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Posted: 2/20/2001 2:49:47 PM EDT
Was reading article in Anerican rifleman about Armscorp USA's M-14 when I read this, "At 600yds the M14 competitor yields nothing, while the average AR15 shooter is scrambling" Hmmmmmm,Guess these guys never heard of Camp Perry, What total B.S.
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 4:01:23 PM EDT
Although I get the American Rifleman, (NRA life mem), I have just about given up on gun rags, just for that kind of thing. The BS, you know. I had a discussion sometime ago with an AR competitor. He told me it is possible to keep a .223 supersonic for 1000 yards. I just did a quick work up on Load from a Disk. My results support that. 75 grain Berger VLD, 1251fps at 1000 yards.
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 4:45:00 PM EDT
David...not trying to be a smarta$$, but didn't you just comtridict yourself? 1251fps is NOT supersonic. Unless I'm mistaken, supersonic is the speed of sound....2000fps. Someone actually said they can get a .223 going 2000fps at 1000yds. downrange??
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 5:06:30 PM EDT
I think David is right about the 1251 fps(approx.) I know it's not 2000 fps because a .22LR is supersonic and those only get around 1300-1400 max. vel. and the .22 subsonics fire around 800-900 fps I think.
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 5:13:41 PM EDT
Thanks Infantry, maybe I can learn something here. Can anyone fill me in on what's considered "supersonic" as it relates to ballistics??
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 5:20:08 PM EDT
X_RING supersonic=faster than speed of sound or right around 1,000 fps depending on elevation
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 5:32:27 PM EDT
But isn't the speed of sound 2000fps, not 1000fps?????
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 5:43:48 PM EDT
The speed of sound in air is around 750mph or about 1050fps at sea level/75 degrees F. So anything that travels 1049fps or slower is subsonic, and anything over 1051fps is supersonic.
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 5:45:54 PM EDT
I thought it was 720mph at sea level and 660mph at 10,000 ft. Do the conversions...I'm an invalid right now...strianed back muscle from work and not moving off the couch w/ laptop!!!
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 6:22:12 PM EDT
From ye ole physics book: V_sound = 331.3 meters/second * sqrt( T / 273 Kelvin ) Where T is the air temperature in Kelvin. To convert to Kelvin from degrees Celsius, add 273.15. This works for a pressure of 1 atmosphere (i.e. sea level). At an air temperature of 58 degrees Fahrenheit ( or 287.6 Kelvin ) the speed of sound at sea level would be 340 m/s, which is the value generally used when most people approximate the speed of sound. 340 m/s = 1,224 kph = 1,115.5 ft/s = 760.56 mph = 660.9 knots = mach 1 = 0.0001134% of the speed of light! 1,251 ft/s is definitely beyond the speed of sound at sea level on a 58 degree day.
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 6:32:52 PM EDT
Well that was more than I needed to know! LOL!!
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 6:36:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2001 6:48:28 PM EDT by copterdoctor]
If you guys want to convert almost anything to anything else, download http://www.zdnet.com/downloads/stories/info/0,,000HUT,.html It's a free download and works very well. Converts instantly. As fast as you can type in a box, the conversion appears in an other box.
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 6:50:31 PM EDT
sub sonic? super sonic? come on guys! all you need to know with the trusty old ar is, "can i engage a target at 300 meters"? if your answer is "yes" then mission accomplished. when i hear sub sonic, or super sonic, (some of you will get this, some won't) i think of the bacon double cheese burger. colt, out. (expert rifleman, M16A2/M203 u.s. army 87-91) "no flames intended, just fun"
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 7:17:11 PM EDT
The point being, when a supersonic bullet goes subsonic there is an effect upon the flight of the bullet and this added [i]variable[/i] is not good. [i]Variable[/i], because it never happens at the same point of the trajectory, shot to shot, so the effect on POI differs, shot to shot. Yea, I wish we had Sonics here, good burger.
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 8:03:03 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 9:44:43 PM EDT
man all of you guys make learning something fun thanks now tell me is a fart sub sonic or super sonic
Link Posted: 2/20/2001 9:57:03 PM EDT
Mmmm, Chili dogs and fries. No Sonics here either, it's been YEARS!
Originally Posted By David M: The point being, when a supersonic bullet goes subsonic there is an effect upon the flight of the bullet and this added [i]variable[/i] is not good. [i]Variable[/i], because it never happens at the same point of the trajectory, shot to shot, so the effect on POI differs, shot to shot. Yea, I wish we had Sonics here, good burger.
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Link Posted: 2/20/2001 11:05:33 PM EDT
Yea, I wish we had Sonics here, good burger.
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I owned a Sonic down in Rockport Tx for several yrs and never ate one. Had the freezer full of shrimp and fish breaded like onion rings. [:P]
Link Posted: 2/21/2001 12:38:07 AM EDT
When I was a kid, I worked at a Mom & Pop butcher shop. Across the parking lot was a Sonic. We had this old S.O.B. that worked with us that had a strawberry shake at least 3 or 4 times a week. Another kid and I used to take turns cleaning out the bug zapper by the back door of the butcher shop and put the dead flies in his milk shake. Never told him. Man, those were the days. Sonic really does have good milk shakes. Kinda miss Whataburger and Braum's too. What were we talking about?
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