[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Ammo Question - UPDATED (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 7/14/2004 7:30:11 PM EDT
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OK, last Sunday I took a state required course for my CCW. I was going over my notes, and I remembered that the instructor told us that we should run 5 boxes of the ammo that we intend to use through our gun with no malfunctions before we can trust it. I have always used FMJ's at the range, but loaded hollow-points at home. I've been doing that for the entire 10 years that I have owned guns! Reason? A box of FMJ's (especially 9mm) cost about half what a box of hollow-points costs. Poll coming. UPDATE - I took my XD-9 Subcompact to the range today and ran 150 rounds of Speer Gold Dot 124 Gr. JHP's through it. It functioned flawlessly. My shooting was my best so far with a handgun. EVERY shot went EXACTLY where I wanted it to go (I love that XD, it's an amazing gun). The cost for the range time and ammo was $82 and change. Oh well I guess. 1 down, 4 to go. |
But hollow points have a flat nose and a cavity. This can cause feeding problems on some guns. Why not spend the $40 and test it out to be 100% sure? You took a class and heard from an expert...but now you don't believe him?? Sgtar15 |
Even for guns that traditionally work fine with hollow-points, like a Beretta 92 or a Springfield XD? |
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Absolutely -- what if your gun chokes on HPs, or a particular brand (Murphy's Law being what it is, it would be the brand **I** choose) of HPs? You gotta know your stuff with 100% certainty. That, and, there is a definite difference (recoil and flash) between the ammo I practice with and the ammo I carry. In short, as F4YR put it, "What's your life worth again?" It's a few boxes in addition to what you'd load in it for carry. |
My problem is this. Range time runs about $20 and hour. Now if I add $20 for a box of 100 Winchester FMJ's then I am at $40 for my trip to the range. If I have to pay $50 to get 100 rounds of Spper Gold Dots, then I am at $70 for one trip to the range. I make good money, but I'm not a Rockafeller. Shouldn't I be able to trust my Beretta 92 and my Springfield to work with industry standard ammo? |
I don't carry yet, and no I don't have 10 year old ammo loaded in my home defense gun. It's about a month old. I do have a box of .45's that are about 4 years old. And yes, I have never shot a hollow point through my future carry gun. I have only had it about 6 weeks though. |
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I carry a Kimber CDP. Its a thousand dollar gun and I put 400 rounds of cheap USA ammo thru it for break in and 200 rounds of hollow point carry ammo for function testing before I carried it. My rule was 200 rounds of flawless function with the ammo I was going to carry. |
Taking this CCW class has got me leaning thinking very seriously about getting a J-Frame. It would definately be nice to have a gun that you can fire from inside a pocket! |
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I have wondered this for awhile never asked since I honestly never thought about it until I was reading this thread. How many of you have actually fired your carry weapon without hearing protection? Do you even know what it feels like when that sonic boom hits your ears and your still trying to hit your target? Cause this is exactly what is going to happen out there in the real world. Personally I think that everyone should be exposed to that before getting their CCW.. And yes Steve you need to test/pratice with the same ammo you carry with. Different ammo shoots higher or lower etc. Has different feel / recoil to it. Its extremly important that you understand this and are "use" to your carry ammo. If it cost you 400 bucks total in range time and ammo to get use to it, isn't worth it knowing for sure you know what to expect when you pull the trigger fighting for your life? ym |
Want to test that theory? FMJ does not equal JHP They don't feed the same, they don't even shoot exactly the same |
To be honest with you, I never considered the idea that high quality guns would not work properly with industry standard ammunition. Especially my Beretta 92F or a Springfield XD, given the reputations that each of these guns has. |
No, it's not the same. In a defensive situation, your body floods with adreniline and there are other changes. Shooting at a range, the gun will be very loud (and WILL damage your hearing) Shooting in self defense, most people claim they don't even hear it. As far as experience, I had a 12 gauge go off about 10" to the side of my head. Does that count? |
Actually, the adrenaline going through your system will completley block out the noise. Ever been hunting???? |
Does a Ferrari work every time? A Porsche? A Rolex? These things are built by humans - humans have good days and bad. Don't bet your life on bubba making $12.48 an hour. |
My main CCW pistol is an M-85 Taurus loaded with 125gr Remington Golden Sabers. I generally carry two reloads in speed loaders or if I'm going out of town I'll pack two extras for a total of 4 reloads. I have a belt holder for extra ammo as well, normall I'll put some snake shot and some FMJ's in the pouch for "special" situations. I like a small frame revolver, their easy to carry, work 99.9% of the time with just about any ammo you feed them and they don't have the stigma of a semi if you have to pull it in a public place. There are a lot of very nice small frame revolvers on the market now, alloy, Ti, stainless. You can get em' in just about any caliber that you'd like. Taurus even makes a medium frame snub in 45 ACP if you want to spend the money on one. For General Purpose carry it's hard to beat a good revolver. |
And some peopl.e will tell you not to do that too! |
Only dumbasses. The same type that tell you to keep the ammo locked up separate from the locked up gun. Let's put it another way - why would you want to bring an unloaded gun to a gun fight? Time kills. Take a good Tactical Handgun course and you'll find out that time = life |
DO IT BEOTCCH!!! You will respect my authoritaaaaahhhh 
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I voted to ensure reliability because I found that my sig 232 didn't like Federal .380 Hydrashoks, but never failed with speer hollowpoints. The Speer has a more rounded bullet which the feed-ramp just likes better. Never trust your life to something you haven't tested, I always say! |
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"Actually, the adrenaline going through your system will completley block out the noise. Ever been hunting" yes without saying more. But I hear everyshot unless on FA. My point was that if you have to use your gun you better know what its going to do with the ammo in it and how loud it really is... The whole adrenaline thing is highly over rated. Train for one to know its happing and then train to control it. Too much AD will cause you to cramp up and not controlled can make you puke. But where talking a whole different ball game and not,, God willing any one here will be subjected to. I'm sure a typical LEO or CCW here that gets caught up in a gun fight will be over in sec's with them on top hopfully. Hell I was caught off guard at my own house a few weeks ago. ym |
I had bought one of these, but I sold it to my dad because he wanted to get a CCW too. He's complaining that the trigger sticks about every 6th trigger pull. |
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"As far as experience, I had a 12 gauge go off about 10" to the side of my head. Does that count?" Yup that will do it... Hey fight4yourrights,,, can you hear me now???? I said can you hear me now??? lol sorry couldn't resist. My ears are ringing just from thinking about your experience... OUCH ym 
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I've got the Ultra Lite model, most of the time I forget it's even there. As for the trigger sticking on the 6th pull, it's only a 5 shot revolver. 
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Right, he loads it once fires 5 shots, reloads and it sticks on the first shot. He cocks it manually, it will run for 5 shots, he reloads and it might stick on the second shot. Is that so hard to understand? |
wolf-ym, Do you hunt big game like deer or bear? Have you ever heard of "buck fever"? The noise and recoil will not be a problem. I had occasion to shoot 6 times in my front yard in self defence with a S&W mod 65(.357) with 125 gr. soft points. Noise was not a factor. |
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" wolf-ym, Do you hunt big game like deer or bear? Have you ever heard of "buck fever"? The noise and recoil will not be a problem. I had occasion to shoot 6 times in my front yard in self defence with a S&W mod 65(.357) with 125 gr. soft points. Noise was not a factor" Yes many years ago. Don't hunt large game anymore. Yes heard and seen, and felt buck fever. Its a perfect time to train someone what AD feels like flooding through their vains. Teach them how to breath, slow their heart beat and bring their vision back out from tunnel mode and bring your hearing back in check... Alot of stuff happens soon as AD hits your system. All of the AD training can cross over but in something like a attempted car jack or robbery etc its not real usefull if its a fast bang bang type of thing. Its invaluable when hunting not matter what game your going after. I'm very glad that those 6 shots you shot in self defence you made it out ok.. With hunting season coming up try this. Sorry getting off OT but I will pull it back into the thread. When you go out Bob hunting and your right where you want to be and see tha buck that you could shoot stop and take notice how fast your heart is beating, how closed your vision is, there could be a better buck just to your left but you won't see him. And your right for most if someone was screaming at you, you might not even hear them. Learn to breath, relax, look off from the buck futher away, far away. Slow everything down and then come back to your scope... It takes ALOT of pratices. Could do it now if you have somewhere you can go. Get some snap caps and go play. Once you get a complete understanding then you will be 100 times the hunter and your buddies will be asking you where did you learn to shoot like that? But then again some love the thrill of it all so if you do the above its not anywhere as gratafing. Steve another thing you can do is load some dummy rounds in your clips. This for one show you if your antipating "sorry spelling is really late at night" two is a good way for you simualte a jam and your reaction to it.. Do you just stare at your weapon tring to fig out what happend or did you rack the slide eject that round and carry one shooting? During this time think to yourself what would it be like if you where in the middle of gun fight!!! Perfect training tool. ym Quote per USMC well not a Quote but you get the point. This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is MINE. My rifle is my best friend. It is my life. I must master it as I must master my life. My rifle without me is useless. Without my rifle, I am useless. I must fire my rifle true. I must shoot straighter than my enemy who is trying to kill me. I must shoot him before he shoots me. I will... My rifle and myself know that what counts in war is not the rounds we fire, the noise of our bursts, nor the smoke we make. We know it is the hits that count. We will hit... My rifle is human, even as I, because it is my life. Thus, I will learn it as a brother. I will learn its weaknesses, its strengths, its parts, its accessories, its sights, and its barrel. I will ever guard it against the ravages of weather and damage. I will keep my rifle clean and ready, even as I am clean and ready. We will become part of each other. We will... Before God I swear this creed. My rifle and myself are the defenders of my country. We are the masters of our enemy. We are the saviors of my life. So be it, until there is no enemy, but PEACE. |
I couldn't hear anything out of that ear for probably 15 minutes. Rang for days. I don't have any noticable long term effects, luckily |
| Never had or will have the right to CCW (as long as I'm in NJ), my opinion lacks experience as to the process. Knowing your gun will go bang when you need it, you will have to eliminate as many variables as possible. As in load development for my rifles, I try several different component manufacturers (brass, bullets, powder) and find which combo works best in a particular rifle and stick with it. I would do the same for a defensive handgun. Try several manufacturers offerings and see which one gives you the best performance and stick with it. Practice with it too. It will cost you more probably, but your carry gun is not your plinker. Practice with it in its intended role and hope that all you will ever do with that gun is practice. |
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Shit, as far as I'm concerned only a FOOL would not give his/her personal defense rounds a good test firing. This reminds me-there's a Funshow coming up here and a my personal defense stuff is approaching a year's age. Gotta shoot it up and get some more.  Those 147gr Winchester HPs shoot REAL good in my 9MMs. Some 158gr HPs for the .357 Some 165gr HPs for the .40 Cor-Bon HPs for the .45 |
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any new gun handgun i buy get 2-300 rnds of fmj reloads for break in and then a full box of whatever i decide to carry to ensure function. I buy a new box of carry ammo every 6 months and shoot the old one. That keeps me fresh on how that gun responds with that ammo and ensures no function problems. mike |