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Posted: 3/11/2006 10:45:46 AM EDT
maybe someone can help me id the rifle i had in the Air Force. i wasnt much into WHAT i had/used/carried etc (as long as i could put rounds downrange) so i never paid much attention to that info...

heres what it was:

AR/M 15-16
safe-semi-auto
skinny barrel
3-prong flash hider
green furniture
triangle shaped charging handle (not the current T style)
less than 12,100 serial number
push-pin front take-down pin (i THINK. its been 14 years)

im thinking it WAS a Colt's but could be wrong. i only carried it one week during a deployment exercise and then in a garbage bag* to keep dry and half way clean. the Air Force wasnt too concerned about giving ammo (blank or otherwise) let alone magazines to Photographers/Videographers.

thanks for everyone's help in ADVANCE

david

*
1cut small portion of a bottom corner off a garbage bag.
2insert rifle inside garbage bag, stock to the bottom.
3feed sling thru hole in garbage bag and attach to sling swivel.
4feed muzzle end of sling into garbage bag and attach to front sling swivel.
5 wrap excess garbage bag around rifle until snug and the wrap with 100mph tape to cut down on
'flappage' caused by loose garbage bag.
6at turn in time, open garbage bag and remove nearly pristine rifle for the armorer to complain about
(how dirty it is and you can counter that "if its dirty, then thats how it was issued" and walk away)

Link Posted: 3/12/2006 6:41:30 AM EDT
Scroll down and look at all the pics and read the info:

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=241681
Link Posted: 3/12/2006 7:03:51 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/12/2006 5:21:36 PM EDT


this is exactly what im talking about! fantastic...

im beginning to think i might have been wrong about the flash hider. the post calls for a duckbill and i may have gotten that confused with a standard 3 prong...

thanks

david
Link Posted: 3/12/2006 6:16:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ltdave:
img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/ltdave/CHold.jpg

this is exactly what im talking about! fantastic...

im beginning to think i might have been wrong about the flash hider. the post calls for a duckbill and i may have gotten that confused with a standard 3 prong...

thanks

david



The "duck bill" term is slang, I just like the name. Will probably change it to A, B, C, etc later on. But yes the Model 601 or Model 01, or US Air Force AR-15, or what ever you want to call it had the first version of the flash hider.

That picture is of a clone, an SP1 with a bunch of old parts on it, but does have the look of the real deal. Here are some more recent pictures of the Model 01 clone, now have a complete upper less the windage drum (and my handguards are rough):







Link Posted: 3/13/2006 1:57:22 PM EDT
i want to get one just like that since thats what i was issued the ONE time...

thanks for the fantastic pics... where i might i find the Armalite charging handle, notch-less bolt carrier group type A flash hider etc?

not that i have any money to get an SP1 anyway...

thanks

david
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 5:55:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ltdave:
i want to get one just like that since thats what i was issued the ONE time...

thanks for the fantastic pics... where i might i find the Armalite charging handle, notch-less bolt carrier group type A flash hider etc?

not that i have any money to get an SP1 anyway...

thanks

david



Piecing together a Model 01 from scratch? That is a tough one, do you want real Model 01 parts, or is something kinda like it, or reproduction parts going to do it for you?
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:02:43 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:18:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Stickman:
Ekie,

To put things in perspective, how long did it take, and roughly how much did it cost to BUILD your 601 clone?



The clone is made up of all original Model 01 parts (some refinished) save the windage drum, receiver extension, lower receiver, and some of the small lower receiver parts.

Spending an average of an hour or so a day searching for parts, took me about 2 years to get where I am at now.

At the moment the total is $1,610.54 complete with mag as shown in the pictures. Did end up with a extra stripped upper that I am selling, so that price will go down. But, will end up getting an earlier SP1 to serve as a host, and that will drive the cost up.


Originally Posted By Stickman:
Ekie,

What do you estimate the cost would be for someone to buy one?



You mean piece one together?

Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:26:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ltdave:
i want to get one just like that since thats what i was issued the ONE time...

thanks for the fantastic pics... where i might i find the Armalite charging handle, notch-less bolt carrier group type A flash hider etc?

not that i have any money to get an SP1 anyway...

thanks

david



Try total silence in the industry section
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 7:00:12 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 7:25:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/14/2006 7:30:21 AM EDT by Ekie]

Originally Posted By Stickman:

I don't think a lot of people understand what you went through to end up getting the parts, so if you included the price of the total parts (not including what you resold to recoup losses), what do you think it was total?



Do keep a spreadsheet on each project, did not break this one down like that. For instance if four bolt groups were puchased and sold three, the net expense is what is keyed in for the cost of the bolt group.


Originally Posted By Stickman:

Secondly, what would your price be (parts and labor) if someone wanted to buy yours, or have you build one for them off their existing SP1 donor gun.



If it were to sell (God forbid) would part it out, in that my experience is that the sum of the parts is more then the whole. Don't see why the parts would not go for at least $2,000.

Far as doing smithing for others, don't have time, have about 9 rifle projects going at the moment (mostly Kalashnikovs) and at least five of these are complete, just need to be assembled.

Far as part searches for others, that is something I do. You come up with a part and ask about something else, then what comes around goes around. That is how it works with "collectibles". If I were to find a Model 01 firing pin, or say a rubber coated AK74 buttplate today, you can bet it ain't going on the EE, dibs has already been called on those from others who have "hooked me up".
Link Posted: 3/16/2006 1:23:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/16/2006 1:25:41 PM EDT by KurtVF]
original duckbills and waffle mags are almost impossible to find. Early heavy firing pins and retaining pins are in the "near" impossible category. The green furniture is around but usually always beat up (it was simply spray painted over the fiberite.) If you keep looking and are willing to pay you will eventually find what you want. P.S. WA Tom's stuff looks great. I wish he had it a few years earlier.
Link Posted: 3/16/2006 3:59:26 PM EDT
i dont really need a 'complete' 601...

just one that LOOKS like it on the outside...

the green short stock and triangle handguards, the notchless bolt carrier, the duckbill or 3 prong flash hider and the armalite charging handle. put it all on a slick sided rifle and i would be happy...

thats all i want...

david
Link Posted: 3/16/2006 6:51:01 PM EDT
Just watch the EE for an SP1 rifle and go from there. Genuine Colt chrome bolt carriers show up on the EE and Ebay pretty regular, I just picked one up that didn't have the gas key. One with the gas key was just on ebay.

Order the CH from TS. 3 prong or repro duckbill. Green furniture will be harder.

rj
Link Posted: 3/17/2006 5:58:03 AM EDT
I can do repro green furniture with a 100% color match. I can do it if there is enough intrest.
Link Posted: 3/17/2006 5:55:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ltdave:
i dont really need a 'complete' 601...

just one that LOOKS like it on the outside...

the green short stock and triangle handguards, the notchless bolt carrier, the duckbill or 3 prong flash hider and the armalite charging handle. put it all on a slick sided rifle and i would be happy...

thats all i want...

david



Like the others said, if just want the look get an SP1 and a few repro parts and there you go. Far as the green furniture goes we need to bug Kurt into getting another batch of paint done.
Link Posted: 3/17/2006 7:33:07 PM EDT
Anybody ever seen a real model 01 sling??? Check out pics of the 01 early XM16E1 the sling has a hook on one end (non adjustable) and a compression buckle on the other. Story I heard was that colt produced these slings (and the green rubber handle bayonet)with the early rifles before they were accepted by the military. Once the rifles became standard issue the military procured slings and bayonets from their usual suppliers. My 1964 SP1 came with such a sling but it was BLACK rather than the model 01 sling which I am told was GREEN.(I've only seen B&W photos)
Link Posted: 3/17/2006 7:54:54 PM EDT
Last summer I sold an slab side upper that had the Verified Proof bbl, cast FSB, 12 on the bbl, etc before I read the M16 sticky . I don't have pics anymore to see if it actually had a 601 or 604 upper rec. I am pretty sure it was AF 604. It had been refinished black somewhere along the way and had an A1 FH.

rj
Link Posted: 3/17/2006 11:05:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rjay:
Last summer I sold an slab side upper that had the Verified Proof bbl, cast FSB, 12 on the bbl, etc before I read the M16 sticky . I don't have pics anymore to see if it actually had a 601 or 604 upper rec. I am pretty sure it was AF 604. It had been refinished black somewhere along the way and had an A1 FH.

rj



The first barrel I got with a cast FSB I figured to have been messed with and sold it. Only later did I figure out it was a rare early barrel. Ooops.
Link Posted: 3/17/2006 11:19:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By KurtVF:
I can do repro green furniture with a 100% color match. I can do it if there is enough intrest.



How much?


TS
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 3:34:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Ekie:

Originally Posted By rjay:
Last summer I sold an slab side upper that had the Verified Proof bbl, cast FSB, 12 on the bbl, etc before I read the M16 sticky . I don't have pics anymore to see if it actually had a 601 or 604 upper rec. I am pretty sure it was AF 604. It had been refinished black somewhere along the way and had an A1 FH.

rj



The first barrel I got with a cast FSB I figured to have been messed with and sold it. Only later did I figure out it was a rare early barrel. Ooops.



I can hear it now............

"Naw........this barrel has a cast FSB, and I refuse to build my genuine reproduction effort with knock-off junk........so I'll put it up for sale.......cheap........in the EE"

Link Posted: 3/18/2006 5:55:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By redfisher:

Originally Posted By Ekie:

Originally Posted By rjay:
Last summer I sold an slab side upper that had the Verified Proof bbl, cast FSB, 12 on the bbl, etc before I read the M16 sticky . I don't have pics anymore to see if it actually had a 601 or 604 upper rec. I am pretty sure it was AF 604. It had been refinished black somewhere along the way and had an A1 FH.

rj



The first barrel I got with a cast FSB I figured to have been messed with and sold it. Only later did I figure out it was a rare early barrel. Ooops.



I can hear it now............

"Naw........this barrel has a cast FSB, and I refuse to build my genuine reproduction effort with knock-off junk........so I'll put it up for sale.......cheap........in the EE"




Yep, sold it for $50.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 6:35:22 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TigerStripe:

Originally Posted By KurtVF:
I can do repro green furniture with a 100% color match. I can do it if there is enough intrest.



How much?


TS



I never thought about it. I guess it would depend on if you supplied the stocks, how much prep work was needed, if you took the sling swivel off etc. I would'nt be doing it to make a living but I would prefer to do more than one at a time to make the whole thing simpler. I think I sold several bottles of the paint (I think we figured 8 oz. would do a stock set) for $15-$20.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 8:09:46 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Ekie:
Yep, sold it for $50.



Sorry, I got $300 for the VP bbl'ed upper with no ch,bcg .

The problem is that I had several 604 uppers and that was just one of them. I had one C MP C bbl'ed upper that I had made ban compliant so I could mount it up and shoot it on a RRA lower back in the bad old days. I sold all the non-molested ones and kept that one. It shoots fine, just missing the bayo lug and has a 3 prong FH held on with set screws.

rj
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 8:17:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By rjay:

Originally Posted By Ekie:
Yep, sold it for $50.



Sorry, I got $300 for the VP bbl'ed upper with no ch,bcg .

The problem is that I had several 604 uppers and that was just one of them. I had one C MP C bbl'ed upper that I had made ban compliant so I could mount it up and shoot it on a RRA lower back in the bad old days. I sold all the non-molested ones and kept that one. It shoots fine, just missing the bayo lug and has a 3 prong FH held on with set screws.

rj



Rub it in.
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