[ARCHIVED THREAD] - 2016 CMP Service Rifle Rules (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 1/8/2016 3:29:08 AM EDT
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https://thecmp.org/wp-content/uploads/Rulebook.pdf 6.1.1 M16/AR15-Type Rifles The rifle must an M16 U. S. Service Rifle or a similar AR15-type commercial rifle that is derived from the M16 service rifle design. The following specific rules apply to this type of rifle:
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interesting. scoped rifles will give an advantage over those using irons no? WE have found in our matches that there is no conceivable difference when shooting at Bullseye type targets. Thanks for the post, these rules are very similar to our own and I like to follow them closely We adopted the 4.5x/4.5lb rules several years ago |
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Quoted: Interesting, I've been looking at getting back into service rifle shooting and have started building up a new rifle, from my interpretation, this means I can use a Magpul UBR stock? I guess they dropped the proposed weight limits for rifles with optical sights? Yup. On the CMP forum, a guy posted his "A4" with Geissele rail, 1-4x scope, and UBR. Someone else said they threw up in their mouth: http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=181560&page=2 |
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Yup. On the CMP forum, a guy posted his "A4" with Geissele rail, 1-4x scope, and UBR. Someone else said they threw up in their mouth: http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=181560&page=2 Quoted:
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Interesting, I've been looking at getting back into service rifle shooting and have started building up a new rifle, from my interpretation, this means I can use a Magpul UBR stock? I guess they dropped the proposed weight limits for rifles with optical sights? Yup. On the CMP forum, a guy posted his "A4" with Geissele rail, 1-4x scope, and UBR. Someone else said they threw up in their mouth: http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=181560&page=2 Damnit RifleBrony I attempted to post those rules from my phone here in gee Dee but my phone screwed up the formatting. It was crud. So I gave up. You win. 
On a side note: I now have three match eligible rifles all of a sudden. It's glorious. However the Razor HD I purchased is not friggen legal. I should waited until the rulebook dropped, but I couldn't. It is so dialed in its not funny, but I can't use it. 
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I'm not too up to speed on service rifle, but it seems this rule change opens up a massive shift in the types and styles of guns you'll see.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it used to basically be a clone look-alike A2, now it's pretty open ended as to what's allowed in regards to aftermarket. (Reading this as basically clones of any in service AR rifle or functional equivalents of those same guns). I wonder why they didn't go with a separate optics category for these types of guns. |
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Quoted: I'm not too up to speed on service rifle, but it seems this rule change opens up a massive shift in the types and styles of guns you'll see. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it used to basically be a clone look-alike A2, now it's pretty open ended as to what's allowed in regards to aftermarket. (Reading this as basically clones of any in service AR rifle or functional equivalents of those same guns). I wonder why they didn't go with a separate optics category for these types of guns. With the targets we use, the optic isn't really helping unless you've got vision issues. And the CMP doesn't do categories/classifications. You're either shooting a service rifle, or you're spectating. |
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Quoted: Can the quad rails be free-floating? Yes. Geissele actually has a "National Match" model that's been out for 2-3 years, I think. https://geissele.com/12-7-super-modular-rail-mk7-black.html Seems almost any are legal as long as the sling (and irons if chosen) is attached at the A2/A4 or M4 position, and I suppose the equivalent for midlengths. |
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With the targets we use, the optic isn't really helping unless you've got vision issues. And the CMP doesn't do categories/classifications. You're either shooting a service rifle, or you're spectating. Quoted:
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I'm not too up to speed on service rifle, but it seems this rule change opens up a massive shift in the types and styles of guns you'll see. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it used to basically be a clone look-alike A2, now it's pretty open ended as to what's allowed in regards to aftermarket. (Reading this as basically clones of any in service AR rifle or functional equivalents of those same guns). I wonder why they didn't go with a separate optics category for these types of guns. With the targets we use, the optic isn't really helping unless you've got vision issues. And the CMP doesn't do categories/classifications. You're either shooting a service rifle, or you're spectating. Thanks. I've only ever shot EIC and Combat matches, not Service Rifle so I'm not terribly familiar with it. |
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Got a Colt A2 match, added a Nikon 1.5x4.5, and am trying it out this Sun at local match. 200 yd, informal, they just use the SRC target for the entire shoot. Have good average there, will see if scope improves score. Going to be colder than a witches titty in a brass bra, tho. Have 8,000+ rounds through rifle, so accuracy might not be all that it can, but I should be able to tell if any improvement. |
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Quoted: Got a Colt A2 match, added a Nikon 1.5x4.5, and am trying it out this Sun at local match. 200 yd, informal, they just use the SRC target for the entire shoot. Have good average there, will see if scope improves score. Going to be colder than a witches titty in a brass bra, tho. Have 8,000+ rounds through rifle, so accuracy might not be all that it can, but I should be able to tell if any improvement. Prediction: You'll lose 5 points Offhand, be about the same in the rapids, and gain some Xs in Prone Slow compared to your average. |
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Quoted: Prediction: You'll lose 5 points Offhand, be about the same in the rapids, and gain some Xs in Prone Slow compared to your average. Quoted: Quoted: Got a Colt A2 match, added a Nikon 1.5x4.5, and am trying it out this Sun at local match. 200 yd, informal, they just use the SRC target for the entire shoot. Have good average there, will see if scope improves score. Going to be colder than a witches titty in a brass bra, tho. Have 8,000+ rounds through rifle, so accuracy might not be all that it can, but I should be able to tell if any improvement. Prediction: You'll lose 5 points Offhand, be about the same in the rapids, and gain some Xs in Prone Slow compared to your average. |
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With the targets we use, the optic isn't really helping unless you've got vision issues. And the CMP doesn't do categories/classifications. You're either shooting a service rifle, or you're spectating. Quoted:
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I'm not too up to speed on service rifle, but it seems this rule change opens up a massive shift in the types and styles of guns you'll see. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it used to basically be a clone look-alike A2, now it's pretty open ended as to what's allowed in regards to aftermarket. (Reading this as basically clones of any in service AR rifle or functional equivalents of those same guns). I wonder why they didn't go with a separate optics category for these types of guns. With the targets we use, the optic isn't really helping unless you've got vision issues. And the CMP doesn't do categories/classifications. You're either shooting a service rifle, or you're spectating. You know that about 65% of adults have worse than 20/20 vision, right? This will help a lot of people. |
| My astigmatism and worsening vision have progressively made my iron sight shooting unsatisfying. That kept me from even trying the discipline, despite having a NM-configured A2 complete with stealth free-float and black-painted stainless bbl. The new rule may prompt me to become a middle-aged newbie. |
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My astigmatism and worsening vision have progressively made my iron sight shooting unsatisfying. That kept me from even trying the discipline, despite having a NM-configured A2 complete with stealth free-float and black-painted stainless bbl. The new rule may prompt me to become a middle-aged newbie. Do it man, its always a great time. The people are always cool too. Space rifle guys can be a little finicky :) |
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Quoted: Then, possibly, it can be corrected.  Quoted: Quoted: The scope shows you everything you are doing wrong. Even more than iron sights, it takes getting used to the wobble... I'm undecided which I'll go with, over 40 so starting to have some vision issues, doc was surprised I'm right eye dominant since that's actually not my good eye... |
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Quoted: I was tied with David Tubbs son in a shooting comp using Iron sights. Next day we went to Red Dots and he beat me. Got 3rd place and $100, not bad since he has his Presidents 100 Tab. For SR some will be able to shoot just as good or better with Iron Sights IMO. Red dot? Really? Reminds me, would a canted base work with a red dot like it does for a magnified scope? |
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Quoted: Red dot? Really? Reminds me, would a canted base work with a red dot like it does for a magnified scope? Quoted: Quoted: I was tied with David Tubbs son in a shooting comp using Iron sights. Next day we went to Red Dots and he beat me. Got 3rd place and $100, not bad since he has his Presidents 100 Tab. For SR some will be able to shoot just as good or better with Iron Sights IMO. Red dot? Really? Reminds me, would a canted base work with a red dot like it does for a magnified scope? It was a post competition with about 80 competitors We used issued M4s with full kit at 100-300m, one day iron sights and the next day CCOs/M68s. 1st place got a ACOG, 2nd got a Surefire flashlite and I got $100 for 3rd place. Free |
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Optics will help old eyes. Adjust to point of aim as opposed to 6 o'clock Adjustable stock will help old backs with sitting. B.A.D lever will make closing the bolt while slung up much easier. But I'm not sure I like it. If it doesn't hurt its not fun Mirage is going to smoke some scope users bad. I have a suspicion a scope will give new shooters a false sense of confidence that will not show up in scores. The same guys doing dry fire practice and show up ready will win. |
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Mirage is going to smoke some scope users bad. I have a suspicion a scope will give new shooters a false sense of confidence that will not show up in scores. The same guys doing dry fire practice and show up ready will win. Quoted:
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Optics will help old eyes. Adjust to point of aim as opposed to 6 o'clock Adjustable stock will help old backs with sitting. B.A.D lever will make closing the bolt while slung up much easier. But I'm not sure I like it. If it doesn't hurt its not fun Mirage is going to smoke some scope users bad. I have a suspicion a scope will give new shooters a false sense of confidence that will not show up in scores. The same guys doing dry fire practice and show up ready will win. But it will be a good way to not worry about seeing the front sight which is starting to get a little fuzzy for me now. A post reticle on 1x power held at 6:00 would be perfect. |
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But it will be a good way to not worry about seeing the front sight which is starting to get a little fuzzy for me now. A post reticle on 1x power held at 6:00 would be perfect. Quoted:
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Optics will help old eyes. Adjust to point of aim as opposed to 6 o'clock Adjustable stock will help old backs with sitting. B.A.D lever will make closing the bolt while slung up much easier. But I'm not sure I like it. If it doesn't hurt its not fun Mirage is going to smoke some scope users bad. I have a suspicion a scope will give new shooters a false sense of confidence that will not show up in scores. The same guys doing dry fire practice and show up ready will win. But it will be a good way to not worry about seeing the front sight which is starting to get a little fuzzy for me now. A post reticle on 1x power held at 6:00 would be perfect. I shoot a match rifle with apertures on both ends. My problem is shooting with my everyday glasses, I need to get a set made with the optical center in the right spot. I used to shim my glasses with mole skin on the bridge, and that worked, but it was a long way from perfect. I have considered adding a magnifier on my front sight, but I would like to try one first. |
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Been shooting an A2 for years with an M1A before that. Eye sight is getting to be a problem but I'm not sure a scope would solve it. (I have floaters in my right eye due to injury) I cannot use red dots at all, maybe the non-magnifying post is a good compromise.
As said above, mirage is going to eat some people's lunch. Those with 4x or so optics are going to find out just how bad their fundamentals are. 
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Quoted: I shoot a match rifle with apertures on both ends. My problem is shooting with my everyday glasses, I need to get a set made with the optical center in the right spot. I used to shim my glasses with mole skin on the bridge, and that worked, but it was a long way from perfect. I have considered adding a magnifier on my front sight, but I would like to try one first. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Optics will help old eyes. Adjust to point of aim as opposed to 6 o'clock Adjustable stock will help old backs with sitting. B.A.D lever will make closing the bolt while slung up much easier. But I'm not sure I like it. If it doesn't hurt its not fun Mirage is going to smoke some scope users bad. I have a suspicion a scope will give new shooters a false sense of confidence that will not show up in scores. The same guys doing dry fire practice and show up ready will win. But it will be a good way to not worry about seeing the front sight which is starting to get a little fuzzy for me now. A post reticle on 1x power held at 6:00 would be perfect. I shoot a match rifle with apertures on both ends. My problem is shooting with my everyday glasses, I need to get a set made with the optical center in the right spot. I used to shim my glasses with mole skin on the bridge, and that worked, but it was a long way from perfect. I have considered adding a magnifier on my front sight, but I would like to try one first. |
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They have corrective lenses that go on the rear sight, that are legal. Don't know the company, but my buddy has one. Come in a kit with the adapter and 4-5 lenses, IIRC. If done right, supposedly goes from 3-point focus to nearly 1. (Rear, front, target.) Quoted:
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Optics will help old eyes. Adjust to point of aim as opposed to 6 o'clock Adjustable stock will help old backs with sitting. B.A.D lever will make closing the bolt while slung up much easier. But I'm not sure I like it. If it doesn't hurt its not fun Mirage is going to smoke some scope users bad. I have a suspicion a scope will give new shooters a false sense of confidence that will not show up in scores. The same guys doing dry fire practice and show up ready will win. But it will be a good way to not worry about seeing the front sight which is starting to get a little fuzzy for me now. A post reticle on 1x power held at 6:00 would be perfect. I shoot a match rifle with apertures on both ends. My problem is shooting with my everyday glasses, I need to get a set made with the optical center in the right spot. I used to shim my glasses with mole skin on the bridge, and that worked, but it was a long way from perfect. I have considered adding a magnifier on my front sight, but I would like to try one first. Typically a service rifle shooter installs a lens on the rear sight. Match rifle shooters usually install an "eagle eye" on the front sight. A lens on both sights is not permitted. |
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Maybe under NRA and not CMP rules Quoted:
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So weren't 308's approved a couple years back? Did that go away or am I losing my mind? I swear I remember reading a Armalite release about a 308 they had being legal for service rifle. Maybe under NRA and not CMP rules I didn't realize there was difference
This is why I shoot handguns |
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I didn't realize there was difference
This is why I shoot handguns Quoted:
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So weren't 308's approved a couple years back? Did that go away or am I losing my mind? I swear I remember reading a Armalite release about a 308 they had being legal for service rifle. Maybe under NRA and not CMP rules I didn't realize there was difference
This is why I shoot handguns To be fair I can't keep all the IPSC, IDPA, USPSA, etc... stuff straight. |
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Quoted: I'm actually hoping for improvement, eyes get tired, and front sight melds into bull. Scope will keep everything clear. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Got a Colt A2 match, added a Nikon 1.5x4.5, and am trying it out this Sun at local match. 200 yd, informal, they just use the SRC target for the entire shoot. Have good average there, will see if scope improves score. Going to be colder than a witches titty in a brass bra, tho. Have 8,000+ rounds through rifle, so accuracy might not be all that it can, but I should be able to tell if any improvement. Prediction: You'll lose 5 points Offhand, be about the same in the rapids, and gain some Xs in Prone Slow compared to your average. |
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To be fair I can't keep all the IPSC, IDPA, USPSA, etc... stuff straight. Quoted:
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So weren't 308's approved a couple years back? Did that go away or am I losing my mind? I swear I remember reading a Armalite release about a 308 they had being legal for service rifle. Maybe under NRA and not CMP rules I didn't realize there was difference
This is why I shoot handguns To be fair I can't keep all the IPSC, IDPA, USPSA, etc... stuff straight. Neither can most of us
Had a friend get bumped to open for improper equipment because of his hogue grips. Few months later the big rule man issued a letter in our offficial magazine stating they were ok. My friend let it go but I would have lost my shit. He basically ate a 200+ dollar match plus travel and lodgings for 3 days. |
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Neither can most of us
Had a friend get bumped to open for improper equipment because of his hogue grips. Few months later the big rule man issued a letter in our offficial magazine stating they were ok. My friend let it go but I would have lost my shit. He basically ate a 200+ dollar match plus travel and lodgings for 3 days. Sounds to me like your local club matches might need to be improved. While we don't run chrono and do full gear checks, we definitely will let people know when they are running illegal gear (though not always bump them outright, but remind them that it will happen at any big match). This is especially true for our matches using static or non-shooting ROs. |
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Maybe under NRA and not CMP rules Quoted:
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So weren't 308's approved a couple years back? Did that go away or am I losing my mind? I swear I remember reading a Armalite release about a 308 they had being legal for service rifle. Maybe under NRA and not CMP rules M110 esque things have been legal for NRA for a decent amount of time, there is just no benefit to shoot it. People who aren't in the HP circuit need to keep in mind that CMP rules don't really matter unless they are shooting a leg match or going to nationals. I've never shot a match that uses CMP rules over NRA rules, excluding the two situations stated previously. But as far as I understand, NRA will be putting out similar rules or just using the exact same as the new cmp. |