[ARCHIVED THREAD] - All please read (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 6/7/2006 8:24:00 AM EDT
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I have been overrun with complaints and problems over the last 2-3 days from people that don't seem to have ever read our Code of Conduct. PLEASE keep your posts resectful of your fellow members. My patience is honestly done with people who can't play nice. Disagree all you want but calling people names and berating them, harrassing them via IM and email through this site, and being a hateful asshole in general, IS NOT the way to behave on this site. I know we have had a major influx of kids lately but honestly they have not been the problem. Team Membership DOES NOT exempt you from the code of conduct . General Guidelines 1.) Posting derogatory comments of a racial, religious, or sexual nature. This includes your username, signature line, and title. Site Staff and Moderators reserve the right to edit these items and to remove your ability to modify them in the future. 2.) Posting pictures* or links to images which contain pornography, nudity+, animal cruelty, racism, or sexism. (Any images of violence which are extreme will be removed and may result in a warning or worse.) *Posts with images of violence or photos of scantly clad men or women should contain a warning in the title. These types of images will not be tolerated if inserted at random in other discussions. +Nudity includes any photo which contains a clear view of genitalia or female nipples. 3.) Posting or linking to information on how to make illegal modifications to firearms or purchase illegal items. 4.) Posting comments or links in support of illegal activities including, but not limited to, threats against the life of any living person, doing harm to a state or federal official, or advocating the overthrow of the government. 5.) Posting of someone else's personal contact information (home phone numbers, home addresses, unpublished e-mail addresses, and the like). 6.) Repeatedly attacking or insulting a person in an effort to elicit a negative response. You have a right to disagree, but please do so in a respectful manner. 7.) Posting topics or discussions with the desire to do the site or community harm. More specifically creating topics meant to disrupt the site's day to day management, disrupt member's resources, or disrupt the ability for the site to function normally. 8.) Posting repeat topics with similar or slightly varying titles. While it may seem to be funny, the "spamming" of the community in this manner results in problems for users and management. (Multiple topics on important issues or discussions are acceptable, this only applies to topics which waste resources for no other reason except personal enjoyment or humor.) |
i haven't seen it but if that is the case yes it must be removed. this is strictly due to some idiots that took that concept and tried to sneak by the COC with certain pics. NO SCANTILY CLAD IMAGES PERIOD. |
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I for one would welcome a blanket rule that directing pejorative comments at the PERSON of any member (well, except for 88s ;-) would be an instaban offense. We debate the ideas, we don't tear down the person. There's a reason that the greatest thinkers the world has ever known came up wiht the observation that ad hominem is a logical fallacy. Calling members "idiot" "fucktard" "dumbass" and other things along those lines probably should get a temporary time out. And addressing people as "bitch" or "cunt" or any other seriously pejorative term probably ought to be subject to an account nuke. |
that is pretty much our exact SOP. it amazes me that this even has to be brought up every few months. i posted almost this exact same thread last year <i will personally bitchslap the first person to scream DUPE > |
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I'm glad I read it before I posted DUPE. j/k Hey listen up kids.....quit IMing complaints to mods. If someone pisses you off, turn the computer off and go relax. This place is supposed to be an enjoyment. If it stresses you out do something different. What a bunch of crybabies. Also listen to TBS and play nice. |
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i don't mind the complaints and i don't mind people pointing us in the direction of problems. What i do mind this the just plain mean spirit some people seem to have around here lately. i have no problem with some good natured ribbing and cutting up. but when people begin calling female posters bitches,c*nts... etc and going for the throat to others it's time for staff to start cracking skulls on problem people. <jmho> argue and joke away, just keep it civil is all i am asking here. |
I thought the thread last night was over the line and out of character of the guy involved. But I have never IMed a mod or staff with a problem about another member.....but I don't escalate them either. I just ignore the dipshits.  |
that was not the first issue i and others had had with him. it was pretty much his "character" |
No shit. |
Starcraft guy! |
I guess I missed a recent thread too. I was thinking of an incident back a couple months ago, when a female member (and mod/wife of a mod) was called a c*nt and b*tch on several occasions. That shit ain't right when its intended in the pejorative. I'm not a fan of "banned words" -- its funny when a friend mine calls me a dago lawyer, 'cause he's italian too; likewise, I remember one of the gay members on the site putting up one of the "this thread is gay" pictures to great humerous effect. But there's a line, and everyone with common sense knows when its being crossed, where the pejorative is invoked specifically to lash out and injure the reputation, integrity, or person of another poster, and its that shit I'd like to see put to an end. Wanting a forum I can feel comfortable introducing to my girlfriend and less gun enthusiastic buddies is not being a "pussy" or a wuss. Its demanding that gentlemen act as such. And to wrap, I simply invoke Old Painless's signature: ""I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it." - Capt. W. F. Call, Texas Ranger" |
Do you need some Cough Syrup? |
So this is permissible in GD so long as it has a content warning? |
You read that there? You know full well the "girly pics" are allowed ONLY in Team--and within those limits/rules. |
Pat of #2 on Page 1. Also the CURRENT stated CoC mentions NOTHING of the Team Forum ONLY restriction (that is just FYI info and not a challenge). Here is the EXACT text of the CURRENT COC. 2.) Posting pictures* or links to images which contain pornography, nudity+, animal cruelty, racism, or sexism. (Any images of violence which are extreme will be removed and may result in a warning or worse.) *Posts with images of violence or photos of scantly clad men or women should contain a warning in the title. These types of images will not be tolerated if inserted at random in other discussions. +Nudity includes any photo which contains a clear view of genitalia or female nipples. Please note it says NOTHING about a Team Forum ONLY restriction. There WAS a tacked topic that no longer exists. And the reason I ASK is because I have been clear on the "rules" in the past and STILL gotten into trouble. I also know that things "change." For instance there was a rule change not too long ago where new rules went into place "after the fact" but I still got into trouble. So in an EFFORT to be REALLY, REALLY CLEAR I asked about the above. |
Are you saying that when the tacked topic became untacked it was no longer a valid rule? It still exists The untacked topic |
| Two upgrades ago GoatBoy took away the ability for anyone but him to edit the Conduct Code. Now we have several items that need attention and he doesn't do it. The "no bad words in thread titles" comes to mind and the "girly pics only in Team" is another. There are others, but I can't think of them. We do our best--that's all there is. |
[D. Harry / ]
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Ok for my buddy Steyr and any others who arent sure lets take a look at the CoC.
e-vol-ving: To develop or achieve gradually. To undergo gradual change. To develop or arise through evolutionary processes.
Gen-er-al Not limited in scope, area or application. Not limited to or dealing with one class of things; diversified. Involving only the main features rather than precise details. <Snip>
This quoted statement plainly states that the written CoC is NOT the entire CoC and individual situations will be handled by staff and moderators. This also plainly gives staff the power to make new rules as they see fit to cover new situations that pop up uncluding abuse of and jailhouse lawyering of the written CoC which was the reason for Strikers tacked rule about BOTD. Hope this helps. |
No I'm saying your average arfcommer could EASILY be unaware of that revision. Especially considering that topic is now in the ARCHIVES and won't be found on a regular search and isn't viewable to NON Team Members. |
Was unaware. Again I was only bringing it to your attention. |
Please spare me the "jailhouse lawyering" speech. I heard it before when "new rules" were retroactively enforced against me "after the fact." The point I was making, and the ONLY point, is that the STATED COC does not YET (as a result of GB not having time to do the update) reflect the current COC as it is enforced and it would be EASY for an arfcom member to run afoul of the COC and NOT realize it. Just as confusion was created with this original topic when I wondered if the rules "as stated" meant another evolution in the CoC. But just to be sure, I asked. ETA: Excuse me if my first line seems indignant but I got hosed on that situation. |
Oh Really?
Thanks for your concern for the average arfcommer |
Yes. A recent arfcommer who came after the tacked thread was lost to the archives and only read the current "as stated" CoC could easily run afoul of the actual "in place" rules. I've seen it happen at least twice.
That's right, try and demonize me. Problem is that last part OBVIOUSLY wasn't about other arfcom members, the first part of my reply was. I presented a very valid scenario where someone could easily NOT "know better." The second part, is of course, about ME. It was ME making really, really sure that you guys UNDERSTOOD what I was saying. That is because I have been hosed in the past. I wanted to make REALLY, REALLY SURE I was clear so I don't get hosed again. I guess that makes me selfish. Clearly I don't care about other arfcommers. |
The UNTACKED TOPIC is currently in the ARCHIVE. Yesterday, I convinced a friend to join this forum. He's a hard working, responsible, married father and vet. Just exactly HOW is he, or other freshly registered members supposed to know about such formally tacked, now UNtacked, archived, "VALID rules"?  Are you saying that archived, untacked topic rules that have fallen into oblivian, that can't be referenced by unpaying newbies, that are not written into the current COC .... STILL VALID? HUH ?? 'splain that one, please. If I understood your original statement correctly, would you then please forward all such prior tacked declarations of law to all new members who have joined since those declarations have slid into the abyss of the archives? << Disclaimer: My apologies at this late hour if I mis-interpreted any of your posts. Help me and one of our newest members to better understand - The Rules. >> Thank you. |
TC, I think he does have a valid point. I hardly post much of anything other than the occasional reply to something these days, and I can easily see where a new person could run afoul of the rules, without even knowing WHAT those rules ARE, you know ? Juan is a busy guy, there's absolutely no doubt about that and he busts his ass for us, to give us a nice site to come to with great features and everything. It's pretty understandable that he obviously wont have the time to do EVERYTHING necessary, right away, every time. That the concrete, in writing, "CoC" rules haven't been updated in a while is again, understandable, as he's just one guy. But you gotta admit, there is a potential for a newbie to Arfcom to not know about the "no BOTD in GD" rule, for instance, as it's not in writing anywhere, except the archive server now, where non team members can't search. I totally agree with Steyr........ You might feel like he's picking nits, just TO pick nits. I don't think he is, but that doesn't matter as I'm nobody important. What you can't argue though, is that he does raise an issue that could potentially cause someone not in the know, much greif, if their intentions were NOT to cause a disturbance and act like a jackass, like unfortunately we seem to see more and more, as of late. I could easily envision an anxious, over-enthusiastic new member jumping off into GD and throwing up a post like "Hot chickies with black guns..... w000t!!!" You know ? It HAS happened before, and undoubtedly will most likely, again. This of course, is gonna get the hammer, as most of us who've been around know, but the new guy and probably others don't. They'll get the standard "CoC violation" warning, then go READ the written CoC on the site and nowhere will it actually SAY that there's no BOTD, etc threads in GD anymore......... See where I'm coming from ? I think that's exactly what Steyr's trying to convey as well... You mods and staff have a hard job, no doubt. I'm not saying you or anyone of ya are ever unclear or unfair or anything like that, just that in writing, the actual CoC CAN be unclear for a new guy/gal...... It's really no big deal, as most of ya give a guy a fair warning and explanation when slip-ups occur, but sadly, tensions seem to be kinda high here lately  Not to mention the influx of actual retards we've had in the past few months who're only here TO instigate.....It's just a procession of bad things that could lead to an unfortunate situation is all, I think. It aint in writing, and God knows, you're always going to have SOME dork who's going to get all pissy and fight with everyone, tooth and nail, because he feels he was unfairly slighted and toss a hissy fit, like a few have already... The majority of the people on this site are mostly good eggs, and play nicely with each other  I like it here a lot but we all know that there's always gonna be some dorks who want to push and push, but that's just the nature of the media. I've never gotten the impression Steyr was one of those types. I quite enjoy many of his threads on obscure movies and such. I feel he's a very positive asset to the site.I think ultimately, once the updated physical CoC is rewritten, and ON the site somewhere in black and white, things will simmer down, with regards to the 'dynamic' rules. Then anyone who wants to be a jackass and start shit, HAS no more arguement and they can either get with the program or go scratch. Then y'all can spend your time more efficiently, hunting trolls  God knows we got enough of em ! Take care, and thanks for the hard work ! JB |
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One last thought........ I think a permanently tacked thread, in bold title, in EVERY sub-forum, titled something like "The Official, not yet in writing, rules of this site" with the 'dynamic' rules that currently are in effect, would go MILES in clearing this sort of thing up.... Just thinking out loud but then anything that isn't yet IN the written CoC on it's own page, can be added to said tacked thread as the need arises. Then there's absolutely no vagarity about any of it, you know ? Might be helpful ? JB |
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for the poeple who have issues with the COC in it's current form..... Mods and staff track Warnings to members for just this very reason. yes there are problems with the current COC. that said we don't lock a new member nor does a first time offender get locked. if the user has no previous problem posts or is a newbie, they get a freindly warning with a detailed description of why what they posted in not allowed. this happens pretty much daily. I have never had a problem with anyone regarding it. i spend a few hours a week via IM with members discussing the warnings i have sent out. 99.99999999% of the time it's simply a misunderstanding that is brushed under the rug. Long term member simply know better. if they have not seen the past tacked threads, it's generally no foul if they have a good history and it's an honest mistake. As many times as the COC is referenced by staff and members there is simply NO EXCUSE for not having read and understand it. Problem posters are a different story. time and time and time again i have given freindly warnings to people. only to recieve asshole responses or to be completely ignored 24hrs later. ARDOC was a good example of that. the only recourse at that point is for me to contct staff and have them deal with the member. It's not something i take lightly and i only ask for staff's involvement after discussing the situation at legth with the person first and coming to no agreements. Steyraug, You above anyone else on this site now the COC and the problems we have had in the past. Bringup the same argument over and over and over again about the BOTD rules is just juvenille stupity. The rules have been made and posted. Because YOU don't agree with them doesn't mean they will not be enforced. Members that don't know the rules or have never read the COC are NOT going to be locked or abused for a first or likely even a second or third offense. |
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Guys, no one has any repercussions for posting "BOTD" pics the first time, so don't get your panties in a wad over this. When someone posts an unacceptable pic there is usually ten people pointing it out, then we (if needed) remove it via edit, and (if needed) we send an IM bringing the person up to speed. As an example, we wouldn't treat someone registered in May, 2006 the same as we would SteyrAUG, who has dealt with this 50 times.
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