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Posted: 9/29/2012 3:32:51 PM EDT
| Wanted some opinions on lightest and highest quality AR on market. Thanks guys |
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Assuming non-NFA,
It will be any 14.5" lightweight barrel profile with pinned muzzle device and standard plastic furniture from a reputable company. You could do some things with a lighter bolt carrier, slick-side upper receiver ect... but those are generally non-standard. The S&W M&P Sport is a good, low cost, lightweight rifle |
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Doesn't colt make a lightweight pencil barrel 6720 or something? In the LE6720 I think. Also PSA makes a pencil upper. PSA UPPER |
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For a great mix of lightweight and high quality, you might look at the noveske skinny moe
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2954 I would add a free float though. Contrary to popular belief the moe handguard are usually heavier than even the heavier free float tubes. The delta pack, FSB, and endplate end up negating the lightweight polymer part of the handguard. If you got a troy alpha you would not have to change the barrel nut and installation would be really easy though. |
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Wanted some opinions on lightest and highest quality AR on market. Thanks guys The lightest get into cut carriers, polymer receivers, and in general are not going to be the same quality as other AR15s. If you are looking for the "lightest", part of the puzzle becomes what you want it to include. |
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I think weight loss is a good thing but there is a breaking point. I think around 6lbs dry is about the easiest limit without giving up much in terms of what it can do and it's effectiveness. I have a government profile 14.5" mid length 5.45 with moe parts on it and a Troy fixed rear that weighs in at around 6.5lbs unloaded. I could hit just under 6 I think but I would need to do a lighter barrel profile as well as a lighter bolt carrier. Keep in mind that doesn't have any sort of optic either. I expect around 7lbs with even a microdot setup.
I think for a great mix of cost and effectiveness keep it as close to 6lbs as you can. |
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I built a PSA 16" pencil mid length, with rainier free float, PRI flip front sight/gas block, MOE stock, hogue grip, and PA micro for the girl, weighs in at 6 pounds 9 oz.
Liked it so much I built a 14.5" mid LW for myself. Be careful, the lightweight rigs tend to multiply faster than standards. |
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When looking for my first I found a couple rifles posted weights of just over 5lb empty. The Core 15 states 5.2, a standard Bushmaster is under 6 and the Bushmaster Carbon at 5 even. Is this just B.S.? Totally doable. To get under 6 you really start axing some functionality. For instance you can save about a 1/3rd of a pound going to a clark carbon fiber handguard, but that has no rails and is slightly larger in diameter than the more recent free float rails. It is also a pain to install/remove/modify. You can go with a ace ultralite stock to save probably 1/2 a lb but then you lose adjustability and cheekweld. A car stock is light as well, but again the cheekweld sucks and the lockup and overall feel is lacking. There are some ways you can save weight and retain functionality though, just focus on small things in every aspect of the build and it will add up. No forward assist, really shaved FSB maybe even cut down so it only utilizes the back pin, lightweight optics mounts, slightly lightened bolt carrier, fluted or lighter profile barrel. Like someone stated before it all depends on what functionality you want to keep. Less than 5 pounds is definitely doable if you just want something that shoots and nothing else. |
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For a great mix of lightweight and high quality, you might look at the noveske skinny moe http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2954 I would add a free float though. Contrary to popular belief the moe handguard are usually heavier than even the heavier free float tubes. The delta pack, FSB, and endplate end up negating the lightweight polymer part of the handguard. If you got a troy alpha you would not have to change the barrel nut and installation would be really easy though. I just weighed a shielded middy dropin HG, 7.9 ounces An MOE middy is 8.7 ounces on the same scale. Yeah, it's a real boat anchor 
Joe |
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For a great mix of lightweight and high quality, you might look at the noveske skinny moe http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2954 I would add a free float though. Contrary to popular belief the moe handguard are usually heavier than even the heavier free float tubes. The delta pack, FSB, and endplate end up negating the lightweight polymer part of the handguard. If you got a troy alpha you would not have to change the barrel nut and installation would be really easy though. I just weighed a shielded middy dropin HG, 7.9 ounces An MOE middy is 8.7 ounces on the same scale. Yeah, it's a real boat anchor
Joe This isn't about 'what AR isn't a boat anchor' it's about 'what's lightest.' Those aren't lightest. Get with the program. |
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For a great mix of lightweight and high quality, you might look at the noveske skinny moe http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2954 I would add a free float though. Contrary to popular belief the moe handguard are usually heavier than even the heavier free float tubes. The delta pack, FSB, and endplate end up negating the lightweight polymer part of the handguard. If you got a troy alpha you would not have to change the barrel nut and installation would be really easy though. I just weighed a shielded middy dropin HG, 7.9 ounces An MOE middy is 8.7 ounces on the same scale. Yeah, it's a real boat anchor
Joe Don't forget the delta ring assembly. There's a good bit more weight to be dropped by going to a low pro gas block in favor of the standard FSB. So in my case, a 15" Samson EVO rail was very significantly lighter than my old standard rifle handguard set up. |
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For a great mix of lightweight and high quality, you might look at the noveske skinny moe http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2954 I would add a free float though. Contrary to popular belief the moe handguard are usually heavier than even the heavier free float tubes. The delta pack, FSB, and endplate end up negating the lightweight polymer part of the handguard. If you got a troy alpha you would not have to change the barrel nut and installation would be really easy though. I just weighed a shielded middy dropin HG, 7.9 ounces An MOE middy is 8.7 ounces on the same scale. Yeah, it's a real boat anchor
Joe This isn't about 'what AR isn't a boat anchor' it's about 'what's lightest.' Those aren't lightest. Get with the program. I AM with the program. Still gotta be able to shoot the thing. The OP is being steered away from carbon lowers for useablilty reasons Seven tenths of an ounce. Other than a CF middy HG, find one that's lighter. Joe |
| The barrel will make the biggest difference. My Noveske N4 light with 14.5" barrel weighs just over 6 lbs (unloaded) with all mil-spec components, a Centurion C4 cut-out rail, an optic (PA micro on Larue mount), buis, and fixed front sight. It doesn't make sense to skimp on quality components in order to save 1/2 oz while choosing to use a barrel that is carrying an extra 2 lbs of fat. |
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Plastic handguards, plus the barrel nut, delta pack, and FSB, weigh more than some free floats with a lo pro gas block and rail mounted front sight.
But without going the SBR or AR pistol route, I would recommend a 14.5" lightweight/pencil barrel, with a carbine length gas system, pinned/welded muzzle device, lo pro gas block, and a 9-11" rail system (Noveske NSR, Troy Alpha, Samson/Rainier Evolution, or Centurion Arms C4). Fixed sights (LMT, DD or Troy) or T1 red dot with flip up sights. Standard upper, and lower with a Magpul MOE stock. |
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muzzle control is a much harder on light weight rigs. Sure you on target fast...but they sure are snappier to shoot. Its not preferred by me at all. whatever floats your boat. 
http://762precision.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/overall-weight-4lbs-14oz-ar-15.jpg http://762precision.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/wet-duracoat.jpg http://762precision.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/touching-up-holes-with-duracoat.jpg http://762precision.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/getting-uglier.jpg Psh. Amateurish. Now - if there was a skeletonized PMag in it...
~Augee |
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I will only use a rail mounted front sight as a backup.
Why? Because a FF rail BY DESIGN moves independently of the barrel. Where the FF moves, you POA moves. Where the barrel moves, the POI moves. Me, I like my POI to be as close to the POA as possible., but I'm funny like that. When the primary (and only) sights on the rifle are irons, my front sight is mounted on the barrel. To my mind, the purpose of a lightweight (NONE of my firearms are safe queens) is to aid in carrying for long distances without fatiguing the operator. When I get where I'm going with said rifle, I'd still like it to function properly, meaning be as accurate as possible, as comfortable as possible, and as durable as possible, within reason. Reminds me of the "gram junkies" I used to see on the bicycling circuit. They spent a ton of dough to make their bicycles as light as possible, hollowed titanium this, minimalist carbon fiber that. Their rigs constantly broke down on the road, and even if they were faster than me, I finished WAY ahead of them. Light is good. Light compromising function is not. Joe |
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For a great mix of lightweight and high quality, you might look at the noveske skinny moe http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2954 I would add a free float though. Contrary to popular belief the moe handguard are usually heavier than even the heavier free float tubes. The delta pack, FSB, and endplate end up negating the lightweight polymer part of the handguard. If you got a troy alpha you would not have to change the barrel nut and installation would be really easy though. I just weighed a shielded middy dropin HG, 7.9 ounces An MOE middy is 8.7 ounces on the same scale. Yeah, it's a real boat anchor
Joe This isn't about 'what AR isn't a boat anchor' it's about 'what's lightest.' Those aren't lightest. Get with the program. I AM with the program. Still gotta be able to shoot the thing. The OP is being steered away from carbon lowers for useablilty reasons Seven tenths of an ounce. Other than a CF middy HG, find one that's lighter. Joe No your not. Your middy MOE handguard weighs 8.74oz. Your delta ring/spring and endcap which will be removed with a free float weighs between 1.5 to 2.5oz. We will go with 1.5 just to be safe. Then there is the difference in the weight saved from chopping down your front sight. That is 3.9oz saved. So all together your handguard actually weighs over 14oz once you factor in all the unnecessary crap. So lighter handguards? How about just about any modular free float rail. Hell a MI GEN2 SS weighs 9.3oz and is longer than the magpul, already has a top rail, is much thinner, would have improved accuracy. Nothing wrong with the MOE handguards, they are a great option for those on a budget. |
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I will only use a rail mounted front sight as a backup. Why? Because a FF rail BY DESIGN moves independently of the barrel. Where the FF moves, you POA moves. Where the barrel moves, the POI moves. Me, I like my POI to be as close to the POA as possible., but I'm funny like that. When the primary (and only) sights on the rifle are irons, my front sight is mounted on the barrel. To my mind, the purpose of a lightweight (NONE of my firearms are safe queens) is to aid in carrying for long distances without fatiguing the operator. When I get where I'm going with said rifle, I'd still like it to function properly, meaning be as accurate as possible, as comfortable as possible, and as durable as possible, within reason. Reminds me of the "gram junkies" I used to see on the bicycling circuit. They spent a ton of dough to make their bicycles as light as possible, hollowed titanium this, minimalist carbon fiber that. Their rigs constantly broke down on the road, and even if they were faster than me, I finished WAY ahead of them. Light is good. Light compromising function is not. Joe You should be careful talking common sense on this forum...
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I will only use a rail mounted front sight as a backup. Why? Because a FF rail BY DESIGN moves independently of the barrel. Where the FF moves, you POA moves. Where the barrel moves, the POI moves. Me, I like my POI to be as close to the POA as possible., but I'm funny like that. When the primary (and only) sights on the rifle are irons, my front sight is mounted on the barrel. To my mind, the purpose of a lightweight (NONE of my firearms are safe queens) is to aid in carrying for long distances without fatiguing the operator. When I get where I'm going with said rifle, I'd still like it to function properly, meaning be as accurate as possible, as comfortable as possible, and as durable as possible, within reason. Reminds me of the "gram junkies" I used to see on the bicycling circuit. They spent a ton of dough to make their bicycles as light as possible, hollowed titanium this, minimalist carbon fiber that. Their rigs constantly broke down on the road, and even if they were faster than me, I finished WAY ahead of them. Light is good. Light compromising function is not. Joe If you are talking about iron sights then yes you might see some slight accuracy gain from using a standard front sight block, but you are still using a non floating barrel so you are losing accuracy there. You can have both however and still have a setup the same weight as an moe handguard setup. I was assuming the use of optics though since that seems to be the direction most people go. Your argument that a lightweight rifle, or a rifle with a free float handguard is somehow less reliable is flawed however. |
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Light compromising function is not. Joe This is what I was trying to get at. I think function starts diminishing under 6 lbs. You can do some crafty voodoo witchery and get slightly under it while still retaining full functionality but I do not believe that is anything other than the exception and not the rule. I think "lightweight" starts under 7lbs unloaded and insane or unusable starts under 5.5lbs. I say for a fighting carbine thats legal in every state (minus the retarded fh or stock or other legalities like those) should be in the 6-7lbs range and as close to the bottom side of that as possible. JMO of course. |
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This one is 6.3 pounds with a fully loaded pmag of m855. If you removed the goodies and put mbus sights on it, it would be even less. So that is 5.2lbs unloaded, and the only compromise that was made was the plumcrazy lower and a 9mm flashider. I did not mess with the bolt-carrier or any other functional components. Here it is shown with a .22lr conversion installed.   |
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