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Posted: 1/27/2005 6:35:19 AM EDT
| I just picked up a complete RRA UTE upper with the M4 style barrel. Looking for pics of complete rifles, or at least complete uppers with optics installed and opinions of the UTE upper. Do optics like the Eotech, Aimpoint and ACOG mount at the correct level? The UTE upper strikes me as a good idea, but wonder what those who have used them think. Pics and opinions are appreciated! |
No. Well the Aimpoint can if you use the crappy cheap ring that comes with it. But it won't work with any of the decent mounts. Though the UTE looks like the perfect receiver for thos with the BSA/Walmart $30 Red-Dots based on the height of the rail. |
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The UTE limits your optic options severely. The best setup is an AimPoint, using the cheapie aluminum mounting ring, and while it works, it's a pretty lousy setup IMO. The AimPoint is too far to the rear, and can't easily be removed if it becomes damaged, which would negate the use of your iron sights as well. Many of the low-end dot sights will also work, but that's about it. Everything in the industry is standardized around the height of the standard flattop, so I strongly recommend using one of those over a non-standard upper like the UTE. -Troy |
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Oh well, at least I know why I got it at such a good price! LOL...next time I'll ask first! I thought it would be a good solution since everyone seems to be using risers and mounting flip up irons on the flat tops. If nothing works with it, why does RRA keep making it? I've got a desktop mill, lathe, drill press, etc, etc at my disposal, if I made a more sturdy example of the aimpoint mount, would that be an acceptable solution? I'm a big guy with a long neck and thought the UTE would be perfect since an Eotech mounted directly to a flat top is way too low for me. Heck, a carry handle mount on my A2 rifle is only slightly too high for me. |
The only risers I see people using regularly are 1/4" spacers for their Aimpoints to put the irons in the lower 1/3. Most mounts put the optic at the right (2.6" HOB) height on a standard flattop.
Yep, lots of flip-ups. There are a variety of resons. Obviously they are the backup if the irons go down. But what if you want to mount a scope instead of a red-dot? With a flip up most scope will fit over them - with fixed sights most scope WON'T fit - at least not w/o a riser or seriously high rings. Then you defeat the purpose of having a flattop, to keep the optics at a reasonable height over bore.
We can't figure that one out - same with their 'tactical carry handle' it just defies logic. Then again why do people buy $1 each M855 rounds from Delta Force Catalog when you can order it from ammoman for less than $0.20 each?
Maybe. There is only 1 way to find out.
If the EOTech is too low then you might need to move the buttstock higher on your shoulder (the full butt plate does not need to be in full contact with your shoulder); you should bring the sight up to your eyes not your head down to the rifle. Another item that could help would be the LaRue mount which raises the EOTech by 1/4" or so. High enough so the irons are in the lower quarter of the display, but usable. That is one of the problems with the UTE & Tacical Carry handle, one can't use the irons AT ALL with the EOTech in place. Good luck - and if you do make such a mount please post pics! The |
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Thanks Forest, I appreciate you taking the time to give me detailed answers. I may make a mount, but that would entail me purchasing an aimpoint (or heaven forbid, a tacpoint) just to give it a try. The upper also has the Oly FIRSH handgaurds, so another option may be to mount the aimpoint, or an eotech, forward on the handguards with enough of a spacer to bring it up to the proper height to co-witness the irons, which was the main purpose in the beginning, being able to use the irons if the red dot fails without having to remove the red dot, or mount anything new, or even have to flip something up. Or I could just call myself an idiot, kick myself in the butt, swap out the upper with a standard flat top and put the whole incident behind me! But I'm a stubborn SOB, and if I think I can make something good out of this I may give it a shot. |
The mounting of the optics on the FIRSH is good idea. I like my 1x optics mounted forward and that certainly is one way to do it.
I understand the feeling. Hey who knows you might make a decent mount and help alot of people out (I think some guys with M1As/M14s would also appreciate a solid low Aimpoint mount). Hey worse comes to worse and nothing works out then you can buy a $95 Bravo Flattop upper and move the FIRSH and barrel onto the new upper. Sell the old one cheap and maybe the change will only cost you $50 or so. |
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I am going to start a new trend here. I happen to be the only person on this board that actually finds the Aimpoint attached to the RRA TCH with 22M68 to be a perfect mount height for the rifle, and thus I forego co-witness completely. And if my 1000+ hour Aimpoint battery should ever die at the exact moment I need it to save my life, the throw lever on the 22M68 operates just as quickly as a flip-up BUIS. Go ahead and give your UTE a try before these guys spend all your money! (This post ought to make me famous) Flame away |
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Huckie, can you post pics of your rifle? I'd love to see how you have the aimpoint mounted and get a look at how it sits on top of the TCH. I'd appreciate it, I've already made up my mind to keep the UTE upper, at least for now. I got a killer deal on the complete upper with the FIRSH handguards so can afford to mess around with it a bit. Edited to add: I just checked out the 22M68 mount and I'm starting to think that I may be pretty well off. If I don't like the mount that comes with the aimpoint I can either try making my own or try the 22M68 on top of the UTE receiver, and if it's too high I can get the spacer block that's meant for the 22M68 and move the mount and aimpoint onto the FIRSH handguards. Damn shame no one makes a quality red dot in the same size and configuration as the cheap BSA models, I just yarded the BSA off my 22 rifle and it works like a charm on the UTE. Thanks Huckie, I'm starting to feel a little better about my purchase. I'd still like to see a pic or two of your setup. |
That would work - but if Aimpoint (or someone else) just made a quality quick detach mount that puts the Aimpoint that low - it would have other applications besides making the UTE a viable option for serious Aimpoint users. |
Once again, this presupposes that all "serious Aimpont users" must have cowitness with BUIS, which I can understand completely in a tactical situation, but I feel that in general, this board tends to overemphasize the importance of cowitness for the casual shooter. I, for one, prefer my primary sight (Aimpoint) to be above and out of the way of my rear iron sight, while still being quickly removable in the event of failure - thus the TCH/22M68 places my Aimpoint at the ideal height FOR ME. YMMV. Since the majority of AR-15 shooters here would not likely categorize themselves as casual shooters, this, I think, makes me the first Tactical Carry Handle user to "come out of the closet". I imagine my experience would be identical for the UTE. http://www.hunt101.com/img/246758.jpg |
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I finished my UTE today, but the lower parts kit came too late for me to get it out to the range. Everything fit up really nicely, which I guess shouldn't be surprising with a RRA upper and Stag lower. Now I need to get a forward vertical grip and some rail covers......and an aimpoint. But I have to say that sitting here with it, testing different optics, mounts and rings on it, and shouldering it each time, that so far I think I'll like it , I've got a lot of mounting options with the UTE upper and the FIRSH guards. If I can't find some mounting position I like then I'm just too damn picky to live! Edited to add: Huckie, just saw your pic, thanks for posting it. I like your setup, and I think I'll like it on mine too. I'll know as soon as I can come up with the coin for the aimpoint. http://members.cox.net/3rdpig/ute01.jpg |
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Here's another pic. I wish you good luck with your new rifle, I'm sure you will enjoy it. The Aimpoint was the best optical investment I've ever made, you won't regret the expense. Also, the 22M68 is rock solid, I highly recommend it. http://www.hunt101.com/img/246751.jpg |
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