Posted: 11/28/2005 4:11:58 PM EDT
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How does this work? Has anyone ever seen one happen, done one or know someone who did one. ------------ Check this out: I even found an incident where a citizens arrest was done on a judge by Rita Goodstory, Denver Post staff writer http://educate-yourself.org/cn/citizenmilitiaarrestsCOjudge27dec04.shtml December 27, 2004 Forward courtesy of Donna Carillo <[email protected] > and < [email protected] > Denver CO - Once again, four members of the Americans for Justice Militia entered a judge's office to place a sitting judge under arrest. At 9:45 this morning the small, unarmed group arrived at the 2nd District Court (1437 Bannock Street), flashed their AJM credentials, and instructed the clerk to escort them to Judge Wilson's office. Judge Wilson was read the charges and was peacefully arrested by Denver AJM members Tom Cooley, William Adamson, Jeffrey Wilson (no relation), and Cynthia Washington. The four calmly walked the arrested judge without handcuffs to the neighboring police station for booking and incarceration, pending a bail hearing. Police Captain Hermano Gutierrez refused to comment, but William Anderson, a senior AJM member, read the following statement for the media: "Judges in Denver and throughout Colorado were first put on notice by Rick Stanley in 2002. Every judge has taken an oath to uphold and defend the constitutions of the United States and the State of Colorado, and the citizens of Colorado have the right and the duty to enforce that oath. Judges who show blatant disregard for the law are held accountable to the law, if not by our hired servants in government then by the citizens themselves. Regretably, this is our nineteenth arrest. We would prefer this to be the last, but that is entirely up to the judges." The militia dispersed by 10:15 a.m. when they returned to their full-time jobs as store clerk (Cooley), programmer (Adamson), elementary school teacher (Wilson), and peace officer (Washington). --------------------- |
No kidding. If someone tries to citizen arrest my ass when I've committed no crime, their ass is getting charged with assault. |
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I, my son, and a neighbor arrested two undercover narcs that assauted an accident victim (hit & run pedestrian) I was giving 1st Aid. Without announcing that they were law enforcement officers they attempted to roll the unconscious person over to get to his wallet. I instructed them three times that the person had an obvious head injury (bleeding from the back of the head), possible neck and back injury. I told them to not touch the unconscious victim, that I was in charge and rendering 1st Aid, and trained to do so (every year for 25+ years). (ETA: These guys did not look like drug dealers... not that good. They looked like junkies.) They ignored me and tried to turn him over. At that point I stood, kicked them over (they were squatting) and drew my pistol. The pistol had been placed in my waistband at the small of my back by another person when I stood up and began warning them to not roll the victim over. My neighbor also drew, and my son came around the wood fence with a CAR-15. Now the two a$$holes, I mean, undercover officers began mumbling that they were LEO's and wanted to show us ID. We all warned them they would be shot if they reached toward their waists, not to lower their hands. They attempted to reach below their shirts several times but finally got the message. When the REAL Sheriff's Deputy got there, he calmly walked over (real cool guy), "Pardon me, sir, could you tell me what is going on here?" Aside: The Deputy never drew on us, or shouted for us to put down our weapons. Also, if he was going to give us a hard time, he would have needed a lot of help which he didn't have. I told him, and said further, "There are plenty of witnesses here, we want these two arrested for assault and battery on this man (referring to the unconscious accident victim). They tried to roll him over after repeated warnings not to." The deputy said, "That's stupid, this guy could have a broken neck or back!" I said, "And further, I want them arrested for impersonating police officers. After being placed under arrest by us, they claimed to be undercover officers." He whispered to me, "They are." I said, "That's not possible, they are too stupid to be cops." He agreed. Had a nice talk with the Sheriff the next day (no, I was not in any trouble, I drove over to his office), and he called the two idiots in and fired them on the spot. Yes, you make a citizen's arrest, but you had better be (1) Right, and (2) have witnesses that you are right and there was no other reasonable choice, and (3) have plenty of friends, neighbors, etc, in on it. It's a lot harder to arrest and try 10-12 people rather than just one. |
Wow! |
Are you an EMT? |
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Are you an EMT? No, I have had Red Cross 1st Aid and CPR every year for about 27 years now. I have taken Bloodborn Pathogens classes, and other related stuff, as required by my employer. I am also fully aware of where this puts me under state law in regards to rendering 1st Aid. |
I imagine they got themselves an attorney for that. not saying it didnt happpen. but i imagine the protocol is first they are placed on leave pending an investigation. not just fired right then and there. |
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The Laws for Citizens Arrest are different in most states. They happen all the time in CA. Basically an LEO can't arrest for a misdemeanor that he hasn't witnessed, but a citizen (aka the victim) or other citizen who has witnessed the crime can. Ergo the PD arrives, takes the story and say we can't arrest, but if you make the arrest they can then take them in and process the arrest. Penal Code 834. An arrest is taking a person into custody, in a case and in the manner authorized by law. An arrest may be made by a peace officer or by a private person. 835. An arrest is made by an actual restraint of the person, or by submission to the custody of an officer. The person arrested may be subjected to such restraint as is reasonable for his arrest and detention. 835a. Any peace officer who has reasonable cause to believe that the person to be arrested has committed a public offense may use reasonable force to effect the arrest, to prevent escape or to overcome resistance. A peace officer who makes or attempts to make an arrest need not retreat or desist from his efforts by reason of the resistance or threatened resistance of the person being arrested; nor shall such officer be deemed an aggressor or lose his right to self-defense by the use of reasonable force to effect the arrest or to prevent escape or to overcome resistance. (included for the keyboard commandoes that bloviate about what might happen if they are getting arrested and are innocent.) 837. A private person may arrest another: 1. For a public offense committed or attempted in his presence. 2. When the person arrested has committed a felony, although not in his presence. 3. When a felony has been in fact committed, and he has reasonable cause for believing the person arrested to have committed it. 838. A magistrate may orally order a peace officer or private person to arrest any one committing or attempting to commit a public offense in the presence of such magistrate. 839. Any person making an arrest may orally summon as many persons as he deems necessary to aid him therein. 840. An arrest for the commission of a felony may be made on any day and at any time of the day or night. An arrest for the commission of a misdemeanor or an infraction cannot be made between the hours of 10 o'clock p.m. of any day and 6 o'clock a.m. of the succeeding day, unless: (1) The arrest is made without a warrant pursuant to Section 836 or 837. (2) The arrest is made in a public place. (3) The arrest is made when the person is in custody pursuant to another lawful arrest. (4) The arrest is made pursuant to a warrant which, for good cause shown, directs that it may be served at any time of the day or night. 844. To make an arrest, a private person, if the offense is a felony, and in all cases a peace officer, may break open the door or window of the house in which the person to be arrested is, or in which they have reasonable grounds for believing the person to be, after having demanded admittance and explained the purpose for which admittance is desired. 845. Any person who has lawfully entered a house for the purpose of making an arrest, may break open the door or window thereof if detained therein, when necessary for the purpose of liberating himself, and an officer may do the same, when necessary for the purpose of liberating a person who, acting in his aid, lawfully entered for the purpose of making an arrest, and is detained therein. 846. Any person making an arrest may take from the person arrested all offensive weapons which he may have about his person, and must deliver them to the magistrate before whom he is taken. 847. (a) A private person who has arrested another for the commission of a public offense must, without unnecessary delay, take the person arrested before a magistrate, or deliver him or her to a peace officer. (b) There shall be no civil liability on the part of, and no cause of action shall arise against, any peace officer or federal criminal investigator or law enforcement officer described in subdivision (a) or (d) of Section 830.8, acting within the scope of his or her authority, for false arrest or false imprisonment arising out of any arrest under any of the following circumstances: (1) The arrest was lawful, or the peace officer, at the time of the arrest, had reasonable cause to believe the arrest was lawful. (2) The arrest was made pursuant to a charge made, upon reasonable cause, of the commission of a felony by the person to be arrested. (3) The arrest was made pursuant to the requirements of Section 142, 837, 838, or 839. 841. The person making the arrest must inform the person to be arrested of the intention to arrest him, of the cause of the arrest, and the authority to make it, except when the person making the arrest has reasonable cause to believe that the person to be arrested is actually engaged in the commission of or an attempt to commit an offense, or the person to be arrested is pursued immediately after its commission, or after an escape. The person making the arrest must, on request of the person he is arresting, inform the latter of the offense for which he is being arrested. |
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Dunno if you are serious or not, what with all the Walmart threads and all, but: Some states allow for loss prevention personell to have powers of detention in some form or another. If you don't, and/or aren't, then why expose yourself to that kind of liability for a $10 an hour job? Dave |
I think it would not be hard to show that 99% of the time that the beeper goes off, the items it detected were legaly purchased. Therefor the beeper can not be used to reliably detect stolen items. Besides, I don't think anyone is going to react very nicely to some19 year old at Best Buy trying to arrest them |
Now I don't believe that at all. I distinctly remember the episode of "The Andy Griffith Show" where Gomer was chasing Barney down for making a U-turn while screaming "citiZEN's arREEST! citiZEN's arREEST!" And everybody knows Mayberry is in North Carolina.  Or did NC change the law after (because of) that show? 
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Ahhh, a cop being too stupid? I thought that being stupid was a requirement for cops… Police reject candidate for being too intelligent http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_56314.html A US man has been rejected in his bid to become a police officer for scoring too high on an intelligence test. Robert Jordan, a 49-year-old college graduate, took an exam to join the New London police, in Connecticut, in 1996 and scored 33 points, the equivalent of an IQ of 125. But New London police interviewed only candidates who scored 20 to 27, on the theory that those who scored too high could get bored with police work and leave soon after undergoing costly training. Mr Jordan launched a federal lawsuit against the city, but lost. The 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in New York upheld a lower court's decision that the city did not discriminate against Mr Jordan because the same standards were applied to everyone who took the test. He said: "This kind of puts an official face on discrimination in America against people of a certain class. I maintain you have no more control over your basic intelligence than your eye color or your gender or anything else." He said he does not plan to take any further legal action and has worked as a prison guard since he took the test. The average score nationally for police officers is 21 to 22, the equivalent of an IQ of 104, or just a little above average. |
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"He who chooses to play the role of Citizen Cop does so at his own peril" (From the Chapter: “The Dangerous Myth of Citizen's Arrest”, In the Gravest Extreme: The Role of the Firearm in Personal Protection by Massad F. Ayoob) In other words, after a cop rolls up on you pointing a gun at anybody (especially another cop) – he gets to go home and sleep in a warm bed that night and you get to die handcuffed and face down in the gutter. |
Lewis Terman did an extensive study of IQ and how it affects people's lives. He also did a historical analysis of what the probable IQs of various famous people were. One of the things he concluded was that, for certain occupations, a high IQ really is a drawback. Two of the professions were painter and general. Nearly all of the famous painters and generals that he and his team analyzed were found to have very average IQs. It could be true of cops, as well, that a high IQ is not a good thing, for various reasons. |
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In most states you are allowed to act in self defense and in defense of others. In this case, I was acting on behalf of a person who was unable to defend himself. 1) The two undercover officers never identified themselves as officers before we were forced to arrest them. 2) They behaved in such a manner as to alarm me and most of the neighbors and bystanders, enough so that some of the neighbors slipped off and retrieved firearms. 3) They never even talked to any of us, only to each other. They were laughing that the unconsious victim was probably drunk. Funny, I was down close enough to feel his breath on my cheek, and never detected an odor of liquor. But that was immaterial... this was a guy unconscious and bleeding on the street. They showed callous disregard for his safety. 4) They attempted to roll him over to get his license. Later they said, "We weren't trying to steal his wallet, we were just trying to look at his ID." I already knew all the ID I needed, unconscious male bleeding on the street. Everything else is secondary at that point. 5) All of the officers I know have had some 1st Aid training, and know how to handle victims of accidents, what to do and not do. I, or I should say WE, it was a group effort, was on solid ground legally. It was a case of defense of other, and an arrest. Somebody stealing from a store, I am not getting involved. For me it had better be something really serious, life and death. |
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AFIK in most state (not all) a citizen may make an arrest if they witness a felony committed. I would never, ever do this. It's best to observe and report. "Hello, 911" "My name is ________ . I just witnessed a (felony) at (location). The persons that did it drove away (direction) on (street). They were driving a (Color/make/model)." Make a mental note of the suspect's description working from head to toe. -Race -Headgear? -Haircut -Facial hair -Torso -Ht/Weight -Torso clothing -Lower body -Pants color -Shoes Go over what you saw, and, go over it again and again. Commit it to paper as soon as you can. You'll do more good to everyone if you let the cops do their job, and, you, as a citizen, do yours. |
I'm no fan of the "Let the cop do his job and you stay out of it" crowd, but in the case of a citizens arrest, I believe it is correct. Threat to life and limb is another thing entirely. |
I understand what you are saying VG, and, in the case of defending a third party, for me, it would depend on the situation. Note: I did not say "Stay out of it." You do noone ANY good dead becasue you got all tactical on someone. My belief is that, in most cases, provideing the po-po with a solid descriptions of everything that went on, and, makeing yourself availiable to be a witness is preferable in most cases to risking your own life in a split second, in a situation you know nothing about. Again, this all is situationally dependant. May sound like a cop-out on my part, but, IMO, it's just how it is. |