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Posted: 7/8/2010 11:34:26 AM EDT
| I am an armorer for my department and we recently got some new S&W MP15s, 5.56. So far, we have had several malfunctions with the weapons, mostly feeding issues. On two seperate occasions, the round flipped and got jammed on top of the bolt. Anyone else experience problems with the MP15? |
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I am an armorer for my department and we recently got some new S&W MP15s, 5.56. So far, we have had several malfunctions with the weapons, mostly feeding issues. On two seperate occasions, the round flipped and got jammed on top of the bolt. Anyone else experience problems with the MP15? Welcome to the forum! I've never seen that with my M&P, but I probably don't use it near as hard as your guys do. So a fresh round did a complete 180 and ended up pointing back towards the rear of the rifle? Or, this was an empty? |
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Your department shoulda bought Colts. Second reply, one more than I figured it would take.  Tell it to my friend that just bought a brand new 6940 that was defective right out of the box.
To the OP, I've never seen anything like that in my own M&P or any other that I've been around. Does sound like something that may be mag related. Are the mags old and possibly misshapen around the feed lips? If it does turn out to be a weapon issue, I'm sure S&W will take care of you. |
| My understanding is Colt never played nice with Police Depts. It's only now with the economy the way it is and Colt getting nervous about US Govt contracts are they making a push to get Police Dept contracts. As far as the Smith.....mine works great. No issues that I couldn't pin on laquer coated ammo. |
| The first time it did it was with a brand new PMAG, the second time was with a surplus mil spec 30rd mag. Both times it was with a live round. Both guns had under 500 rounds through them. We used the same mags in the Colts and STAGs that we had and never had a problem. I had received information about questionable manufacturing on certain batches of MP15s, my rifles happen to be in the range that were suppose to be questionable. I was told of issues with the milling of mag well and sub standard barrels. That is why I am reaching out for any similar problems. The round on the last one was a Winchester FMJ that clearly misfed due to the fact the round was forced back into the casing halfway before flipping. I will try to post some pics tomorrow. |
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"You should drink less kool-aid. Smith makes a fine rifle."
Seems a lot of S&W AR's have problems from what I read on this forum. Being a fine rifle doesn't make it reliable. You should try it, the Kool-Aid tastes pretty sweet. I wouldn't hesitate sending them back to the manufacturer and have them make it right. Are they M4's, if so are the ramps ok? Sometimes feed ramp problems can cause feed issues. How do the Colts and Stags function? It's not unheard of for bullets to get hung up inbetween the extension lugs. |
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The first time it did it was with a brand new PMAG, the second time was with a surplus mil spec 30rd mag. Both times it was with a live round. Both guns had under 500 rounds through them. We used the same mags in the Colts and STAGs that we had and never had a problem. I had received information about questionable manufacturing on certain batches of MP15s, my rifles happen to be in the range that were suppose to be questionable. I was told of issues with the milling of mag well and sub standard barrels. That is why I am reaching out for any similar problems. The round on the last one was a Winchester FMJ that clearly misfed due to the fact the round was forced back into the casing halfway before flipping. I will try to post some pics tomorrow. This sounds like a situation for the manufacturer to remedy. Since you are LE (and possibly local to S&W - your location is listed as MA), I'd imagine they would make it right PDQ. |
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The first time it did it was with a brand new PMAG, the second time was with a surplus mil spec 30rd mag. Both times it was with a live round. Both guns had under 500 rounds through them. We used the same mags in the Colts and STAGs that we had and never had a problem. I had received information about questionable manufacturing on certain batches of MP15s, my rifles happen to be in the range that were suppose to be questionable. I was told of issues with the milling of mag well and sub standard barrels. That is why I am reaching out for any similar problems. The round on the last one was a Winchester FMJ that clearly misfed due to the fact the round was forced back into the casing halfway before flipping. I will try to post some pics tomorrow. This sounds like a situation for the manufacturer to remedy. Since you are LE (and possibly local to S&W - your location is listed as MA), I'd imagine they would make it right PDQ. I concur. If you've ruled out magazine or ammunition as the root cause then I'd advise having S&W address the issue. They will make it right. My experience has been much like most other M&P15 owners - my M&P15T has functioned flawlessly for ~2,000 rounds and a fairly wide variety of ammo. My experience with S&W's customer service over the years has been equally as positive and dependable. They'll take care of you. |
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I have got quite a few coyote skins that got taken with the S&W 15T heavy barrel target model and it gets carried and used hard.It is a custom shop model and never had problems.I do however have a big problem with the S&W repair,services,info people.When paying about $2,000 for that rifle with the custom trigger and Lothar barrrel and handguard and stock the least you should expect is an instruction manual in detail for that rifle.I called repeatedly,sent Emails and even a letter to no avail,all that got sent to me was a generic book that covered the cheap basic $700 model
That to me is a shitty way to treat a customer who pays that kind of money (And Profit Margin) should at least get a book even if they have to make one up detailing handguard removal ect in that custom gun which was my question first asked of them and never answered.Due to that that pricey rifle is the very last weapon that I will purchase or own from them. |
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So, my S&W problems continue. We have had 3 guns fail with the same malfunction. It has happen twice with metal mags and once with a PMAG. I have attached two pics of the misfeeds. The ammo is Winchester .223 hollow point boattail 69 grain on each incident. Both rounds are live, one flipped and feed on top of the bolt and the other one did not flip. I have never seen this happen before and I have run numerous ranges.
http://i760.photobucket.com/albums/xx249/sykosully413/2010-08-12_09-16-57_266.jpg http://i760.photobucket.com/albums/xx249/sykosully413/2010-07-06110306.jpg |
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Quoted: This is happening as guys are charging the weapon while on patrol, this is not happening while on a firing range. I have talked to S&W, they feel it is a mag issue. OK...maybe dumb but here goes I have a marlin 60 .22 rifle, bolt doesn't stay open after last round. After loading/reloading, you have to cock it by pulling the bolt back. Without fail the thing would jam similar to the pictures above. What I noticed is, if you ride the bolt closed, it'll do that. If you just pull it back, release it quickly, "let 'er fly", it won't jam. So...when your guys are charging their rifles, are they pulling back on the charging handles and letting them fly forward or riding them back down? Might be something and might not. *shrugs* |
| i only personally know 2 people tha have bought smith ar's, both had feeding issues. 1 was sent back to factory (early smith) when i think someone else was actually making them and fixed. the other, we polished the chamber....... smoothed the feedramp...... cleaned and cleaned and finally got it extracting and feeding most of the time. kinda soured me on smith ar's. i own bushmaster, dpms, mueller and a couple of doublestar kit guns...... also a PLINKER, for all you koo; aid drinkers........ they have all been 100%. |
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Hillboy,
Those pictures both look like a bolt override. Check the extractors, extractor spring, and ejectors. Try the entire BCG in another working rifle and see if you can duplicate the malfunction. One overlooked cause of this is simply operator error in which, as mentioned earlier, the user rides the bolt foward instead of releasing it. By riding the bolt, the extractor may not fully seat on the rim of the case, loosening up as the bolt is pulled to the rear, and causing a bolt override. Be sure that the operators are conducting administrative loads properly by locking the bolt to the rear, inserting the loaded magazine and pressing the bolt release on the side of the rifle. If these actions do not correct the malfunction, contact your S&W LE rep and he should take actions to resolve the problem immediately. Stay safe! |
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Same thing happened on my Colt. Turned out that I didn't have the magazine in all the way as you really have to slap it up in there with
it fully loaded. I make damned sure its slapped into place when loading a fully loaded 30 round magazine and the problem has never happened to me again. This may or not be your problem but thought I would add my experience. Good luck getting it resolved. |
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Same thing happened on my Colt. Turned out that I didn't have the magazine in all the way as you really have to slap it up in there with it fully loaded. I make damned sure its slapped into place when loading a fully loaded 30 round magazine and the problem has never happened to me again. This may or not be your problem but thought I would add my experience. Good luck getting it resolved. Also down loading by two rounds will get the mag to lock in better on a closed bolt. |
You should have bought BCM. *Joke* 
Seriously though, you should box up each malfunctioning rifle and send them back with a detailed note descibing the problem. Insist they stand behind their product. Regarding colts, they are great rifles and I love them but I have to say the only out of the box rifles I've had problems with have been two new colt ARs. One short stroking and the other had an out of spec disconnector that would lock the trigger up. I replaced with a Bushmaster disconnector and it fixed the problem. Every manufacturer puts out a few lemons occasionally. Good luck |
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This is happening as guys are charging the weapon while on patrol, this is not happening while on a firing range. I have talked to S&W, they feel it is a mag issue. OK...maybe dumb but here goes I have a marlin 60 .22 rifle, bolt doesn't stay open after last round. After loading/reloading, you have to cock it by pulling the bolt back. Without fail the thing would jam similar to the pictures above. What I noticed is, if you ride the bolt closed, it'll do that. If you just pull it back, release it quickly, "let 'er fly", it won't jam. So...when your guys are charging their rifles, are they pulling back on the charging handles and letting them fly forward or riding them back down? Might be something and might not. *shrugs* This. Maybe their being too careful and afraid to let it fly. |
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