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Posted: 12/17/2003 11:43:05 PM EDT
Israel's army phases out Uzi submachine gun

JERUSALEM (AP) --Israel's military is phasing out the legendary Uzi submachine gun, calling it antiquated and replacing it with more sophisticated, electronics-outfitted weaponry, an army spokesman said Wednesday.

But the Uzi, a national icon and the country's most famous contribution to the arms industry, will still be produced and exported, to the presumable delight of drug dealers, gang members, Secret Service agents and Hollywood action stars alike.

Israel's military took the simply constructed, half-century-old weapon out of front line units two decades ago, but continued to issue it to some elite units and soldiers carrying heavy gear who needed a light weapon for self-defense.

Now the army says it will dump it altogether.

As of this week, "we're no longer training soldiers on the Uzi," said army spokesman Capt. Jacob Dallal. "Basically, it's antiquated," he said of the 9-mm weapon.

State-owned Israel Military Industries has made over 1.5 million Uzis and will continue manufacturing the weapon, which has earned hundreds of millions of dollars from sales the world over, including in the United States, Latin America and Africa.

Illegal arms sales have also put the weapon into the hands of Colombian drug lords.

In Israel, the weapon's smaller models are still popular with security guards who favor portability over accuracy. Many private security companies use the original, larger model because it's cheap.

It's also still a mainstay with some of the world's police forces and security services guarding VIPs, said Yiftah Shapir of the Jaffee Center for Strategic Studies at Tel Aviv University.

The Uzi, while still used by the U.S. Secret Service, is also beloved of gangs in the United States because of its reputation as "a macho weapon," said gun expert Tim Brown of Globalsecurity.org. But he added the Uzi "is not a very good gun -- it's very inefficient, inaccurate. ... It's mostly used in bad Hollywood action movies."

In 1984's "The Terminator," for example, a gun shop owner commends Arnold Schwarzenegger's cyborg for ordering the "Uzi nine millimeter" before his murderous rampage.

Whatever its qualities as a weapon, the Uzi arouses nostalgia and pride in Israel, where it was developed around the same time as the country's war-rattled birth in 1948.

"It was the first Israeli weapon after 2,000 years of diaspora," Shapir said. Recalling his own days in the military in the late 1960s, he added, "I can still disassemble an Uzi with my eyes closed, hands tied behind my back, even if you wake me in the middle of the night."

Elite Israeli fighting units found it useful because of its resistance to mud and water, giving the weapon a further mystique -- and marketing cachet.

The Uzi again made headlines when the weapon's creator, Uzi Gal, 79, died in September 2002.

At 15, Gal developed a bow that could automatically fire arrows, and later he secretly made weapons in a metal workshop for the Jewish underground. When the first Arab-Israeli war erupted in 1948, he was asked to develop a submachine gun for Israel's army, which faced weapons embargoes and had little cash.

The Uzi first found its way into soldiers' hands in 1954, and it swiftly proved its deadly effectiveness two years later in the Sinai campaign against Egypt.

Among various models are Uzi Carbine, with a long barrel, the Micro-Uzi, which is smaller, and the Uzi Pistol, a semiautomatic weapon slightly larger than a regular handgun and weighing less than 4 pounds.

The Uzi -- whose modified single-shot pistol version can be bought for some $500 in the United States -- is one of the most copied weapons in the world, with knockoffs produced in China and several eastern European countries, according to Israeli media reports.

Through its long years of service in the Israeli military, soldiers revered it for its hardiness and ease of operation -- but at the same time lamented its limited range and disturbing tendency to fire itself when dropped or struck. Its short barrel gave it an accurate range of just 50 yards.

The weapon was taken out of use by front line units in Israel in the early 1980s. It was replaced with standard and short versions of the American-made M-16, which can accurately hit a target at 1,000 yards.

This year, Israel announced the development of the Tavor, a new, compact assault rifle to be issued to soldiers starting in January. The rifle comes in three designs: a basic assault rifle, a sharp-shooting model and a shorter version for commandos and paratroopers that is useful in urban warfare.

The Tavor, like the Uzi, is small enough to be useful in street combat, but it can also be outfitted with high-tech electronics, such as sights that can provide real-time data on targets a soldier might not be able to see with his own eyes.

The simple Uzi, by comparison, is greatly outdated, Shapir said.

"Just a few pieces of metal, one spring, and that's it."

www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/12/17/israel.obsolete.uzi.ap/index.html
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 12:06:06 AM EDT
Originally Posted By raven: to the presumable delight of drug dealers, gang members, Secret Service agents and Hollywood action stars alike.
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[V]
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 12:17:26 AM EDT
I've seen it shot and I was surprised at it's accuracy. but then again it wasn't more then 50 yards. If I had a choice though, I guess I'd go for the MP5 over an UZI.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 12:19:04 AM EDT
Maybe out of full time army forces. But I know for a fact the UZI will see heavy use with reserve, settlement militia and army truck/mobli driver units. Hell, I have seen some reserve police officers still use the M1 Carbine there!
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 12:37:23 AM EDT
The Mini-Uzi is still and will continue to be used by Israeli SF "Operators".
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 12:39:49 AM EDT
Originally Posted By osprey21: The Mini-Uzi is still and will continue to be used by Israeli SF "Operators".
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Good point, I'll try to dig up a recent pic..
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 1:26:19 AM EDT
Obviously that reporter has never used an Uzi. I used a 50's era import Uzi and it was accurate @200yrds (even on F/A). My choices for a 9mm SMG 1} H&K MP5A1 2} Beretta M12 3} Uzi (with original wood stock) 4} Walther MPL / MPK 5} Colt M16/9mm 6} MAC M10/9mm ( the fire hose )
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 2:11:51 AM EDT
There are many people "accurate out to 1000 yards" with an M-16 either. The writer is a loser.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 2:34:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/18/2003 2:49:32 AM EDT by Wildweasel]
Lightwieght and Uzi In the same sentance? Not . 10.5 lbs is not light for a subgun. <-----see avitar
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 2:47:52 AM EDT
Where can I get a $500 Uzi?
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 2:54:08 AM EDT
I swear Uzi's are made out of lead. When I think of a heavy weapon, I think of Uzi and BAR.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 3:03:20 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Oslow: Where can I get a $500 Uzi?
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I would buy one too. You have to figure that is one of the most famous guns of the 20th century.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 3:46:06 AM EDT
I'll take an UZI over an MP5...I like the weighty feel of the Uzi with the wood stock.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 3:52:07 AM EDT
I've had to qualify with one of those stamped-metal POS's and they scare the shit out of me. They're almost as dangerous standing behind it as in front of it. Give me an MP5 or an M4 anyday.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 4:03:13 AM EDT
Originally Posted By pale_pony:
They're almost as dangerous standing behind it as in front of it.
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Care to qualify that statment ?
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 4:15:54 AM EDT
I am not an Uzi expert, although I have owned a Norinco copy, but this article is filled with inaccuracies, not to mention over-the-top ridiculous statements. M-16 accurate to 1000 yards? Gangbangers and drug dealers were delighted to read in 'Internation Illegal Arms Sales Monthly' that the Uzi will still be produced and imported? Sights that provide real time data? Like, what, besides an image of the target? Uzi is very inefficient and inaccurate? This article is as poorly written and researched as any I have ever seen.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 4:28:34 AM EDT
From my experience, I like the fact that the Israeli Uzi is heavy, providing to me at least better control when firing at full-auto over the MP5. The MP5's front section is much lighter than the Uzi, I noticed the groupings using an MP5 on full-auto are a bit scattered on the target paper.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 4:35:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By sherrick13: There are many people "accurate out to 1000 yards" with an M-16 either. The writer is a loser.
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Damn!!! You beat me to it! "...1000 yards"????? WTF?
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 4:35:35 AM EDT
It wasn't the CNN reporter who said the UZI was inaccurate and inefficient, it was that idiot Tim Brown of Globalsecurity.org. Here is a link to his bio: http://www.globalsecurity.org/org/staff/brown.htm Note that actual military experience, and I presume weapon handling experience too, is absent from his write up. Its interesting that many of these alleged security experts, either have no hands on experience or word their experience so vaguely that anything is possible.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 4:39:14 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 4:57:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/18/2003 5:06:39 AM EDT by StariVojnik]
She looks like she's having a little difficulty.... [img]http://www.gulfcoastarmory.com/shoots/10-24-99/sb-mp5.jpg[/img] LOL! This one's even better...HA! [b]The UZI stock should give her a great case of TMJ!!! [/b] [img]http://www.gulfcoastarmory.com/shoots/10-24-99/sb-uzi.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 5:13:11 AM EDT
Originally Posted By AvengeR15: Sights that provide real time data? Like, what, besides an image of the target?
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It'll be a modified EOTech that flashes a cartoon-style sound bubble reading "BANG!" as each round is fired.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 5:20:46 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ProfGAB101: Obviously that reporter has never used an Uzi. I used a 50's era import Uzi and it was accurate @200yrds (even on F/A). My choices for a 9mm SMG 1} H&K MP5A1 2} Beretta M12 3} Uzi (with original wood stock) 4} Walther MPL / MPK 5} Colt M16/9mm 6} MAC M10/9mm ( the fire hose )
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I would think a Sites Spectre would rate rather high on the list. I have experience with the handgun model, and believe that the SMG would be awesome.
Link Posted: 12/18/2003 6:23:13 AM EDT
btt
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