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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:13:18 PM EDT
[#1]
2 different DPMS AP4 rail heights:
LR-308 rail height (called a "Low Profile" for more clarity): 
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:14:17 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I went looking for those myself when I got called out and realized that they were gone. Looks like ArmaLite has a different master these days. I've always wondered why they changed the thread pattern on their uppers which makes them incompatible with KAC rails unfortunately. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Looks like they pulled their tech notes, which were one of the few in the industry that were actually useful: ArmaLite Tech Notes gone from new site I went looking for those myself when I got called out and realized that they were gone. Looks like ArmaLite has a different master these days. I've always wondered why they changed the thread pattern on their uppers which makes them incompatible with KAC rails unfortunately. Probably to avoid potential patent infringement, and making customers come to them for handguards. |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:17:17 PM EDT
[#3]
I own a Noveke N6 lower, it is the same as the Eagle Arms one I owned in 2010ish.
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:34:33 PM EDT
[#4]
If you are looking for a budget AR10... look at the DPMS rifles.
I bought this one on black Friday for $689. Magpul mags are easily found for it and are relatively cheap. Swapped on a set of M4 handguards, hogue grip and Magpul stock. Already picking up spare parts and started the Form1 to make it into a 11.5" SBR. 
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:35:22 PM EDT
[#5]
Pardon my ignorance, but what's so special about the G2?
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:45:22 PM EDT
[#6]
Rail height difference doesn't seem like a big deal. Just make sure you have the corresponding rail height handguard to match up.
If doing a LR308 patter gun, the rules of thumb: -Get an upper and lower of the same make. -Get a barrel and bolt of the same make. -If you have a DPMS high pattern upper, get high pattern handguard rail. If low, then get low. -Get a DPMS .308 barrel nut -Use either a 7" AR-15 receiver extension, a .308 carbine buffer (it's shorter than an AR15 carbine buffer) and .308 carbine buffer spring. Or use a 7-3/4" AR10 carbine receiver extension or VLTOR A5 RE (also 7-3/4) and then you can use any AR15 carbine buffer (i.e. H, H2, H3) with an AR10 buffer spring. -Buy LR308/SR25 mags and ammo. -Go shoot |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:46:19 PM EDT
[#7]
Looks like buying a Scar-H is the easy answer here, or am I wrong? I have not plunged into the 308 building phase yet. Which way id the correct way, looking into the future?
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:51:36 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Rail height difference doesn't seem like a big deal. Just make sure you have the corresponding rail height handguard to match up. If doing a LR308 patter gun, the rules of thumb: -Get an upper and lower of the same make. -Get a barrel and bolt of the same make. -If you have a DPMS high pattern upper, get high pattern handguard rail. If low, then get low. -Get a DPMS .308 barrel nut -Use either a 7" AR-15 receiver extension, a .308 carbine buffer (it's shorter than an AR15 carbine buffer) and .308 carbine buffer spring. Or use a 7-3/4" AR10 carbine receiver extension or VLTOR A5 RE (also 7-3/4) and then you can use any AR15 carbine buffer (i.e. H, H2, H3) with an AR10 buffer spring. -Buy LR308/SR25 mags and ammo. -Go shoot Also to note: The DPMS LR308 carbine uses the exact same gas tube as the AR15 carbine. I just had mine apart a few nights ago and confirmed it as fact. |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:52:36 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Probably to avoid potential patent infringement, and making customers come to them for handguards. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Looks like they pulled their tech notes, which were one of the few in the industry that were actually useful: ArmaLite Tech Notes gone from new site I went looking for those myself when I got called out and realized that they were gone. Looks like ArmaLite has a different master these days. I've always wondered why they changed the thread pattern on their uppers which makes them incompatible with KAC rails unfortunately. Probably to avoid potential patent infringement, and making customers come to them for handguards. It's been a long time but I don't remember them having their own in the early days. 10 years ago when I bought my first ArmaLite this was a lot easier to keep sorted out. Now I just stick to KAC; can't go wrong there. |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 7:54:23 PM EDT
[#10]
interesting thread
however the lack of uniformity has always been why I have not yet decided to jump into the AR10 platform |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 8:08:44 PM EDT
[#11]
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Gas tubes are also different lengths. Pin diameters for the Take Down and Pivot pins are different diameters and lengths. Bolt carrier rails are different lengths, so when you think you got a "DPMS-compatible" BCG from XYZ parts.com, the bottom rail slams into your lower receiver even when you use the "correct length" buffer. Muzzle threads are all over the map. KAC uses 3/4x24. ArmaLite Inc. and DPMS use 5/8x24. Bolt catches vary in dimensions. Bolt lug lengths and face depths vary all over the place. Upper receiver barrel nut threads are different between the main companies, no telling what the after-market is doing. Extension tube lengths and buffer lengths are different. Gas ports are located and cut differently, most not with any understanding of .308 pressure curve and case volume. Firing pin apertures in the bolts and firing pin heads vary in diameter, to the extent that many will cause cratering even at normal working pressures when you shoot 175gr and up. Every time I see someone say, "Just build your own, it's easy." I chuckle, because while it may be like assembling an AR15, reliability is rarely there for the home-builder with all these parts coming from different sources, many of whom have never designed and tested a rifle themselves. That makes me glad I didn't buy one. I like to change stuff and it sounds like I would be happier with a rifle that all the parts are indeed standard. |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 8:18:33 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Also to note: The DPMS LR308 carbine uses the exact same gas tube as the AR15 carbine. I just had mine apart a few nights ago and confirmed it as fact. Yeah everything else except the muzzle device is the same for an AR 15. Same LPK, same gas tubes, same gas blocks. The muzzle device must be .308 size threaded for 5/8x24 ETA - My bad. LPK bolt catch is .308 specific. So get a .308 LPK which has the correct bolt catch. Maybe the mag catch is specific too. |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 8:24:37 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you are looking for a budget AR10... look at the DPMS rifles. I bought this one on black Friday for $689. Magpul mags are easily found for it and are relatively cheap. Swapped on a set of M4 handguards, hogue grip and Magpul stock. Already picking up spare parts and started the Form1 to make it into a 11.5" SBR. http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r504/yullose/DSC00592_zpslucdm3dt.jpg Carbine-Length Gas System + .308 Winchester pressures and case volume....check 16" barrel dwell time...check Add a suppressor....check Topped with Barska....check What could go wrong? FTFeed, bolt over base, stove pipe Reitcle canted after a few mags, windage backlash |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 8:28:24 PM EDT
[#14]
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Pardon my ignorance, but what's so special about the G2? Like the Colt 901, it has a smaller receiver set that feels more like an AR15 versus the aluminum bricks that the SR25, ArmaLites, and LR-308s are made from. The GII bolt carrier is AR15 diameter, but with a larger bolt for the .308 Win. The new POF Revolution is even smaller-actually an AR15 chambered in .308 Winchester that works. MGI tried it many years ago and gave up due to reliability issues, as well the headspace giving out early. 
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Posted: 1/31/2017 8:32:48 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Rail height difference doesn't seem like a big deal. Just make sure you have the corresponding rail height handguard to match up. If doing a LR308 patter gun, the rules of thumb: -Get an upper and lower of the same make. -Get a barrel and bolt of the same make. -If you have a DPMS high pattern upper, get high pattern handguard rail. If low, then get low. -Get a DPMS .308 barrel nut -Use either a 7" AR-15 receiver extension, a .308 carbine buffer (it's shorter than an AR15 carbine buffer) and .308 carbine buffer spring. Or use a 7-3/4" AR10 carbine receiver extension or VLTOR A5 RE (also 7-3/4) and then you can use any AR15 carbine buffer (i.e. H, H2, H3) with an AR10 buffer spring. -Buy LR308/SR25 mags and ammo. -Go shoot You might also consider the port location, port diameter, spring quality of ejector, extractor, and recoil springs, correct pins, etc. Bolt carrier group parts are all over the map in regards to quality, tempering, and critical dimensions. There is a lot more to it than that. If KAC couldn't get their rifles to be as reliable as they wanted until about 25 years of testing and evaluation, what chance does the home builder have with 92% likelihood of public schooling background, no understanding of materials science, no understanding of gas dynamics, inertia, conservation of energy, momentum, elasticity modulus, coefficient of friction, or coefficient of thermal expansion? |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 8:34:03 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's been a long time but I don't remember them having their own in the early days. 10 years ago when I bought my first ArmaLite this was a lot easier to keep sorted out. Now I just stick to KAC; can't go wrong there. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Looks like they pulled their tech notes, which were one of the few in the industry that were actually useful: ArmaLite Tech Notes gone from new site I went looking for those myself when I got called out and realized that they were gone. Looks like ArmaLite has a different master these days. I've always wondered why they changed the thread pattern on their uppers which makes them incompatible with KAC rails unfortunately. Probably to avoid potential patent infringement, and making customers come to them for handguards. It's been a long time but I don't remember them having their own in the early days. 10 years ago when I bought my first ArmaLite this was a lot easier to keep sorted out. Now I just stick to KAC; can't go wrong there. They had an aluminum knurled float tube, as well as the carbon fiber tubes. My first was the black aluminum tube on my AR10T 24" 1/3 MOA tack driver, 10rds of FGMM into an inch at 300yds. |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 9:07:31 PM EDT
[#17]
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Posted: 1/31/2017 9:28:30 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
interesting thread however the lack of uniformity has always been why I have not yet decided to jump into the AR10 platform I never understood that mentality. The main guns are built in quantities that have aftermarket support. I have a older AR10 from right before the ban lifted and I've always been able to find what I wanted. The LR308 was probably made in the highest quantities if I were to guess and the G2 will probably be the same way. Just pick one and go for it. All it takes is a small bit of research and you can be out and shooting. |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 9:30:40 PM EDT
[#19]
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So just to be clear here are some of the things that vary between all of the manufacturers: SR-25 length RE or AR15 w/shorty buffer or other (proprietary) Different threading patterns on upper receiver Several different BCG styles Not all uppers mate with all lowers depending on how they are contoured at the rear There is no standard barrel extension KAC SR-25 LMT MWS LaRue OBR ArmaLite AR-10 DPMS LR308 and GII Daniel Defense S&W M&P 10 RRA CMMG This is just off the top of my head--there are more. Tell me which two of those are of the same pattern and fully interchange? Exactly. Wayyyy more than 2-3 platforms. The cmmg and LR308 might interchange but that's just a guess. I too wish everyone would have just picked a platform and gone with it but we still have a hell of a market as is. |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 9:35:49 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Carbine-Length Gas System + .308 Winchester pressures and case volume....check 16" barrel dwell time...check Add a suppressor....check Topped with Barska....check What could go wrong? FTFeed, bolt over base, stove pipe Reitcle canted after a few mags, windage backlash Until I join a range here in my AO... and put .308 specific optics on it... and adjustable gas block... and 11.5" barrel... it's more than adequate to shoot subsonics in the backyard. The can and cheap optic works fine for that. I've also done the 07FFL/02SOT thing a few years... built a few machineguns... and even did some detailed troubleshooting and diagnostic work on a problematic NIB Armalite AR10 10-15 years ago. The findings were forwarded to Mark Westrom. You know who he is ? IIRC, he even chimed in here at Arfcom re the issue. He thanked me for the helpful info and I have no doubt it played a part in fixing some bugs back then. So... this is not my first rodeo... but I appreciate your concern. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cNi3MVwc5o&feature=youtu.be |
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Posted: 1/31/2017 9:59:40 PM EDT
[#21]
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Coming in late to this subject (and thoroughly confused), are there basically three /308 battle rifles on the civilian market today? The M1A, FAL, AR-10 (and variants of those rifles)? And the AR-15 is a scaled down carbine version of the AR-10 chambered in 5.56. Is that about right? AR-15 is derived and scaled down from the original AR-10, as I understand it. Modern "AR-10" rifles are a variety of competing efforts to scale the AR-15 up as opposed to copying or starting off from the AR-10 proper. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 12:50:19 AM EDT
[#22]
Very interesting discussion. Ready to learn more.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 1:25:12 AM EDT
[#23]
So, I'm about to take the plunge into the .308 AR world. My plan was to stick with Mega (at least for the receivers) as they seem to be some of the least problematic in my research.
Looking at their site, it appears the MATEN-SF is only being advertised as a complete rifle at this point. Does anyone know if they're going to be offering components individually? Or is that unknown yet? ETA: @LRRPF52 If you were going to build a .308 AR at this point in time, what route would you take? Are there any manufacturers that pay more attention to getting things in spec/do more testing (at least to the point where reliability isn't as large of a concern)? Would you even build one at all? My original plan was to go with the Mega MATEN (with one of the MML uppers that includes their handguards) and probably a Rainier barrel/BCG. Do you think I'll run into too many issues going this route? |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 1:55:18 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So, I'm about to take the plunge into the .308 AR world. My plan was to stick with Mega (at least for the receivers) as they seem to be some of the least problematic in my research. Looking at their site, it appears the MATEN-SF is only being advertised as a complete rifle at this point. Does anyone know if they're going to be offering components individually? Or is that unknown yet? ETA: @LRRPF52 If you were going to build a .308 AR at this point in time, what route would you take? Are there any manufacturers that pay more attention to getting things in spec/do more testing (at least to the point where reliability isn't as large of a concern)? Would you even build one at all? My original plan was to go with the Mega MATEN (with one of the MML uppers that includes their handguards) and probably a Rainier barrel/BCG. Do you think I'll run into too many issues going this route? For starters, I would not build a .308 Win. I have owned 3 different AR10s/LR-308s, to include going the custom route, but .308 is obsolete and has been for a while. If you are going to build a large frame, I would use the 2A Xanthos receiver set, their BCG, and a 6.5 Creedmoor barrel. For the larger guns, I'm at the point where I just recommend getting a factory rifle from one of the precious few reputable manufacturers. Right now, there are no small frame kits available, so I would look to someone who makes a good small frame gun and pay whatever it costs, with the most features you are looking for. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 2:33:48 AM EDT
[#25]
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For starters, I would not build a .308 Win. I have owned 3 different AR10s/LR-308s, to include going the custom route, but .308 is obsolete and has been for a while. If you are going to build a large frame, I would use the 2A Xanthos receiver set, their BCG, and a 6.5 Creedmoor barrel. For the larger guns, I'm at the point where I just recommend getting a factory rifle from one of the precious few reputable manufacturers. Right now, there are no small frame kits available, so I would look to someone who makes a good small frame gun and pay whatever it costs, with the most features you are looking for. On that note, have you had any experience with the Noveski N6 switchblock version? I know their 5.56 offerings are top shelf but that doesn't necessarily translate to other products when a company tries something ETA: Ok, so the N6 variant isn't quite new for them but it seems the last time they produced it it was only for a couple of years and that was nearly a decade ago, so I'm curious if their rifle had issues they couldn't sort out. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 3:16:52 AM EDT
[#26]
The only slight downside to my Armalite AR10 is that it doesn't take Pmags
AR10 (modified M14) mags are hard to source here |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 8:39:36 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The only slight downside to my Armalite AR10 is that it doesn't take Pmags AR10 (modified M14) mags are hard to source here My Armalite takes PMAGS, and brownells 
http://grabagun.com/armalite-armalite-defender-10-308win.html https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/93834/Firearms/Rifles/Armalite/ARML+DEF10+DEFENDER+10+308+BLK http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/308-ar-20-round-magazine-prod71942.aspx 
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Posted: 2/1/2017 8:54:40 AM EDT
[#28]
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:28:17 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Er, the AR-10A's been out for a few years now, lad. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:52:28 AM EDT
[#30]
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AR10 comes in an A & B models. The A model accept sr25 pattern mags including pmags. Don't be afraid. Ask a lot of questions before you buy. Personally for a budget gun I'd buy a Palmetto. For better quality, an Armalite def10 A model. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 12:31:57 PM EDT
[#31]
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Er, the AR-10A's been out for a few years now, lad. Yes I know.....still doesn't help me Not a huge deal though :-) |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 12:54:11 PM EDT
[#32]
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yes I wish there was an AR10 version of "The Chart" Not sure if serious... |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 1:01:56 PM EDT
[#33]
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Not sure if serious... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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yes I wish there was an AR10 version of "The Chart" Not sure if serious... It would look like a Pentagon powerpoint presentation. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 1:05:22 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
On that note, have you had any experience with the Noveski N6 switchblock version? I know their 5.56 offerings are top shelf but that doesn't necessarily translate to other products when a company tries something ETA: Ok, so the N6 variant isn't quite new for them but it seems the last time they produced it it was only for a couple of years and that was nearly a decade ago, so I'm curious if their rifle had issues they couldn't sort out. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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For starters, I would not build a .308 Win. I have owned 3 different AR10s/LR-308s, to include going the custom route, but .308 is obsolete and has been for a while. If you are going to build a large frame, I would use the 2A Xanthos receiver set, their BCG, and a 6.5 Creedmoor barrel. For the larger guns, I'm at the point where I just recommend getting a factory rifle from one of the precious few reputable manufacturers. Right now, there are no small frame kits available, so I would look to someone who makes a good small frame gun and pay whatever it costs, with the most features you are looking for. On that note, have you had any experience with the Noveski N6 switchblock version? I know their 5.56 offerings are top shelf but that doesn't necessarily translate to other products when a company tries something ETA: Ok, so the N6 variant isn't quite new for them but it seems the last time they produced it it was only for a couple of years and that was nearly a decade ago, so I'm curious if their rifle had issues they couldn't sort out. I haven't seen much of anything forward-thinking from them since John crashed and died. Any time I see a massive receiver set on AR10s, I think about how much they weigh and throw the center of balance off the rifle. The only ones I have felt recently that don't to this are the 2A Xanthos set, which are phenomenal. I would love to see them make a Small Frame receiver set with their own BCG with integral adjustable gas like they have. Their 6.5 Creedmoor felt like a paper toy at SHOT. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 1:10:00 PM EDT
[#35]
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Er, the AR-10A's been out for a few years now, lad. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Er, the AR-10A's been out for a few years now, lad. The mag issue is overblown, just go buy some. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 1:51:28 PM EDT
[#36]
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I don't mind my B's. The mag issue is overblown, just go buy some. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Er, the AR-10A's been out for a few years now, lad. The mag issue is overblown, just go buy some. Not many AR10 shops in London you know 
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Posted: 2/1/2017 1:56:21 PM EDT
[#37]
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Not many AR10 shops in London you know Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Er, the AR-10A's been out for a few years now, lad. The mag issue is overblown, just go buy some. Not many AR10 shops in London you know |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 2:00:23 PM EDT
[#38]
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Not many AR10 shops in London you know Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Er, the AR-10A's been out for a few years now, lad. The mag issue is overblown, just go buy some. Not many AR10 shops in London you know 7.62 *51 land is no place for cheapskates. The extra cost of an Armalite mag over a pmag can be less than one mag worth of ammo. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 2:00:30 PM EDT
[#39]
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Can you bend your own or is that illegal? Not illegal at all, but if I could find them I'd like some of the 25 rounders for mag resting |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 2:02:10 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This comment was more directed at the inevitable "proprietary mag" comment. 7.62 *51 land is no place for cheapskates. The extra cost of an Armalite mag over a pmag can be less than one mag worth of ammo. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Er, the AR-10A's been out for a few years now, lad. The mag issue is overblown, just go buy some. Not many AR10 shops in London you know 7.62 *51 land is no place for cheapskates. The extra cost of an Armalite mag over a pmag can be less than one mag worth of ammo. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 2:11:21 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not illegal at all, but if I could find them I'd like some of the 25 rounders for mag resting Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Can you bend your own or is that illegal? Not illegal at all, but if I could find them I'd like some of the 25 rounders for mag resting Well then: This link: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1960908_Why-doesn-t-the-AR-10-have-the-same-industry-standard-.html#i64417352 leads you to this link: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/669426_-308-AR-magazine-compatibility.html Original AR-10 (waffle type, also Magpul, et al) magazines:
Armalite AR-10B (modified) Which leads you to this link: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/378850_AR10_FAQ_and_information_Small_Update_2012.html 29 Will Magpul mags work in the AR10?
YES in the AR10A released in 2012 Kindof in the AR10B. Although they were not designed for the AR10, they can be made to work in th AR10B. I'm not saying they should, just saying they can. To make them work you have to cut (dremmel) the front/top of the mag so it will sit high enough to feed. You will be removing material to get around the mag stop shelf that the AR-10 upper has. You must also sand the sides/front and back so that it will fit the magwell. It can be done and they will work, but at a price. After modding one, I found the plastic too thin to be field worthy, Removing material in a heavy mag is a bad idea if you want to depend on them. While the PMAGS are defiantly great mags, I cannot justify moving away from a reliable steel Gen 2 mag. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 2:41:11 PM EDT
[#42]
I was very hesitant to step into the 308 AR game.
AIM surplus pushed me over the edge by offering the Alexandria Pro Fab complete 18" upper and stripped lower. They are DPMS compatible and a great value if you want a free float rifle as opposed to the DPMS entry level with plastic handguards. I added a CMC trigger from DSG that came with a parts kit. Grabbed some DPMS style take down pins from fleebay to replace the AR-15 ones in the kit. I opted for an A2 stock to balance the rifle out as a collapsible left it very front heavy especially with the can. Complete upper $460 Lower $120 CMC LPK $170 Used A2 $30 Pins $10 308 buffer/ spring $30 $820 The rifle has shot great from day one but was over gassed even unsupressed. I have just added an adjustable gas block and it has helped immensely.  Attached File |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 2:43:44 PM EDT
[#43]
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Well then: This link: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1960908_Why-doesn-t-the-AR-10-have-the-same-industry-standard-.html#i64417352 leads you to this link: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/669426_-308-AR-magazine-compatibility.html Which leads you to this link: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/378850_AR10_FAQ_and_information_Small_Update_2012.html Thanks I think I have a 308 Pmag somewhere, might try that |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 3:12:23 PM EDT
[#44]
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It would look like a Pentagon powerpoint presentation. "The Chart" was a poorly conceived idea to begin with. It accepted that mil spec was what was to be achieved - no more, no less. In order to receive full blessing from the chart, a rifle must essentially copy the aspects of the TDP that the chart makers/gatekeepers decided were worthy. In addition to that, with no mil standard or even an industry standard for .308 ARs, a AR-308 "Chart" could make rocket science dissertations look like coloring books by comparison. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 5:17:55 PM EDT
[#45]
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Not many AR10 shops in London you know pack up ur shit and come to America for good bring ur motorcycle and cool D-Day pics if you land in new york, for Gods sake, keep moving westward 
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Posted: 2/1/2017 5:24:48 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"The Chart" was a poorly conceived idea to begin with. It accepted that mil spec was what was to be achieved - no more, no less. In order to receive full blessing from the chart, a rifle must essentially copy the aspects of the TDP that the chart makers/gatekeepers decided were worthy. In addition to that, with no mil standard or even an industry standard for .308 ARs, a AR-308 "Chart" could make rocket science dissertations look like coloring books by comparison. The chart is outdated yes. When it was written it was timely and useful because few things were better than TDP and a lot of shitty guns were around. Look at the tech forums now. Factory guns almost always work and most problems are half baked home brews. It wasn't always so. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 7:20:22 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
pack up ur shit and come to America for good bring ur motorcycle and cool D-Day pics if you land in new york, for Gods sake, keep moving westward Thanks Should've done it years ago 
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Posted: 2/1/2017 7:27:55 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Probably to avoid potential patent infringement, and making customers come to them for handguards. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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Looks like they pulled their tech notes, which were one of the few in the industry that were actually useful: ArmaLite Tech Notes gone from new site I went looking for those myself when I got called out and realized that they were gone. Looks like ArmaLite has a differe9nt master these days. I've always wondered why they changed the thread pattern on their uppers which makes them incompatible with KAC rails unfortunately. Probably to avoid potential patent infringement, and making customers come to them for handguards. 
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Posted: 2/1/2017 7:31:12 PM EDT
[#49]
A slightly off topic drift, but one of my friends picked this deact up today
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Posted: 2/1/2017 7:33:55 PM EDT
[#50]
How badly has it been buggered?
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