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Posted: 1/26/2006 7:51:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/2/2006 8:48:00 AM EDT by niceguymr]
Anyone ever heard of BST EXPRESS SHIPPING as an escrow agent?
www.bstexpressshipping.com

How about MAX BICYCLE LTD. located in MAX Bicycle Store 915 Washington St., Helena, MT, 59601, USA.
www.maxbicycle.com/

I'm still trying to figure out if this is a scam before I post any more information. I'm starting to get a really funny feeling about this. I will not be sending any money until I can confirm the validity of BOTH of these business.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 7:52:46 PM EDT
need more info
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 7:53:58 PM EDT
What exactly are you getting in return of sending them money?
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:06:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 8:11:06 PM EDT by niceguymr]
I have to admit, this seems very legit on the surface until you try to do business with them.

The Maxbicycle website has all these great prices on bikes well below normal prices. You cannot order throught their website using any secure ordering system. You must email them, and then they send you ordering instructions. If you call the number on the website, you get a robotic answering service (I tried several times today and even left a message with no responses). If you email them though, they respond rather quickly. So far, this is what has happened. I emailed them as follows:

I am interested in the Specialized Stumpjumper FSR
> Expert Disc 120 for $1500 with Free shipping, and
> would like to know how to purchase it from you. I
> can be reached at (XXX) XXX-XXXX. My name is XXXXX.
> Unless you call me, I wont be able to respond to
> emails until Friday at the earliest. I can provide
> payment immediately. Please call me right away for
> immediate transaction.



To which they responded...

Dear customer,

Thank you for your interest in our bikes. THIS IS A
STOCK LIMIT OFFER!!! We give this discount because we
are liquidating the 2005 stock.

We have all sizes and colors available on stock right
now in this model.

The buy it now price for the complete bike is US$1500
. In this price all shipment costs are included too.

We want a safe transaction to be made and we prefer to
use a Third Party Company (escrow company) to handle
this transaction and both to be protected from fraud.
We will support all the fees for a fast transaction.

If you decide to buy it now, please email us
imediately and we will give you more details.

You can check our website at www.maxbicycle.com


We look forward for your reply,

Thomas Bowler,
Sales Dep.,
Max Bicycle ltd,
address: 915 Washington St., Helena, MT, 59601, USA
toll free number: 866-837-0608
website: www.maxbicycle.com
email: maxbicyclestore@yahoo.com



To which I responded...

Yes, I want to buy this now (NEW 2005 SPECIALIZED STUMPJUMPER FSR EXPERT DISC 120 in size LARGE 19") What color is it available in? Does it come with FULL WARRANTY? Please tell me what to do to complete this transaction.

Thank you,
XXXXX


To which they responded...

Dear customer,

We have it available. It comes with full warranty.

We would like to make a fast and secure transaction.

We have used escrow.com in past but we received
payments after 3 weeks after our customers told them
to send us payments. We will not use this company
anymore.

We have found a very good company who can handle
shipping too and that works as a Third Party Company.
We work with them for 5 months and we are satisfied
with them.

The company is BST Express Shipping and their web site
is www.bstexpressshipping.com. Please take a look and
make a decision (Read the HOW IT WORKS section). We
accept to support their fees.

It will take 7 days the bike to arrive at your door.



We look forward for your reply,

Thomas Bowler,
Sales Dep.,
Max Bicycle ltd,
address: 915 Washington St., Helena, MT, 59601, USA
toll free number: 866-837-0608
website: www.maxbicycle.com
email: maxbicyclestore@yahoo.com


To which I responded...

Thomas,
I have read and registered with bstexpressshipping.com. I am ready to complete the transaction, however I am concerned that I cannot locate your business in any telephone directory and have been unable to reach anyone by telephone. Before I agree to send $1500 to anyone, I would like to speak to someone directly to verify the validity of your business. Please let me know who or where to call to verify this information.

Thank you,
XXXX


As of now, I have not heard back from them. They have responded within minutes to all my previous emails except for the last one. It's been almost a half an hour. I'm not being impatient, but this deal is starting to smell very fishy.

ETA: I have done a thorough search for both business entities involved and have turned up nothing. There is nothing listed at the address in Helena Montana either. The "squaretrade" logos on the website are 'unclickable'. MAX Bicycle is not listed as a dealer on the Specialized Bicycle Company website. That part doesn't concern me the most though... I'm aware there are many unauthorized dealers of many things across the country. Sometimes, that's how you can get a really good deal, but this is very sketchy.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:12:30 PM EDT
Old adage in non-face to face transactions. "Buy the buyer, not the product". The fact that these guys don't have a secure way of ordering from their website should be your first warning. The next red flag should be the wording of their emails. I would stay away from these people. Not worth potentially getting burned to save a few bucks. Besides, support your local bike shop. They can provided you with after purchase service that those internet companys never can.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:16:44 PM EDT
This stuff stinks...

I ran WHOIS lookups on those domains:

(www.maxbicycle.com)
Registrar: AAAQ.COM, INC.
Status: REGISTRAR-LOCK [the normal status for a domain when it is locked]
Dates: Created 23-jan-2006 Updated 23-jan-2006 Expires 23-jan-2007
DNS Servers: A.DNS.HOSTWAY.NET B.DNS.HOSTWAY.NET
Registrant:
WhoisProtector Inc.
Domain Name:maxbicycle.com
Domain servers in listed order:
a.dns.hostway.net
b.dns.hostway.net

(www.bstexpressingshipping.com)
Registrar: AAAQ.COM, INC.
Status: REGISTRAR-LOCK [the normal status for a domain when it is locked]
Dates: Created 23-jan-2006 Updated 23-jan-2006 Expires 23-jan-2007
DNS Servers: A.DNS.HOSTWAY.NET B.DNS.HOSTWAY.NET
Registrant:
WhoisProtector Inc.
Domain Name:bstexpressshipping.com
Domain servers in listed order:
a.dns.hostway.net
b.dns.hostway.net

Run away from that crap. Hiding Registrant info is a little bootleg, and having the two "independent" companies use the same domain servers is fishy. Notice the registration dates? Those websites were created 3 days ago.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:22:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 8:22:41 PM EDT by blacklisted]
Scam.

[whois.aaaq.com]
Registrant:
WhoisProtector Inc.

Domain Name:maxbicycle.com

Domain servers in listed order:
a.dns.hostway.net
b.dns.hostway.net



[whois.aaaq.com]
Registrant:
WhoisProtector Inc.

Domain Name:bstexpressshipping.com

Domain servers in listed order:
a.dns.hostway.net
b.dns.hostway.net

I doubt that is a coincidence.

ETA: Findsman beat me to it!


Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:24:08 PM EDT
Yeah, this must be a scam... A good one I must admit b/c I'm not very gullible and it was a deal that was not so ridiculously good that you would suspect anything, but it was pretty enticing.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:24:38 PM EDT
I'd also like to add that the bst shipping site is TERRIBLY unprofessional. It sucks.

http://www.bstexpressshipping.com/thrd_register.htm

Note that this is not a secure server (you can tell by https and/or a lock that appears on the status bar).
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:27:51 PM EDT
If you look at the satellite photo of their supposed US headquarters it appears to be a building in a resdential/commercial area of los angeles. There are shipping/receiving docks so it could be a real building. I doubt that it has anything to do with this "company" though.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:29:33 PM EDT
BST SHIPPING - We Delivery Anything
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:44:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 8:45:15 PM EDT by jpman7]
Run!!!!

Ask them if they need any Anus laptops!!!
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:56:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jpman7:
Run!!!!

Ask them if they need any Anus laptops!!!



TRUST ME... I've already thought about going the ANUS LAPTOP route.... I just don't have the time to deal with it. These guys should really get what they deserve one day!
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:57:14 PM EDT
I got one today too, I told him to meet me here in Hawaii, if he shows up hes gonna catch an ass whoopin.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:02:43 PM EDT
If you really want to freak them out, tell them you will be in the area and that you will be willing to pick it up in person. I bet they will not allow you to do that.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:03:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By blacklisted:
If you look at the satellite photo of their supposed US headquarters it appears to be a building in a resdential/commercial area of los angeles. There are shipping/receiving docks so it could be a real building. I doubt that it has anything to do with this "company" though.



I live about 2 miles from the BST Shipping Express "Corporate Headquarters". I can check it out tomorrow if you'd like. btw, I say don't order from them, no matter how much you save, it doesn't seem worth the risk.

But, just for the sake of it, I can shoot by tomorrow.

Eric
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:04:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ARDOC:
If you really want to freak them out, tell them you will be in the area and that you will be willing to pick it up in person. I bet they will not allow you to do that.



That my friend, will get you murdered in Nigeria, whether you show with money or not. Id rather they come to my doorstep, I even told the guy I would reimburse him for the ticket if he showed up.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:04:52 PM EDT
Call the phone number.

Its says all lines are busy! They must do a whopping amout of transactions at 1 in the AM.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:05:19 PM EDT
I looked at the Helena address on Google Earth. I'm familiar with Helena, went to elementary school there. There are no businesses at that address. It's a low-income housing area. This is definitely a scam.

Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:06:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By ARDOC:
If you really want to freak them out, tell them you will be in the area and that you will be willing to pick it up in person. I bet they will not allow you to do that.



That my friend, will get you murdered in Nigeria, whether you show with money or not. Id rather they come to my doorstep, I even told the guy I would reimburse him for the ticket if he showed up.




I think you miss the point. You offer this to see what they will reply. If its a scam they will not want to meet you face to face. They will worry its a sting as well.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:08:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ARDOC:

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By ARDOC:
If you really want to freak them out, tell them you will be in the area and that you will be willing to pick it up in person. I bet they will not allow you to do that.



That my friend, will get you murdered in Nigeria, whether you show with money or not. Id rather they come to my doorstep, I even told the guy I would reimburse him for the ticket if he showed up.




I think you miss the point. You offer this to see what they will reply. If its a scam they will not want to meet you face to face. They will worry its a sting as well.



It really depends on the scammer and where they are in the world. If they are stateside, they will pussyfoot away from you. If its international they will do their best to get you in their backyard so they can play hopscotch in your asshole.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:13:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By ARDOC:

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By ARDOC:
If you really want to freak them out, tell them you will be in the area and that you will be willing to pick it up in person. I bet they will not allow you to do that.



That my friend, will get you murdered in Nigeria, whether you show with money or not. Id rather they come to my doorstep, I even told the guy I would reimburse him for the ticket if he showed up.




I think you miss the point. You offer this to see what they will reply. If its a scam they will not want to meet you face to face. They will worry its a sting as well.



It really depends on the scammer and where they are in the world. If they are stateside, they will pussyfoot away from you. If its international they will do their best to get you in their backyard so they can play hopscotch in your asshole.



So Helena is now international?
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:19:57 PM EDT
ROFL, on the MAX website there is a feedback link so I clicked it. There's a bunch of testimonials from "happy customers". I copied one of them and put it into google, and it's actually quoted verbatim from a different bicycle sales website. It's the "I bought my 450 after much research, and it paid off. My bike greatly outperforms big names like Trek that blah, blah, blah one"
Hunter A., Lake Tahoe, CA

IBEX
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:21:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ARDOC:

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By ARDOC:

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By ARDOC:
If you really want to freak them out, tell them you will be in the area and that you will be willing to pick it up in person. I bet they will not allow you to do that.



That my friend, will get you murdered in Nigeria, whether you show with money or not. Id rather they come to my doorstep, I even told the guy I would reimburse him for the ticket if he showed up.




I think you miss the point. You offer this to see what they will reply. If its a scam they will not want to meet you face to face. They will worry its a sting as well.



It really depends on the scammer and where they are in the world. If they are stateside, they will pussyfoot away from you. If its international they will do their best to get you in their backyard so they can play hopscotch in your asshole.



So Helena is now international?



Could just be a drop box.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:22:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 9:23:03 PM EDT by nf9648]

Originally Posted By ARDOC:

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By ARDOC:

Originally Posted By nf9648:

Originally Posted By ARDOC:
If you really want to freak them out, tell them you will be in the area and that you will be willing to pick it up in person. I bet they will not allow you to do that.



That my friend, will get you murdered in Nigeria, whether you show with money or not. Id rather they come to my doorstep, I even told the guy I would reimburse him for the ticket if he showed up.




I think you miss the point. You offer this to see what they will reply. If its a scam they will not want to meet you face to face. They will worry its a sting as well.



It really depends on the scammer and where they are in the world. If they are stateside, they will pussyfoot away from you. If its international they will do their best to get you in their backyard so they can play hopscotch in your asshole.



So Helena is now international?



I put it in red this time for you since you didnt catch it last time.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:24:15 PM EDT
Dude what is your problem. The guy is talking about addresses in Helena not Nigeria. Last time I looked Helena is in MT.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:24:22 PM EDT
niceguymr - There is absolutely NO "MAX Bicycle" in Helena, MT.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 9:26:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ARDOC:
Dude what is your problem. The guy is talking about addresses in Helena not Nigeria. Last time I looked Helena is in MT.



Youre becoming my problem, take it for what its worth. Obviously youve got a problem with others opinions, not all scams come from Helena. Obviously youve made your point, you should recognize mine.
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 12:39:46 AM EDT
You can get a PO box pretty easily, and you can have mail forwarded from it to any address you want, even internationally. Just because they have an address in Montana doesn't mean they aren't in a basement in Monrovia...
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 9:22:20 PM EDT
Well... I managed to turn 'possible' scam against me into money in my pocket.

I went to the local bike shop and asked if they would match advertised pricing, to which they responded 'yes'. Mind you that the bike model that I wanted from the website mentioned in this post was an '05 model and my local bike shop happened to have 2 different model '05 left (The rest of their bikes are 2006 models). The ones that they had in stock were a model that was only inferior b/c of a few components, but still carried an MSRP of $2000, of which I probably would have been able to get it for $1500 since it was last years model... it has the same exact frame though as the '06. Anyway, he pulled up the price on that website and was surprised to see the (possible scammer's) price at $1000. The guy looked in disbelief and then went to check on the cost of the bike which turned out to be $1040 which he was nice enough to show me. He said he couldn't do the $1000 price, but he could do $1100 which would cover the shop's cost + shipping & assembly. I gratefully agreed, and even upgraded a few of the components, still getting the bike at around 40% off MSRP with the shop still making money and a happy new customer. Yeah, I know they actually probably lost money on my sale, but they gained a new customer which can go a long way for them.
Link Posted: 1/31/2006 1:29:21 PM EDT
I just got a phone call from a private investigator working for the Attorney General's Office inquiring about my experience with the websites I originally posted about. Apparrently, over 20 people have already sent money to these scammers who are based out of Chicago and not some country in Africa. Anyway, I guess I was lucky & smart enough to be suspicious and not go through with the deal. Anyway, the guy just asked me a few questions and wanted to be certain that I did not send them any money. They are still trying to track the scammers down, but so far they still run loose.
Link Posted: 1/31/2006 1:39:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By niceguymr:
Well... I managed to turn 'possible' scam against me into money in my pocket.

I went to the local bike shop and asked if they would match advertised pricing, to which they responded 'yes'. Mind you that the bike model that I wanted from the website mentioned in this post was an '05 model and my local bike shop happened to have 2 different model '05 left (The rest of their bikes are 2006 models). The ones that they had in stock were a model that was only inferior b/c of a few components, but still carried an MSRP of $2000, of which I probably would have been able to get it for $1500 since it was last years model... it has the same exact frame though as the '06. Anyway, he pulled up the price on that website and was surprised to see the (possible scammer's) price at $1000. The guy looked in disbelief and then went to check on the cost of the bike which turned out to be $1040 which he was nice enough to show me. He said he couldn't do the $1000 price, but he could do $1100 which would cover the shop's cost + shipping & assembly. I gratefully agreed, and even upgraded a few of the components, still getting the bike at around 40% off MSRP with the shop still making money and a happy new customer. Yeah, I know they actually probably lost money on my sale, but they gained a new customer which can go a long way for them.



Not to bust your balls, but that seemed a mite unethical to me.

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 8:54:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:

Not to bust your balls, but that seemed a mite unethical to me.




Maybe to some. Maybe to me. Maybe not.

Local Bike Store LBS that marks up their products 45% to the vast majority of public claims they'll meat any competitors 'advertised' price. I find a competitive website (that I only SUSPECT may be a scam, but cannot draw a decisive conclusion on) and show to the LBS. They gladly agree to match the prices, without a hitch. They simply say that they're selling it to me at their cost, but since it's last years model, it's OK. They want to clear those out anyway. So I decide to purchase it. After the purchase, I'm informed that the website is a scam by an outside 3rd party. The LBS loses only a potential gain of a few hundred dollars, compared to actually gaining a loyal customer who will pay full price in the future. It's not like I KNOWINGLY did anything. I never ABSOLUTELY KNEW there was a scam involved until days after I purchased the bike. The bike store didn't lose any money either. I upgraded plenty of parts to throw a little more money their way for coming down on the price. Sometimes, that's the cost of doing business. You give a little, take a little. I saved about $800. The LBS made some money off my purchase, and lots more money off other peoples purchases. It's a wash if you ask me.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:22:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By niceguymr:

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:

Not to bust your balls, but that seemed a mite unethical to me.




Maybe to some. Maybe to me. Maybe not.

Local Bike Store LBS that marks up their products 45% to the vast majority of public claims they'll meat any competitors 'advertised' price. I find a competitive website (that I only SUSPECT may be a scam, but cannot draw a decisive conclusion on) and show to the LBS. They gladly agree to match the prices, without a hitch. They simply say that they're selling it to me at their cost, but since it's last years model, it's OK. They want to clear those out anyway. So I decide to purchase it. After the purchase, I'm informed that the website is a scam by an outside 3rd party. The LBS loses only a potential gain of a few hundred dollars, compared to actually gaining a loyal customer who will pay full price in the future. It's not like I KNOWINGLY did anything. I never ABSOLUTELY KNEW there was a scam involved until days after I purchased the bike. The bike store didn't lose any money either. I upgraded plenty of parts to throw a little more money their way for coming down on the price. Sometimes, that's the cost of doing business. You give a little, take a little. I saved about $800. The LBS made some money off my purchase, and lots more money off other peoples purchases. It's a wash if you ask me.



Yea, that's some pretty gray territory there!
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:33:55 PM EDT
I wish I had the spare 1100 to buy a bike i mean my first AR-15 a i mean new car to replace my beat up 400 dollar POS.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:47:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By niceguymr:

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:

Not to bust your balls, but that seemed a mite unethical to me.




Maybe to some. Maybe to me. Maybe not.

Local Bike Store LBS that marks up their products 45% to the vast majority of public claims they'll meat any competitors 'advertised' price. I find a competitive website (that I only SUSPECT may be a scam, but cannot draw a decisive conclusion on) and show to the LBS. They gladly agree to match the prices, without a hitch. They simply say that they're selling it to me at their cost, but since it's last years model, it's OK. They want to clear those out anyway. So I decide to purchase it. After the purchase, I'm informed that the website is a scam by an outside 3rd party. The LBS loses only a potential gain of a few hundred dollars, compared to actually gaining a loyal customer who will pay full price in the future. It's not like I KNOWINGLY did anything. I never ABSOLUTELY KNEW there was a scam involved until days after I purchased the bike. The bike store didn't lose any money either. I upgraded plenty of parts to throw a little more money their way for coming down on the price. Sometimes, that's the cost of doing business. You give a little, take a little. I saved about $800. The LBS made some money off my purchase, and lots more money off other peoples purchases. It's a wash if you ask me.



Bullshit. You committed a crime.

You used a website that you knew was the work of a con-man in order to gain a financial benefit for yourself. That's fraud. Because of the amount involved, it's probably a felony. Congratulations, you're no better than the person who put up the maxbicycle.com website.


Originally Posted By niceguymr:
These guys should really get what they deserve one day!



So should you.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 8:38:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Nimrod1193:
You used a website that you knew was the work of a con-man in order to gain a financial benefit for yourself.



First of all Nimrod, I had NO absolute certain knowledge that the website was a fraud at the time of purchasing my bike from the LBC. Even still today, the website is still up and running and although I received that phone call from a private investigator, nothing has been proven about the 'suspected' scammers. Even more still, the bicycle shop agreed to sell me the bicycle based on information that was publicly available on the internet. I did not create the website nor could I prove that it was real or fake, and I still cant today. In fact I may go back and buy ANOTHER bike from them for my girlfriend so long as they are willing to honor the price 'match'.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 8:44:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By niceguymr:
First of all Nimrod, I had NO absolute certain knowledge that the website was a fraud at the time of purchasing my bike from the LBC.



If it helps you sleep at night, fine, but sell that bullshit somewhere else, we ain't buying.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 8:45:34 AM EDT
YET ANOTHER SCAM FOLLOWS IN THE WAKE OF THE ORGINAL...

So I put one of my older bikes for sale up on craigslist.com since I don't have room for so many bikes in my home (and b/c my gf insists that I get rid of at least one of them) and what follows is a transcript of some correspondence I had with a 'potential' buyer of my old bike... (start from the bottom and work your way up) ME and SCAMMER

Excellent! No problem. Please reply back with your phone number and I will call you with the information.

Thank you for the response.I am okay with the price and the condition.My mode of payment will be by check in US dollars ,because that is the only convenient means for me .Concerning the shipment,my shipper will be at your place for the pick up after you receive the payment .I really wish to be there to check out the item but i dont have chance.Please let me have the following so that the payment can be made to you .your full name to be on the check your full contact address ,your zip code and your mobile and land number ASAP Regards


> I am the direct owner. I just had it tuned up at the bike shop and
put new tires and cables on it. It runs PERFECTLY and is
in EXCELLENT condition. The price of the bike is $200. For $250 I
will include a car/trunk rack and a helmet.
>


-----Original Message-----
From: patrick lewis [mailto:lewis42020@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 11:20 AM
To:
Subject: Bike

craigslist Advisory: Fraud and Scam Warning!
Please read our scam advisory page before replying to this message:
http://www.craigslist.org/about/scams.html

This warning is automatically attached to
ALL craigslist forwarded emails


Hello seller
I will like to buy your bike placed for sale .Are you the direct owner ? If
yes,let me know the present condition .And i will like to know the
last price you are ready to sell. Get back to me immediately. Regards


I haven't heard back from the guy since my last email response.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:27:23 AM EDT

Originally Posted By niceguymr:
YET ANOTHER SCAM FOLLOWS IN THE WAKE OF THE ORGINAL...

So I put one of my older bikes for sale up on craigslist.com since I don't have room for so many bikes in my home (and b/c my gf insists that I get rid of at least one of them)





Why is your GF making demands on what happens inside your house?
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:29:38 AM EDT
It's a scam dude and covered extensively over on dirtrag.com

Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:44:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By niceguymr:

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:

Not to bust your balls, but that seemed a mite unethical to me.




Maybe to some. Maybe to me. Maybe not.

Local Bike Store LBS that marks up their products 45% to the vast majority of public claims they'll meat any competitors 'advertised' price. I find a competitive website (that I only SUSPECT may be a scam, but cannot draw a decisive conclusion on) and show to the LBS. They gladly agree to match the prices, without a hitch. They simply say that they're selling it to me at their cost, but since it's last years model, it's OK. They want to clear those out anyway. So I decide to purchase it. After the purchase, I'm informed that the website is a scam by an outside 3rd party. The LBS loses only a potential gain of a few hundred dollars, compared to actually gaining a loyal customer who will pay full price in the future. It's not like I KNOWINGLY did anything. I never ABSOLUTELY KNEW there was a scam involved until days after I purchased the bike. The bike store didn't lose any money either. I upgraded plenty of parts to throw a little more money their way for coming down on the price. Sometimes, that's the cost of doing business. You give a little, take a little. I saved about $800. The LBS made some money off my purchase, and lots more money off other peoples purchases. It's a wash if you ask me.




So you were smart enough to stay away froma scam, yet you used it on a legit business to save some change. Not much better than the scammer your self.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:50:08 AM EDT
You should really call up Specialized and make sure they list that company as an authorized dealer. If they don't, the bike will not be covered under the mfr warranty regardless of that the bike shop says.


Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:55:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Timanator:

Originally Posted By niceguymr:

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:

Not to bust your balls, but that seemed a mite unethical to me.




Maybe to some. Maybe to me. Maybe not.

Local Bike Store LBS that marks up their products 45% to the vast majority of public claims they'll meat any competitors 'advertised' price. I find a competitive website (that I only SUSPECT may be a scam, but cannot draw a decisive conclusion on) and show to the LBS. They gladly agree to match the prices, without a hitch. They simply say that they're selling it to me at their cost, but since it's last years model, it's OK. They want to clear those out anyway. So I decide to purchase it. After the purchase, I'm informed that the website is a scam by an outside 3rd party. The LBS loses only a potential gain of a few hundred dollars, compared to actually gaining a loyal customer who will pay full price in the future. It's not like I KNOWINGLY did anything. I never ABSOLUTELY KNEW there was a scam involved until days after I purchased the bike. The bike store didn't lose any money either. I upgraded plenty of parts to throw a little more money their way for coming down on the price. Sometimes, that's the cost of doing business. You give a little, take a little. I saved about $800. The LBS made some money off my purchase, and lots more money off other peoples purchases. It's a wash if you ask me.




So you were smart enough to stay away froma scam, yet you used it on a legit business to save some change. Not much better than the scammer your self.



+1

Hall of Shame
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 10:04:38 AM EDT
You can assume it's a scam.

When I was shopping for wierdo-recumbent bicycles, I asked around at a lot of established bike shops all over the centeral USA. Not ONE of them ever mentioned the need for escrow B.S., you gave them a CC# and they'd ship it however-the-hell you asked, UPS or FedEx or truck freight, it was all your decisions.
......
Of course, the tiny difference there was that these bicycle shops actually really existed!
~
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 10:05:05 AM EDT
Of coarse it is a scam. Didn't you get the memo?

The bicycle mafia has banned the internet sale of all brand name bikes in the US. It is okay to sell them overseas, but not in the US. A small online discount is allowed on accessories, but nothing off complete bikes.

You must go to your local bike shop and pay full retail..
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 10:07:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mejames:
Of coarse it is a scam. Didn't you get the memo?

The bicycle mafia has banned the internet sale of all brand name bikes in the US. It is okay to sell them overseas, but not in the US. A small online discount is allowed on accessories, but nothing off complete bikes.

You must go to your local bike shop and pay full retail..



Not necessarily. I bought my Bianchi online (and probably saved about $400 at least).

Tehnically, I couldn't ORDER it online, but had to call the shop, and that is one way they get around such rules.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 10:08:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/2/2006 10:09:44 AM EDT by remedy]
You are calling him a scammer when his local retailer agreed to drop their price in order to gain a customer? Wtf? The dude didn't coerce the local retailer into anything, it is THEIR CALL on whether to "price match" or not. It is completely discretionary. Not to mention, he ended up buying extra parts. As long as a retailer sells what is in their inventory and doesn't take a loss, it is a win for them. Apparently you don't run a fucking sales-driven business or you would know this. Not to mention, they could be BS'ing on what their cost really is. Their cost may have been $800 instead of $1000. Who the fuck knows, it is THEIR CHOICE.

- rem
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 10:17:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/2/2006 10:18:56 AM EDT by NewbHunter]
Sorry buddy, but no matter how you rationalize it what you did was not right. At the least, it was unethical, being that you had a pretty good idea it was a scam. At worst, you're just as bad as the scammers because you knew it was a scam. (I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt here, but I don't really see how you couldn't have known it was a scam for sure based on what you posted).

If I were you I would at least go back to the shop and tell them that you found out that it was a scam. I'm willing to bet that they might even just let you keep the bike at that price "for being honest" . At the very least do it so some other person does try and scam them the same way.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 10:23:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By remedy:
You are calling him a scammer when his local retailer agreed to drop their price in order to gain a customer? Wtf? The dude didn't coerce the local retailer into anything, it is THEIR CALL on whether to "price match" or not. It is completely discretionary. Not to mention, he ended up buying extra parts. As long as a retailer sells what is in their inventory and doesn't take a loss, it is a win for them. Apparently you don't run a fucking sales-driven business or you would know this. Not to mention, they could be BS'ing on what their cost really is. Their cost may have been $800 instead of $1000. Who the fuck knows, it is THEIR CHOICE.

- rem




Your right about it being the store's choice. But a price matching is for real sale prices, not some internet scam. Would it be legal for me to set up a electronics site look alike with lower price than retail, and then ask Best Buy to price match?

Although this isnt what he did, but knowing the prices he found online are a scam, and still using it against a legitamit business to save change is wrong. Period.


He's not Robin Hood,
He did take away the profit margins the store unfairly.
He didnt do his bargaining in good faith.


Bottom line, the Store should be applauded for upholding thier policy to price match, even in a situation like this. And NiceguyMr scammed the store.

Link Posted: 2/2/2006 10:23:23 AM EDT

Originally Posted By remedy:
You are calling him a scammer when his local retailer agreed to drop their price in order to gain a customer? Wtf? The dude didn't coerce the local retailer into anything, it is THEIR CALL on whether to "price match" or not. It is completely discretionary. Not to mention, he ended up buying extra parts. As long as a retailer sells what is in their inventory and doesn't take a loss, it is a win for them. Apparently you don't run a fucking sales-driven business or you would know this. Not to mention, they could be BS'ing on what their cost really is. Their cost may have been $800 instead of $1000. Who the fuck knows, it is THEIR CHOICE.

- rem




Price-matching offers are ALWAYS based on "real" advertised prices, not your cousin's webpage where you got him to post a fake price or something that like that.

If you knowingly use a fake advertisment to get a price-matching discount, it is fraudulent on your part - whether or not it is technically a crime, it certainly is dishonest and unethical.
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