[ARCHIVED THREAD] - HAND SALUTE (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 6/3/2011 1:19:41 PM EDT
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Howdy,
There are 2008 and 2009 bills that have been signed into law permitting veterans to render the hand salute during raising and lowering of the flag as well as during the playing of the National Anthem while out of uniform. What is your opinion and as a vet, would you feel comfortable hand saluting? Or should it be reserved to personell in uniform only. Ed |
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There are laws that allow/dissallow such things  it was passed to point out that veterans are more than welcome to render a hand salute. And yes... there is USC covering customs and courtesies of the flag. To be honest, I haven't had this situation occur yet. Part of me would feel like a tool for saluting, but the other part of me would most likely do it without thinking. time in service will burn things like saluting into muscle memory. Fuck... if I was walking down the street and saw a "staff car" with the rank license plate, i'd probably whip out a salute without thinking about it....until two seconds later, when I wondered how badly i was brainwashed. lol.. |
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I've been rendered a hand salute about 10 times in the last few weeks while driving my CUCV, by passing vehicles (that probably were vets themselves). I have a vet plate on my truck and a US Army front plate from the vehicle's time in the Army. I was saluted yesterday by a vet in a wheelchair crossing the street. I have started recently saluting the flag outside of uniform at functions. I am an LEO and I will salute while in uniform as well during those functions. |
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As an active duty Marine, I never saluted while out of uniform, or in uniform in not wearing a cover. I didn't do it then, and don't feel it appropriate now. The people that I have met that do seem like they just want the attention. YMMV I'm more comfortable saluting... that and I'm not here to impress anyone. I salute flagpoles with trucks on them too and get funny looks... don't do it for attention. |
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So do we arrest vets who don't salute? What about civies who do? Thank god we have another unenforceable meaningless law to attempt to govern our lives. How many hours did they spedn in writing, debating, and voting on this that could have been spent on more meaningful legislation? On the other hand maybe I should be grateful they didn't use the time on something that would usurp more power and take away more of our rights. |
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So do we arrest vets who don't salute? What about civies who do? Thank god we have another unenforceable meaningless law to attempt to govern our lives. How many hours did they spedn in writing, debating, and voting on this that could have been spent on more meaningful legislation? On the other hand maybe I should be grateful they didn't use the time on something that would usurp more power and take away more of our rights. You keep typing, dissenter. We've almost got your IP address, SWAT will be inbound... |
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So do we arrest vets who don't salute? What about civies who do? Thank god we have another unenforceable meaningless law to attempt to govern our lives. How many hours did they spedn in writing, debating, and voting on this that could have been spent on more meaningful legislation? On the other hand maybe I should be grateful they didn't use the time on something that would usurp more power and take away more of our rights. The law has no punitive provisions. It only provides accepted guidelines for care, display, and honoring the Flag. |
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Quoted: I stand at attention for raising and lowering but would not salute as I am 100% postive that my SDI, Senior Drill Instructor SSgt Rucker, would pop out of the bushes and destroy my soul for saluting out of uniform. This  , except Senior Drill Instructor GySgt. Glover |
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Quoted: As an active duty Marine, I never saluted while out of uniform, or in uniform in not wearing a cover. I didn't do it then, and don't feel it appropriate now. The people that I have met that do seem like they just want the attention. YMMV I agree with this part I won't salute un-covered and, when out of uniform I am uncovered (I don't consider a baseball cap covered even though it technically is) hand over my heart works just fine in civilian clothing
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| It seems the big rift is whether you are a Marine, or anyone else. As far as I know, Marines don't salute uncovered, period, therefore, out of uniform means uncovered. The other services do salute while uncovered in certain situations so for those of us of the other services it's not as big a deal. |
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It seems the big rift is whether you are a Marine, or anyone else. As far as I know, Marines don't salute uncovered, period, therefore, out of uniform means uncovered. The other services do salute while uncovered in certain situations so for those of us of the other services it's not as big a deal. Zoomie here....While it is rare to need to salute while not under cover, there are circumstances where you would (flightline = no cover, ceremonies, mess dress, etc) |
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Congradulations to those that won't salute out of uniform or without head gear. You've been successfully indoctrinated with institutionalized thinking. In case you missed it, the law does not require vets salute , just authorizes saluting. Your choice but some of the resons given for not saluting baffle me. I see it as trying to break other institutional thinking/habits like saying "OUT" when done talking on the phone yars after your service is done.
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Really? I can't think of one good reason to salute other than "Hey everybody, look at me, I was in the military and wanna make sure everyone knows it."
How about PRIDE. They have that in the Marine Corp don't they? When you were active duty, you were under a different set of rules of when to salute and when not to. Everyone who served earned the right to salute and now the government recognizes that right as well. You don't want to salute outside of active duty then don't. You don't see a reason, fine. Doesn't give you the right to accuse those that do of being vane attention hounds. |
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Dude, you seriously shoudn't be so defensive, I never said that everyone that does it is an attention whore, just those that I know. I do have a sense of pride and everybody that knows me well knows that I love my country and my corps. I don't have to do anything special to prove that to anybody. If you feel that you should salute, by all means salute, just stating how I feel about it. Kinda an afterthought, but I was just thinking, the old timer's I meet (WWII guys, Korea guys) always wear their "conflict", ship's name, or other various veterans type hat, but I never see them salute. Usually in a situation where a salute would be rendered, they take their cap off and put it over their heart (once again, not saying that all of them do this, just those I have seen). Like I said TC don't let what I am saying get under your skin, I am not saying anything about you imparticular. Can't we just be friends  |
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You know what?
Some of your answers make me almost regret bringing this topic to the forum. The few times I have saluted out of uniform and uncovered, I felt immense pride in having been a part of the military. Part of a small fraction of the population that has shared a very special bond and accountability. For some it was a blessing bestowed, for some it was happenstance. But we all knew at some level, that we were willfully signing our ass away on the dotted line. I think, at the time that we signed, we all acknowledged to ourselves, "If it comes to that, I will lay it on the line for my brother, my family and my flag". I can think of very few actions that remind my heart of that commitment and intensity. That day. I will salute the anthem and the flag again if it feels right, I won't if it doesn't. I will say though, if someone, active or vet., feels entitled to judge me because I saluted the National anthem, Taps or Pass in review, (out of uniform, ret., etc.), I did not want to miss an opportunity to recapture that feeling and that day. Life is short. E B Ferrer |
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I've saluted while being out of uniform for years...I don't need anyone's permission to salute the colors....  This! Yep. On Memorial Day I visited a local cemetery where veterans from the Civil War, both World Wars, Korea, and Vietnam are buried. I stopped to salute each grave marked as a veteran's grave. I do not need anyone's permission to render a salute in civilian clothing if I want. |
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I stand at attention for raising and lowering but would not salute as I am 100% postive that my SDI, Senior Drill Instructor SSgt Rucker, would pop out of the bushes and destroy my soul for saluting out of uniform. This......I think my Marine Aircrew instructor would do the same, thanks SSgt Schlogel. |
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It seems the big rift is whether you are a Marine, or anyone else. As far as I know, Marines don't salute uncovered, period, therefore, out of uniform means uncovered. The other services do salute while uncovered in certain situations so for those of us of the other services it's not as big a deal. Zoomie here....While it is rare to need to salute while not under cover, there are circumstances where you would (flightline = no cover, ceremonies, mess dress, etc) Save for ceremonies and Dining In/Out, reporting to senior officers is the only time AF members salute indoors; I wonder if Marines render a hand salute when reporting to a senior officer indoors? B_S |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: It seems the big rift is whether you are a Marine, or anyone else. As far as I know, Marines don't salute uncovered, period, therefore, out of uniform means uncovered. The other services do salute while uncovered in certain situations so for those of us of the other services it's not as big a deal. Zoomie here....While it is rare to need to salute while not under cover, there are circumstances where you would (flightline = no cover, ceremonies, mess dress, etc) Save for ceremonies and Dining In/Out, reporting to senior officers is the only time AF members salute indoors; I wonder if Marines render a hand salute when reporting to a senior officer indoors? B_S Negative |
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It seems the big rift is whether you are a Marine, or anyone else. As far as I know, Marines don't salute uncovered, period, therefore, out of uniform means uncovered. The other services do salute while uncovered in certain situations so for those of us of the other services it's not as big a deal. Zoomie here....While it is rare to need to salute while not under cover, there are circumstances where you would (flightline = no cover, ceremonies, mess dress, etc) Save for ceremonies and Dining In/Out, reporting to senior officers is the only time AF members salute indoors; I wonder if Marines render a hand salute when reporting to a senior officer indoors? B_S Negative Wow, I did not know that! 
B_S |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: It seems the big rift is whether you are a Marine, or anyone else. As far as I know, Marines don't salute uncovered, period, therefore, out of uniform means uncovered. The other services do salute while uncovered in certain situations so for those of us of the other services it's not as big a deal. Zoomie here....While it is rare to need to salute while not under cover, there are circumstances where you would (flightline = no cover, ceremonies, mess dress, etc) Save for ceremonies and Dining In/Out, reporting to senior officers is the only time AF members salute indoors; I wonder if Marines render a hand salute when reporting to a senior officer indoors? B_S Negative Wow, I did not know that! B_S Same with the Navy. No cover = no salute. I don't salute out of uniform. Don't really care if others do. Maybe once I'm out I'll feel different.
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I don't usually wear a cover anymore these days. So its usually hand over heart at attention for this ol Marine..... But I have done the salute thing when I did have a cover on, in civvies & everything !! My salute looks a little F'd up these days though, I broke my right elbow about 8 years ago & have limitted range of use of it. |
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I perform military funerals as a full time job....
I see vets salute (either in civilian clothing or whatever sort of "uniform" their particular branch of Veteran's Service Organization [VFW, American Legion, etc.] wears) all the time during the playing of taps and while the colors are moving with the casket/urn. I see no problem with it at all. (Interesting side note, this INCLUDES the local Marine Corps League of the VFW or American Legion, etc. They too have been seen saluting during movement of the colors/remains and taps. Take that with a large grain of salt because covers of some sort ARE part of these organizations "uniform" and keeping in mind some of the old birds aren't as sharp or up on their SOP's, but for the most part they all do the same thing.) My feeling is, if you're a vet, do what you want man... |
| The whole thing smacks of vote pandering. The military services write their rules. People not under the jurisdiction of the latter are free to do whatever they feel is right - and that will generally be based more on the traditions of their former service than some BS law passed by Congress. |
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I stand at attention for raising and lowering but would not salute as I am 100% postive that my SDI, Senior Drill Instructor SSgt Rucker, would pop out of the bushes and destroy my soul for saluting out of uniform. I feel Tsgt. Bayles lurking around me all the time. Strong is the force with that one! |
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Really? I can't think of one good reason to salute other than "Hey everybody, look at me, I was in the military and wanna make sure everyone knows it."
How about PRIDE. They have that in the Marine Corp don't they? When you were active duty, you were under a different set of rules of when to salute and when not to. Everyone who served earned the right to salute and now the government recognizes that right as well. You don't want to salute outside of active duty then don't. You don't see a reason, fine. Doesn't give you the right to accuse those that do of being vane attention hounds. +1 |
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I stand at attention for raising and lowering but would not salute as I am 100% postive that my SDI, Senior Drill Instructor SSgt Rucker, would pop out of the bushes and destroy my soul for saluting out of uniform. Same, but my Kill Hat, SSgt Francoeur would be the one destroying me |
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Kinda an afterthought, but I was just thinking, the old timer's I meet (WWII guys, Korea guys) always wear their "conflict", ship's name, or other various veterans type hat, but I never see them salute. Usually in a situation where a salute would be rendered, they take their cap off and put it over their heart (once again, not saying that all of them do this, just those I have seen). They probably don't know the law was changed. I did my AD in the 80's and there was no saluting out of uniform back then. |
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I think it's a nice gesture. The hand salute is a link to my service, the whole brotherhood thing.
Personally I don't do it a lot, I'm self conscious about it, I suppose. But I've always snuck one in now and then. My wifes uncle was a Korean War vet, his son (Marine) and I saluted his casket. it fit the moment.... depends. |
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I too don't do it much as I feel uncomfortable. But do every once in awhile.
Not looking for attention or any of that crap. Just paying repects to my flag and my country in the way the Corps taught me. Though I have been out for 18 years it is still automatic to salute when the flag is raised. Though as we all know if not under cover you stand at attention, which is what I do at football games and such. Never felt right to place my hand on my heart. But standing at attention with my fingers curled grabbing my pants legs at the seem and feet at 45 degree angle is much more natural. Even when I raise my flag in the front yard I can't help but place a quick salute to the red white and blue. Not for attention, for respect. Even if I do not have a cover(cap) on hand still goes up, or when at a parade and the color guard marches past, That so strong of a desire brings that right hand up in a very sharp and crisp salute, though I feel weird doing it if I don't have a cover or cap on. I am not only honoring our flag and our country but all those that have passed before me who lived and died for that flag. Semper Fi! Makes we want to stand up and salute right now. 
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i have saluted for a fallen vet several times. in my opinion they have earned a salute. every other time i place my hand over my hear. if im wearing a ball cap or any other type of cover i remove it and then place my hand over my heart. i pisses my off when i see men not remove their covers during the nation anthem. i have never saluted the flag since i got off active duty.
usmc 
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I feel weird saluting outside/inside w/out a cover on, its the Marine in me. Now that I am in the Air Force they salute indoors and it makes me throw up in my mouth a little everytime I see it happen  .
I do stand attention for the National Anthem and if the colors pass in front of me. |