Posted: 4/26/2004 3:36:42 PM EDT
| I know that they are bad for you, but what about in moderation??? I am looking at some OTC stuff that has "anabolic" results. I am not looking to gain 100lbs or anything, I am looking to cut fat and build muscle mass. I am currently working out 4 times a week for about 1 1/2 hours a day. I am targeting specific muscle groups on each day (back, chest, arms and shoulders) working my abs every day and my legs every other day (I am only looking to tone my legs). I am losing weight, and gaining mass, but I would like to do it a bit faster. Like I said, I am not looking to be The Hulk, just build some mass faster. Any thoughts? |
| Don't screw with the OTC stuff, they are a waste of money and in most cases more expensive then the real stuff. If you are really set on trying roids then do a shit load of research and talk to some people who actually know about them and have experience. Your first cycle is the most important, don't screw it up. How old are you and how long have you been lifting? |
|
Here's a totally different approach for you: You may be overtraining. I'd try REDUCING the number of workouts you do a week. Each workout has its best effect if you've COMPLETELY recovered from the previous one. If you have ANY residual soreness left over from the previous workout, you should NOT work out again on those muscles. I work out just ONCE every TWO WEEKS, and here at the age of 38 I'm building muscle FASTER than I was able to do when I worked out 3 times a week in my early 20's. And that's with no chemical enhancements or supplements of any kind. You don't want steroids, and that's final. Even a short program of them can have long term undesirable side effects. CJ |
|
Let me tell you about roids....................................... I was on them by perscription for years in varying dosages. First they don't put muscle on you period. Without exercise they will only increase your water content. They pump up your addrenniline, give you mood swings (you will cry at ole yeller), too much and quit too soon you die, even proper dosages you lose all motivation when you come down and just want to sleep. Why do sports people like them? They are a euphoric drug. You feel you are fine when you aren't so don't feel the pain. Like most euphoric drugs they give you the munchies and you eat more. It reduces inflammation, keep in mind it doesn't prevent it and as a result makes getting better take longer. You require less sleep. You'll make this all up when you stop taking them all at once. Second biggest downer, is take them enough your teeth rot, you lose bone desnsity thus height and are more prone to breaks. Biggest downer is that you take them enough your organs can't function without them and you die a few decades too soon. Medically it's a mircle drug that awakens every organ in your body. Recreationaly anyone who takes them is a frigging fool that had just as well take a revolver and play Russian Roulette. Tj |
|
I use Universal Nutrition products. www.universalnutrition.com/enter/high_bandwidth/brands/animal/main.html I like the Animal Stak, Animal Cuts, Animal Pak, and Animal Test. Their products do not have any ill effects and are only 3 week cycles. I have been using them for over the past year or so. I have added about 30lbs of muscle and dropped about 50lbs of fat. If you buy over the net you can find good deals on supplements. These guys have good prices. www.bodybuilding.com/store/index.html Universal has added ingredients to alleviate any potential side effects, including dihydrotestosterone (DHT) blockers, estrogen blockers (anti-aromatase inhibitors), liver support nutrients (the site of prohormone conversion is the liver), and key vitamins and minerals. Since I have started taking these products I have not noticed any side effects. I work out 4 days a week on a rotation program. So each work out targets a different portion of the body. I highly suggest you stay away from illegal steroids. Not worth the long term risk or effects. You can get positive results with legal OTC supplements. |
Incorrect. Steroids were designed to increase muscle mass and rates of tissue regeneration and they work very well at it. A first-time steroid user on a heavy cycle of androgens can expect to gain anywhere from twenty to thirty pounds of mass over a twelve week period, provided they engage in a proper workout regiment and consume enough calories and protein to facilitate such growth. Even without exercise, a significant amount of muscle mass would be gained. Granted, a percentage of the weight gained in any case is due to fluid retention, but the majority of it will be lean tissue. I agree with you that it is not worth the potential health problems to gain something as trivial as an inch on your arms, or a new PR on your bench press. To state that these drugs don't work to build muscle though, is very ignorant indeed. Just out of curiousity, what type of steroid were you on, and in what dosage? |
|
If its OTC, then its not steroids. Stay away from steroids. My buddies and I did some heavy cycles when I was in college. We got big and strong. I went from 185 lbs to 225 lbs in about 3 months. My blood pressure went from normal to 220/190 at rest. Later in life you will realize it was all for nothing. The best way to cut fat and build mass is to workout harder. |
are you using any supplements now? i would definately recommend using creatine, protein, glutamine, etc... before you make the jump (and its a big one) to roids |
Anyone know if this sort of stuff happens with the type of steroids in allergy nasal sprays? like flonase, nasacort, etc.? |
|
No. Steroids are illegal and I now have cause to junk this thread. However, if I do, nobody will learn anything, except for the thread author, whom I would IM. We have a fitness forum. See my sigline. As stated above, you are likely overtraining, by a whole bunch. If you did one 1.5 hour workout per week, you probably would start showing gains again. Also, make sure you are feeding your muscles what they need: one gram of protein per pound of bodyweight per day. Protein bars and shakes (even though somebody recommended against them the other day) help a lot with getting protein. I've even seen opinions that suggest that creatine doesn't do much but add water mass. I am not entirely sure if that is bad or not, since I know that muscles need water to grow. Again, Steroids are illegal, and you need to adjust your workout and diet, not add illegal substances which will give you manboobs, zits and turn you into an emotional wreck. |
The nasal sprays (such as flonase) contain various types of corticosteroids, which act mainly as anti-inflammatory agents. They are an entirely different class of drugs from the anabolic steroids that athletes take for ergogenic effects. Actually, the side effects from the corticosteroids can be much more severe, but since so little of the drug is actually absorbed into the bloodstream with intranasal use, it usually doesn't cause any problems. |
|
PM me for any info. www.elitefitness.com/forum/index.php NO, they aren't bad for you in moderation. I've done about 5 cycles with doctor supervision. I went from 180 and 16%BF to 220 at 11%BF over about 4 years. I don't do them anymore, but they have it down to an art now days. If you do it "right" which means getting bloodwork done before and after, aren't at any risk. OTC crap is just as bad for you as the real thing. If you are going to supress your bodys natural test production is really doesn't matter hom much you replace it with. Actually they can hurt you. Here is how, You body produces natural test and when it detects a higher amount is will gradually shut down its production. You can actually lower the amount of test in you body to lower then when you started. That is why I say if you decide to do it do the real thing. Read up on it at the board I gave you and make your own decision. I researched it for a whole year before I took the plunge. Talk with a sports doc and tell him you are considering using steroids and you want his opinion. I told my doc and he ran my liver values, free test vs. bound test, etc.. There are safe "fool proof" ways to using steroids now. It is illegal though, but there are legal ways around this also which I will be glad to help you with if you decide you want more info PM me or ask on elitefitness, they will be glad to help |
I am not and would never be interested in the illegal steriods. I am/was mostly concerned with the "anabolic" type LEGAL OTC stuff. There seems to be so many negatives, I will just stay the course and continue with the other suppliments (protein and glutamine). DF, I promise I was NOT looking for illegal advise for illegal products. |
| Stay away from the OTC crap. Protein 50 grams every two hours switch your routine up. Train one muscle group a day, take days off! Make sure you are doing compound movements like bench, deads, squat. Check out the training board over at www.elitefitness.com it is a great place to learn. |
| 1-AD or 1-AD Extreme. Pro-hormone OTC. Put on 15 lbs of solid mass in 6 weeks without changing my workout routine and no water retention. Lifts are stronger all around. Definitely feel a difference in the pump at the gym. Cycle for 6 weeks on and then 6 weeks off. Its only been 4 weeks off for me, yet I have not lost a pound. |
|
Keep Away... As someone who is prescribed them, I strongly recommend against them. I try hard to only take them if it's an emergency. The warnings posted above are pretty accurate. If you want muscle mass, WORK OUT HARDER; Eat more meat & calories if necessary, but just exercise/work out harder. It's the best way, and maybe the only healthy way. Good luck, and don't take any steroids. Trust the advice here... Only take them if your doctor says they're necessary to keep you alive. -inuhbad |
Well clinically you are right but percentage wise to gain significant muscle gain without exercise you would be one fat person. I've been on about every steroid out there at various levels from low dose predisone to intravenious hydracoritzone. Longterm from levels of up to 60 mg a day to as low as 5 mg a day for say seven years. This isn't something I read in a book but lived. The worst part of it is like all drugs you will love it while it slowly kills you. Tj |
|
Well then, allow me to retort... If you feel the need to escape from who/what you think you are (and that is, not being muscular enough) - why not try pot? Don't kid yourself - these things you're looking for are drugs. Safer than sticking needles in your ass and probably cheaper to get (no internet relationship with an Arizona pusher employing a team of Juarez mules to risk establishing) – with pot, you won’t wake up one morning in 20 years with a big old set of titties. Oh, sure you can use Andro safely (look at Barry Bonds), but the results will not be permanent – in fact they may even induce severe depression – where as with pot – even though you're not increasing your set weight – you won’t be decreasing it when you're off your cycle (and getting all pissed off at everybody in sight because of it). There's all kinds of discussion forums out there with tons of info on Andro - check them out. It's realy sad to read about some 17 year old kid fucking up his body for life - but what the hell - he looked good for his trip to Spring Break. |
| steroids are a lot safer these days, but so is cocaine. don't use them, you're only cheating yourself. get a jug of protein and creatine if you're really serious. to help your joints recover, buy some glutomine(sic). your neighborhood supplement dealer will know what you're talking about. eat every 3 hours. it's simple. |
|
If you're looking for OTC products to accelerate your gains, you might want to look at creatine, HMB and protein supplements. Everything else is garbage. There is no such thing as an effective OTC steroid. All the precurser stuff you see being marketed is crap. Lots of good info on creatine out there, it appears to reduce refractory time between sets and helps gains in lean mass. HMB appears to reduce catobolism, mitigating muscle destruction during heavy training. Getting enough protein during heavy gain cycles is difficult, but a good whey isolate protein supplement makes it easier. With any of these, increase your water intake considerably. Good sleep is also a must. |
|
Back when I used to lift weights and be in exceptional shape I took creatine after I platued. I did cycle off of it every 3 weeks and take a week off so my body wouldn't build up an immunity to it. It worked great, it allows you to do more work and allows your muscles to absorb more water. If you have't already used creatine, I recommend it. (if you have hit a plateu) On a side note, my work out partner started using Androstendione because he felt the creatine wasn't enough. He didn't get much stronger but he did break out in these disgusting oozing zits all over his back and he was always getting pissed off at stupid stuff. Those are my experiences with work out supplements and you can see what I would avoid if I were you. Steroids have a bad rap and rightfully so in my opinion. It is nasty stuff that will give you a short term gain and long term problems. When you are a grand dad do you really think you are going to give a shit how buff you were when you were a kid???? Or do you want to be around for as long as you can and in the best health you can?? Think about it. |
You are confusing two entirely different classes of drugs. prednisone is a derivative of cortisol (AKA hydrocortisone), which is a stress hormone produced in the adrenal glands. These drugs act primarily as anti-inflammatories, and thus are often prescribed for a myriad of conditions including asthma, severe allergies, arthritis, and some skin disorders. The corticosteroids are most certainly NOT performance enhancing, as they have a marked catabolic action and therefore tend to break down muscle mass. Anabolic steroids (such as oxandrolone, fluoxymesterone, oxymetholone, etc...), are derivatives of testosterone, a gonadal hormone responsible for the development of secondary sex characteristics in males. These are the types of steroids that athletes take for their ergogenic effects. They are rarely prescribed to patients except in cases of severe muscle wasting brought on by diseases such as AIDS, or as hormone replacement in hypogonadal males. It is very common for people to confuse these two types of drugs, since they are both typically referred to as "steroids". However, the differences between them in their effects on the human body are like night and day. Again, I'm not saying that anabolic steroids are safe, or that I approve of their recreational use. I just don't like to see misinformation being spread around. |