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Posted: 1/9/2006 8:54:03 AM EDT
Have been seeing more and more of these ''coyoties'' in our area.

They have more of the appearance of a sandy colored rufus wolf and are starting to range around on days when it is overcast.

They do not seem to be especially afraid of back road traffic or even the presence of people for that matter.

This morning I was talking to a back counter gun sales guy at Gibson's ace hardware in weatherford texas and asked him if he has heard of anyone else seeing these critters moving about.


This guy told me several of his regulars has spotted them running in branch bottoms and in the open and have bought .22 class varmit ammo and the bigger stuff because they claim to be loseing livestock, mainly kids and young calfs to these''wild dogs''.

Does anyone know exactly what they are?

I think they are coyote/ferral dog mix but I am unsure if the two can breed pups.

But if these are the product of that formula then I am thinking we could have a very smart and potentially dangerous predator out there that is basically unafraid of man and could do alot of damage to livestock and people unaware.

Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:55:50 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/9/2006 8:56:29 AM EDT by BarryTolar]
Hybrid with a dog and yeah they are a big problem
Edit - have heard the term "Coydog" used to describe them.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:56:52 AM EDT
"Macroevolution" in action.

Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:57:41 AM EDT
In my local area they are referred to as "Coy Dogs" and yes they are a big problem.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:58:46 AM EDT
In the Northeast where Wolves was been more or less extinct, the coyotes are growing to wolfs size.

I will see if I cant find the artical
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:59:47 AM EDT
We have a lot of them around here, but I don't think believe they are hybrids. One of the game wardens thinks coyotes from further north are migrating south. They ARE bigger up around Colorado and such.

The ones around here are also VERY well fed on cats and small poodle dogs.

We have mountain lions and bobcats these days too.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:00:00 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BarryTolar:
Hybrid with a dog and yeah they are a big problem
Edit - have heard the term "Coydog" used to describe them.

Coydogs, all the wild of a coyote, with the dog's lack of fear of man. Shoot on sight.

Kharn
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:00:42 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:05:32 AM EDT
You know, I was wondering about this. Where I live in Nevada, we are seeing huge coyotes. Like German Shepherd-size ones. Thought they were wolves, but they aren't. but they're killing and eating all of the cats in town, so we don't mind.

One morning a few months ago, when our town hosted another town in pop-warner football, we got to the field early to mark it off and found 3 half-eaten cats. I was never happier!
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:05:32 AM EDT
Has anyone ever hunted them successfully and if so, how???
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:05:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/9/2006 9:07:23 AM EDT by Platz]
Definitely sounds like a coydog. They've started showing up everywhere here in southern michigan in the last 10 years. Did it look like this? I took the pic in my backyard, and I live on the edge of a very "urban" area to say the least. I hear about 10-15 of them every time a police car/fire truck goes by with the siren running ( which is about every 10 minutes at night)

Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:06:51 AM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
when we moved out here we were covered up in them. local farmers were offering 25.00 per head. i could sit on my roof and rack up in the late afternoons.

They died back for awhile but are begining to become a problem again. i see 3-4 a week run over on the highway.



hummmmmm sounds like a win win proposistion for me....
wanna start a small business?
Do like the P-dog excursion hunts, charge tourist 20 bux a yote, we get 45 bux a head instead of 25 .......
what a bargain!
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:10:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By nightowl7:
Has anyone ever hunted them successfully and if so, how???



A .270 off the back porch over a big pile of fish guts works fine. Alternatively, a couple cans of cheap cat food spread around the kill zone.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:13:36 AM EDT
That picture looks like a full blooded coyote to me. I had a coy dog as a pet for a while picked it up when it was very young. It wasnt very social or trainable and had to be put doown eventually Dogs generally only have brush on the bottoms of their tails and coytes tail have the brush all around coydogs usually will have a dog type tail and often a coloring to it like a white tip. Coyotes size varies greatly. I believe some of the coyotes in parts of Texas are the offspring of Red Wolf coyote hybrids but the last Red Wolves were gone from Texas years ago so that may be bunk IU dont know if the Wolf genes would continue to be passed down or if they would fade away. I have shot some very large coyotes in North and central Texas
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:29:16 AM EDT
In mid-Michigan, not only are they getting bigger and bolder, they're getting smarter.

Recently they've been using the scent of a bitch in heat to lure in stray domestic dogs to eat. When the dog finds the bitch they attack and kill. They've had no problems taking down big dogs like a Rottweiler.

I wonder how long until they hunt small children at bus stops?
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:38:34 AM EDT
It's time to move up to the .308, for sure!



I'd love to get a shot off at a....coydog. Make a nice trophy.

Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:52:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By fadedsun:
It's time to move up to the .308, for sure!



I'd love to get a shot off at a....coydog. Make a nice trophy.




I dunno. They're gettin' kinda big....
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:53:22 AM EDT
As long as they don't start looking like Sabrewulf from Killer Instinct I'll live and let live.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:55:10 AM EDT
I have to agree that Mi is also having problems. If you have to track a deer you had better do it quick of the Yotes will get it first. While you might not see them all that often, they are everywhere. I can't say they are getting all that much bigger but they are smart bastards.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:55:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/9/2006 10:06:58 AM EDT by nightowl7]

Originally Posted By Platz:
Definitely sounds like a coydog. They've started showing up everywhere here in southern michigan in the last 10 years. Did it look like this? I took the pic in my backyard, and I live on the edge of a very "urban" area to say the least. I hear about 10-15 of them every time a police car/fire truck goes by with the siren running ( which is about every 10 minutes at night)

img215.imageshack.us/img215/2473/coyotesmall9ln.jpg



Thats looks sort like like then but with heavier bodies and bigger heads.

Only difference on the color of the coat on the ones down here look more tannish but have darker patches from shoulders down.

The last pack I saw was had about fifteen members and it looked like the larger ''coy dogs'' were out in front and smaller more coyote lookin critters were in the back.

Wonder if coys and yotes will mix up like that???

Drew out my pistol but by the time I slowed down they were lickity-split into the brush.

Besides shooting on a county road is probably not a good idea, ya know.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 9:57:04 AM EDT
I've read that wolves are killing them in massive numbers in Montana, a buddy of mine saved his GF's chiuawa from a coyote's mouth LOL.

Link Posted: 1/9/2006 10:16:48 AM EDT
Yep got em in NY. They work very efficiently like a pack of wolves.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 10:17:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
That picture looks like a full blooded coyote to me. I had a coy dog as a pet for a while picked it up when it was very young. It wasnt very social or trainable and had to be put doown eventually Dogs generally only have brush on the bottoms of their tails and coytes tail have the brush all around coydogs usually will have a dog type tail and often a coloring to it like a white tip. Coyotes size varies greatly. I believe some of the coyotes in parts of Texas are the offspring of Red Wolf coyote hybrids but the last Red Wolves were gone from Texas years ago so that may be bunk IU dont know if the Wolf genes would continue to be passed down or if they would fade away. I have shot some very large coyotes in North and central Texas



Flash... the red wolf is back. They reintroduced it into east Texas about 10 years ago.

There are some pretty good size ones around me. They howl every time a train passes by, and then my dogs answer them. They woke me up around 3 this morning. Another thing about yotes. They move around based on the amount of food available. Watch the rabbit population. When you start seeing a bunch of rabbits, it won't be long till they show up. One good thing about them. If you got coyotes, you won't have skunks.

The last big one I shot was about german shepherd size. Most of the "purebred" coyotes weigh in the neighborhood of 40 lbs.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 10:37:50 AM EDT
I've heard that the Coyote-Dog mix is a myth and they are really either a Canadian subspecies or they have some Gray Wolf mixed in. I don't know the truth and don't feel like Googling it right now.

I've seen many coyotes within 20 yards in Arizona. We would set dog food and bird seed out to attract bird, rabbits, javelina, coyotes and the occasional bobcat. A couple weeks ago I saw a coyote in northeast Ohio while deer hunting. What a difference! The OH yote was charcoal grey, a bit taller, a lot stockier and likely weighed half again to double the AZ yotes. Unfortunally I wasn't able to get off a shot.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 10:40:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/9/2006 10:43:11 AM EDT by nightowl7]

Originally Posted By 338winmag:

Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
That picture looks like a full blooded coyote to me. I had a coy dog as a pet for a while picked it up when it was very young. It wasnt very social or trainable and had to be put doown eventually Dogs generally only have brush on the bottoms of their tails and coytes tail have the brush all around coydogs usually will have a dog type tail and often a coloring to it like a white tip. Coyotes size varies greatly. I believe some of the coyotes in parts of Texas are the offspring of Red Wolf coyote hybrids but the last Red Wolves were gone from Texas years ago so that may be bunk IU dont know if the Wolf genes would continue to be passed down or if they would fade away. I have shot some very large coyotes in North and central Texas



Flash... the red wolf is back. They reintroduced it into east Texas about 10 years ago.

There are some pretty good size ones around me. They howl every time a train passes by, and then my dogs answer them. They woke me up around 3 this morning. Another thing about yotes. They move around based on the amount of food available. Watch the rabbit population. When you start seeing a bunch of rabbits, it won't be long till they show up. One good thing about them. If you got coyotes, you won't have skunks.

The last big one I shot was about german shepherd size. Most of the "purebred" coyotes weigh in the neighborhood of 40 lbs.



I lived in east texas in trinity county years ago.

The state may have ''reintroduced'' rufus wolfs into that area about ten years ago but I had seen them and heard them and saw several dead ones while coon hunting in the trinity river bottom at night for many years before then.

I have also saw on skidder trails in the river bottom scrap marks from black or cinnamon bears over seven feet high on hardwood trees and said nothing to nobody because I'm sure no one would have believed me.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 1:17:49 PM EDT
A friend of mine in North Texas was just commenting on the same thing the other day.

He said that his neighbor had some hanging up that he had shot and they looked like deer hanging there.

Ed
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 1:59:28 PM EDT
My brother shot and wounded a "coyote" outside of Abilene Texas in the late 80s that was better than twice the size of the other 4 yotes standing around it and they were all full grown we killed one of the smaller ones out right. The biog one he shot litterally did a hhand (paw) stand and flipped over into the brush off the trail we found tracks and a tuft of bloody hair but the trail disapeared quick I always wondered if that wasnt a Red Wolf. I havent heard anything about the Red Wolf being reintroduced last I heard they had a breading population quarintined on island somewhere
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 2:34:05 PM EDT
I have not personally seen a coydog around here. But my contract loggers are saying they have had alot of encounters with them. They will come up to loggers even with the chainsaws and equipment running. Ballsy sumbitches. They have killed acouple coydog that seemed like a threat.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 3:31:27 PM EDT

I don't know about the hybrid/coydog stuff but I think it is true the coyotes east of the Miss have a lot easier life than ones that live in snow country. When I was a kid we had no coyotes. Now they are everywhere.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 4:09:49 PM EDT
coyotes are a "desert wolf" according to biologists and not a diferent genus from any other wolf, canine lupus.
they are Native to the west and south west, the first sightings that became common east of the mississippi were not until the 1960's
they believe the demise of the eastern black and or timber wolves and black bear population lead to coyotes moving eastward.

they are more of a scavenger than the wolf , main reason they are seen in populated areas and will also feed on the dead which wolves are less prone to do. they also feast on garbage in more urban settings which has led to an increase in size and overall health of the animal.

I own and have owned several rural properties in the last 20 years,
in Miss. I have 10 acres and I have seen a pack of coyote, coydog being led by a Large Feral GSD. the shepard was the obvious Alpha male. I also shot and killed 8 coydogs one summer as they were feasting on a neighbors piglets.

In Texas I have 50 acres in the rockwall area and shot and killed 3 big coyotes there, leaving them on the fence line is a common practice as it is said to chase off the rest of the pack.

The Red wolf has never been extinct in Texas but was very endangered, I believe they started a new series of packs about 20 years ago and are now actually becoming a problem to some rural ranchers.
with the reintroduction of wolves in the north central/west from Canada, it is believed there are many coyote packs being driven south because of the wolf's increased number.

I believe they will continue to become a major nusience in urban areas over the next 10 years. I have heard is several cities, Pheonix, Dallas, Houston, Sante fe. and Los Angles there are areas you dont leave your pets or young childran outside alone, ever. The threat from coyotes being that prevelant in those areas.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 4:13:45 PM EDT
Southern ohio has admitted it has a coyote problem.

The 275 loop around cincinnati had two packs that were known about last winter, it was on the boob tube when some lady had a poodle or something taken from her back yard which had a low height chain link fence.

I am in a different county than cincinnati and out in a very rural area. There were 2 different coyote dens last winter. It looks like one of them may be back in business.

Out where I live we have coy dogs. We also have a problem with a lot of stupid pet owners just tossing their dogs out to fend for themselves. So now and then we get a wild dog.

I have never seen a dog running with the coyote pack but I have shot coy dogs that seemed like a mix to me but I am not an expert and I sure as heck did not wish to handle the thing and take it to an expert.

As far as what to use, I used my new bolt action 308 with a new scope on it because I wanted to put some rounds through it. If I had a 50 caliber I would have used it.

I consider varmints to be plinking material.

My neighbor likes his 22, of course he has a 22-250 so it tends to be an interesting 22 to use on varmints. I sometimes call his targets fertalizer since there is not much left of a small critter when he uses certain bullets in his loads.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 5:25:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Kharn:

Originally Posted By BarryTolar:
Hybrid with a dog and yeah they are a big problem
Edit - have heard the term "Coydog" used to describe them.

Coydogs, all the wild of a coyote, with the dog's lack of fear of man. Shoot on sight.

Kharn




Yeah. At the place my dad hunted as a kid in PA the owner, old family friend, told us last time we were up that we could come and hunt or hike anytime. But to ALWAYS take a rifle.

I don't hike anywhere without a firearm 'cause of 'em.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 5:36:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JellyBelly:

Originally Posted By fadedsun:
It's time to move up to the .308, for sure!



I'd love to get a shot off at a....coydog. Make a nice trophy.




I dunno. They're gettin' kinda big....
my.core.com/~dleahy/.photos/Guns/Barrett1.jpg



It would be reminscent of the exploding prarie dog videos, just a tad bit larger.


Be sure to take pics.

Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:01:07 PM EDT
Coy Dogs, pack killers, bad news
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:55:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By nightowl7:

Originally Posted By 338winmag:

Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
That picture looks like a full blooded coyote to me. I had a coy dog as a pet for a while picked it up when it was very young. It wasnt very social or trainable and had to be put doown eventually Dogs generally only have brush on the bottoms of their tails and coytes tail have the brush all around coydogs usually will have a dog type tail and often a coloring to it like a white tip. Coyotes size varies greatly. I believe some of the coyotes in parts of Texas are the offspring of Red Wolf coyote hybrids but the last Red Wolves were gone from Texas years ago so that may be bunk IU dont know if the Wolf genes would continue to be passed down or if they would fade away. I have shot some very large coyotes in North and central Texas



Flash... the red wolf is back. They reintroduced it into east Texas about 10 years ago.

There are some pretty good size ones around me. They howl every time a train passes by, and then my dogs answer them. They woke me up around 3 this morning. Another thing about yotes. They move around based on the amount of food available. Watch the rabbit population. When you start seeing a bunch of rabbits, it won't be long till they show up. One good thing about them. If you got coyotes, you won't have skunks.

The last big one I shot was about german shepherd size. Most of the "purebred" coyotes weigh in the neighborhood of 40 lbs.



I lived in east texas in trinity county years ago.

The state may have ''reintroduced'' rufus wolfs into that area about ten years ago but I had seen them and heard them and saw several dead ones while coon hunting in the trinity river bottom at night for many years before then.

I have also saw on skidder trails in the river bottom scrap marks from black or cinnamon bears over seven feet high on hardwood trees and said nothing to nobody because I'm sure no one would have believed me.



I work just down the road from the San Jacinto monument. Last week we worked late. Shut down around 8. When it got quiet, I could hear coyotes yapping.
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 6:56:50 PM EDT
I live in a grown up suburb of Atlanta and just last spring had a full blooded yote come up the street and right through my yard at 10 AM !! I now have some CB caps ready if the right opportunity presents it self. The neighborhood behind me has lost a lot of cats. My next door neighbor found a dead one in his yard that was basically just a ribcage and a collar.

I figure the 6.5 or 6.8 should REALLY do the business on a yote. The 556 is adequate but the extra ft lbs will help.

rj
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 7:53:35 PM EDT
Wile E. Coyote - Super Genius
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:04:48 PM EDT
Strange. Had one cross in front of me today with a fullgrown house cat in its mouth and i thought that he was on the large size. Just have to remember it can be decieving this time of year as they have their winter coats on to.
CH
Link Posted: 1/9/2006 8:10:37 PM EDT
Big `yotes are not news in this area. By the late 80s we started seeing them wider across the shoulders and taller.
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