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Posted: 8/24/2001 6:50:30 AM EDT
While studying for an upcoming Sgt's test, I cam accross the following blabble in one of the text books that I need to read for the test: "One dangerous trend that law enforcement and community leaders must respond to is the 'domestic arms buildup'. In many urban areas, citizens that fell vulnerable to crime purchase handguns for self-protection. The research to date does not clearly indicate whether the increase in firearms ownership has served to boost or to reduce levels of crime, but a number of researchers cite indirect evidence that handguns have contributed to the level of violence in the United States. Furthermore, there is little evidence that owning a gun reduces one's chances of victimization or lowers one's fear of crime. And there is some evidence that possession of a weapon actually increases one's chances of injury when one is confronting a criminal. In addition, statistics on gun-related accidents and guns stolen from legitimate owners should be considered when one is making decisions about practices and policies."
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 6:55:16 AM EDT
paragraph two: " Handguns may be the most important law enforcement issue of the 1990'sand every community needs to decide what course of action is most appropriate, given local standards and values. If a community is not prepared for a total ban on handguns, it has two options: strong, enforceable restrictions on gun ownership, or comprehensive gun safety programs. " The chapter goes on about other issues as well.... "Local Government and Police Management, Third edition. William A. Geller, editor. Published for the IMCA training institute.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 6:57:49 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 6:59:48 AM EDT
Oh, I almost forgot.....I need prayers on this test! Some of the guys taking it are pure machines, reading and studying all hours of the day. Quite a few guys took several weeks of vacation to study. I wish I had their time. Afterall, I have to make time for my "domestic arms buildup" and shooting!
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 7:05:15 AM EDT
Now really, are you surprised by reading this? From what I have found, most police [b]agencies[/b] are against the average person owning firearms. they believe they are the only ones that should have the [b]power[/b] to arrest criminals. We people are just to stupid because we don't have training or the knowledge to safely operate a firearm. Fact is this. They care more about there job security then anything else. And usualy the average cop isn't nearly as well trained as he thinks he is when it comes to firearms. The political views of the police politician are our real enemy. Eventually those beliefs will trickle down to the beat cop. You'll see sgtar15
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 7:07:04 AM EDT
One valid point in there. Thousands of firearms are stolen every year and, until the Clinton Administration, this had been the number one source of illegal guns on the street. (now they blame the "loophole") Good luck with the test.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 7:11:31 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 187: While studying for an upcoming Sgt's test, I cam accross the following blabble in one of the text books that I need to read for the test: "One dangerous trend that law enforcement and community leaders must respond to is the 'domestic arms buildup'. In many urban areas, citizens that fell vulnerable to crime purchase handguns for self-protection. The research to date does not clearly indicate whether the increase in firearms ownership has served to boost or to reduce levels of crime, but a number of researchers cite indirect evidence that handguns have contributed to the level of violence in the United States. Furthermore, there is little evidence that owning a gun reduces one's chances of victimization or lowers one's fear of crime. And there is some evidence that possession of a weapon actually increases one's chances of injury when one is confronting a criminal. In addition, statistics on gun-related accidents and guns stolen from legitimate owners should be considered when one is making decisions about practices and policies."
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This is pure BS. We know that the statistics show that the safest way to defend oneself from a violent attack is to use a gun. We know that there is strong evidence that widespread gun ownership reduces crime. And so on. You would think these guys would at least look at some modern studies, not the old junk science studies that used to dominate the litature.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 7:11:53 AM EDT
"And there is some evidence that possession of a weapon actually increases one's chances of injury when one is confronting a criminal" With logic like this then it would be safer yet to disarm the police to keep from getting themselvs hurt.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 7:23:35 AM EDT
Hey, easy on the messenger....You would be surprised how many pro-gun officers I work with at my agency, and at others. I would agree that there are many anti's among our ranks also, but LE is no different than the rest of the population in that you'll have pro-rkba'a and anti's. I wish some of you could hear the smart-ass locker room comments about 10 round mags, etc reducing crime while the courts let violent felons walk the streets, etc. Although, I have had many frustrating days and some verbal altercations with guys I work with when they get on their soap box and start spewing crap about " only the police should have certain weapons, or guns at all" At least those guys are in the minority, however, they are the favorites for the next round of promotions.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 10:04:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 187: Although, I have had many frustrating days and some verbal altercations with guys I work with when they get on their soap box and start spewing crap about " only the police should have certain weapons, or guns at all" At least those guys are in the minority, however, they are the favorites for the next round of promotions.
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That's exactly what I meant. I do believe that most of the actual beat cops are pro-gun, unfortunitely they are not the one's writing policy. And sooner or later the beat cop will have a very hard decission to make. sgtar15
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 10:11:05 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 10:37:12 AM EDT
Civilians do not need guns, but a cell phone with 911 and DOD on autodial.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 10:53:12 AM EDT
Man what Police Dep. are you with? That sucks, I'm not to the Sgts test yet by a long shot but I have never seen any thing like that I hope it will stay that way.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 11:21:17 AM EDT
Sounds like your administrators have an agenda. I have taken three promotional exams, and am on deck for Lt. and have never seen any anti gun material in any texts. I have found however, that most of the ideas about management and supervision in those texts are not applied at my Dept. Oh well, I guess you only need to know it for a day. Good luck with the test.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 12:45:04 PM EDT
Good luck on your sergeant’s examination. How is the promotion scoring set up in your department? Written, oral, outside education, seniority, etc.? Originally Posted By 187: “Although, I have had many frustrating days and some verbal altercations with guys I work with when they get on their soap box and start spewing crap about " only the police should have certain weapons, or guns at all" At least those guys are in the minority, however, they are the favorites for the next round of promotions.” This is one of my greatest concerns with the course of contemporary law enforcement. From what I have seen (I am not a LEO) the ideological purity tests start with the initial hiring and become more rigorous with promotion. By the time a LEO is in the position to set policy and publicly comment on legislation, they are either authoritarian statists, politicians with NO ethical foundation, or VERY unusual. I believe that many of the concerns that are expressed by members of this board are based on their observations of this. I have heard (yes, I know that this is anecdotal) that in some departments, private firearms ownership is considered to be a negative when it is discovered in a pre-employment investigation. Once again – GOOD LUCK!
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 1:17:41 PM EDT
Sounds like HCI bogus statistics got their foot in the door. Instead of taking the test, protest with a hunger strike.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 1:37:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Imbroglio: Civilians do not need guns, but a cell phone with 911 and DOD on autodial.
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MAN OH MAN! Instead of 911 on AUTODIAL how about an M16 on FULL AUTO DIAL?
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 5:11:45 PM EDT
Maddock... We have the written test (multiple choice 200 questions), which is worth 60%, and an assessment center, which is worth 40%. The assessment center involves oral boards and written essay questions. It won't apply to this test, but the Chief just petitioned the civil service commission to have a rule of three for promotions. Which means that he can pick from the top three scorers, instead of #1, and so on. Most guys think this promotes politics, some say it will allow the Chief to select the most qualified candidates..... Chaingun... I like the hunger strike but the bastards would let me starve to death.
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 5:17:08 PM EDT
Kennesaw GA, where a resident is required by law to own a firearm. The exceptions are if one has religious or personal beliefs preventing them from owning a firearm. If for some unforseen reason shit gets messed up in the rest of GA, Kennesaw will be the last bastion of hope for gun owners!!! I lived there, and was a law abiding citizen of course. And also the crime rate in Kennesaw GA is very low. Now granted there were many DUI's so we should just ban alchohol there. hahhaah [beer] Just a thought for everyone, Kennesaw is a good place to live!!!
Link Posted: 8/24/2001 5:24:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ECS: MAN OH MAN! Instead of 911 on AUTODIAL how about an M16 on FULL AUTO DIAL?
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Don't you mean a M16 on FULL AUTO DIAS?[heavy] sgtar15
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 9:57:39 PM EDT
It scares me that your Sgt exam material has this blatant anti-gun sentiment. I think It will just make the citizens more afraid of the cops. This will act as a substantial barrier between the citizens and cops, When a cop needs to fit in and have a good relationship with the general public. Banning anything has not worked well in this country. Anyone with money can get almost anything they want Examples:(1920's Prohibition, cocaine, heroin, and other drugs. The people who write so narrow minded text always seem to miss the real source of the problems they are trying to fix. I am not a cop, but I wish you all the luck on your Sgt exam.
Link Posted: 8/28/2001 10:29:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 187: Hey, easy on the messenger....You would be surprised how many pro-gun officers I work with at my agency, and at others.
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I haven't seen anyone bitching at you, although given this quip, I think people should. Unless you and other pro-civilian-gun-possession officers stand up for what you know is right, the politically-motivated weasels will continue to dominate the policy agenda. That will, of course, continue to make your jobs increasingly dangerous over the coming years. You're in Ohio, it looks like -- feeling safe and happy in the Over-the-Rhine district there nowadays?? That's what you get when you let the weasels run the show and guide public perceptions.
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