Posted: 12/18/2004 7:50:17 AM EDT
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One of my oldest friends just called me to say he was getting some special paint which is supposed to defeat traffic enforcement cameras. Sounds like he got ripped on some gimmick to me. I searched google and If anything, it puts a shiney coating on a license plate which could have been done with a polyurathane gloss paint and not at 30 dollars a spray can?? Anyone hear of this stuff |
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I once knew a person who would take one of those mega water guns filled with baby oil and spray the lens of the cameras, kind of a vigilanty protest. ETA: In the town that he was doing it in, he was not costing the town a penny, the cameras were owned and operated by Lockheed-Martin, all maintanence was done by thier contractors at thier expense, they also recieved 75% of funds generated by the cameras. |
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They make polarized license covers that limit the angle from which the license can be read. Usually you have to be nearly directly in front of and nearly level with the plate. Probably illegal all by themselves. Just shoot the camera. Wait.....that might be illegal in some states. |
Well running red lights is cool sarge... plus, eventually you will get to kill another human and then, when caught, you will get sent away to the booty bin and have lots of boyfriends -- what more could one want? |
a $350 fine and an ass kicking? Sgatr15 |
Except that red light cameras make mistakes and there is no appeal proccess, and it has been proven in many communities when the cameras were not bringing enough money in, the yellow light time got turned down to "create" more criminals. Plus it automatically accuses the vehicle owner no matter who is driving. Red light cameras are nothing more than a revenue tool. If one is accused of being a "criminal" as you put it, in this country we have the right to face our accusers.... not machines. |
They may or may not work... that is not really the issue though is it. Because they are marketed as a criminal tool they are suspect from inseption -- especially when you have to admit that these sprays are marketed as tool used to perpetrate a violent crime against others (and face it, that is what they are, traffic regulation signals are designed to prevent accidents, injury and death)... So, given that the people that would use such a product are probably stretched to muster an IQ equal to room temperature... why would you want to tell them that they can get cloak in a can and operate the hoopty with full impunity? Heck... might as well sell the spray with ski mask huh? If you take steps to obfuscate you CRIMINAL actions then you are a CRIMINAL by choice and no better than those that would enter your home and do you harm... |
Well...I disagree with the last part. I knowingly and willing break a law now and then, but when I get caught I accept it. Sgatr15 |
Okay... this is not at all what I am talking about and I do not argue what you are saying. I am saying that a person that outfits, alters, or makes steps toward masking their criminal actions does so with premeditation and forethought, the intent is nefarious and nothing more. |
Relax... I am mostly just trying to get people riled up... but don't tell anyone 'k? 
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It's "proven" that communities change the yellow light to make money? I guess since it's proven, you can show us the proof. I live in the city of Tempe. They have a photo radar van, and when they set it up they put a huge sign in front of it before you reach the van that the van is there and in use, yeah sounds like the city is trying to make money by warning people the camera is there. There is also a web page that shows where it's going to be. And the photo radar cameras? They won't go off unless you run the red light or is 11 mph over the speed limit (I would have to be going 56 mph in a 45 mph) to get photo radared. I always stop for red lights, and strangely enough I have never gotten a ticket from them. Cameras might make mistakes but I think the rate that cameras make mistakes is way lower that a human cop, and if a cop says he caught you speeding and sticks with it, you have the same appeal process as the camera. It's your word against the cops. |
Remember this when they start installing speed enforcement cameras on the highways. I'll love to see the same righteous indignation when you get a $200 ticket in the mail for doing 60 in a 55. IMO, red-light cameras and all government CCTV monitoring sets a dangerous precedent. |
So if I object to right light cameras based upon my above reasons and would use such an item (were I foolish enough to believe it worked) my intent is nefarious? Say I let friends use my car and don't want to be ticketed if they make a mistake. Say my community recently turned down the yellow light time to create more "criminals" and I object to teh tactic, am I "nefariuos" in my intent to not play along with thier little teft-by-law-enforcement sceme? |
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Want to find a way to "fight" the red light cameras? Stop for red lights. I know, I know it's such a outrageous and totally off the wall suggestion, but it really does work. And as an added bonus, your chances of plowing into a mini van and killing entire families is reduced as well. |
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First of all, the lenght of a yellow light is based on traffic flow, the camera doesn't take the picture till you CROSSED the line. Second, the cameras also get a picture of your face...CLEARLY...if your friend is driving the car you might get the ticket, but in court it will be clear that you were NOT the driver. Sgtar15 |
 That sounds like a redneck in Tulsa back in 1988 who worked at NORDAM, an aerospace defense contractor.He was caught stealing scraps of top secret Stealth material, sheets of rubber like material used on the Stealth Fighter and the Stealth Bombers. He told the FBI that when he got enough of it he was going to wallpaper the outside of his hot-rod El Camino so that he could speed and be invisible to highway patrol radar guns! |
First on the appeal, try it with a red light camera. You can't. Even if you were not driving, if it was your car you pay. I know a guy whos GF when she decieded to break up with him ran 20 red lights in his car right before..... think he could appeal those? Nope. His car, he paid. If a cop catches you, he sees you in person and has a positive ID on the person getting the citation. On the times I will have to google it and get back to you, but it has been shown to happen. If someone doesn't beat me too it I will do it tomorrow when I'm not at work. |
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I don’t know how well the paint works, but I saw a tag a while back with the plastic covering which obscured the tag from angles other than straight on. It was real obvious – and I suspect anyone stopped by a cop for some other violation would have a real hard time talking the cop out of giving them a ticket for that other violation. I also wonder how much of an issue it might be in any legal actions stemming from some sort of serious traffic accident. Also, while I agree that the concept has been abused by some localities, the issue of red light runners is a very real one around here. And, FWIW, this county has big signs in intersections with the cameras warning that they are there – so there’s really no excuse for even an idiot to get a ticket here. |
Depends on the state you are in. Some states ticket the owner of the car, some states ticket the driver. In Arizona, if the picture showed a woman driving, I wouldn't get the ticket since that is obviously not me. Which state is the state you're friend is in? If it shows a woman driving, he should be able to appeal them. Another reason why I don't let anyone drive my car. |
Not so in some communities here in NC. We have no front plates and it only takes a photo of the rear. they get around it by making it only a "civil" fine with no criminal charges. And as far as yellow light times go, the shorter they are the more likely people are to run the red light. |
NC, we only have rear tags and in some communities thats the only picture it takes as they don't want to put up dual camera setups to photograph the driver and tag. |
| San Antonio spent $160 MILLION dollars on a city-wide camera system....same amount we pizzed away on the Alamodome. It's called transguide and is a useless POS. I wonder how long it will take them to convert the taxpayer funded camera sysytem into a 'revenue tool'>???? |
What precedent is that? You mean moving into the 21st century and making use of available technology? Is that anything like when motorists began using radar detectors and CB radios to keep from getting caught while speeding? 
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There can be extenuating circumstances for running a red light (I'm not talking about blatantly flying through the intersection). Examples... 1st car stopped at a red light, emergency vehicle is approaching from the rear and the driver of the car has to run the red light so the emergency vehicle can pass. Granted, in that situation the camera may (or may not), take a picture of the emergency vehicle, and even if it does who's to say that the camera contractors will conviently ignore it. Car is in left or right hand lane preparing to make a turn. There are a few cars in front of the driver. The light turns green and vehicles make the turn. your car easily makes it through the green light, but for some reason the cars in front of you stop. Your car is in the intersection and by the time the vehicles are moving the light has changed to red. The examples I posted might be uncommon (there could be examples that would be more common), but the point is a cop can use discretion when issuing (or not issuing), a ticket. A camera isn't necessarily going to tell the whole story. |
Yes, but you also must make the "prepare to stop" warning tiem long enough to allow someone to stop. Read the studies here: www.motorists.com/issues/enforce/studies.html Lots of yellow light timing studies there, very informative reading. I wish teh lick to Dick armeys big report on cameras still worked but it is down, if anyone has it please post where we can find it. |
Wow, lot's of things just plain wrong in this post:
Several cities have admitted to doing it, including Charlotte, NC.
That's not true, and it is one of the major problems with the lights. My wife was ticketed by a camera on Independence Blvd in Charlotte, NC. She had to stop because of an accident in the middle of the intersection. She was ticketed. About a month later she was ticketed at an intersection on the same street when an officer was directing traffic around construction. She was following the direction of the officer as required by law, but still had to pay the fine.
Not usually. I posted a copy of the NC and city of Charlotte, NC laws concerning the red light cameras, and you didn't have the right to appeal. I also posted a copy of a letter from the Charlotte-Mecklenberg police that stated you didn't have the right to challenge the camera. I'm afraid when those cameras come to SC, because here you don't even have the right to a trial over moving violations, so there's no way you'd have the right to one wrt red light cameras.z |
Check out this post by this asshat from the UK:
Kind of like kitchen knives encourage people to stab each other, and McDonald's encourages fat people to remain obese, huh? Y'know, it's almost like a different planet over there. |
Red light cameras are sold and used for revenue generating purposes, period. The day the red-light ticket machine got wrecked. www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=27&article_id=1934&page_number=1 Red-light cameras and the secret Gotcha! line. www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=27&article_id=1979&page_number=1 Rear-end crashes go up after red-light cameras go in. www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=27&article_id=2843 Red lights, loot, and the law. www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=27&article_id=3805&page_number=1 |
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Just drive faster than the speed of light! Or leave a few minutes earlier and not have to run red lights. I seem to actually able to read the lights and know when a green light I'm approaching is getting ready to turn - acutally I am able to see the walk/don't walk lights. The don't walk light will flash a number of times, then turn solid for a while before the traffic light turns red. Works for me. |
This is for the sadly informed who question others without doing a google search on "In San Diego, a judge threw out 292 tickets because the automated camera system had run amok. Investigators discovered that when cameras were put up, yellow lights were routinely shortened. Again, city hall's need for cash was the driving force behind the new surveillance technique." Google-up your IQ. |
How does that in any way affect my statement?
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Great quoute that says it all about yellow lights and trafiic money from cameras: If reducing violations were really the point, then D.C. would follow the example of nearby Fairfax County, Virginia, which chopped red-light running to less than 1/10th its former rate at the corner of U.S. 50 and Fair Ridge Drive. The miracle was accomplished by lengthening the yellow to 5.5 seconds from 4.0. No civil rights were trampled in the process. But there was a casualty. With citations dropping to less than one a day, the ticket machine is a total wreck. www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=27&article_id=1934&page_number=2 |
| I heard the spray works. I saw some pics of how it looks like when the pic is developed. When the camera flashes, the license plate glares and reflects back some of the flash. It's a see through paint, but it reflects back when you shine some bright light to it. |
No. The precedent that governmental monitoring of citizens via CCTV is positive thing and that if you question and/or circumvent the system, you are obivously guilty of something. Incrementalism. |
Don't laugh, it works. You just have to remember to cover all the glass with the polarizing film also. ETA: Against RF/microwave radar only, not laser. |
------------VICTIMLESS CRIME----------- IN THE MOST PURE FORM. |
| They have had some problems with this system that I have read about. Some of the cameras are apparently set to record anything that goes through an intersection during a red light, but in some areas, (can't remember where right now, but think it was in IL), people were sent tickets because they made a right turn on red, which is, of course, legal in most areas afaik. |