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Posted: 8/30/2003 7:17:44 AM EDT
Hi all,

Have a new M4, and have been having problem with a failure to extract. The rifle only has ~300 rounds through it, and it had only a handful of rounds through it that day when the problem was happening. Looking at the problem casings, the rim appeared to be almost ripped off (the standard ejects looked normal).

Any thoughts?
Link Posted: 8/30/2003 7:38:14 AM EDT
What ammo???
Link Posted: 8/30/2003 8:26:06 AM EDT
Make sure the rifle is properly cleaned and lubricated. Improperly maintained rifles account for most malfunctions.
Link Posted: 8/30/2003 8:49:31 AM EDT
It's South African military surplus. Hadn't had problems with the ammo before, after doing the malfunction drill, the casings extracted fine. The rifle was clean, lubed, etc. I'm pretty anal about keeping it clean... Everything seems cherry, but something isn't jiving here.
Link Posted: 8/30/2003 10:09:51 AM EDT
[url]http://www.sawlesales.com/[/url] Get the HD spring and bumper from SAW, it will beef up your extractor power. or you can get a Wlof spring and a D-fender ring which cost more then the SAW part. both will work fine.
Link Posted: 8/30/2003 9:11:51 PM EDT
Chen, I thought you would be recommending the new LMT stuff you got from MSTN!
Link Posted: 8/31/2003 8:12:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SMGLee: [url]http://www.sawlesales.com/[/url] Get the HD spring and bumper from SAW, it will beef up your extractor power. or you can get a Wlof spring and a D-fender ring which cost more then the SAW part. both will work fine.
View Quote
If it's not a true M4 (going full auto), you probably don't need both the spring AND a ring - just get the HD or Wolff spring. YMMV
Link Posted: 9/1/2003 2:47:08 PM EDT
What brand of AR and does it have a .223 or 5.56 chamber? Seems to me that if the extractor is very nearly ripping the rim off to begin with, then the problem might be too high a pressure and/or the AR is starting to cycle too quickly. For starters, I’ll second the recommendation that you try different ammo. Definitely make sure the chamber is clean and uncorroded. However, considering how new your AR is, maybe it came from the factory with a problem to begin with.
Link Posted: 9/1/2003 3:15:23 PM EDT
Who makes your rifle?
Link Posted: 9/1/2003 3:16:24 PM EDT
Who makes your rifle?
Link Posted: 9/1/2003 3:57:08 PM EDT
I am going to disagree on the extra power for the xtractor spring. It sounds like your extractor is gripping well enough as is if it is ripping off rims. Who made your barrel and what type of chamber does it have?
Link Posted: 9/2/2003 7:30:40 AM EDT
Sounds to me like he has a standard AR buffer and spring installed instead of the heavier M-4 buffer and spring. I had the same problem with my shorty carbine until I went with the heavier buffer and spring set. This was after I changed out my extractor spring with a wolffe one and insert from GPSS.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 2:12:04 PM EDT
Your chamber is probably not chromelined. you just have to clean it more than others. you may also have to go with different ammo if it isn't chrome lined.
Link Posted: 9/7/2003 5:50:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/7/2003 5:56:52 PM EDT by Para504]
It's a new bushmaster M4 variant, with only ~200 rounds through it. About 50 - 75 rounds a session / between cleanings (ex-11B, it's usually "over cleaned"...). The weapon was fired in a moderate rate, not rapid fire. The buffer / spring appear to be a standard AR setup (the stock is fixed in extended position). The real collapsing stocks I've seen have a smaller buffer in them.
Link Posted: 9/7/2003 6:33:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/7/2003 6:37:26 PM EDT by model927]
check the extractor or change it all together then,it shouldnt be doing that as it is new,if it keeps up call bushmaster they will probably send you one for free.What kind of ammo are you using?
Link Posted: 9/7/2003 6:58:28 PM EDT
[url]www.brownells.com[/url] Get a 3-pack of Wolff extra power extractor springs. They only cost a couple bucks and brownells has really cheap shipping on light orders and no minimum order. The D-Fender is unneeded, redundant, if you use the Wolff EP spring. You can use your existing spring insert.
Link Posted: 9/8/2003 5:19:25 AM EDT
[b]WHAT AMMO ARE YOU USING?[/b] I had the same problem and it about drove me nuts until I figured out that it was a bad lot of Winchester. Luck, SD
Link Posted: 9/8/2003 6:31:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/8/2003 6:32:58 AM EDT by James_Gang]
Wow that's unusual. I have the same rifle. It works flawlessly. Have you disassembled the extractor while cleaning? Do you oil the chamber, or roughed it up while cleaning? Do you swab it out with a patch? Again, before you do anything else tell us what ammo are you using?
Link Posted: 9/8/2003 3:29:42 PM EDT
It's South African military surplus ammo, and came in a sealed "battle pack". The chamber appears to be good shape after inspecting it for scratches, etc. I use CLP, but is kept with only very light coat when done cleaning. All parts (chamber, lugs, bolt, etc) are free of carbon build up. The bolt looks good, with firm but managable travel in extractor, and ejector. The bolt carrier group operates fine, and the buffer spring seems to have a lot of snap behind it. Very frustrating... I am guess it may be a bad lot of ammo as well. Maybe a variation in the casing size?
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