[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Is this stealing? (Page 1 of 3)
Posted: 12/13/2009 12:45:18 PM EDT
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Clearly, based on a recent thread, some members of ar15.com have very different (and quite strong) opinions on what constitutes stealing, and what does not. Hopefully, we can all agree that if you deliberately try to remove something from a store without paying, that is stealing - regardless of how easy or hard it may be to get away with it. But, it seems that there's some grey area about whether or not it is stealing for you to keep something that the store accidentally allowed you to leave the store with, without paying for (through no fault or intent of yours). An additional factor seems to be how much money is involved - in that someone who thinks it's definitely stealing to keep a plasma TV that the store forgot to ring up, may not think it's stealing to keep an apple that the store forgot to ring up and charge you for.
I'm now curious about something slightly different that happened to me last week. I went to the grocery store to buy a bunch of things. When checking out, I noticed that the bagger almost forgot to put my eggs in the cart, so I made sure to mention it to him. When I was putting the groceries away at home, my wife told me what a great idea it was to buy a bag of grapes. Too bad I hadn't bought any grapes!  Clearly, the bagger had accidentally forgotten to bag some grapes from a previous customer (like he almost forgot my eggs), and had accidentally put them in my cart when he was bagging my stuff. In other words, I had no interest in grapes, and did not put any in my cart.
I am curious what people think the correct course of action is for this situation. |
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In! ... and before the poll...  Voted... I vote return them to the store. The alternative could be to call the manager and tell him what happened, and let him make the call. The perishable food item choice is weird, because I like grapes, but not onions. I'd consider returning to pay for the grapes, but merely returning the onions. Say for instance... it was a pack of pink hair scrunchies. Definitely going back to the store: "These were put in my bags by mistake. Just trying to keep your inventory accurate". Once you deliberately make the choice to deprive someone of their property... I tend to be a little more careful around that individual. |
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Just pay for em next time. Problem solved.
Edit: I retract my previous. Since you did not select the item there was no intent. So I don't consider it stealing. If you consume the item then technically you should pay for it. But honestly no one is going lose sleep over it. Including the store. |
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Quoted:
Clearly, based on a recent thread, some members of ar15.com have very different (and quite strong) opinions on what constitutes stealing, and what does not. Hopefully, we can all agree that if you deliberately try to remove something from a store without paying, that is stealing - regardless of how easy or hard it may be to get away with it. But, it seems that there's some grey area about whether or not it is stealing for you to keep something that the store accidentally allowed you to leave the store with, without paying for (through no fault or intent of yours). An additional factor seems to be how much money is involved - in that someone who thinks it's definitely stealing to keep a plasma TV that the store forgot to ring up, may not think it's stealing to keep an apple that the store forgot to ring up and charge you for. I'm now curious about something slightly different that happened to me last week. I went to the grocery store to buy a bunch of things. When checking out, I noticed that the bagger almost forgot to put my eggs in the cart, so I made sure to mention it to him. When I was putting the groceries away at home, my wife told me what a great idea it was to buy a bag of grapes. Too bad I hadn't bought any grapes! Clearly, the bagger had accidentally forgotten to bag some grapes from a previous customer (like he almost forgot my eggs), and had accidentally put them in my cart when he was bagging my stuff.
I am curious what people think the correct course of action is for this situation. Man, I seriously love you. Like totally. 
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Did you have prior intent of taking the item you did not pay for? No? Then it is not stealing. You had no idea of it until you were already at home.
Example: If a security guard was watching your register, and he saw that the cashier did not scan the grapes, yet still gave them to you, the cashier would be the one at fault, not you. |
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I think intent has a lot to do with but what you do after you find out makes a difference as well. Tough call...
I think the prudent thing to do would be to call the store and tell them what happened. Most are going to say not to worry about it and just keep it on such small items. On bigger things they may request you return it when convenient. |
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Seriously - this actually happened to me last week.
I'm curious about it, because it's DIFFERENT from the other thread, where the item WAS something the person intended to buy, but was accidentally not scanned by the cashier. But this wasn't anything I wanted to buy, but was something from another customer's cart that accidentally got bagged into mine. If there's any stealing, I didn't steal from the store - I stole from the other customer!!!
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Just pay for em next time. Problem solved. This. It's such a simple process.  But, I didn't want to buy grapes, and I never put grapes into my cart or onto the cashier's belt. It was another customer's grapes that accidentally got placed into my cart by the bagger without my knowledge. If the bagger had put anal lube into my cart, should I pay for that too? |
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I have returned to the store and paid for the $1.25 item they missed when I was checking out. Stealing is stealing, taking what is not rightfully yours. The price, ease, ability to get caught, has nothing to do with it. But he didn't take it, the cashier gave it to him and he had no intention of buying it anyway. |
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what constitutes stealing? intent. finding something in your bags they forgot to ring up isnt stealing, some other form of moral failing perhaps but not stealing imo. I'll agree with that, however once you discover the item and then decide to keep it without paying for it, then it becomes theft. How hard is it to make a call and say, "hey, I think my checker accidentally put some grapes in my bag and I don't think s/he charged me for them"? Or in the case of the BluRay Disc pay for it next time you go back? Especially when you intended to buy the item in the first place... |
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what constitutes stealing? intent. finding something in your bags they forgot to ring up isnt stealing, some other form of moral failing perhaps but not stealing imo. I would figure it makes up for the time they didn't get my JP magazine in the bag. Or the time the bagger didn't put the potatoes in the trunk. Or the time the checker charged me twice for the milk and I didn't catch it. The list goes on. The same people that would call you a thief are the same people that would tell you tough luck on paying for but not receiving your stuff. |
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Quoted: Yeah, that is just a freak accident.Seriously - this actually happened to me last week. I'm curious about it, because it's DIFFERENT from the other thread, where the item WAS something the person intended to buy, but was accidentally not scanned by the cashier. But this wasn't anything I wanted to buy, but was something from another customer's cart that accidentally got bagged into mine. If there's any stealing, I didn't steal from the store - I stole from the other customer!!! If you can return them without too much trouble, I would say to do so (although they probably would throw them out); otherwise, that is much like finding a dollar on the sidewalk. You did not do anything wrong and finding the rightful owner is next to impossible, so just be nice to someone else (random act like) and call it a Karma push. |
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what constitutes stealing? intent. finding something in your bags they forgot to ring up isnt stealing, some other form of moral failing perhaps but not stealing imo. I'll agree with that, however once you discover the item and then decide to keep it without paying for it, then it becomes theft. How hard is it to make a call and say, "hey, I think my checker accidentally put some grapes in my bag and I don't think s/he charged me for them"? Or in the case of the BluRay Disc pay for it next time you go back? Especially when you intended to buy the item in the first place... Right - but the BluRay case is different, because the customer actually wanted to buy the BluRay. I didn't want to buy grapes. So should I be required to pay for any and all items that incompetent baggers put into my cart without my knowledge? Plus, as I pointed out - THE STORE IS NOT OUT ANY MONEY - because the customer in front of me already paid for the grapes!! |
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what constitutes stealing? intent. finding something in your bags they forgot to ring up isnt stealing, some other form of moral failing perhaps but not stealing imo. I would figure it makes up for the time they didn't get my JP magazine in the bag. Or the time the bagger didn't put the potatoes in the trunk. Or the time the checker charged me twice for the milk and I didn't catch it. The list goes on. The same people that would call you a thief are the same people that would tell you tough luck on paying for but not receiving your stuff. Not according to LarryG and Pato. That is nothing more than justifying your theft of the grapes in their eyes, I am sure they will be along shortly to agree. 
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Clearly, based on a recent thread, some members of ar15.com have very different (and quite strong) opinions on what constitutes stealing, and what does not. Hopefully, we can all agree that if you deliberately try to remove something from a store without paying, that is stealing - regardless of how easy or hard it may be to get away with it. But, it seems that there's some grey area about whether or not it is stealing for you to keep something that the store accidentally allowed you to leave the store with, without paying for (through no fault or intent of yours). An additional factor seems to be how much money is involved - in that someone who thinks it's definitely stealing to keep a plasma TV that the store forgot to ring up, may not think it's stealing to keep an apple that the store forgot to ring up and charge you for. I'm now curious about something slightly different that happened to me last week. I went to the grocery store to buy a bunch of things. When checking out, I noticed that the bagger almost forgot to put my eggs in the cart, so I made sure to mention it to him. When I was putting the groceries away at home, my wife told me what a great idea it was to buy a bag of grapes. Too bad I hadn't bought any grapes! Clearly, the bagger had accidentally forgotten to bag some grapes from a previous customer (like he almost forgot my eggs), and had accidentally put them in my cart when he was bagging my stuff.
I am curious what people think the correct course of action is for this situation. PLEASE do not drag the other thread into this (and avoid the name-calling). This is not actually intended to be some clever commentary on the other thread. This is me being reminded of a slightly different situation, and wondering what the arfcom mob thinks about this one. |
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what constitutes stealing? intent. finding something in your bags they forgot to ring up isnt stealing, some other form of moral failing perhaps but not stealing imo. I would figure it makes up for the time they didn't get my JP magazine in the bag. Or the time the bagger didn't put the potatoes in the trunk. Or the time the checker charged me twice for the milk and I didn't catch it. The list goes on. The same people that would call you a thief are the same people that would tell you tough luck on paying for but not receiving your stuff. I would never tell you "tough luck"... It's a simple matter to call the store and explain what happened. It's happened to me on several occasions. Each time they told me that the item would be waiting for me at the customer service desk and thanked me for being a customer. |
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Just pay for em next time. Problem solved. Who do you pay, the store? Someone else already paid for them. There aren't really many options. There is no way to find the person who actually paid for them, so you can't reimburse him. The store has already been paid for them, so it doesn't make since to go pay them again. You could return them, but the store is no more capable of finding the person who bought them than you are, and they aren't going to put produce that you took home back on the shelf, so they'll end up in the garbage. There really isn't a course of action that can right the situation. I'm not sure that the actions in the other thread would constitute theft, but I'm at a loss trying to figure out why he thought it would be a good idea to brag about it here and make a bunch of excuses for why he shouldn't have to pay for it. In his case, unlike yours, he knows who to pay(Walmart), and how it could be done. His situation could be righted if he has the integrity to do it. |
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what constitutes stealing? intent. finding something in your bags they forgot to ring up isnt stealing, some other form of moral failing perhaps but not stealing imo. I'll agree with that, however once you discover the item and then decide to keep it without paying for it, then it becomes theft. How hard is it to make a call and say, "hey, I think my checker accidentally put some grapes in my bag and I don't think s/he charged me for them"? Or in the case of the BluRay Disc pay for it next time you go back? Especially when you intended to buy the item in the first place... Right - but the BluRay case is different, because the customer actually wanted to buy the BluRay. I didn't want to buy grapes. So should I be required to pay for any and all items that incompetent baggers put into my cart without my knowledge? Plus, as I pointed out - THE STORE IS NOT OUT ANY MONEY - because the customer in front of me already paid for the grapes!! Meh, I'd still call, just in case the guy calls the store looking for his grapes... |
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Clearly, based on a recent thread, some members of ar15.com have very different (and quite strong) opinions on what constitutes stealing, and what does not. Hopefully, we can all agree that if you deliberately try to remove something from a store without paying, that is stealing - regardless of how easy or hard it may be to get away with it. But, it seems that there's some grey area about whether or not it is stealing for you to keep something that the store accidentally allowed you to leave the store with, without paying for (through no fault or intent of yours). An additional factor seems to be how much money is involved - in that someone who thinks it's definitely stealing to keep a plasma TV that the store forgot to ring up, may not think it's stealing to keep an apple that the store forgot to ring up and charge you for. I'm now curious about something slightly different that happened to me last week. I went to the grocery store to buy a bunch of things. When checking out, I noticed that the bagger almost forgot to put my eggs in the cart, so I made sure to mention it to him. When I was putting the groceries away at home, my wife told me what a great idea it was to buy a bag of grapes. Too bad I hadn't bought any grapes! Clearly, the bagger had accidentally forgotten to bag some grapes from a previous customer (like he almost forgot my eggs), and had accidentally put them in my cart when he was bagging my stuff.
I am curious what people think the correct course of action is for this situation. Man, I seriously love you. Like totally. The difference is YOU INTENDED TO BUY THE ITEM, there was no mistake on your part. Then you come in here and brag about it. Intended to buy does not equal theft. I did everything in my power to buy the disc, two employees were there to make sure I did buy it. I thought I bought it. Where is the intent of theft? There is only intent to purchase/. |
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Return the grapes is the honest thing to do.
I think the problem many have is as long as the man is a big faceless corporation that won't miss a few lost dollars, it's ok. The way I look at it is, would I return the grapes if my neighbor had accidentally given them to me? If the answer is "I would give the grapes back to my neighbor" then I would give the grapes back to the store. |
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Clearly, based on a recent thread, some members of ar15.com have very different (and quite strong) opinions on what constitutes stealing, and what does not. Hopefully, we can all agree that if you deliberately try to remove something from a store without paying, that is stealing - regardless of how easy or hard it may be to get away with it. But, it seems that there's some grey area about whether or not it is stealing for you to keep something that the store accidentally allowed you to leave the store with, without paying for (through no fault or intent of yours). An additional factor seems to be how much money is involved - in that someone who thinks it's definitely stealing to keep a plasma TV that the store forgot to ring up, may not think it's stealing to keep an apple that the store forgot to ring up and charge you for. I'm now curious about something slightly different that happened to me last week. I went to the grocery store to buy a bunch of things. When checking out, I noticed that the bagger almost forgot to put my eggs in the cart, so I made sure to mention it to him. When I was putting the groceries away at home, my wife told me what a great idea it was to buy a bag of grapes. Too bad I hadn't bought any grapes! Clearly, the bagger had accidentally forgotten to bag some grapes from a previous customer (like he almost forgot my eggs), and had accidentally put them in my cart when he was bagging my stuff.
I am curious what people think the correct course of action is for this situation. PLEASE do not drag the other thread into this (and avoid the name-calling). This is not actually intended to be some clever commentary on the other thread. This is me being reminded of a slightly different situation, and wondering what the arfcom mob thinks about this one. Agreed, I will do no more. 
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PLEASE do not drag the other thread into this (and avoid the name-calling). This is not actually intended to be some clever commentary on the other thread. This is me being reminded of a slightly different situation, and wondering what the arfcom mob thinks about this one. Sorry DK, I'm pretty sure he thought you were trying to vindicate him in some way, which is why he responded the way he did. |
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Just pay for em next time. Problem solved. Who do you pay, the store? Someone else already paid for them. There aren't really many options. There is no way to find the person who actually paid for them, so you can't reimburse him. The store has already been paid for them, so it doesn't make since to go pay them again. You could return them, but the store is no more capable of finding the person who bought them than you are, and they aren't going to put produce that you took home back on the shelf, so they'll end up in the garbage. There really isn't a course of action that can right the situation. ... Exactly. That's why I found my case so interesting, after reading the other thread. If there IS any "theft" here, I think it's by the bagger - because he "stole" (unintentionally, I am sure) the grapes from one customer, and then "gave" them to another customer, who didn't want them. The victim is clearly the previous customer, not the store. |
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PLEASE do not drag the other thread into this (and avoid the name-calling). This is not actually intended to be some clever commentary on the other thread. This is me being reminded of a slightly different situation, and wondering what the arfcom mob thinks about this one. Sorry DK, I'm pretty sure he thought you were trying to vindicate him in some way, which is why he responded the way he did. No apology necessary. That clearly was the impression the thread gave, even though that was not my intent!
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Just pay for em next time. Problem solved. Who do you pay, the store? Someone else already paid for them. There aren't really many options. There is no way to find the person who actually paid for them, so you can't reimburse him. The store has already been paid for them, so it doesn't make since to go pay them again. You could return them, but the store is no more capable of finding the person who bought them than you are, and they aren't going to put produce that you took home back on the shelf, so they'll end up in the garbage. There really isn't a course of action that can right the situation. ... Exactly. That's why I found my case so interesting, after reading the other thread. If there IS any "theft" here, I think it's by the bagger - because he "stole" (unintentionally, I am sure) the grapes from one customer, and then "gave" them to another customer, who didn't want them. The victim is clearly the previous customer, not the store. That's why I'd call the store... Just letting them know means a lot. |
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Let me ask you this question .Say you get back to your car and find the cashier didnt charge you for a Blue Ray DVD ? Do you go home and brag about it or walk back into the store and pay for it?
The grapes are a perishable item if you brought them back on the next trip to the store they would not be in sellable condidtion .DK if you descovered the grapes in the parking lot of the store would you return them? |
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Return the grapes is the honest thing to do. I think the problem many have is as long as the man is a big faceless corporation that won't miss a few lost dollars, it's ok. The way I look at it is, would I return the grapes if my neighbor had accidentally given them to me? If the answer is "I would give the grapes back to my neighbor" then I would give the grapes back to the store. But the store is NOT out any money, since they were already paid for the grapes by the previosu customer. |
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I've had a few pricing mistakes work out to my favor over the course of my life. If the store wants to charge me less than what I was willing to buy the items for, I don't feel the least bit sad in letting it slide. I know if it was the other way around, they accidentally charge me $20 more and I don't catch it, I'm sure the store manager isn't losing sleep over it. |
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Just pay for em next time. Problem solved. Who do you pay, the store? Someone else already paid for them. There aren't really many options. There is no way to find the person who actually paid for them, so you can't reimburse him. The store has already been paid for them, so it doesn't make since to go pay them again. You could return them, but the store is no more capable of finding the person who bought them than you are, and they aren't going to put produce that you took home back on the shelf, so they'll end up in the garbage. There really isn't a course of action that can right the situation. ... Exactly. That's why I found my case so interesting, after reading the other thread. If there IS any "theft" here, I think it's by the bagger - because he "stole" (unintentionally, I am sure) the grapes from one customer, and then "gave" them to another customer, who didn't want them. The victim is clearly the previous customer, not the store. So? Is it still ok to steal from an individual? You DID receive the stolen property that the bagger"slipped" into your cart didn't you? |
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Just pay for em next time. Problem solved. Who do you pay, the store? Someone else already paid for them. There aren't really many options. There is no way to find the person who actually paid for them, so you can't reimburse him. The store has already been paid for them, so it doesn't make since to go pay them again. You could return them, but the store is no more capable of finding the person who bought them than you are, and they aren't going to put produce that you took home back on the shelf, so they'll end up in the garbage. There really isn't a course of action that can right the situation. ... Exactly. That's why I found my case so interesting, after reading the other thread. If there IS any "theft" here, I think it's by the bagger - because he "stole" (unintentionally, I am sure) the grapes from one customer, and then "gave" them to another customer, who didn't want them. The victim is clearly the previous customer, not the store. So? Is it still ok to steal from an individual? You DID receive the stolen property that the bagger"slipped" into your cart didn't you? The thin ice. You are on it... |