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Posted: 7/19/2006 4:19:26 PM EDT
I'm not one for useless gadgets and gizmos, but this looks like it might have some merit. Probably at least half of the AR failures I've seen over the years were due to blown primers blocking the trigger. DPMS unveils the Patent applied for "Receiver Rug", a rubber molded 3-dimensional gasket that blocks blown primers and other debris from wedging under the trigger action. Designed for easy installation into the bottom of the lower receiver, This clever little device is a must for competition shooters, 3-gunners, military and Law Enforcement because it keep's you in the fight! |
I agree. I think Colt is an old has-been name, and they seriously fail to keep up with current technology in the shooting field. You're just paying for an old name. The guys who only know Colt and Bushmaster, are often the ones who only know what they hear from their buddies. And if you think DPMS "sucks" that may be one of the first complaints I have heard about them...if it actually counts as a complaint. |
I own a few DPMS components and I’m happy with the products I have. No DPMS bashing here, but…….. I’m sorry the receiver rug is simply a product designed to turn a profit. A product designed to address a problem that is not recurrent enough to even consider addressing in my book. |
I think he was just countering your flame of DPMS, for which you provided no examples of how it relates to the usefullness of the product discussed here, with a flame on Colt. 
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Lon_Moer and QUIB already pointed out the "usefullness" of this receiver rug. |
Do you really think this is a good idea to run this stuff through your gun just for a "test" of a $3 gizmo? |
Yup, really. Including several thousand XM193, XM193PD, XM855PD, Olympic M193, SA battlepack, PMP commercial, Q3131, Q3131A, Fed AE, Rem UMC, Wolf, and a bunch more I'm sure I'll never remember. I repeat, I have NEVER had a blown primer fall into my action. Not a single time, EVER. I hear about this every so often and wonder if you guys are shooting 5.56 in .223 chambers. Btw, M193 has crimped primers, how the hell is it popping out on you?? |
It's happened to me a couple (maybe more) times over the years. Worth a try... might just be cheap insurance. |
I have seen it twice once was a Colt M16 and the other was a armalite A3 carbine both were with winchester Q3131 and within a couple of months of each other the armalite guy bought the rifle "broken" out of the newspaper dirt cheap needless to say he was estatic when I fixed his rifle in 5 minute and didn't charge him anything I heard some scuttlebut about win putting out a bad batch of 3131 about that time ( late 2000) so i blame it on that but it will sure tie up a rifle so yeah it has a purpose but i don't think Ill buy one |
| While shooting some old Talon Manufacturing M196 Tracer rounds, I had a primer fall into the lower which blocked the action causing a failure. Since this has already happened to me, chances are it should never happen to me again. I am statistically "Blown Primer Proof". Talon Manufacturing M196 tracer ammo is now "Range Use Only" for me. I do not think the "blown primer" is common enough to justify this item. If there was a real problem, would not Stoner have put slots in the bottom of the reciever for the primers to fall out? |
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I've heard of it, but seen only once, over here, luckily on the range. One of my guys was "WTF?", Trigger all locked up. after clearing it and breaking it open, we were able to clear the primer out. Ammo ? Later I realized I hadn't even looked, and have been kicking myself for stupidity since then. I know we have a many different lots of ammo, and have seen quite a bit of radway green both in our unit and other units. |
If DMPS would just chamber their rifles properly, they wouldn't have a need for such a device. |
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A buddy of mine experienced a bunch of blown primers when shooting crappy Adcom ammo. A couple of times, it jammed up his FCG. The solution was very simple. He stopped shooting that ammo. Which seems like a pretty simple fix to me. I'm not sure how a chunk of rubber shoved into your FCG would help any. The relatively small space surrounding an AR-15 FCG probably increases the likelihood of foreign material getting jammed in it. Making it an even smaller space could just increase the possibilities of something binding the FCG. Look at an AK for example. It has an enormous amount of space around its FCG and is well known for its reliability. |
+1 |
No If you really want to get down to it, I'll give the reasons why DPMS sucks that I refered to in the first page. Here it goes: Improperly chamber barrels One of the few companies using cast lowers when everyone else was forged Cast front sight bases (I don't know if they still do this) The receiver rug Cast lower components Tight Charging Handle Channels in their uppers A few others I can't think of off the top of my head. I'll add them later. I found it quite interesting on the DPMS episode of American Rifleman, how Randy Luth talked about how "milspec" their rifles were while one of their employees was squirting a bunch of loctite on an out of spec receiver extension. |
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heh i do own a dpms m4 and have well over 4000 rounds through it with not one problem. i will definitly buy another. why all the flaming?I can see it if your that insucure about your rifle being outperformed by another. If i accutally listened to you guys on here bout how crappy they are i would have never bought one. most complaint i see about the dpms are by people that have never owned one. go by hear say. Just like glock and the XD. If i listened to the glock owners i wouldnt have bought my XD .45 acp. Glad i didnt listen to any of the haters. cuz now i own 2 great arms and wouldnt trade them for anything. so flame away as i laugh i need more comedy. |
The M4 I toted for a year in Iraq had a cast FSB. You could see the mold line down the middle of it, and where they'd ground the flash off of it. Worked pretty well for me, cast or not. BTW, the rifle was a Colt Defence M4. |
No it didn't
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Why don't you ask Pat Rogers in a recent IN class where all 7 DPMS M4s of the SWAT team went down thanks to the overly tight chamber. It's not an isolated incident. Either you got lucky and got a good one, or you really haven't worked that carbine hard. |
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Scotty - let's talk more about the improperly chambered barrels. What is the "proper" demension? What is the demension of a DPMS barrel? How many have you personally seen and mic'ed that were out of spec? Forrest - sounds anecdotal........ All 7? Were those chamber's mic'ed? Were they DPMS tubes? Were they brand new guns that the team just received and took? Did the staff armorer 'tweek' them? There are so many questions that the story doesn't mean much. What also doesn't mean much - the number "7" - seven out of how many in 2005 alone? If it was a wide spread problem don't you think we read about it on a daily basis on this board and others "DPMS Chamber's Too Tight" and that DPMS would have to institute a recall of some sort? The really sad part - there are people here that genuinely think that by reading a forum that they will get good advice as to how to spend their hard earned money. |
That is just a recent one, Pat's got more, heck I've seen problems with DPMS guns due to improper gas port size.
Yep Were those chamber's mic'ed?
Yes The 'rest of the story' is on another AR related site.
Armorer did nothing - but Pat & crew
That story speaks volumes. A police force that receive a batch of uppers for duty use and ALL of them failed? Did nobody test them?
Seven out of a batch of 7 indicates a problem, especially if you're shipping to a SWAT team that is supposed to be using them to protect the public. But like I said this was just 1 class, this has been seen (and reported on) for years.
DPMS just passed the blame (you did read the entire thread didn't you?)
Pat sees more AR's running hard in a month then 99.9999% of the people in this forum will see in their lifetime. He's been training LEOs and civilians for years. Yeah I think he's passing on good advice. BTW he is not the only trainer to have noticed this, he just happened to have a recent post to backup the comment. |
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Forrest - for clarification - you were not in attendance during said event - correct? (The way you have phased everything - this is how it reads) Specifically, what did Pat and his crew do to get these out of spec chambers running? If it didn't involve a lathe and reaming - it wasn't the chamber. For the record - I don't have a full DPMS anything. I am just REALLY sick of people without facts - like "fuck yeah, I was there, it was mine, the spec was 0.0001 over and it failed like this, and here is how I / we / they fixed it ......folks just tossing shit out there for the sake of having something to say and then have others that don't know take it like it is the gospel is bullshit. As for DPMS passing the blame - again - one event - I had an issue with DPMS... I called... asked to speak to THE big fuckin cheese himself - Randy Luth... he took the call right then and there..... took care of it on his nickle and fast too... said straight up - you tell me what you want me to do - fix it or give you your money back... no bullshit......as a result you can see why I am skeptical of "DPMS passing the blame"....kinda like a few months ago when someone posted that they bought a parts kit at a show and then claimed DPMS shorted them. Sorry if I'm cranky. And you and Scotty may have umpteen facts behind what you say. If you do - great - post them. ELEVATE the discussion. Again - not here to beat on anyone. Just really want to see more informed discussion. |
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Never had anything jam up my trigger or buffer tube, But I have had WWB ammo pop a primer and get stuck in the barrel extension bolt lug area this was fun to clear. took me a minuet to figure out what was stopping the bolt from going home(Dam forward assist first time I need it and *$@^). Maybe a receiver rug with fly paper on it to keep stuff from bouncing around. 
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Correct.
It did involve a reaming.
I belive DPMS did ask that of the SWAT team - their response "Send us 7 Colt uppers".
This is not an isolated incident and this types of occurances have been going on for years. Many of these stories have been posted on here since the board began, feel free to search the archives and ask Goatboy if he can provide the posts from the first board and the original AR15-L. But I suspect no matter what is posted you still won't want to believe. IM inbound.
Hm I've already post a link to the comments made by one of the top M4 trainers in the country (if not the world). I don't see how it can get much higher elevated. |
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Scotty - I guess I don't follow...if I am not related to DPMS in any way shape or form, don't profit from them and can not tell you what motivates them to do what they do, why is it on me? I asked you a question. I asked you for specific info. Just like in the LB thread..... I'm not here to piss in the pool...... |
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Why do technical discussions, narrowly defined around a certain part or problem, have to turn into a general bashing of one company or another? I just went through this on another board when I asked about a Lee reloader. Out of 20 responses 2 were people, familiar with Lee loaders, who took the time to answer my question, the rest were Dillon owners trashing a company who's products they've never owned or used. Or did own and couldn't get to work right. C'mon people, is this shit really necessary? I think some of you look for certain company names in thread titles just so you can pop in and trash the company. For example, start any thread with "Olympic" in the title and within 10 posts MarkM will appear, with no useful information to the OP, but just to bash the company. It gets fucking old. If said company were a contributor here the mods would put a stop to it fast. |
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I had a pebble get lodged under my trigger once on the qual range, the only way I can see how it go there was it was a windy day and the Army has this brilliant idea of having you lock your bolt to the rear with no mag and laying it on a sandbag before you shoot. I think it enterd then. Point is, that it caused me to score a sharpshooter for the first time in my life and it took the armorer a month to figure out why the rifle wouldnt shoot. If someone could come up with something decent that worked for this (like the receiver rug but actually works) I would invest the money just so it didnt happen to me again. |
That's odd. If you can't move the trigger, or get the hammer to fall, then it should be obvious that the problem is with the FCG. In less than 5 minutes, your armorer should have been able to pull that FCG out, see the offending pebble, and then remove it. I don’t understand how that could take a month to troubleshoot. On the completely different topic that has hijacked this thread: I like how there is a diversity of AR manufacturers out there. This makes the market competitive. This increases ingenuity. Some new ideas are poor, whereas others are quite good and very useful additions to the platform. Many times it is just hit and miss. So if a company doesn’t even try, there’s no way to progress. Also, this diversity of manufactures allows for certain companies to market their products in different price ranges. So companies like Olympic and DPMS allow for those of us that are less fortunate to own an AR. There’s nothing wrong with that. I wouldn’t scoff at some kid just out of college who is proud of his AR, just because it’s an Olympic or DPMS. That being said, a lower price is no excuse for manufacturing a firearm that doesn’t function correctly. That is where research is good for the first time buyer. Weigh the pros and cons, and then make a decision. Personally, I always try to buy the best. I have this innate ability to break things that aren’t built like a tank. (I’ve got a pile of cheap optics to prove it.) Many times, about half of what I hear is truth and the other half I have to figure out myself. What gets me, is that a lot of times the products that many people say are good/great, tend be where the discrepancy is. When people say that a product is cheaply built, they usually are right. When people say that a product is well built, is where I tend to disagree. I used to work at a precision CNC machine shop, so I’m kind of snobby about fit and finish. For me, my rating sort-of goes like this: Adequate to good: Equal to commercial aircraft parts +/- 0.01 tolerance. Great to excellent: Microwave data transmission parts +/- 0.003 tolerance. Amazing to perfect: Space station data cable connector (wire EDM) +/- 0.001 tolerance. |
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