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Posted: 5/20/2022 6:13:48 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: and in Texas y'all pay coaches cause that draws students and that draws money. It's not just Texas. In the majority of US states, the highest paid public employee in the entire state is a coach. |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 6:48:44 PM EDT
[#2]
PBIS is serious business.
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Posted: 5/20/2022 7:42:41 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Except tooth to tail is more than 1:1…..old article. My Daughter just left the NCY public school system as a teacher. She mentioned that in NYC it's almost better than 2 administrators for every teacher. I suppose that analogous to having 70 2LTs for every 35 enlisted men in an Infantry Plt. To your question OP. It's known as a jobs program that distributes tax dollars. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Somebody has to hire, fire, supervise that teachings goals are being met, that hot dogs and buns show up before lunch. Any sizeable organization is going to require some administration. Except tooth to tail is more than 1:1…..old article. My Daughter just left the NCY public school system as a teacher. She mentioned that in NYC it's almost better than 2 administrators for every teacher. I suppose that analogous to having 70 2LTs for every 35 enlisted men in an Infantry Plt. To your question OP. It's known as a jobs program that distributes tax dollars. This. Used to be a lot of published data about % money spent in the classroom vs total. Used to be around 50% in the big city districts but haven't seen numbers lately from totally failed districts like NYC, Baltimore or WDC. For college it's exploded. I always quote the stat I heard in the whole U of CA system- more administrators than professors. Recent one was Yale has 2 administrators per student. It's all just become a Democrat slush fund and jobs program. 
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Posted: 5/20/2022 7:51:11 PM EDT
[#4]
Last time I brought up football in Texas High Schools and the tax payers cost(s), all kinds of sand was found in Texan vaginas.
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Posted: 5/20/2022 8:25:09 PM EDT
[#5]
Everyone knows the real money is in education admin, not teaching. Greatest fraud perpetrated on the public, until the 2020 election that is.
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Posted: 5/20/2022 8:29:01 PM EDT
[#6]
Without administration, who will sell the next bond issue? Someone needs to be looking at building construction and maintenance. That's different than teaching.
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Posted: 5/20/2022 8:36:37 PM EDT
[#7]
My post will get 100% ignored, but the administrative swell came from schools going from institutional models to customer support models, compounded with disability laws.
1990 Principal: "You're kid is acting like a shit, he's earned himself two days of out-of-school suspension. Come get your kid before we drop him off at the corner... *click*" 2020 Principal: "Good afternoon Mrs. Karen Fuckface, little Johnny's behavior manifestation came out during recess from being overstimulated. He bit five kids, smeared fecal matter on the walls, and hit his teacher Mrs. Grouch with a chair. We checked his IEP folder and saw he has five out of six main disabilities, plus a 504 to do 1/10th the work and given a minimum of a 50%. We have our school guidance councilor on the line for any assistance and care. Our dean is here as well to babysit your turd. This is his 3rd teacher after the previous two had mental breakdowns and resigned. We're here to kiss your ass because if you complain to anyone above us, all hell fire of retardation will fall on us all from the morons elected to our school board. Have a wonderful day!" |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 8:41:39 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My post will get 100% ignored, but the administrative swell came from schools going from institutional models to customer support models, compounded with disability laws. 1990 Principal: "You're kid is acting like a shit, he's earned himself two days of out-of-school suspension. Come get your kid before we drop him off at the corner... *click*" 2020 Principal: "Good afternoon Mrs. Karen Fuckface, little Johnny's behavior manifestation came out during recess from being overstimulated. He bit five kids, smeared fecal matter on the walls, and hit his teacher Mrs. Grouch with a chair. We checked his IEP folder and saw he has five out of six main disabilities, plus a 504 to do 1/10th the work and given a minimum of a 50%. We have our school guidance councilor on the line for any assistance and care. Our dean is here as well to babysit your turd. This is his 3rd teacher after the previous two had mental breakdowns and resigned. We're here to kiss your ass because if you complain to anyone above us, all hell fire of retardation will fall on us all from the morons elected to our school board. Have a wonderful day!" LOL. This guy speaks truth. |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 9:31:30 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Except tooth to tail is more than 1:1…..old article. My Daughter just left the NCY public school system as a teacher. She mentioned that in NYC it's almost better than 2 administrators for every teacher. I suppose that analogous to having 70 2LTs for every 35 enlisted men in an Infantry Plt. To your question OP. It's known as a jobs program that distributes tax dollars. Interpreting that article to suggest a 1:1 ratio of admin to teachers is a grossly bad interpretation. A lot of the non-teacher employees that they are referencing are not administrators. Most of them provide supporting roles- with some of them (e.g. counselors) holding certs and being covered by the teacher contract. Operational employees (food service, maintenance, etc...) are important roles and keeping those in house makes sense in a lot of districts. Other people who are really important to helping teachers provide instructional services (e.g. paraprofessionals/ teacher's aides are important for supporting small group or individualized instruction, especially for students with special needs). Admins are effectively managers, often of both students and staff. There are relatively few per building at the building level. There are district offices that sometimes seem to have disproportionate numbers which do increase the ratios- but when you break down their roles and responsibilities, you have to ask if a ratio is necessarily the best way of handling it. |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 11:21:13 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This. Used to be a lot of published data about % money spent in the classroom vs total. Used to be around 50% in the big city districts but haven't seen numbers lately from totally failed districts like NYC, Baltimore or WDC. For college it's exploded. I always quote the stat I heard in the whole U of CA system- more administrators than professors. Recent one was Yale has 2 administrators per student. It's all just become a Democrat slush fund and jobs program. |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 11:27:01 PM EDT
[#11]
There is certainly a need for a limited number of school administrators, but it is currently out of all proportion to those actually needed. Seems to be a safe almost tenured position for lazy ex-teachers.
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Posted: 5/20/2022 11:27:23 PM EDT
[#12]
Tell me you've never been an administrator or manager anywhere, without telling me you haven't been an administrator or manager anywhere ...
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Posted: 5/20/2022 11:28:07 PM EDT
[#13]
Would love to see a comparison of numbers of admins v teachers in the US versus China, Japan, Korea, UK, Poland etc
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Posted: 5/20/2022 11:28:23 PM EDT
[#14]
Boomers need jobs too.
Same argument as the work from home topic. |
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Posted: 5/20/2022 11:56:57 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My post will get 100% ignored, but the administrative swell came from schools going from institutional models to customer support models, compounded with disability laws. 1990 Principal: "You're kid is acting like a shit, he's earned himself two days of out-of-school suspension. Come get your kid before we drop him off at the corner... *click*" 2020 Principal: "Good afternoon Mrs. Karen Fuckface, little Johnny's behavior manifestation came out during recess from being overstimulated. He bit five kids, smeared fecal matter on the walls, and hit his teacher Mrs. Grouch with a chair. We checked his IEP folder and saw he has five out of six main disabilities, plus a 504 to do 1/10th the work and given a minimum of a 50%. We have our school guidance councilor on the line for any assistance and care. Our dean is here as well to babysit your turd. This is his 3rd teacher after the previous two had mental breakdowns and resigned. We're here to kiss your ass because if you complain to anyone above us, all hell fire of retardation will fall on us all from the morons elected to our school board. Have a wonderful day!" Someone has worked in the school system. For some reason, we have decided that realizing Johnny isn't the best student in math and that it's ok as long as he tries his best isn't allowed any more. Instead it's become a pony show of letting Johnny learn nothing and allow him to do corrections on his corrections until he gets an 80. So now Johnny is completely enabled and shouts about his 504 and IEP everyday just to get out of being responsible for anything. Oh and he can play on his phone if he gets anxious. It's in the 504. |
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Posted: 5/21/2022 12:28:49 AM EDT
[#16]
When I was in HS, we had 1 principal, 1 vice principal and 8 secretaries in the office (1 for each principal and vp, other 6 were for the rest of the school). Was the same in BOTH high schools. That was back in 84-87.
Now, theres a principal and 4 Asst principals in each school. And each of those positions has TWO secretaries along with about 10 other secretaries. Each asst principal is assign 1 grade. Total waste of money. |
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Posted: 5/21/2022 4:58:17 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When I was in HS, we had 1 principal, 1 vice principal and 8 secretaries in the office (1 for each principal and vp, other 6 were for the rest of the school). Was the same in BOTH high schools. That was back in 84-87. Now, theres a principal and 4 Asst principals in each school. And each of those positions has TWO secretaries along with about 10 other secretaries. Each asst principal is assign 1 grade. Total waste of money. There are probably decades of additional rules and regulations they have to follow that weren't around when you were in school. Government and laws keep expanding and so do the demands they place on everything else. I seem to remember Vice Principles being relegated to addressing student behavior problems and the actual Principle handling administrative guidance. If there are more VPs, perhaps there are move students misbehaving? |
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Posted: 5/21/2022 5:49:34 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You'd be surprised at how much admin staff there is any organization, such as police and fire departments. Things like policy, purchasing, logistics, etc, don't just happen in a vacuum. It's not as exciting the work people do on the front lines, but it needs to be done, and there's a lot more of it that the average person thinks. Pretty much this. They get paid to deal the with things I don't have to, and there's a lot of it. |
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Posted: 5/21/2022 6:25:45 AM EDT
[#19]
Imagine the utter chaos that would follow from leaderless teachers and students having at each other. There must be administrators to command, lead, and- and, where necessary, restrain their subordinates.
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Posted: 5/21/2022 6:33:06 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I live in McKinney. I was the Dad's club president for several years and worked with the PTA and other volunteer groups who raised $75k one year. I spoke with the principal about the money raised from these groups and using it to pay for another teacher or pay multiple teachers more. Instead the school used the money to buy more iPads. It boggles my mind why school districts would do that. I became a precinct chair last year and have block captains helping me reach voters in my precinct. They spend 15 minutes twice a week speak with voters or leaving information at the door. I've also volunteered for other campaigns, poll watched and spent time when I had it available. We need many more people willing to get involved. These school board trustees are insane. $75k one year. What about next year or the next or the next? |
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Posted: 5/21/2022 9:26:00 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Someone has worked in the school system. For some reason, we have decided that realizing Johnny isn't the best student in math and that it's ok as long as he tries his best isn't allowed any more. Instead it's become a pony show of letting Johnny learn nothing and allow him to do corrections on his corrections until he gets an 80. So now Johnny is completely enabled and shouts about his 504 and IEP everyday just to get out of being responsible for anything. Oh and he can play on his phone if he gets anxious. It's in the 504. Both of your posts are accurate. The definition of FAPE has become catering to every trashy parent and their bratty, entitled children. |
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Posted: 5/21/2022 10:35:40 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:  Quite the spread there Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So I have been thinking about this since I have school age kids. There is a teacher shortage in Texas. Teachers here get paid garbo and they simply cannot attract good ones anymore. If you need 5 more teachers, why would you hire or keep an administrative director that makes the equivalent of 5 teachers just to tell you that your district does not have the money for 5 more teachers. They don't add anything, they cannot fix anything since the problem they are trying to fix - they created by simply existing. Get rid of the dead weight. HR, hiring, maintenance, etc should all be privately outsourced to companies that can better keep costs down. Also - sports. Does a highschool of ~1500 kids need 36 coaches? Those coaches all make between 50% and 200% more than the average teacher. It seems to me that the future is being sacrificed on the altar so administrators and hobby level sports team coaches can collect an easy paycheck and can give each other high fives. Quite the spread there Public educated. 
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Posted: 5/21/2022 10:36:37 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When I was in HS, we had 1 principal, 1 vice principal and 8 secretaries in the office (1 for each principal and vp, other 6 were for the rest of the school). Was the same in BOTH high schools. That was back in 84-87. Now, theres a principal and 4 Asst principals in each school. And each of those positions has TWO secretaries along with about 10 other secretaries. Each asst principal is assign 1 grade. Total waste of money. There are likely substantially more legal requirements. For example, teacher evaluation and accountability laws have exponentially increased the amount of evaluative observations per teacher, which is a function that legally requires an admin. There are also a lot of legal and contractual matters involving staffing where building admin is the 1st line point. Admins are also required to be a part of an increasing number of legally mandated student functions (e.g. RTI/SRBI processes, SPED referrals, SPED and 504 meetings, disciplinary matters which will result in suspension, etc...). They are always busy- I don't envy them. |
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Posted: 5/21/2022 11:14:41 AM EDT
[#24]
The number of school administrators has gone up by a factor because computers make administration easier.
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Posted: 5/23/2022 12:17:02 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So based on 2020 undergrad numbers (4703 students), Yale has ~9400 administrators. That's some Ivy League quote there, sir. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This. Used to be a lot of published data about % money spent in the classroom vs total. Used to be around 50% in the big city districts but haven't seen numbers lately from totally failed districts like NYC, Baltimore or WDC. For college it's exploded. I always quote the stat I heard in the whole U of CA system- more administrators than professors. Recent one was Yale has 2 administrators per student. It's all just become a Democrat slush fund and jobs program. Misremembered it. More administrative employees than undergrads, so not 1:2, but more than 1:1 https://thefederalist.com/2021/11/11/yale-now-has-more-administrators-than-undergrads-thanks-to-a-mammoth-bureaucracy/ |
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