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Posted: 7/3/2005 9:43:54 AM EDT
[#1]
Pic from the museum on Rock Island Arsenal.
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Posted: 7/3/2005 10:16:14 AM EDT
[#2]
What is the barrel length with the mod on 5883 and 5864? Which models are they considered? I think that 5864 with a slightly longer barrel is as close as I can get in this state.
At some point, I would like to alter the below carbine to be a little more correct. Not exact, but a little closer. I was going to replace the lower with a slabside, but it doesn't really look like that is needed. 
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Posted: 7/3/2005 10:21:45 AM EDT
[#3]
Hey, Stickman!
Those would be XM177E2s but I'm not certain on the designation for with vs. without forward assist. Colt653 could probably enlighten us or probably even Ekie or ScottyRyan. Those should be 11.5" barrels excluding the flash supressors/moderators. With the correct length non-NFA moderator, you come up about an inch short without SBR'ing it. Are you in an SBR-friendly state? |
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Posted: 7/3/2005 10:48:40 AM EDT
[#4]
Oh sure, kick a man when he's down..... 
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Posted: 7/3/2005 1:58:53 PM EDT
[#5]
To make an NFA legal carbine cut the bbl to 12.5" and attach WA-TOM's moderator for an OAL of 16.1". Once we move to our new location I will gear up and start making more of my XM177E2 kits and complete carbines with our new A1 lowers. We're also hoping to be able to offer Sandstrom 9A recoating for those that want the original Colt Gray color.
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Posted: 7/3/2005 1:59:37 PM EDT
[#6]
The XM177E2's without fwd assist are USAF GAU-5's
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Posted: 7/3/2005 2:59:19 PM EDT
[#7]
Colt Model 630 |
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Posted: 7/3/2005 3:03:08 PM EDT
[#8]
*deleted*
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Posted: 7/3/2005 3:45:06 PM EDT
[#9]
Here' my repro of the GAU-5A/A. IMO, nothing more cool than the XM177 type rifles.
Dan 
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Posted: 7/4/2005 4:24:17 AM EDT
[#10]
Greek SF
 
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Posted: 7/4/2005 4:45:59 AM EDT
[#11]
Ain't that the truth |
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Posted: 7/4/2005 5:02:37 AM EDT
[#12]
when i wa in the usaf security police in the late 80's early 90's we had quite a few gau-5's. we used them for gate banging " searching vehicles" . area supervisors and shift comanders were also issued the gau-5. in tec school we also qualified on xm-148 grenade launchers. when we got permantly stationed we qualified with the m-203. m-9, m-60 anyway cool pics,if i can figure how to post a picture i''ll post one ot the gau-5 i carried.
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Posted: 7/4/2005 5:18:12 AM EDT
[#13]
What model of grenade fit the 177 moderator? |
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Posted: 7/4/2005 6:02:26 AM EDT
[#14]
UXB, I rehosted the color-corrected pic at another location. The issue came about when I wanted to put up family photos for someone at photobucket and would have broken the link by moving the SOG photo. Thanks, though.
I've seen GAUs on the backs of USAF folks in the Balkans with M4 barrels. |
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Posted: 7/4/2005 6:24:57 AM EDT
[#15]
I'm pretty sure those were to maintain organic night vision while prepping for the raid, it's standard practice to acclimate in red light before night ops. I would think that a red lens over your eyes at night would make it more difficult to see. |
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Posted: 7/4/2005 10:51:16 AM EDT
[#16]
The GAU-5's with M4 barrels are called GUU-5/P's. They are rebarreled Colt 654's that previously had 1:12" M16A1 Carbine barrels and were rebarreled with M4 1:7" barrels.
Hope this info helps. Sammy
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Posted: 7/4/2005 11:37:12 AM EDT
[#17]
That would be a precursor to today's modern Red dot sight-The Armson OEG(Occluded Gun sight). |
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Posted: 7/4/2005 12:52:56 PM EDT
[#18]
The Red Dot sights used were made by SinglePoint of Great Britain Ltd and were held in place with fabricated mounts or black tape. The sight is basically an early version of the OEG...tritium and ambient light powered…..as soon as I have some free time I will post some pics of the unit I have on one of my XM177E2s
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Posted: 7/5/2005 7:50:17 AM EDT
[#19]
A better view of the SinglePoint;
 Secretary of Defense Melvin Laird bestowing ribbons to Son Tay Raiders: 
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Posted: 7/5/2005 10:05:49 AM EDT
[#20]
hey! replace that bolt carrier!! |
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Posted: 7/5/2005 7:10:48 PM EDT
[#21]
Great pics.
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Posted: 7/5/2005 7:56:29 PM EDT
[#22]
 I slapped it together for the photo, then promptly locked the upper away in another location...now that I'm in a state where I can register an SBR, once I get that done, I'll have the upper shipped back to me so I can assemble it without feeling like a felon  |
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Posted: 7/6/2005 12:56:23 AM EDT
[#23]
Done a little research and now I'm wondering, I see "miner's lights" on the packing list for Son Tay. I'm thinking white light headlamps with red lens goggles maybe? I can't really see a reason, hence my wondering. Anyone know? I have a buddy who was in SOG during the Son Tay time frame and he knows some of the Raiders so maybe he'll know. |
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Posted: 7/6/2005 12:59:46 AM EDT
[#24]
Stick, you should grind the support webbing off the sides of that stock and coat it in gloss black 
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Posted: 7/6/2005 1:10:46 AM EDT
[#25]
and lose the bayo lug!
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Posted: 7/6/2005 8:40:48 AM EDT
[#26]
Until you guys brought it up, I hadn't even noticed the bayonet lug......
 Lumpy- I need to get an aluminum one for it eventually. Much like everything else, its a matter of time, and figuring out when and where I can get a good deal. |
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Posted: 7/7/2005 12:58:27 AM EDT
[#27]
Stickman,
Contact OAI, when I was there they still had some Al stocks (undrilled and unfinished) you might be able to get one and fix it up. |
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Posted: 7/14/2005 12:05:07 AM EDT
[#28]
Well I spoke with my buddy, he didn't know for sure. He says he tried to get in on the raid but he was in BNOC at the time and he couldn't get cut loose to volunteer for the "underwater welders" they were soliciting. He thinks the goggles were to protect night vision, maybe something to do with making lasers easier to see?
I saw a book at Barnes and Noble today, on the discout rack, History of Special Operations or something similiar, huge book. Anyway, there was a fairly detailed Son Tay section. In one of the pics there are several raiders sitting in a fuselage and more of them have clear lenses in their goggles than red ones. They all have the miner's lights mounted on their harnesses and one guy with the red lens goggles has his hand on tanks of what might be a welding rig. Maybe eye protection for the guys running the cutting torches?
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Posted: 8/1/2005 7:49:37 PM EDT
[#29]
These images are courtesy of AR15.com member Baja (A1C Drew) and were taken between 1989 and 1991.
   Sammy |
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Posted: 8/1/2005 9:26:40 PM EDT
[#31]
Tag.
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Posted: 8/2/2005 12:15:00 AM EDT
[#32]
  
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Posted: 8/2/2005 8:14:39 AM EDT
[#33]
Thanks, I missed that portion of the thread earlier! |
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Posted: 8/2/2005 11:12:30 AM EDT
[#34]
FWIW, the Son Tay raid is being made into a major motion picture. It is being directed by John Milius (The Wind and the Lion, Dirty Harry, Red Dawn, etc...) and the technical advisor is John Plaster, who was a member of Studies and Observations Group and a participant on the raid.
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Posted: 10/2/2005 6:53:59 AM EDT
[#35]
that always cracks me up. not seeing Son Tay on Plasters bio? list of Raider awardees |
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Posted: 10/3/2005 5:26:13 AM EDT
[#36]
Anybody know where a guy could find an old singlepoint scope? Are there any good UK forums out there that I should post on for this instead?
Thanks, Steve |
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Posted: 10/3/2005 5:34:56 AM EDT
[#37]
I am piecing together an XM177E2 clone, and have been looking for a SinglePoint. About the only thing I can find are references to the sight on STAR WARS web sites: www.thedentedhelmet.com/davin/replica_weapons.htm |
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Posted: 10/3/2005 6:46:36 AM EDT
[#38]
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Posted: 10/3/2005 7:31:14 AM EDT
[#39]
I can see the similarities of sitting on the couch watching Saving Pvt Ryan with your M1 Garand, and doing the same with a STAR WARS movie, well, maybe not, hehe. |
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Posted: 10/3/2005 8:51:46 AM EDT
[#40]
Tweak, I stand corrected. Probably something I read and misinterpreted from SOG, A Photo History of the Secret War authored by John Plaster. |
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Posted: 10/27/2005 1:30:35 PM EDT
[#41]
I know he was in SOG (that's where he knew my buddy from) just didn't know if he was in on the raid.
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Posted: 10/27/2005 8:10:27 PM EDT
[#42]
SOG didn't have any involvement in Son Tay, go to Greg Walker's At The Hurricane's Eye for details. Basically the DoD didn't trust the RVN echelons in SOG to maintain OPSEC. There was some prior CCN involvement, but I'm fuzzy on the details. I'm in Baghdad and away from my library.
Plaster ran out of CCC, Kontum, as I recall. The Raiders all came out of Training Group, 6th, and 7th. I'm 99 percent sure he was NOT in on the raid, but as far as weapons and training tech advising goes he'd be an excellent choice to help Jon out. Jon just needs to finish his Manila John Basilone project first. |
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Posted: 10/27/2005 8:26:21 PM EDT
[#43]
Whelp, he can't do it, but I can. Tag |
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Posted: 10/27/2005 10:53:35 PM EDT
[#44]
I don't think anyone said SOG was involved in the raid, they did put out "want ads" during the recruitment phase tho. Greg's a great guy, I've shot with him. |
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Posted: 10/28/2005 12:05:37 AM EDT
[#45]
drool |
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Posted: 10/28/2005 7:58:35 PM EDT
[#47]
Tag, as an inspiration to complete my project.
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Posted: 11/30/2005 7:47:56 PM EDT
[#48]
bump
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Posted: 12/1/2005 4:08:33 AM EDT
[#49]
tagged
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Posted: 12/1/2005 4:19:46 AM EDT
[#50]
Tagged too!
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