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Posted: 2/13/2006 7:13:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/13/2006 7:14:10 AM EDT by LoginName]
I'm so pissed-off right now that I can't even begin to comment on this article...

City seeks safeguards on sale of bullets
Tracking technology is among possibilities

By Suzanne Smalley, Globe Staff | February 13, 2006

With firearm violence in Boston continuing to surge, police and city officials are looking for new anticrime tools, potentially including limiting ammunition sales, recording who buys ammunition, and using a new technology that transfers a gun's serial number onto a bullet's shell casing any time the gun is fired, said two officials who know about the plans.

Police Department and city officials offered few details publicly, but in his weekly column on the city's website, Mayor Thomas M. Menino discusses his plans, saying his recently formed strategic crime council is ''examining everything from ammunition sales regulation and bullet micro-stamping to stricter sentencing for illegal possession and trafficking."

''We want to tighten up how people can get ammunition," Police Superintendent Robert Dunford said. ''We're seeing loose rounds, a mix of ammunition. That might be a point of attack for us. . . . When you get the gun with ammunition and you fire it off, then you need to resupply. . . . That can be tough."

Dunford said Menino's office is working on proposed legislation to regulate ammunition. A spokesman for Menino declined to comment on the specifics of any legislation, saying only, ''Mayor Menino has made the message clear. He has a tremendous sense of urgency around devising both policy alternatives and new legislation that could make Boston a safer city."

The officials with knowledge of the plans, who declined to be named because the City Hall review is just beginning, said the city will focus on tightening the law.
Pop-up GLOBE GRAPHIC: Tracking the bullets

Currently, vendors are not required to record who buys ammunition, and buyers can purchase as much as they want, said Sergeant Detective Ray Mosher, who supervises the Boston Police Licensing unit, which regulates ammunition sales in the city. Mosher also said the current law allows buyers with a license for one type of gun to buy ammunition for any type of gun.

The number of shootings in which people were wounded or killed rose 28 percent last year over 2004. Police rolled out several programs to try to reverse that spike in gun violence, but after two shooting deaths Friday, there were six this year, compared with four at the same time last year. There have been 36 nonfatal shootings this year compared with 17 this time last year.

Police and city officials acknowledge that criminals could buy ammunition on the black market and out of state, but they say they have noticed an apparent shortage of ammunition on the streets. They also say that youths, who are both suspects and victims in many shootings, might be deterred if ammunition is more difficult to get.

The officials said Menino's interest in the new bullet-tracking technology, known as microstamping, is exploratory.

Still, the city is interested in the technology's ability to allow investigators to tie shell casings to gun owners. Under current ballistics technology, detectives must recover a weapon to link an owner to a crime scene or must compare markings on shell casings with bullets fired from guns recovered later.

''Microstamping is the most elegant solution to this problem," said Joshua Horwitz, the executive director of the nonprofit gun control advocacy group Educational Fund to Stop Gun Violence.

Horwitz said two members of Congress are preparing legislation that would require gun manufacturers to begin outfitting weapons with microstamping technology.

One of the most interesting features of microstamping technology is the ability it gives police to tap easily into existing databases, Horwitz said. In Massachusetts, buyers must list their name and the serial number of the weapon they're purchasing.

''It's using what's set up now," said Horwitz, who spoke at a US Conference of Mayors anticrime meeting attended by Menino last month. ''There's no extra administrative responsibilities."
Pop-up GLOBE GRAPHIC: Tracking the bullets

Horwitz said microstamping legislation recently passed one house of the California Legislature.

Griffin Dix, whose 15-year-old son was killed in an unintentional shooting and who now runs the California chapters of the Million Mom March, a group that fights for tougher gun laws, said he is hopeful the California Legislature will pass the microstamping bill, which he said would require the technology for all semi-automatic handguns sold there by 2009.

About 30 police chiefs have also lobbied legislators in support of the bill, Dix said. Handguns are used in about 60 percent of the average of 2,400 annual homicides in California, and no arrest is made in 45 percent of them because police don't have enough evidence, Dix said.

''If people realize that they are likely to be found out, who bought that gun, then they're less likely to commit a crime," Dix said. ''Also, this will have an effect on reducing gun trafficking. . . . With straw purchasers knowing that this gun can be traced right back to them . . . they're less likely to buy these guns and give them to traffickers."

But Andrew Arulanandam, a spokesman for the National Rifle Association, a gun rights advocacy group, said criminals will always find ways around systems such as microstamping.

''Schemes such as this do not work for a very simple reason: Criminals by definition don't follow the law," Arulanandam said. ''Therefore, the only universe of people who are affected by this are law-abiding. A criminal intent on committing a heinous crime is not going to be deterred by such laws."

But Menino appears to be listening to groups on the other side of the issue.

Peter Hamm, communications director for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, said Menino's office asked the gun control advocacy organization in November for advice on how to combat firearm violence. He said the Brady Campaign advised City Hall not only on the availability of microstamping technology, but also on the importance of partnering with other urban mayors, as Menino has recently done with New York Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg.

''If there are ideas on the table that could increase closure rate of gun crime investigations by 10 or 15 or 20 percent, they're worth doing because there are real victims here," Hamm said.

''We felt like the city's interest in this and the mayor's interest in this is strikingly real because of the outreach they've made to us."

www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2006/02/13/city_seeks_safeguards_on_sale_of_bullets
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:14:23 AM EDT
5...4...3...2...1
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:15:12 AM EDT
Didn't they try something like that in Cali a while ago?
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:20:23 AM EDT
AND THAT MY FRIENDS IS WHY WE STOCK UP ON AMMUNITION, not for some global zombie fight, but so the "MAN" can't control us.

[austin powers] "it's a groovy time we're living in baby, yeahhh.[/austin powers]
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:25:36 AM EDT

About 30 police chiefs have also lobbied legislators in support of the bill, Dix said. Handguns are used in about 60 percent of the average of 2,400 annual homicides in California, and no arrest is made in 45 percent of them because police don't have enough evidence, Dix said.


Let me guess. They're exempt.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:41:32 AM EDT
Well, when in doubt, reload. I highly doubt they've thought to regulate cartridge components entering the state/city. That way there would be no record of ammunition transactions since you aren't actually making a transaction for loaded ammunition. MJD
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:42:52 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/13/2006 7:43:09 AM EDT by Gloftoe]
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:46:00 AM EDT
BeanTown Libtards...sheesh! [whackos]
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:47:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By LoginName:
and using a new technology that transfers a gun's serial number onto a bullet's shell casing any time the gun is fired,



Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:49:50 AM EDT


Originally Posted By LoginName:

and using a new technology that transfers a gun's serial number onto a bullet's shell casing any time the gun is fired,



They would then need to enact a GANG BANGER GUN TRADE-IN PROGRAM where said gang banger turns in his Gat, and gets a new one that has the serial number feature.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:54:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By stormwalker:
AND THAT MY FRIENDS IS WHY WE STOCK UP ON AMMUNITION, not for some global zombie fight, but so the "MAN" can't control us.

[austin powers] "it's a groovy time we're living in baby, yeahhh.[/austin powers]



I wonder if there can be some money made from this law too. Spending 5K on no-stamp ammo now, might payoff at the guns shows later. hmmmmmmmm. If I lived in MASS I would hedge.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:58:04 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 7:59:19 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:02:59 AM EDT
So they want to have every gun equiped with some kind of Microstamper???!?

I am guessing that the technology and equipment necessary to do this would make every handgun a crew-served weapon....

Idiots.....
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:06:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By highwayman:
Well, when in doubt, reload. I highly doubt they've thought to regulate cartridge components entering the state/city. That way there would be no record of ammunition transactions since you aren't actually making a transaction for loaded ammunition. MJD



You underestimate the stupidity and liberal BS of the MA State Legislature...


"GOAL is pleased to announce that we are launching our next effort to reform the state's "Worst in the Nation" gun laws. Last year GOAL was successful in passing Chapter 150 of the Acts of 2004. That bill brought some long awaited reforms such as the 90 day grace period, extended six year licenses, the Firearms Licensing Review Board and more.

This year, GOAL is launching our Precision Sports Legislative Reform Package. This reform package is intended to address the problems regarding restrictions on the sale of precision firearms and ammunition components.

For more than six years, lawful Massachusetts gun owners have been prevented from purchasing new precision firearms that are necessary to compete in internationally and nationally recognized competitions such as Olympic Style, International Practical Shooting or Single Action. Every Massachusetts resident who participates in these competitions is restricted from lawfully purchasing the latest precision firearms. GOAL's Precision Sports Legislative Reform Package will address this problem by exempting firearms that are manufactured and sold for formal target shooting as well as exempting single action revolvers.

Another problem that will be addressed by this reform package stems from the Massachusetts Attorney General's new interpretation of the ammunition laws. This new interpretation prevents out of state companies from selling ammunition and/or components to lawfully licensed Massachusetts residents. The reform package will solve part of this problem by removing casings, bullets and primers from the legal definition of ammunition. This will at least allow individuals to order precision reloading components from companies outside of the state.

We urge all Massachusetts citizens to call their legislators and ask them to support the Precision Sports Legislative Reform Package.

www.goal.org/target/Home.htm
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:08:02 AM EDT
Yep, the anti-gunners are at it again. Even though it has nothing or little to do with crime, the anti-gun politicos are at it again. Unfortunately the gunners are asleep at the switch as usual. The gunners allow such politicians to be elected in the first place because they aren't active personally politically because they are too busy etc or just plain lazy. Many of them depend on the NRA or the state rifle association to do the job. And this is what they are going to get.

Here in Calif, we will probably suffered the same feat, as Ahnold vetoed a similar bill, but the Democratic controlled legislature promised to revisit this bill to regulate ammo. The problem is that Ahnold could conceiveable loose the re-election to a Dem and ..................
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:13:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/13/2006 8:16:37 AM EDT by gardenWeasel]

Horwitz said two members of Congress are preparing legislation that would require gun manufacturers to begin outfitting weapons with microstamping technology.



That's because SAAMI told them to go pound sand when they tried to make ammunition manufacturers
serialize bullets.

www.nssf.org/common/PR/042605.cfm?wTPL=X&print=X&PR=X
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:15:03 AM EDT
GIT YER BRAAASSSSS CAAATCHERRRSS HEEERRR......

Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:22:02 AM EDT
You could theoretically laser engrave the chamber wall so that when the case expands, it makes a marking into the case. However, I can see some potential problems with this (KA BOOM for one), and what happens when you don't clean the chamber, or rather, overclean the chamber.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:34:16 AM EDT
And the MA state quarter has a man with a gun on it. FALSE ADVERTISING!
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:36:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By metroplex:
You could theoretically laser engrave the chamber wall so that when the case expands, it makes a marking into the case. However, I can see some potential problems with this (KA BOOM for one), and what happens when you don't clean the chamber, or rather, overclean the chamber.



One company has already devopled that sort of thing.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:38:59 AM EDT

Originally Posted By LoginName:

Originally Posted By metroplex:
You could theoretically laser engrave the chamber wall so that when the case expands, it makes a marking into the case. However, I can see some potential problems with this (KA BOOM for one), and what happens when you don't clean the chamber, or rather, overclean the chamber.



One company has already devopled that sort of thing.



I guess that would make the revolver more popular among criminals?
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:42:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By five2one:

Originally Posted By stormwalker:
AND THAT MY FRIENDS IS WHY WE STOCK UP ON AMMUNITION, not for some global zombie fight, but so the "MAN" can't control us.

[austin powers] "it's a groovy time we're living in baby, yeahhh.[/austin powers]


I wonder if there can be some money made from this law too. Spending 5K on no-stamp ammo now, might payoff at the guns shows later. hmmmmmmmm. If I lived in MASS I would hedge.


Guys, it's not the ammo that is stamped, it's the gun that stamps the ammo as it is fired.

That's what they are talking about..
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:42:55 AM EDT
Wow, didn't work in Cali, so it gets shopped around. Don't worry, serialized ammo or a pistol that serializes shell casings; coming to a state near you!
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:43:24 AM EDT
"loose ammo" haha.

Somebody should do an airdrop of ammo on this guy's house. Drive him bonkers.

The BULLLETS! They're All around me!
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:45:46 AM EDT
If this law was passed and I was a criminal, I'd go down to the local range and grab a handful of spent .40 casings. Then when I had to pop a cap in somebody, I'd pick up my own brass and throw a handful of the range casings at the scene. Now the popo has a whole bunch of red herrings to chase down.

Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:50:03 AM EDT
It pisses me off that they consult the Brady bunch for advice to reduce "gun" violence. They already knew what the suggestion would be. Apparently they could care less about any other forms of violence.

On the Mass Pike right outside of Fenway park there was a huge anti-gun billboard saying Mass gun laws work. Guess they should take it down.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:50:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Wobblin-Goblin:

That's what they are talking about..



As long as the guns you own now are grandfathered by law, you will have nothing to worry about.

Link Posted: 2/13/2006 12:19:22 PM EDT
" Mosher also said the current law allows buyers with a license for one type of gun to buy ammunition for any type of gun."


WHAT IS THIS SHIT???????


Did he have his brain removed, or has he never seen the MGL's?

You CAN NOT buy pistol ammo without a pistol license(LTC-A). For fucks sake, non-residents can't even by ammo here without a Non-Res license(Non-Res LTC-A). You also CAN NOT buy pistol ammo if you only have a LTC-B(rifle only).


Link Posted: 2/13/2006 12:29:08 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 12:33:20 PM EDT
I love them..the real problem is BIG CITIES and the Polititions they breed
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 12:49:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FunYun1983:

Did he have his brain removed, or has he never seen the MGL's?

You CAN NOT buy pistol ammo without a pistol license(LTC-A). For fucks sake, non-residents can't even by ammo here without a Non-Res license(Non-Res LTC-A). You also CAN NOT buy pistol ammo if you only have a LTC-B(rifle only).




Wow, Is that the law in tax-a-chu-shits? I thought the PRK had screwed up firearms laws but that is off the hook.

BTW tax-a-chu-shit 'law makers' would spend their time better PUNISHING those fine upstanding young gang social club members who commit crimes rather than restricting the RIGHTS of decent people.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 12:54:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/13/2006 12:56:10 PM EDT by LoginName]

Originally Posted By FunYun1983:
You also CAN NOT buy pistol ammo if you only have a LTC-B(rifle only).





That's incorrect; a class B LTC will allow a person to purchase handgun ammunition.

(maybe you were thinking of an FID card... rfile and shotgun only?)

A Class A LTC will cover purchase and possession of all handguns, rifles
and shotguns, including those now considered “large capacity.”

A Class B LTC will cover possession of large capacity rifles and shotguns, and non large capacity
handguns. A Class B License does not permit the holder to carry concealed or loaded on a
public way. (Generally, a handgun or rifle is large capacity if it can hold more than ten rounds
of ammunition, a shotgun if it can hold more than five shot shells.)

www.goal.org/misc/faq/ltcfaq.pdf

Nonetheless... the asshats statement that "the current law allows buyers with a license for one type of gun to buy ammunition for any type of gun." is assinine... as in it should be ileagal.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 12:58:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By happycynic:
If this law was passed and I was a criminal, I'd go down to the local range and grab a handful of spent .40 casings. Then when I had to pop a cap in somebody, I'd pick up my own brass and throw a handful of the range casings at the scene. Now the popo has a whole bunch of red herrings to chase down.




I would find a way to get hold of the brass that the chief of police fires for practice and ensure that that turned up at each end every crime scene - same for the politicos body guards.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 1:08:55 PM EDT
According to the article the primer would be stamped by the firing pin with the guns ID.

Now, I'm no gunsmith but would not a piece of 400 grit sandpaper and about 2 minutes take care of this problem?
Not that I would ever seek to avoid compliance with the law. I'm just sayin' thats all.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 1:15:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sslocal:
According to the article the primer would be stamped by the firing pin with the guns ID.

Now, I'm no gunsmith but would not a piece of 400 grit sandpaper and about 2 minutes take care of this problem?
Not that I would ever seek to avoid compliance with the law. I'm just sayin' thats all.



exactly, thats if the criminals happen to "steal" a new gun with the new technology!! I live here. We have some of the strictest gun laws in the country and gun crime is on the rise DUH!! Criminals like unarmed victims. Mayor Menino is a mumbling moron!!!
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 1:34:18 PM EDT

The number of shootings in which people were wounded or killed rose 28 percent last year over 2004. Police rolled out several programs to try to reverse that spike in gun violence, but after two shooting deaths Friday, there were six this year, compared with four at the same time last year. There have been 36 nonfatal shootings this year compared with 17 this time last year.


I'm guessing none of them see that more gun control = more crimes?
Jesus - what a bunch of fucktards.
Massachusetts gunowners - aren't you glad you got your licenses, and registered your guns, like good little Juden?

Zeit für Ihre Dusche, Herr Gewehrinhaber!
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