Posted: 11/13/2004 10:30:23 PM EDT
|
Does anyone know how well on average pepper/OC sprays are against drunk persons? Any LEO's out there? Experiences? -MrMaeda |
|
I'm OC certified but haven't had the chance to actually use mine yet. From what I've heard it usually works pretty well on most people. Only the extremely intoxicated or if they're drugged up pretty well will they not feel the effects. As a sober person that's been sprayed I can tell you that it incapicates almost immediately. It sucks. |
Dog attacks are somewhat common in my life so taser is sorta outta the idea. Plus I still want a less then lethal for the 2-leggeds. Thanks though. |
|
I got a site that sells pepper spray grenades. Pop cap, push button, throw into unruly crowd. Nice for clearing rooms or getting that mob in front of your home/place of business to disperse. They also sell a ring that goes on your index or middle finger. Someone jumps you, click off the safety and hose them with three seconds worth of pepper spray. Looks like a decorative silver/gold ring and refills in seconds. Pepper spray works if you can hit them square in the face. If they're on drugs or keep squirming out of the spray, it won't be as effective. If you get a direct blast to the face, you should blind them and make them wheeze for breath for at least a few seconds, long enough to get away. Many will be totally incapacitated by it. |
|
It works fine if you tag them in the eyes but you can develope a slight resistance to it once you get over the shock and they will continue the fight if they can still see or feel you. Them mucus membranes dont like it much either. Use the figure 8 patern to spray it there. Find a %10 OC or higher if you can. Use in 2 or 3 second bursts to allow the air to kick in and make it worse for the person now wearing the OC. If you get tagged do not use hot water as it will open up the pores on the skin and will become more pronounced. Some kinds of soaps will increase the effects of OC during the decontamination (I forgot the types at this moment, sorry). Think of dripping the pepper juice into your eyes.heck A funner toy is the ispra-jet that puts a nice spray in a large area, feels like lava (kick ass pepper)on the skin, most puke after 5 seconds after introduction and they are tagged a nice deep orange color where the chemical agent just sits and burns. Have not used it on a drunk/doped up person yet to give info on that part, but normal people seem not to like it much. Also can be easier to carry in some areas due to some local areas having a problem with the 2nd Ammendment. |
|
Percentage has nothing to do with effectivness- only Scoville Heat units are important for that. FOX sprays have 5.3 SHUs, which places them heads above the rest- and since they provide sprays to lots of police departments, quality control is there. Check out this article by James Yeager: OC article |
|
The percentage only affects the decontamination time. Ten percent averages 45 minutes. The Scoville Heat Units are to Oleoresin Capsicum as British Thermal Units (BTU's) are to your furnace. The proper spray technique is to spray a 1/2 to 1 second burst to the face/eyes then move yourself from his last known location and prepare to spray a second time and move again. If the adversary is still coming at you prepare to escalate the force needed to stop the attack. I have not seen a good quality spray fail to stop an aggressor yet, approximately 35 personal sprays. However be aware I have heard of some instances where it only slowed them down. If it fails to stop them on the second attempt and you have no other escalation of force, use this delay to create safe separation and get to a safe location. NEVER GIVE UP! |
|
I was sprayed in training. Part of our certification process. Thoroughly soaked down: stream into eyes, up nose, all over chest. Ended up throwing away the shirt I was wearing due to gross contamination. I was blind for the better part of an hour. That was the _only_ effect. No respiratory impairment, no overwhelming pain; I just couldn't open my eyes. If I was resisting, I could have done a lot of damage to anyone I could put may hands on. Pepper spray has its place. But it's no magic bullet. I've never used it on anyone, since every time I've unsnapped the carrier the asshole suddenly became much better behaved. But if the day comes when I do use it, I'm going to be sure that I have an impact weapon like an ASP, and a deadly weapon like a pistol, ready for immediate use. |
|
When I was living in NYC I had a can of OC that I carried for a while. I was riding the #2 train coming home from work at about 11pm and the train was mostly empty so I decided WTF why not. I shot some in the car and took a whiff, nothing. I'm thinking this shit dosen't work so I spray some more and take another breath, HOLYFRIGGENCHRIST I gagged and started to choke. I ran into the next car so I could breathe. The next stop was mine so I got off and a bunch of folks where waiting on the platform to get on, I quickly took the stairs to change trains and I could hear people screaming OMG, gagging and screaming WTF. I was scared shitless I might get caught but luckily my train was right there and I got right on, I had a nervous laugh when my train pulled away. 
|
. If not you still gotta get down and dirty and probably get it all over yourself
|
Man, I sure see a lot of armchair quarterbacks talking about the great effectiveness of OC in this thread. "I was issued it but haven't used it yet", You have to use a figure 8 pattern", It works if you hit them in the eyes", etc, etc. Fact Do not EVER count on OC working on ANYBODY, period!! I have been exposed to Sabre 10% level III law enforcement spray MANY times(probably around 50-60 times) and taken direct face hits a bunch of times. At this point the spray basically has very limited effect on myself. I have seen a fairly large number of individuals who were sprayed in a combat situation take the initial blast and shake it off. I have seen 1 guy laugh when sprayed several times. Do not think that a person can not fight after being sprayed, he can. All the spray does is involuntarily close your eyes for a few seconds, and get into your mucous membranes, it does not incapacitate the person. We have sprayed people who it has little effect on, it pisses them off, and then the fight is on. Problem with that is that now you get it all over you. Yes, it does effect some people to the point of them being totally compliant, but don't ever use the spray to save your life. It is just another tool on the officers belt, and is the next level up from verbal commands in the continuim of force for a reason. That is to delay or try to stop the aggressor for long enough so that the LEO can subdue the person with as little harm to both parties as possible. BTW, the more hot(spicy) foods a person eats in his normal life, diminishes the effects of sprays. |
Please tell me more... I'm quite interested. |
Well...I played with some Fox Labs stuff a while back...it's AWFUL. Sprayed on the ground in an open area, it was enough to make me cough from 15 feet away. It made the bottom fall out of a styrofoam coffee cup in less than 30 seconds, and one of my cop buddies had it take the tint off the back window of his car when one of his dumbass co-workers sprayed a guy INSIDE HIS CAR
|
After the first time, I'd have learned to do what the nice officer tells me to do. 
Now, I have heard something like this. I've heard that it will shorten the recovery time but the initial effect remains the same. I haven't seen any evidence to back it up though. |
www.selfdefenseproducts.com Irv Miller who runs this shop is totally cool. He ain't happy unless you are happy. |
Sure, no problem. I am a Correction Officer in a Maximum Security Jail (around 1500 inmates). I have spent the last 10 years of my 17 yrs in Central Booking, which means we get the A-holes right off the street, sometimes VERY aggravated by their placement at our doorstep. Sometimes, these upstanding citizens (rapists, murderer's, child molesters, drug dealers, etc.) decide they don't want to go with the program, and it escalates into a force situation. The next level of force up from verbal commands is the use of OC. There are times when it get used A LOT in a matter of a few days, then you can go for a couple of weeks without seeing it used. I think it has something to do with the full moon  When you combine A-hole convicts, with overzelous supervisors who can't spray a guy without spraying those around him, you tend to eat tons of OC It works great on some individuals, sucks on others. You just never know. The guy that laughed at it got sprayed by us, then the response team (twice, I think) and still wanted to fight. He was so dusted he couldn't feel a thing.As far as it having less effect on those who eat hot(spicy) foods, it is definitely true as far as I can tell. The spray is made from Cayenne peppers, so naturally, if you eat this type of food, you will create some amount of resistance. The biggest factor of a guy that gets sprayed is the initial shock, because he doesn't know what to expect. Once a person has been sprayed, the next time he can have a much quicker recovery time. Life as a C.O. , not just a job, but an adventure! |
A person who consumes hot peppers on a regular basis will have a diminished initial reaction as well as a quicker recovery time. Another factor to think about are people with a dark skin pigment, these people have a diminished initial reaction as well. Red haired light complected suffer unmercifully. Remember the above exceptions suffer diminished symptoms not immunity, and only to the burning felt by the skin. Eye irritation and respiratory irritation stay equal. So use it anyway, it will give you some time to get away. As far as building an immunity I've seen it go both ways, a slight immunity too a greater reaction. 
|