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Posted: 1/26/2006 12:27:59 PM EDT

A buddy of mine who works at the range of a good sized police dept told me they called Winchester for a load of Q3131 and were told it has been dropped from production and they did not have any more.
They ended up buying 50K rounds from a distributor and that was all he had. Anybody else hearing this?
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:28:45 PM EDT
No, saw plenty at the gunshow last weekend. They were supose to ramp production up on it.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:29:09 PM EDT
Hmmm...news to me. Somebody here ought to call Winchester and verify this, before the rumors get started.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:31:04 PM EDT
Wonder if it has anything to do with Winchester closing it's US plant?
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:32:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By LoginName:
Wonder if it has anything to do with Winchester closing it's US plant?

Those were plants that produced rifles, not ammo. A lot of Winchester's ammo is manufactured in Israel.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:35:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VTHOKIESHOOTER:
Those were plants that produced rifles, not ammo. A lot of Winchester's ammo is manufactured in Israel.


Yup-I think by IMI. Maybe they're keeping their current production of .223 for their own near future use. Feel free to perpetuate that rumor.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:35:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VTHOKIESHOOTER:

Originally Posted By LoginName:
Wonder if it has anything to do with Winchester closing it's US plant?

Those were plants that produced rifles, not ammo. A lot of Winchester's ammo is manufactured in Israel.


That is correct, the U.S. Repeating Arms Co. a div of FN makes the guns uses the name Winchester under a license agreement. The ammo biz has not related to that
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:40:14 PM EDT
Well, the website still shows it, but I can't find a phone number to verify availability. I suppose I could call a ditributor.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:40:27 PM EDT
Gander mountain had about 2k on the shelf a week ago, I may just have to go buy hte rest of it. It;s been shooting nice out of the SBR.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:40:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VTHOKIESHOOTER:

Originally Posted By LoginName:
Wonder if it has anything to do with Winchester closing it's US plant?

Those were plants that produced rifles, not ammo. A lot of Winchester's ammo is manufactured in Israel.



Thats US repeating arms, totaly differnt than the Winchester making Ammo.

Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:44:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VTHOKIESHOOTER:

Originally Posted By LoginName:
Wonder if it has anything to do with Winchester closing it's US plant?

Those were plants that produced rifles, not ammo. A lot of Winchester's ammo is manufactured in Israel.



That's Q3131A.

But, with Winchester shutting down it's domestic production on firearms, and discontinuing certain models entirely, it's possible they've dropped some of their domestic ammo production also.

Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:47:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 12:49:23 PM EDT by VTHOKIESHOOTER]

Originally Posted By LoginName:

Originally Posted By VTHOKIESHOOTER:

Originally Posted By LoginName:
Wonder if it has anything to do with Winchester closing it's US plant?

Those were plants that produced rifles, not ammo. A lot of Winchester's ammo is manufactured in Israel.



That's Q3131A.

But, with Winchester shutting down it's domestic production on firearms, and discontinuing certain models entirely, it's possible they've dropped some of their domestic ammo production also.


My Q3131 says East Alton, IL my Q3131A does say Israel. They won't drop domestic production they have so much invested in the Short Magnum series. They also said in their press release that they plan on bringing new firearms to the market. Lets hope that the new models will be something to chear about.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:48:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 12:53:25 PM EDT by SubnetMask]
OK, I called them up. According to the fine lady on the phone, Q3131 had been replaced with Q3131A. While they currently have none in inventory, they ARE still making it and it is in the 2006 price list. Alot of it is going to Iraq. She says it's in very high demand, but they ARE still manufacturing it, and to the best of her knowledge there are no plans to stop this - even for civilian use.

Your best bet is to buy from a distributor who hasn't run out yet. More will come.

See? One phone call clears everything up.


ETA: To clarify, I called Winchester, not a distributor.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:53:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 12:54:13 PM EDT by The_Macallan]

Originally Posted By SubnetMask:
OK, I called them up. According to the fine lady on the phone, Q3131 had been replaced with Q3131A. While they currently have none in inventory, they ARE still making it and it is in the 2006 price list. Alot of it is going to Iraq. She says it's in very high demand, but they ARE still manufacturing it, and to the best of her knowledge there are no plans to stop this - even for civilian use.

Your best bet is to buy from a distributor who hasn't run out yet. More will come.

See? One phone call clears everything up.

I haven't seen Q3131A at the funshows in a couple years (good thing I stocked up ).

And of the last two "big ones", only one had any Q3131 in any reasonable amount.

I don't even think Ammoman has either anymore.

Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:53:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 12:59:05 PM EDT by M38A1]
And the differences between Q3131 and Q3131A would be?

I snagged 6 boxes at $4.49 the other day of Q3131 and thought it was steep....

ETA:
Looking at my Q3131 boxes, they seem to be a varied bunch or rounds with differing primer coatings/appearance and packed with a divider between the rounds. The Q3131A are tightly packed, no divider and seem to be all consistent. Is that part of the differences?
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:55:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 12:56:04 PM EDT by The_Macallan]
dammit.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:57:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SubnetMask:
OK, I called them up. According to the fine lady on the phone, Q3131 had been replaced with Q3131A. While they currently have none in inventory, they ARE still making it and it is in the 2006 price list. Alot of it is going to Iraq. She says it's in very high demand, but they ARE still manufacturing it, and to the best of her knowledge there are no plans to stop this - even for civilian use.

Your best bet is to buy from a distributor who hasn't run out yet. More will come.

See? One phone call clears everything up.

ETA: To clarify, I called Winchester, not a distributor.


Well that is good to hear from the "horse's mouth." That illustrates a problem with USA manufacturing perchant for JIT and oversees manufacturing. No one stockpile anything, and everything is made only when there is an order, if we there is any itty-bitty disruption of the supply chain, we're screwed.

Did she when they will get more for civilian sales?
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 12:58:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By warlord:

Originally Posted By SubnetMask:
OK, I called them up. According to the fine lady on the phone, Q3131 had been replaced with Q3131A. While they currently have none in inventory, they ARE still making it and it is in the 2006 price list. Alot of it is going to Iraq. She says it's in very high demand, but they ARE still manufacturing it, and to the best of her knowledge there are no plans to stop this - even for civilian use.

Your best bet is to buy from a distributor who hasn't run out yet. More will come.

See? One phone call clears everything up.

ETA: To clarify, I called Winchester, not a distributor.


Well that is good to hear from the "horse's mouth." That illustrates a problem with USA manufacturing perchant for JIT and oversees manufacturing. No one stockpile anything, and everything is made only when there is an order, if we there is any itty-bitty disruption of the supply chain, we're screwed.

Did she when they will get more for civilian sales?



I asked, and she couldn't give me an answer. She says distrubutors CAN still order it, however. They just don't have any to ship them right now.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 1:02:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By SubnetMask:
OK, I called them up. According to the fine lady on the phone, Q3131 had been replaced with Q3131A. While they currently have none in inventory, they ARE still making it and it is in the 2006 price list. Alot of it is going to Iraq. She says it's in very high demand, but they ARE still manufacturing it, and to the best of her knowledge there are no plans to stop this - even for civilian use.

Your best bet is to buy from a distributor who hasn't run out yet. More will come.

See? One phone call clears everything up.

I haven't seen Q3131A at the funshows in a couple years (good thing I stocked up ).

And of the last two "big ones", only one had any Q3131 in any reasonable amount.

I don't even think Ammoman has either anymore.




They don't. 95% of it is Federal American Eagle at $209.00 per 1,000 (not even any Federal XM193).

The supply of 7.62x39 is even worse.

It looks like the days of inexpensive bulk buys of surplus/imported ammo aren't gonna be around much longer.

Link Posted: 1/26/2006 1:07:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/26/2006 1:11:23 PM EDT by warlord]

Originally Posted By SubnetMask:

Originally Posted By warlord:

Originally Posted By SubnetMask:
OK, I called them up. According to the fine lady on the phone, Q3131 had been replaced with Q3131A. While they currently have none in inventory, they ARE still making it and it is in the 2006 price list. Alot of it is going to Iraq. She says it's in very high demand, but they ARE still manufacturing it, and to the best of her knowledge there are no plans to stop this - even for civilian use.

Your best bet is to buy from a distributor who hasn't run out yet. More will come.

See? One phone call clears everything up.

ETA: To clarify, I called Winchester, not a distributor.


Well that is good to hear from the "horse's mouth." That illustrates a problem with USA manufacturing perchant for JIT and oversees manufacturing. No one stockpile anything, and everything is made only when there is an order, if we there is any itty-bitty disruption of the supply chain, we're screwed.

Did she when they will get more for civilian sales?



I asked, and she couldn't give me an answer. She says distrubutors CAN still order it, however. They just don't have any to ship them right now.


That is not encouraging. There will be no more Q3131A in the USA for the forseeable future. In normal times, it takes about 4-6 weeks for something to be shipped by ship from half way around the world. Man, I hope we don't run out of bullets for the USA military in the Middle East.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 1:07:54 PM EDT
My local bass pro had q3131a a couple of weeks ago, but they wanted $4.99 a box of 20.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 1:09:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bologna:
My local bass pro had q3131a a couple of weeks ago, but they wanted $4.99 a box of 20.



That's about the norm online, it seems. It's not hard to find, but everybody wants $5 a box for it.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 1:19:10 PM EDT
There's plenty of XM193 and Q3131A (even IMI marked stuff) right here:
www.kyimports.com/ammo.htm
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 2:43:59 PM EDT
I also heard they are notching UP production of Q3131
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