Posted: 5/25/2005 6:18:13 PM EDT
| My department, like many out there require us to be armed at all times. Most of the times I throw on a opened button shirt to help hide my gun but sometimes I don't bother (when it's really hot out..etc.) During those times I make sure to clip my badge next to my gun. My dept. doesn't have a policy on the books regarding how we carry off-duty. I've read several articles stating that an officer should never carry openly when off-duty. How many of you make it a point to always hide your off-duty carry no matter what? Why? |
A big +1!! I don't live in Tx so people around here arn't used to seeing guns. Plus if I'm off duty I don't want people to know I'm a cop! I don't want them to know what kind of car I drive OR where I live. (they could follow you, or do a search on you plates)! |
|
When I used to carry off duty, I made an effort to keep it concealed. But, if I was doing something that required me to dress up, or was on my way to or from my security job (uniform was a jacket and tie) I'd put my badge on my belt next to my holster. Maybe it's the New Yorker in me, I dunno, but I never did and still don't care what other people think. So they see it? So they pull the "Oh, are you a cop?!?!". I just didn't care. Same reason I'm a proponent of civilian open carry. I don't care what people think. 
|
| My constant companion, go everywhere no matter what gun is a S&W .38 M60 stainless. Always concealed, always ready, with one speed reloader. If I feel a little more is needed, I carry my Glock, again concealed. I always have a knife, badge and small flashlight. It pays to be prepared. |
|
My american express Glock... Don't leave home without it. Always concealed. I don't want to be the first person to draw bullets when things go bad. I don't wear a vest off duty. I may just want to be a good witness.. Like someone else said... someone will say "Your a COP so do something".. Blending in is good. |
| In Arizona open carry is leagal and I've seen some people carry openly. However I've also noticed people's uneasy responses to this. Also I'm from Texas and although there are many guns there, there are still uneasy people. Conceal it everytime. And +1 you don't want people to know you are armed and are a cop. |
I conceal a 6906 and spare mag. It's dept policy the weapon will be concealed. It's also policy that off duty weapons are qualified with and used with issued ammo. I cannot imagine giving up the tactical advantage by open carry.  Buy lots of tall size polo shirts. 
|
|
I do not leave the house unarmed or unbadged. I figure that little dirty bastard Murphy has enough oportunities to mess with me without me making it easier for him. Even on the short half mile trips to the grocery to pick up some milk and baby food I am ready to go. The Glock goes on the hip and the Shield on a badge clip on a dogtag chain around my neck under my shirt. My second skin is a Royal Robbins vest...........these days known as a 5.11 vest. I detest carrying stuff in my pant/jean pockets so it suits me very well. All I have to do is holster up, sling my badge, and throw on the vest and I have my wallet, keys, phone, flashlight, cuffs, and two spare mags. Pretty effortless and the gun is hidden under the vest. What I am getting at with this is I suggest the vest. Folks will think your going fishing or to a photography shoot. |
| I keep my badge and ID away from my wallet and I carry a wad of drop money in my front off hand pocket. If I got my primary in an ankle rig due to dress (rarely dress nice) I got a 32 in my pocket to empty as I go for the ankle rig. If I screw up and leave the house without I turn around and get armed. |
| Thanks for the input guys. I have an additional question. What the difference between patroling alone, in uniform, gun out in the open, with back-up that's usually around 15 mins. away as opposed to carrying openly when in plain clothes? Not looking to pick an argument just your point of view. BTW I've been on the job going on six years now. I don't consider myself a new officer but I know some of you out there may. |
|
I would say there are still a couple of differences---when you are patrolling alone in uniform, you are on duty, and have a radio handy which, if you say certain things into it, will cause a bunch of very agitated and pissed off men/women in blue (or whatever color you folks use where you're at,) to drop everything and get to where you are as fast as they possibly can. When off duty, you are most likely not carrying a radio, and must get to a cell phone, pay phone, etc., which can cause a substantial delay in those pissed off folks getting to you. Also, those pissed off folks may be from other agencies, and may not know who the dude holding a pistol is before they shoot him. Ever call your dispatch/communications division? There is usually an additional delay as they get info, then relay it to field units (one reason I am a firm believer that everyone should be armed----we usually show up AFTER things go to shit, and try to clean it up---we rarely are able to show up before the shit hits the fan, unless a psychic calls, I suppose.) When on duty alone in uniform, chances are that someone already knows where you are, or at least has a pretty good idea. When in the uniform, the thug who is about to rob the 7-11 may just turn around and go elsewhere when he sees your cruiser parked in front. He is unlikely to do so if your pickup truck is out front--and when he gets in, you do not know he has reached his commit point for doing the deed and has a gun held behind his back-----but he just saw your gun and badge. Guess where his first shots are going now? When in uniform, no matter how far away your backup is, the bad guys tend to percieve it differrently--they may just think that 12 of your brothers are 3 blocks away, and not take it to a lethal level with you. I know we are all hyper vigilant and aware at all times. BUT, the simple fact is that when on duty in uniform, especially responding to a call, we are much more likely to be assessing threats, playing out worst case scenarios, etc., than we are when walking down the aisle at the grocery store trying to remember if the wife/husband said sharp cheddar or mild. I don't know about anyone else, but I HAVE to turn it off sometimes, or my gastrointestinal health would be worse than it already is. When on duty in uniform you are armed with the uniform, the radio, your command presence, the public perception of your department's numbers, a vest, some people's innate fear of the law, and as a last resort, your sidearm. When off duty wearing an exposed weapon, you are armed with a badge that some people will not see, that others will not understand (is he a security guard/someone with a fake badge/who does he work for/etc.---better call 911/shoot him first,) and your sidearm. Lot of tools missing in that situation. Off duty, armed but concealed, you have your observation skills, a degree of anonymity, a sidearm that nearly everyone is unlikely to be aware of, and the element of surprise if you are forced to deploy said sidearm. Still not all you would have on duty, but more than if the weapon and badge were openly visible. This is a topic of some concern to me, since I am a detective, and usually have a visible sidearm alongside a badge when ON duty, as well as the ever-handy radio. We are supposed to wear coat and tie, but in New Orleans in the summer, this regulation is unenforced, and unenforceable, so button up shirt and tie is the norm. |
|
The trend here for off duty carry is to get a state concealed carry permit and then carry whatever gun you want to. If you carry an official "off duty" weapon you must qualify with it and carry concealed. The thought behind the state permit is that if you use your "off duty" weapon you are carrying on your badge and that means you are the police. That means attempting to arrest. Following departmental procedures. On and on and on. There is no getting around that stuff and color of law if you are carrying on your badge. Like others have said off duty you have no radio, no partner, no shotgun, no vest, no back up gun, no stick, no pepper spray, no cuffs, maybe no reload. You may be wearing flip flops. Your kids may be with you. Right off the bat things are not going your way. If you have to act and you use a weapon that has nothing to do with your department and are carrying on your personal state permit you can say "I was acting as a private citizen". This will help keep you from being held to a "higher standard" and a bunch of restrictive policies. At least here in TN state law is forgiving while dept policies are a bitch. Other depts have ended "off duty" and help their officers get state permits for reasons like this. Our dept is considering it. It also lets you carry whatever gun you prefer instead of whatever gun you are saddled up with. |
| Always concealed when I'm off duty, just out of curiosity, are there any other departments that are forming official policy about carrying while going out drinking, my dept has actually gone to the point of stating that we should not carry if we're going to be consuming alcohol |
|
Dept S.O.Ps: 1. If carrying off-duty, at all times weapon must be concealed 2. If consuming alcohol or in an establishment who's main purpose is the sale and/or consumption of alcohol (i.e. a bar), off-duty carry is prohibited. 3. Mandatory once-a-year off-duty qual I carry to take the garbage out. I carry when I mow my lawn. I know two officers that have been fired from suburban PDs for off-duty carry violations. One went to a Target with badge/gun clipped to belt, not concealed. Yes, he was rookie. Number 2 was a guy in a bar. One of his Sgts happened to be there as well, somehow discovered the guy was carrying. A PD that encourages off-duty carry? Must be nice. Sheep |
|
Not a police officer, private citizen. I have a permit to carry a concealed handgun in my state. But I have never been able to figure out how to "comfortably" carry a firearm concealed (either to heavy or bulky). Therefore, I do not carry concealed like when I go walking, etc., etc., only in-vehicle. I can not understand how you guys and gals can stand to carry a concealed firearm. Also, I am somewhat in awe of the amount of equipment (firearm included) that you guys and gals carry around all day on those belts you wear, I don't think I could ever get used to that. It looks extremely uncomfortable, is it ??? |
I usually go with an inside the pants holster for my concealed carry |
Around here any 5.11 or similar screams "OFF DUTY COP"...... I carry a S&W 642 in a pocket holster - I typically wear shorts with cargo pockets. Brian |
1.) Rookies will shoot you = keep it hidden 2.) Bank/Credit Union take-over roberry while you are there, robbers will shoot you if they ID you first = keep it hidden. 3.) General car jackings/robberies, now you have the upper hand ie element of surprise if you carry concealed = keep it hidden. Also, several personal rules I personally observe. 1.) Have a gun for a gunfight is good, but also should mean have ENOUGH gun. a Five shot .22LR don't cut it. 5 shot .38, might. Bigger is better, big enough to conceal that is. 2.) Anyone worth shooting is worth shooting again. 3.) 2 to the chest and 1 to the head is good, BUT 2 to the chest and 2 to the head is better, or see rule #2. 4.) Carry at least one spare reload. I have carried for more than 20 years now as an LEO. I have also tried almost everything from small .22LR to .32, .380, 9mm, .38, .40 .357 and various .45's. When I was young LEO and quite full of myself, I also had a matched pair of cut down .41 Mag. revolvers in a dual shoulder rig for off duty carry. Boy were they heavy. I see now why San Antonio PD sold them. After all these years of carrying I finally hit on a good compromise on size versus concealiability. I now carry a Glock 22 or Glock 19 and conceal it under my shirt or jacket or in summer months, I carry a S&W M60 .38 in a pocket holster. As a matter of fact I always carry the M60 winter or summer as I am now plain clothes and there are times I take off the Glock. I also carry a folding knife, Leatherman Super Tool, spare ammo. Since I cannot control day versus night, or a dark building, I carry a small surefire light. FWIW |