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Posted: 7/3/2017 7:08:52 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
...... I'm still confused on the 40mm markings on the receive then. So colt is releasing them but only to you? Are they a special order? Mfg date? Did they mark them 40mm and have an overrun? Is this ATF compiant? I thought once a 'full auto always a full auto' thing applies to destructive devices too? Before I spend $2,000, I have to know all the facts.... |
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Posted: 7/3/2017 7:10:15 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
80% ar lowers are engraved with autos, yes. But I have never seen a manufacturer engrave auto on a lower and get away with it. So this is only a Colt thing that they require a 4473? How are our ffls supposed to know? If this is the only 37mm m203 on the market that requires it, do we just have to remind them? |
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Posted: 7/3/2017 7:10:48 PM EDT
[#3]
Thanks again ,I will patiently wait for my notification from your site
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Posted: 7/3/2017 7:26:06 PM EDT
[#4]
You mentioned that the launcher and mounting hardware were in the box...Is the mounting hardware m4 type or adjustable for other barrel types?
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Posted: 7/3/2017 7:32:03 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
FWIW he paid more than $2,000 for the 40mm from us...the 37mm's is a deal that won't come around again, great opportunity for serious Colt collectors |
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Posted: 7/3/2017 7:59:25 PM EDT
[#6]
Becuse this is the only 37mm launcher that requires a 4473. I'm not the only thinking this is odd..... I'm not bashing the price just want to get the facts straight before I buy.
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Posted: 7/3/2017 8:00:42 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There isn't anything illegal with engraving AUTO on a lower. |
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Posted: 7/3/2017 9:50:02 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Becuse this is the only 37mm launcher that requires a 4473. |
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Posted: 7/3/2017 9:55:44 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No it isn't. What other 37mm requires a 4473? |
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Posted: 7/4/2017 1:21:45 AM EDT
[#10]
Colt was not going to release serialized receivers that very easily have potential to be DD's with their markings and not serialize / Title 1 them. You can keep pushing the "37mm is not a firearm" all you want, it isn't going to change what these are and how they are going to be sold
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Posted: 7/4/2017 10:15:44 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Colt was not going to release serialized receivers that very easily have potential to be DD's with their markings and not serialize / Title 1 them. You can keep pushing the "37mm is not a firearm" all you want, it isn't going to change what these are and how they are going to be sold These devices were originally built, serialized and marked to be used as a 40mm GL, which where designated originally for someone else in some gov application, foreign or domestic. Colt just happens to have them sitting around and you guys come along and say..."hey, why don't you put 37mm smooth bore tubes on these DD with serial numbers and we will sell them to some unsuspecting idiots on one of the gun forums." They say..."we won't sell them that way unless they have a serial number on them, cause we don't want some religious zealot to go about blowing up farm animals and such." There appears to be more to the situation than what meets the eye. May I suggest you have someone else at your company present all the facts and answer all of the questions these folks have about these "devices" in a more transparent manner. Releasing information piecemeal is not a good business practice. |
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Posted: 7/4/2017 11:02:20 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is a fallacy in your arguement...Do you think if someone is going to use one of these devices in a crime or in a mass event, they care if the device has a serial number or Colt markings on it? These devices were originally built, serialized and marked to be used as a 40mm GL, which where designated originally for someone else in some gov application, foreign or domestic. Colt just happens to have them sitting around and you guys come along and say..."hey, why don't you put 37mm smooth bore tubes on these DD with serial numbers and we will sell them to some unsuspecting idiots on one of the gun forums." They say..."we won't sell them that way unless they have a serial number on them, cause we don't want some religious zealot to go about blowing up farm animals and such." There appears to be more to the situation than what meets the eye. May I suggest you have someone else at your company present all the facts and answer all of the questions these folks have about these "devices" in a more transparent manner. Releasing information piecemeal is not a good business practice. |
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Posted: 7/4/2017 11:24:49 AM EDT
[#13]
Colt doesn't release firearms without serial numbers, that is the answer. You keep asking the question in different ways because you dont like the answer.
Before 1968 the government did not require manufacturers to put serial numbers on firearms, that is why you find many old mossbergs without serial numbers. Guess what? Colt put serial numbers on theirs regardless of the requirement prior to that year |
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Posted: 7/4/2017 12:36:41 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
37mm launchers are not considered firearms by the atf. What other 37mm requires a 4473? The receiver of an M203 is at minimum a title 1 other firearm even if no barrel is attached. It has always been this way. |
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Posted: 7/4/2017 12:45:24 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is a fallacy in your arguement...Do you think if someone is going to use one of these devices in a crime or in a mass event, they care if the device has a serial number or Colt markings on it? These devices were originally built, serialized and marked to be used as a 40mm GL, which where designated originally for someone else in some gov application, foreign or domestic. Colt just happens to have them sitting around and you guys come along and say..."hey, why don't you put 37mm smooth bore tubes on these DD with serial numbers and we will sell them to some unsuspecting idiots on one of the gun forums." They say..."we won't sell them that way unless they have a serial number on them, cause we don't want some religious zealot to go about blowing up farm animals and such." There appears to be more to the situation than what meets the eye. May I suggest you have someone else at your company present all the facts and answer all of the questions these folks have about these "devices" in a more transparent manner. Releasing information piecemeal is not a good business practice. It basically accuses AU of wrong doing. What is exactly underhanded about this situation? If a person does not have a DD dealer in their area and their local NFA dealer does not want to use a courtesy transfer on a customer, buying a M203 with a 37mm barrel and then doing form 1 for a 40mm barrel is the only way for many people to own a real M203. This situation has been going on for 40 years. Just because you have never been exposed to real firearms and don't understand the process, doesn't mean everyone else is deficient. |
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Posted: 7/4/2017 2:23:51 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Any M203 with a 37mm barrel. The receiver of an M203 is at minimum a title 1 other firearm even if no barrel is attached. It has always been this way. I've owned a Bushmaster M203 title one reciever, and a one off FN M203 title one receiver...without the bbl Non NFA until you pay the tax as a DD and add the 40 mm bbl |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 1:28:30 AM EDT
[#17]
Holy crap!
I kinda want one... 
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Posted: 7/5/2017 2:49:09 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Never said it was. I know of several instances where people engraved a sear pin hole and got there lowers taken away. That is my point. |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 4:52:18 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
37mm launchers are not considered firearms by the atf. What other 37mm requires a 4473? 
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Posted: 7/5/2017 9:24:01 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Who took their lowers? Nothing illegal about engraving. I would like to see a link or something. That sounds like horse shit. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Never said it was. I know of several instances where people engraved a sear pin hole and got there lowers taken away. That is my point. https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1944580_UH-OH--BATF-involved-with-US-Anodizers.html https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_123/708639_-ARCHIVED-THREAD----Heard-from-the-BATF-today-regarding-seized-Sear-pin-engraving.html |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 9:45:02 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Who took their lowers? Nothing illegal about engraving. I would like to see a link or something. That sounds like horse shit. |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 10:08:28 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh for fucks sake, just let it go already. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There is a fallacy in your arguement...Do you think if someone is going to use one of these devices in a crime or in a mass event, they care if the device has a serial number or Colt markings on it? These devices were originally built, serialized and marked to be used as a 40mm GL, which where designated originally for someone else in some gov application, foreign or domestic. Colt just happens to have them sitting around and you guys come along and say..."hey, why don't you put 37mm smooth bore tubes on these DD with serial numbers and we will sell them to some unsuspecting idiots on one of the gun forums." They say..."we won't sell them that way unless they have a serial number on them, cause we don't want some religious zealot to go about blowing up farm animals and such." There appears to be more to the situation than what meets the eye. May I suggest you have someone else at your company present all the facts and answer all of the questions these folks have about these "devices" in a more transparent manner. Releasing information piecemeal is not a good business practice. An LMT m203 receiver is almost the same price. These are COLTs, REAL m203s. |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 4:27:57 PM EDT
[#23]
Would the 9" be best served by being attached to a RIS handguard by KAC? What about the 12" M203?
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Posted: 7/5/2017 4:34:04 PM EDT
[#24]
I think it's cool, but I'm still trying to wrap my head around this...
Title 1 firearm Marked 40mm on the receiver Fires 37mm Is the barrel visibly marked 37mm? I thought (factory) title 1 firearms had to be clearly marked with the correct caliber? |
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Posted: 7/5/2017 4:37:48 PM EDT
[#25]
The DD 9" rail mounted M203 is better in every conceivable way...
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Posted: 7/5/2017 4:47:55 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The DD 9" rail mounted M203 is better in every conceivable way... 
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Posted: 7/6/2017 11:33:41 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I thought (factory) title 1 firearms had to be clearly marked with the correct caliber? |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 11:57:01 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nope Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nope 27CFR 478.92 1. FIREARMS. You, as a licensed manufacturer or licensed importer of firearms, must legibly identify each firearm manufactured or imported as follows: i. By engraving, casting, stamping (impressing), or otherwise conspicuously placing or causing to be engraved, cast, stamped (impressed) or placed on the frame or receiver thereof an individual serial number. The serial number must be placed in a manner not susceptible of being readily obliterated, altered, or removed, and must not duplicate any serial number placed by you on any other firearm. For firearms manufactured or imported on and after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting, or stamping (impressing) of the serial number must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch and in a print size no smaller than 1/16 inch; and ii. By engraving, casting, stamping (impressing), or otherwise conspicuously placing or causing to be engraved, cast, stamped (impressed) or placed on the frame, receiver, or barrel thereof certain additional information. This information must be placed in a manner not susceptible of being readily obliterated, altered, or removed. For firearms manufactured or imported on and after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting, or stamping (impressing) of this information must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch. The additional information includes: A. The model, if such designation has been made; B. The caliber or gauge; C. Your name (or recognized abbreviation) and also, when applicable, the name of the foreign manufacturer; D. In the case of a domestically made firearm, the city and State (or recognized abbreviation thereof) where you as the manufacturer maintain your place of business; and E. In the case of an imported firearm, the name of the country in which it was manufactured and the city and State (or recognized abbreviation thereof) where you as the importer maintain your place of business. For additional requirements relating to imported firearms, see Customs regulations at 19 CFR part 134. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 12:01:05 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Becuse this is the only 37mm launcher that requires a 4473. I'm not the only thinking this is odd..... I'm not bashing the price just want to get the facts straight before I buy. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 12:11:13 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
See above...... |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 1:03:38 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh really? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Nope 27CFR 478.92 1. FIREARMS. You, as a licensed manufacturer or licensed importer of firearms, must legibly identify each firearm manufactured or imported as follows: i. By engraving, casting, stamping (impressing), or otherwise conspicuously placing or causing to be engraved, cast, stamped (impressed) or placed on the frame or receiver thereof an individual serial number. The serial number must be placed in a manner not susceptible of being readily obliterated, altered, or removed, and must not duplicate any serial number placed by you on any other firearm. For firearms manufactured or imported on and after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting, or stamping (impressing) of the serial number must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch and in a print size no smaller than 1/16 inch; and ii. By engraving, casting, stamping (impressing), or otherwise conspicuously placing or causing to be engraved, cast, stamped (impressed) or placed on the frame, receiver, or barrel thereof certain additional information. This information must be placed in a manner not susceptible of being readily obliterated, altered, or removed. For firearms manufactured or imported on and after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting, or stamping (impressing) of this information must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch. The additional information includes: A. The model, if such designation has been made; B. The caliber or gauge; C. Your name (or recognized abbreviation) and also, when applicable, the name of the foreign manufacturer; D. In the case of a domestically made firearm, the city and State (or recognized abbreviation thereof) where you as the manufacturer maintain your place of business; and E. In the case of an imported firearm, the name of the country in which it was manufactured and the city and State (or recognized abbreviation thereof) where you as the importer maintain your place of business. For additional requirements relating to imported firearms, see Customs regulations at 19 CFR part 134. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 1:07:07 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The caliber does not have to be marked on the receiver. If the complete launcher doesn't say "37mm" anywhere on it then it technically doesn't meet the ATF requirements for caliber engraving, right? |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 1:46:53 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I didn't specify receiver, that's why I asked if the barrel had "37mm" engraved on it. Plenty of "multi" caliber lowers out there, but the barrel is engraved with the correct caliber. If the complete launcher doesn't say "37mm" anywhere on it then it technically doesn't meet the ATF requirements for caliber engraving, right? |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 1:49:00 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think people need to stop posting about these, trying to find some wrongdoing on the behalf of AU or Colt. The only question I asked was whether or not it was marked "37mm" anywhere. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 1:54:20 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not my intention at all, I just don't want to see someone drop a couple grand just to have the ATF flip the first time they encounter one thinking it's an unregistered DD. The only question I asked was whether or not it was marked "37mm" anywhere. So these being marked 40mm raises a lot of questions about legality and FFL holder who need to do the paperwork . |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 2:05:37 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is where I'm at. I'd love to buy one but me being an FFL holder, I can't put 40mm in the 4473. Even it a lower is marked multi and the barrel says 223, I put multi in box as that is what the receiver is marked. That has been verified by ATF many times So these being marked 40mm raises a lot of questions about legality and FFL holder who need to do the paperwork . ETA: disregard, I see you answered it already. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 3:48:56 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is where I'm at. I'd love to buy one but me being an FFL holder, I can't put 40mm in the 4473. Even it a lower is marked multi and the barrel says 223, I put multi in box as that is what the receiver is marked. That has been verified by ATF many times |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 3:53:37 PM EDT
[#38]
It should transfer The same as any M203 receiver. The 37mm barrel is irrelevant.
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Posted: 7/6/2017 3:57:31 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have any proof of that? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have any proof of that? https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/ruling/2013-3-adopting-identification-firearms/download . If the caliber or gauge was not identified or designated (e.g., marked “multi”) on the firearm, the manufacturer, importer, or maker must legibly and conspicuously mark the frame, receiver, barrel, or pistol slide (if applicable) with the actual caliber/gauge once the caliber or gauge is known. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 3:58:52 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It should transfer The same as any M203 receiver. The 37mm barrel is irrelevant. The problem is that if the only caliber designation on the thing is "40mm" then that's what's going on the 4473, and that's going to get someone thinking that an unregistered DD just got transferred on a 4473. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 6:26:06 PM EDT
[#41]
That's how a M203 receiver without barrel is transferred too though. Caliber "40mm"...and it's perfectly legal as long as you don't posses a barrel before the F1 comes back.
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Posted: 7/6/2017 7:00:09 PM EDT
[#42]
A better example is the Colt 9mm lowers we are selling. They are marked 9mm on the receiver but they dont have barreled uppers, you simply put n/a for caliber you don't put 9mm. What is so hard to understand about this?
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Posted: 7/6/2017 7:16:48 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A better example is the Colt 9mm lowers we are selling. They are marked 9mm on the receiver but they dont have barreled uppers, you simply put n/a for caliber you don't put 9mm. What is so hard to understand about this? |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 7:23:20 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
...... that's not how that works. If it says 9mm, the 4473 needs to say 9mm. It's not n/a and it's not an other receiver. Once a rifle always a rifle in the ATF eyes. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 7:38:03 PM EDT
[#45]
I fucking hated those when I had one on my M16A2. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 8:05:27 PM EDT
[#46]
So... how do we go about signing up for one ....or two .....of these?
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Posted: 7/6/2017 8:07:45 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're not going to buy one anyways so why are you even here? That's why I am here asking these questions. |
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Posted: 7/6/2017 8:27:30 PM EDT
[#48]
So maybe this is a stupid question, I don't know... Is it just the barrels that are different between the two models (9" vs. 12")?
Can you buy a 12" 37mm barrel & stick it on the 9" model's receiver & vice versa or would I need to buy one of each model? I'm wanting to buy a 12" to be used with this... 
But I'd also like to be able to mount it (using a shorter barrel) on my M4A1 clone as well. Thanks, FlDiveCop71
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Posted: 7/6/2017 9:07:37 PM EDT
[#49]
Ok, after all that....what can it shoot out of one of these? Chalk? Or something more interesting???
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Posted: 7/6/2017 9:16:34 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've actually said about 3 times in this thread that I wanted to buy one. That's why I am here asking these questions. |
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