Quoted: Quoted: No more .308 ever? I've heard that 10 times about every popular surplus caliber, EVER, and guess what always happens? More turns up. .308 is still in widespread use, goofball, it's not going to disappear from the surplus market. It's not obsolete, where there are only X number of storehouses who have sold to the importers and once that's depleted it's gone. It's being made RIGHT NOW, all over the world. Even if it's scarce for a while, it won't be forever. I despise rumor mongering, and chicken-little fantasies....and I've been around the horn enough to know how small-minded such cries of panic really are. Guys - you are mistaken bigtime if you think that surplus ammo is going to continue to be available ad infinitum. Simply saying that ".308 is a popular caliber, therefore cheap surplus will always be available" is nonsense. I have also heard from several reliable sources that SA .308 is about to dry up completely. Whatever is in stores now is IT. Once it's gone, it's gone. Think back about a year or two when Port and Aussie .308 was cheap and plentiful. Remember how quick that went? How about South African .223 battlepacks? People were saying "It'll be around forever". Guess again. The UN is getting more and more countries to sign on to the idea of non-proliferation of small arms. Granted, the guy didn't come off too well complaining about extractor wear with Wolf ammo, but I keep fairly well-informed about this stuff as moderator of the Ammo forum. He is more or less spot-on about the current state of ammo availability. But hey - if you choose to believe that ammo will continue to be cheap and plentiful, more power to ya. I'll be glad if I'm proven wrong, believe me...

You're forgetting something, high priest of ammunition...

.308 that is on the surplus market RIGHT NOW, was being made in 1970, 1980, 1990, etc. It got put into stores, then after a while went for sale on the surplus market. That's how it works, yes? Well, guess what? Unlike 8mm and 7.5 Swiss, it's in production RIGHT NOW by militaries and ammunition plants all over the world. And, guess what? In 10 years the stuff that's going into stores RIGHT NOW will be available for sale. Same with .223, same with 9mm, same with .22lr.

Some ammunition is finite....762x54, 8mm, .303, it has a limited number of years left of stores. Not .308.

And, if you'd like to prove me wrong, have a big "I told you so", then print out this post, and keep it on a shelf for 10 years. If I'm wrong (I'm not), then at that time .308 will be as you say "gone forever".

As for the suppliers and importers telling you it's all running out? Well, I used to sell ammuntion and 10 years ago it was all running out then too. Guess what? They were wrong/lying/being salesmen.

Speaking of Wolf ammo; the Steel case will cause accellerated Extractor wear especially for ARs and Mini 14s.

ROFLMAO

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: No more .308 ever? I've heard that 10 times about every popular surplus caliber, EVER, and guess what always happens? More turns up. .308 is still in widespread use, goofball, it's not going to disappear from the surplus market. It's not obsolete, where there are only X number of storehouses who have sold to the importers and once that's depleted it's gone. It's being made RIGHT NOW, all over the world. Even if it's scarce for a while, it won't be forever. I despise rumor mongering, and chicken-little fantasies....and I've been around the horn enough to know how small-minded such cries of panic really are. Guys - you are mistaken bigtime if you think that surplus ammo is going to continue to be available ad infinitum. Simply saying that ".308 is a popular caliber, therefore cheap surplus will always be available" is nonsense. I have also heard from several reliable sources that SA .308 is about to dry up completely. Whatever is in stores now is IT. Once it's gone, it's gone. Think back about a year or two when Port and Aussie .308 was cheap and plentiful. Remember how quick that went? How about South African .223 battlepacks? People were saying "It'll be around forever". Guess again. The UN is getting more and more countries to sign on to the idea of non-proliferation of small arms. Granted, the guy didn't come off too well complaining about extractor wear with Wolf ammo, but I keep fairly well-informed about this stuff as moderator of the Ammo forum. He is more or less spot-on about the current state of ammo availability. But hey - if you choose to believe that ammo will continue to be cheap and plentiful, more power to ya. I'll be glad if I'm proven wrong, believe me... You're forgetting something, high priest of ammunition... .308 that is on the surplus market RIGHT NOW, was being made in 1970, 1980, 1990, etc. It got put into stores, then after a while went for sale on the surplus market. That's how it works, yes? Well, guess what? Unlike 8mm and 7.5 Swiss, it's in production RIGHT NOW by militaries and ammunition plants all over the world. And, guess what? In 10 years the stuff that's going into stores RIGHT NOW will be available for sale. Same with .223, same with 9mm, same with .22lr. Some ammunition is finite....762x54, 8mm, .303, it has a limited number of years left of stores. Not .308. And, if you'd like to prove me wrong, have a big "I told you so", then print out this post, and keep it on a shelf for 10 years. If I'm wrong (I'm not), then at that time .308 will be as you say "gone forever". As for the suppliers and importers telling you it's all running out? Well, I used to sell ammuntion and 10 years ago it was all running out then too. Guess what? They were wrong/lying/being salesmen.

I couldn't agree with swingset more. I can remember when the Malaysian M193 disappeared. You would have thought it was the end of the world!!  Not five years later there were SA tubs everywhere. I think the UN will continue to lose credibility and relevance over the next few years as more and more countries acknowledge the folly of appeasement and UN policy in general. This is but a bump in the road.   JMHO.  I've been stocking up for the last few years because I knew we were in a cheap/abundant phase.

I wish I had the money to send AIM surplus a big order for Guatemalan 5.56
and more SA.308, but I'm gonna have to wait.

If all of the surplus rifle ammo does go the way of the dodo bird, I am going to have a
kickass custom 10/22 built and start shooting .22 a whole lot more.

Thank God there is plenty of 8mm still available for cheap for my Mauser.

Quoted: You're forgetting something, high priest of ammunition... .308 that is on the surplus market RIGHT NOW, was being made in 1970, 1980, 1990, etc. It got put into stores, then after a while went for sale on the surplus market. That's how it works, yes? Well, guess what? Unlike 8mm and 7.5 Swiss, it's in production RIGHT NOW by militaries and ammunition plants all over the world. And, guess what? In 10 years the stuff that's going into stores RIGHT NOW will be available for sale. Same with .223, same with 9mm, same with .22lr. Some ammunition is finite....762x54, 8mm, .303, it has a limited number of years left of stores. Not .308. And, if you'd like to prove me wrong, have a big "I told you so", then print out this post, and keep it on a shelf for 10 years. If I'm wrong (I'm not), then at that time .308 will be as you say "gone forever". As for the suppliers and importers telling you it's all running out? Well, I used to sell ammuntion and 10 years ago it was all running out then too. Guess what? They were wrong/lying/being salesmen.

   There could be Billions of 7.62 stockpiled around the world that could be declared ‘Surplus’ tomorrow. Tell me what good that would be if it will not be made available to the ‘Public’? That is where the problem is going to come from. How many Countries that do supply ‘Surplus’ Ammo would defy the UN if it said no more sales? Take off the ‘Rose’ colored glasses, the days of ‘plenty’ are-a-passin’.  

Quoted: Quoted: You're forgetting something, high priest of ammunition... .308 that is on the surplus market RIGHT NOW, was being made in 1970, 1980, 1990, etc. It got put into stores, then after a while went for sale on the surplus market. That's how it works, yes? Well, guess what? Unlike 8mm and 7.5 Swiss, it's in production RIGHT NOW by militaries and ammunition plants all over the world. And, guess what? In 10 years the stuff that's going into stores RIGHT NOW will be available for sale. Same with .223, same with 9mm, same with .22lr. Some ammunition is finite....762x54, 8mm, .303, it has a limited number of years left of stores. Not .308. And, if you'd like to prove me wrong, have a big "I told you so", then print out this post, and keep it on a shelf for 10 years. If I'm wrong (I'm not), then at that time .308 will be as you say "gone forever". As for the suppliers and importers telling you it's all running out? Well, I used to sell ammuntion and 10 years ago it was all running out then too. Guess what? They were wrong/lying/being salesmen.    There could be Billions of 7.62 stockpiled around the world that could be declared ‘Surplus’ tomorrow. Tell me what good that would be if it will not be made available to the ‘Public’? That is where the problem is going to come from. How many Countries that do supply ‘Surplus’ Ammo would defy the UN if it said no more sales? Take off the ‘Rose’ colored glasses, the days of ‘plenty’ are-a-passin’.

Unfortunately I agree.  Either way, stock up now because there might not me any more tomorrow.

Quoted: Well, there you have it. Cheap surplus ammo can't be drying up because it hasn't before. I'll rest much better now. Thanks. Oh BTW - .223 is a popular military caliber, yes? Where's all the surplus .223 on the market? I think it's still being made all over the world. There should be a glut of it on the market then, right? Let me know when you find some. www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=222888

Maybe we're taking the wrong tack.

No, no you guys, you're totally right. It'll always be here.

(dashes off to various websites to buy now while it's still moderately affordable...)

All I can say is I wish I'd picked up a few more cases of Aussie .308 when I had the chance. That F4 was awesome.

I think the surplus ammunition is going to get worse instead of better. So many of our former allies bought tons of ammo for the Cold War and now they see no need for huge standing forces, nor ammunition for those units.

We will still get some surplus, just not as much. I am not going to wait for prices to fall. I will continue to buy.

What are the thoughts on China? Do Canadians get cheap ammunition from Norinco? Are they a big supplier on the world market?

I am researching about 100 sources in the print media, WWW sites, Importers, Distributers, Retailers, personal contacts, etc.

I know I hear some of you say that ALL of what I have been told and read are  Lies, B.S., Sales Pitches, etc. So How many of these sources have any of you arm chair B.S.s contacted and interogated?

Wolf Steel case ammo HAS Broken Ar -15 and Glock weapon EXTRACTORS. Anyone who say it ain't so is a LIER. How do I know this is true besides the Reports on the WWW? My friends some of whom are in Law Enforcement have had it happen in my presence. So stick that where ----.

I am EXTREMELY Disappointed to find some of the B.S. offered in reply to the FACTUAL information I presented. However, others have posted LISTS of all the Surplus ammo that is already GONE or Nearly so.

Well here is a challenge for the NAY SAYERS: Where is there a supply of RADWAY GREEN 223 or 308 available to be IMPORTED into the US? How about South African 223 or Portuguese 308, or Australian 308, etc. ? Well all of you "KNOW IT ALLs"? Cat Got Your Tongues?

None of the Nay Sayers will like this source either. This is From The FAL FILES by Luis.



"I don't know if it is or isn't BS, but I do know that I sell ammo at the gun shows and have for years, and certain calibers are getting impossible to find in cheap deals. 303, 8x56, 7.62x51 and a few others like 9mm Largo, were 10c a round for the longest time. The Guatemalan stuff was 10-12c a round if it was tarnished or not. Not any more. Can't even find them for any price in surplus. Even the dreaded Pakistani 303 is mostly sold out. 7mm is gone, as is 8mm Lebel, all Italian and Jap. calibers. I would strongly suggest that the 8mm shooters load the garage to the roof, since when this caliber is cheaper now than ever, but some of the best stuff, German, Portuguese, Israeli, etc are gone, as is for the most part the Turk. We can't even get surplus x39 for the most part since Klinton era banned steel core. Moral is whenever you have some extra money buy ammo, it will probably outlast you if stored well!"

Please present FACTs to support any Allegations made PEOPLE. I have Reported FACTUALLY what I have been told and Read.




Here is an offer: Anyone want to Commision a THINK TANK type of Totally comprehensive Study (WHITE PAPER) on Surplus Ammunition's Future? Come on now, Poney-up the money so you can Have me Prove My current reports are ALL Wrong.

Here is a better offer, Make a Bet in GOLD or Silver with me then Go Out and bring back Proof I'm Wrong.

Quoted: that 308 is bad news!!! i want an M1A really bad, but ammo is going to render it into a display piece as soon as i buy it!

Antidote:



With one of these you can be a Post Hoe and an Ammo Hoe too!

ETA My photobucket powers wane!

Quoted: You're forgetting something, high priest of ammunition... .308 that is on the surplus market RIGHT NOW, was being made in 1970, 1980, 1990, etc. It got put into stores, then after a while went for sale on the surplus market. That's how it works, yes? Well, guess what? Unlike 8mm and 7.5 Swiss, it's in production RIGHT NOW by militaries and ammunition plants all over the world. And, guess what? In 10 years the stuff that's going into stores RIGHT NOW will be available for sale. Same with .223, same with 9mm, same with .22lr. Some ammunition is finite....762x54, 8mm, .303, it has a limited number of years left of stores. Not .308. And, if you'd like to prove me wrong, have a big "I told you so", then print out this post, and keep it on a shelf for 10 years. If I'm wrong (I'm not), then at that time .308 will be as you say "gone forever". As for the suppliers and importers telling you it's all running out? Well, I used to sell ammuntion and 10 years ago it was all running out then too. Guess what? They were wrong/lying/being salesmen.

Swingset, I really wish that I could feel comfortable in the knowledge that you are correct on this, but I don't.

The factor that has changed things now is the UN and their attempts to "civilize" the whole world and convince the coutries that hold surplus to destroy it instead of selling it. We in America view the UN as a bunch of weak, moronic power-hungry despots looking for something to rule, but some of these other countries are much more apt to fall into line with the UN and go along for the ride, therefore leaving us high and dry on ammo.

Quoted: Well, there you have it. Cheap surplus ammo can't be drying up because it hasn't before. I'll rest much better now. Thanks. Oh BTW - .223 is a popular military caliber, yes? Where's all the surplus .223 on the market? I think it's still being made all over the world. There should be a glut of it on the market then, right? Let me know when you find some. www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=222888

Are you 18? Completely new to the gun world?

Of course surplus has dried up before. I can recall 2 or 3 times when surplus ammo was scarce - especially com-bloc ammo, and I remember a time when surplus 30.06 and .308 was [spooky voice] GONE FOREVER!! [/spooky voice].

Look, anything can happen, and in 10 years who knows maybe the surplus market will again ebb, but what I'm saying is that NOTHING that is being said now hasn't been said before to suppliers and to the buying public. The only difference between now and 1988 is that we have an internet where paranoia, "experts" and rumor make for great stories about how all the world's surplus better be bought RIGHT NOW.

What I want to know is, in 5 years when a shitload of stuff shows up again, who's going to have the balls to come back here and say "God damn, I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about!" ???

I'll be happy to, if all the world's ammo is [spooky voice] GONE FOREVER!! [/spooky voice].

Quoted: Quoted: You're forgetting something, high priest of ammunition... .308 that is on the surplus market RIGHT NOW, was being made in 1970, 1980, 1990, etc. It got put into stores, then after a while went for sale on the surplus market. That's how it works, yes? Well, guess what? Unlike 8mm and 7.5 Swiss, it's in production RIGHT NOW by militaries and ammunition plants all over the world. And, guess what? In 10 years the stuff that's going into stores RIGHT NOW will be available for sale. Same with .223, same with 9mm, same with .22lr. Some ammunition is finite....762x54, 8mm, .303, it has a limited number of years left of stores. Not .308. And, if you'd like to prove me wrong, have a big "I told you so", then print out this post, and keep it on a shelf for 10 years. If I'm wrong (I'm not), then at that time .308 will be as you say "gone forever". As for the suppliers and importers telling you it's all running out? Well, I used to sell ammuntion and 10 years ago it was all running out then too. Guess what? They were wrong/lying/being salesmen. Swingset, I really wish that I could feel comfortable in the knowledge that you are correct on this, but I don't. The factor that has changed things now is the UN and their attempts to "civilize" the whole world and convince the coutries that hold surplus to destroy it instead of selling it. We in America view the UN as a bunch of weak, moronic power-hungry despots looking for something to rule, but some of these other countries are much more apt to fall into line with the UN and go along for the ride, therefore leaving us high and dry on ammo.

So the shortages now are due to the UN? News to me.

The UN has been pressuring countries for years and years to quit surplusing arms and munitions, and has been largely ignored. Money talked then, it'll keep talking. The "UN scare" was a popular story in the early 90's when I bought from Century and SCD.....and here we are still biting our nails waiting for the blue helmets to take our bullets.

Surplus ammo may take a down turn, but I don't see it disappearing. We'll see who's right.

Quoted: Are you 18? Completely new to the gun world? Of course surplus has dried up before. I can recall 2 or 3 times when surplus ammo was scarce - especially com-bloc ammo, and I remember a time when surplus 30.06 and .308 was [spooky voice] GONE FOREVER!! [/spooky voice]. Look, anything can happen, and in 10 years who knows maybe the surplus market will again ebb, but what I'm saying is that NOTHING that is being said now hasn't been said before to suppliers and to the buying public. The only difference between now and 1988 is that we have an internet where paranoia, "experts" and rumor make for great stories about how all the world's surplus better be bought RIGHT NOW. What I want to know is, in 5 years when a shitload of stuff shows up again, who's going to have the balls to come back here and say "God damn, I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about!" ??? I'll be happy to, if all the world's ammo is [spooky voice] GONE FOREVER!! [/spooky voice].

   This was pretty much the mindset about the Passenger Pigeon and the Buffalo. Look where they are now. Dem' Rose colored glasses do not protect the eyes too good when ya bury your head in the sand.

"Relax, the surplus ammo will always be there for you, and cheaply!"

OK the last one got me.....

SURPLUS IS DRYING UP AND.........

A. I load up now= I can shoot cheaper farther into the future.

B. I don't load up now= I have to use commercial (more costly- shoot less) or reload (time involved- shoot less).


SURPLUS IS NOT DRYING UP AND.........

C. I load up now= I can shoot cheaper farther into the future.

D. I don't load up now= No problemo, but it will cost more to shoot in the future. Here you get into the exercise of comparing the normal increase of the general price level with the interest you give up in the future.

I can live with A., C., and D. I choose to prevent, to the extent my budget will allow, B. But I still hope to add .308 to my reloading setup this year.

From the International Action Network on Small Arms website ( http://www.iansa.org/)
this is a list of countrys that have ratified the UN small arms protocol:


Algeria
Azerbaijan
Belarus
Belgium
Benin
Bulgaria
Burkina Faso
Cape Verde
Costa Rica
Croatia
Cyprus
El Salvador
Estonia
Grenada
Guatemala  
Jamaica
Kenya
Lao People's Democratic Republic
Latvia
Lesotho
Liberia
Libyan Arab Jamahiriya
Lithuania
Malawi
Mali
Mauritius
Mexico
Netherlands
Norway
Panama
Peru
Poland
Romania  
Saint Kitts & Nevis
Slovakia
Slovenia
South Africa
Turkey
Turkmenistan
Uganda
Zambia


The following countries have signed the protocol:

Argentina
Australia
Austria
Barbados
Brazil
Canada
China
Denmark
Dominican Republic
Ecuador
European Community
Finland
Germany
Greece
Iceland
India
Italy
Japan
Korea, Republic of
Lebanon
Luxemburg
Madagascar
Monaco
Nauru
Nigeria
Portugal  
Senegal
Seychelles
Sierra Leone
Sweden
Tunisia
United Kingdom of Great Britain & NI

I have purchased and shot thousands of rounds of  surplus ammo made in all of the countries highlighted in red above, and I know most of you have too. That Aussie .308 was awesome. I
shot the best 5-shot group in my entire life with a scoped M1A at 100 yards with Aussie surplus.
I wish I had bought a pallet of it now.  

Quoted: From the International Action Network on Small Arms website ( http://www.iansa.org/) this is a list of countrys that have ratified the UN small arms protocol: Portugal

God damn. I'm going to miss Port .308. I absolutely LOVED it.

Quoted: Quoted: From the International Action Network on Small Arms website ( http://www.iansa.org/) this is a list of countrys that have ratified the UN small arms protocol: Portugal   God damn. I'm going to miss Port .308. I absolutely LOVED it.

Yeah, looks like I'm headed to the local store that has Port on links this weekend...

Wolf Steel case ammo HAS Broken Ar -15 and Glock weapon EXTRACTORS. Anyone who say it ain't so is a LIER. How do I know this is true besides the Reports on the WWW? My friends some of whom are in Law Enforcement have had it happen in my presence. So stick that where ----.

LOL!!!

Quoted: Wolf Steel case ammo HAS Broken Ar -15 and Glock weapon EXTRACTORS. Anyone who say it ain't so is a LIER. How do I know this is true besides the Reports on the WWW? My friends some of whom are in Law Enforcement have had it happen in my presence. So stick that where ----.

I have talked to my contacts in the Navy SEALs and U.S. Army and Israeli Special Forces.  They have had a serious problem with Wolf Steel-Cased ammunition causing early wear on chambers, sometimes in as little as 250 rounds.  Don't even get me started on extractors.  My friend Bill (not his real name) is a small arms instructor out at Coronado who complains bitterly about all the broken extractors from Wolf Steel-Cased ammo.  He makes his SEALs carry at least 3 or 4 spare extractors for each weapon.  He has told me that once their current supply of Wolf is gone, they will be switching to ammunition loaded exclusively by the Maine Cartridge Company.

I have many contacts in law enforcement as well.  One officer was trying to double tap a dog and the AR extractor broke after the first shot.  The poor dog was shot through the shoulder and suffered for more than a minute before he could install a new extractor and finish the second shot from his double tap.  

I just noticed this guy has posted on a couple other gun forums I use. What is the agenda for you? causing panic buyin? Why tell us this info so we will buy all the current inventory available? We will do this anyway.

Quoted: Quoted: Wolf Steel case ammo HAS Broken Ar -15 and Glock weapon EXTRACTORS. Anyone who say it ain't so is a LIER. How do I know this is true besides the Reports on the WWW? My friends some of whom are in Law Enforcement have had it happen in my presence. So stick that where ----. I have talked to my contacts in the Navy SEALs and U.S. Army and Israeli Special Forces.  They have had a serious problem with Wolf Steel-Cased ammunition causing early wear on chambers, sometimes in as little as 250 rounds.  Don't even get me started on extractors.  My friend Bill (not his real name) is a small arms instructor out at Coronado who complains bitterly about all the broken extractors from Wolf Steel-Cased ammo.  He makes his SEALs carry at least 3 or 4 spare extractors for each weapon.  He has told me that once their current supply of Wolf is gone, they will be switching to ammunition loaded exclusively by the Maine Cartridge Company. I have many contacts in law enforcement as well.  One officer was trying to double tap a dog and the AR extractor broke after the first shot.  The poor dog was shot through the shoulder and suffered for more than a minute before he could install a new extractor and finish the second shot from his double tap.

I guess I am just one lucky SOB I have literally shot pallets of wolf .223 in several ARs and have never broke one. When I was a 45B in the army I saw very few broken extractors. And as far as chamber wear I have no clue about how wolf would wear a chamber out in as little as 250 rounds.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Wolf Steel case ammo HAS Broken Ar -15 and Glock weapon EXTRACTORS. Anyone who say it ain't so is a LIER. How do I know this is true besides the Reports on the WWW? My friends some of whom are in Law Enforcement have had it happen in my presence. So stick that where ----. I have talked to my contacts in the Navy SEALs and U.S. Army and Israeli Special Forces.  They have had a serious problem with Wolf Steel-Cased ammunition causing early wear on chambers, sometimes in as little as 250 rounds.  Don't even get me started on extractors.  My friend Bill (not his real name) is a small arms instructor out at Coronado who complains bitterly about all the broken extractors from Wolf Steel-Cased ammo.  He makes his SEALs carry at least 3 or 4 spare extractors for each weapon.  He has told me that once their current supply of Wolf is gone, they will be switching to ammunition loaded exclusively by the Maine Cartridge Company. I have many contacts in law enforcement as well.  One officer was trying to double tap a dog and the AR extractor broke after the first shot.  The poor dog was shot through the shoulder and suffered for more than a minute before he could install a new extractor and finish the second shot from his double tap.   I guess I am just one lucky SOB I have literally shot pallets of wolf .223 in several ARs and have never broke one. When I was a 45B in the army I saw very few broken extractors. And as far as chamber wear I have no clue about how wolf would wear a chamber out in as little as 250 rounds.

I think he was kidding

If it ever does start to dry up for real it will be a good excuse for a high volume loading press. After I load all I need I will have surplus, so I will help ya'll out!

I'm kinda surprised more people don't go this route. My shooting buddy and I are getting ready to start reloading a bunch of 5.56, .308,and 9mm.
FWIW,I just purchased two SA 308 battle packs today. Eighteen cents a round and the guy has over 9K rounds of it left.
Clint

Quoted: Quoted: Wolf Steel case ammo HAS Broken Ar -15 and Glock weapon EXTRACTORS. Anyone who say it ain't so is a LIER. How do I know this is true besides the Reports on the WWW? My friends some of whom are in Law Enforcement have had it happen in my presence. So stick that where ----. I have talked to my contacts in the Navy SEALs and U.S. Army and Israeli Special Forces.  They have had a serious problem with Wolf Steel-Cased ammunition causing early wear on chambers, sometimes in as little as 250 rounds.  Don't even get me started on extractors.  My friend Bill (not his real name) is a small arms instructor out at Coronado who complains bitterly about all the broken extractors from Wolf Steel-Cased ammo.  He makes his SEALs carry at least 3 or 4 spare extractors for each weapon.  He has told me that once their current supply of Wolf is gone, they will be switching to ammunition loaded exclusively by the Maine Cartridge Company. I have many contacts in law enforcement as well.  One officer was trying to double tap a dog and the AR extractor broke after the first shot.  The poor dog was shot through the shoulder and suffered for more than a minute before he could install a new extractor and finish the second shot from his double tap.

Seals use Wolf?  Hmmm.  

As to the rest, bull-fuckin-shit.  

I've shot THOUSANDS of rounds of Wolf through my AR, with no signs of excess wear--it's just a little more dirty than other commercial or surplus ammo.  I'm on the original extractor.  

I'm so sick of this internet Wolf myth.  

A hardened steel chamber or extractor will experience no more wear (or not appreciably more) from a soft steel case of Wolf than from brass.  



Edit:


Oh, he was kidding.  

Nevermind.  

ATTN ARFCOM BROTHERS!
What this guy says is 100% true. Dont ask me how i know, i just know.
So with that in mind i plan on going on a shopping spree to stock up. There is only one problem, I got no MONEY!
So i am appealing to all of you to send me money. IM me for paypal account Info.
I know all of you here are very generous and would like nothing more than to give me donations so i can load up on .308. To all those who donate i bless you and you will receive your reward from Heavan, to those who dont' may your skin turn orange in hue and may your head fall off at an inopportune time. Bless you all.

+2 for employed by ammo dealer to cause a stir.

I have never known domestic police departments or the military to use Wolf ammo.

How many of these countries that have
signed or ratified the UN Small Arms Protocol
are also involved in the UN food for oil scandal ?

You don't think They'll ship crates of surplus ammo
to the US ,where the real $$$$ is ?

You don't think guys at the recycling plant in Guatemala
aren't going to ship out ammo instead of recycling it for
the base metals ?

If you tac a $20 dollar bill to the wall in Guatemala ,
and say "you and you fight to the death for it "
they'll freaken do it .Trust me.


On top of that,how about the definition of surplus ammo ?


Cut a half millimeter off the tips of each round ,and drill
a hole in them.

BAM !!!!!

Now they're importable "Hollow Points".

Quoted: +2 for employed by ammo dealer to cause a stir.

Maybe so.....maybe no, but I'll tell you one thing:

I bet the telephones at AIM Surplus have been ringing off the friggin wall today.  

I'd be interested in seeing when those countries signed the agreement and how long the current supplies of their ammo have been in country.  The UN stuff is bullsh*t for sure, but I just wonder how much of an effect it really has had.

I'm glad I've got as much as I do, but it's never enough.  I just hope I can finish this new house thing in time to free up some money to buy more, even if it's not all doom and gloom.

Quoted: Here is an offer: Anyone want to Commision a THINK TANK type of Totally comprehensive Study (WHITE PAPER) on Surplus Ammunition's Future? Come on now, Poney-up the money so you can Have me Prove My current reports are ALL Wrong. Here is a better offer, Make a Bet in GOLD or Silver with me then Go Out and bring back Proof I'm Wrong.

Lighten up Frances.

Will do.

twincities.bizjournals.com/twincities/stories/2006/03/06/daily43.html

Alliant receives $134M ammo order

Alliant Techsystems Inc. has received small-caliber ammunition orders worth $134 million from the U.S. Army, the company said Thursday.

The Edina-based defense contractor is the U.S. military's leading supplier of small-caliber ammunitions. The company operates the U.S. Army's Lake City ammunition plant in Independence, Mo., where it produces 5.56mm, 7.62mm and 50-caliber rounds, as well as various other small-caliber ammunitions.

Alliant (NYSE: ATK) and the U.S. Army are expanding ammunition production at the Lake City facility to 1.5 billion rounds a year.

Now SEALs and police use wolf? yeah ok.

Quoted: Now SEALs and police use wolf? yeah ok.

You forgot the space shuttle door gunners. It's the official practice ammo of the Space Shuttle Door Gunner Marksmanship Unit (SSDGMU). They specified uber tactical 2-stage triggers with adjustable screws, 1/7 twist barrels, and uber tactical free float handguards. It's all in the SSDGMU TDP

Quoted: Now SEALs and police use wolf? yeah ok.

You fellers need to re-tune your humor-meter.

He was only joking.

Quoted: Quoted: Now SEALs and police use wolf? yeah ok. You fellers need to re-tune your humor-meter. He was only joking.

I guess I should have made it more obvious I was joking.