet mastered the trigger pull? or should i keep what i have an master the fundamentals totally? Buy a set of JP Enhanced Reliability springs (red hammer yellow or bronze color trigger). That should drop the weight you have now down to about or a hair under 5.5lbs. I have that combo on one of my ACT and my Spike's Battle Trigger and that's about what I was measuring. seems like a cheap middle ground. i'll give it a shot. this one? Yep that's the one. It's a 3.5# with the JP adjustable trigger. With the ACT it will be heavier, but still smoother and lighter than a standard mil spec trigger. |
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<snip> does anybody have any experience with two or more of these that can give an unbiased comparison? anybody have anything else that they'd suggest i look at? 101fng, Here's a biased opinion, if you haven't pulled the trigger, no pun, watch for our Father's Day sale. 
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Quote: "seems like a cheap middle ground. i'll give it a shot". I've installed a number of the JP trigger spring kits with varying success. Only to be replaced with Geissele triggers. Mostly the SSA-E version. Do yourself a favor and get a Geissele trigger that meets you budget. The Geissle ALG trigger are a better middle ground imo. |
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