Posted: 11/27/2015 11:39:49 PM EDT
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All right, I picked up the TC triumph Bone Collector last winter and just finally got the time to sight it in. First shot at 25 yards was pretty solid at an inch left and half inch high. I then moved to 50 yards and the first shot was six inches right but level. The next was six inches right, so I adjusted the sight and shot again with no change. I did this until I couldn't move the sight any more with no change. I switched to round balls with no change as well.
It eventually started to tighten up however it is still right. Has anyone had something similar happen? Maybe a tip? Load - 2 50/50 pyrodex pellets Bullet - 250 grain TC shock wave |
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Try a different projectile? Shooting sabots? What powder? Powder charge? Lots of variables you can control and change. Yup. You have to experiment to find the charge and projectile the gun likes. If you are using the powder pellets you might change to loose powder then start at the lowest recommended charge and work up until you get your best group. If you work up all the way to the highest recommedned charge and still have poor grouping then try a different projectile and start over. Get it grouping well then worry about adjusting the sights. If the gun is set up to use shotgun primers then you might also change brand of primers as they are not all the same. Also swab the barrel after each shot when trying to get a group and when sighting in. Once it is sighted in then you can start shooting three to five shot groups to see where it will shoot out of a dirty barrel. Your groups might get looser or tighter as the crus builds up in the barrel. |
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You're doing it wrong.
BLACKHORN 209. http://www.blackhorn209.com Read All Of It. All other BP subs are horseshit. Take 110vmu/77gr of BH209, 290gr BARNES T-EZ FB and CCI 209 Magnum primer and start shooting half dollar groups at 100yds. Now, get rid of the horseshit and quit worrying about swabbing the bore. |
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Stop swabbing the bore every however many shots, and start weighing/measuring by volume. Also, be consistent in how you tamp the load. Report back. Yep. I forgot about that. I always tamp three times after the bullet is seated against the charge. Once you get a charge and bullet worked out mark your ramrod. |
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Quoted: Yep. I forgot about that. I always tamp three times after the bullet is seated against the charge. Once you get a charge and bullet worked out mark your ramrod. Quoted: Quoted: Stop swabbing the bore every however many shots, and start weighing/measuring by volume. Also, be consistent in how you tamp the load. Report back. Yep. I forgot about that. I always tamp three times after the bullet is seated against the charge. Once you get a charge and bullet worked out mark your ramrod. |
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I'll be sure to do that once I get it all figured it out. I've just never had a rifle not react to having the sight changed. Quoted:
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Stop swabbing the bore every however many shots, and start weighing/measuring by volume. Also, be consistent in how you tamp the load. Report back. Yep. I forgot about that. I always tamp three times after the bullet is seated against the charge. Once you get a charge and bullet worked out mark your ramrod. Could you possibly pulling the shot? |
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I'll be sure to do that once I get it all figured it out. I've just never had a rifle not react to having the sight changed. Quoted:
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Stop swabbing the bore every however many shots, and start weighing/measuring by volume. Also, be consistent in how you tamp the load. Report back. Yep. I forgot about that. I always tamp three times after the bullet is seated against the charge. Once you get a charge and bullet worked out mark your ramrod. Black powder can be a finicky mistress. It's nothing at all like traditional smokeless projectiles. Every single thing you do affects it. How you store your powder (especially hygroscopic), how you seat the load, how you treat the rifle after the shot and prior to the next shot, if you allow the rifle to get cold and then take it into a warm house with a load seated, etc etc. I've seen 5 grains powder difference make huge changes in a loads POI.....not just up and down, but also left to right. Which doesn't make a damn bit of sense, but I watched it with my own eyes Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Check out modernmuzzleloader.com. Its the ARFCOM of muzzleloaders.
There are so many variable that can affect the POI of ML. Best I was ever able to do with pellets and a 250 SST was about 3 inches at 100 and that took work and swabbing after every single shot. I even found that if the pellets got crushed when I loaded the bullet/sabot that that affected the accuracy of the shot. With BH209 I'm just over 1inch at 100 with 110grs (by volume) of powder, CCI 209M primer, a Harvester short/black sabot and a 250gr SST out of my TC Triumph. This took a lot of experimentation with different sabots, loads weights, bullet weights and makes etc. I also do NOT tamp the load, I just bare down on the rod with the same pressure each time. Good thing about the BH209 is that I can shoot 25 or more shots with the same POI with OUT swabbing the barrel before accuracy starts to trail off. One of the biggest changes in accuracy that I found, other than changing power load was the sabot/bullet combo. My gun will shoot radically different POI with different sabots (they are consistent but a lot different). The tightness of the sabot and how it comes off the bullet after it leaves the muzzle are a big factor. BMW20 has a lot of good info in his post too. We have spend countless hours over the years at the range messing around with ML'ers and guns in general. One thing that I did was NOT to adjust my sight until I was able to group my shots (do this with all my guns regardless). As long as you are paper, get your load grouping then worry about POA vs POI, other wise you will pull your hair out. What I always do is take like a 4x4 sheet of cardboard, plywood etc and spray paint a couple of inch dot in the middle. Aim at the dot EACH TIME until you are grouping, then move your group to the dot and then fine tune. J- |
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You're doing it wrong. BLACKHORN 209. http://www.blackhorn209.com Read All Of It. All other BP subs are horseshit. Take 110vmu/77gr of BH209, 290gr BARNES T-EZ FB and CCI 209 Magnum primer and start shooting half dollar groups at 100yds. Now, get rid of the horseshit and quit worrying about swabbing the bore. this. I use 100 grains. |
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UPDATE I picked up some 245 grain powerbelts today, after we finished butchering two pigs, we used their heads for target practice at 50 yards and I was hitting right where I should have been for being zeroed at 100. Thanks for all the tips guys! This site is great |
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UPDATE I picked up some 245 grain powerbelts today, after we finished butchering two pigs, we used their heads for target practice at 50 yards and I was hitting right where I should have been for being zeroed at 100. Thanks for all the tips guys! This site is great Do some research on the powerbelts. Atleast a few years ago they were not very popular or consistent performing when it came to actually killing an animal. J- |
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Dont tamp. The bullet should be seated with the same pressure each time. Mark your ramrod to the right length when you get an accurate load.
Some barrels need a break in. May take a few shots. Nothing wrong with wiping the bore between each shot. Experiment to see if it is necessary. |
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Do some research on the powerbelts. Atleast a few years ago they were not very popular or consistent performing when it came to actually killing an animal. J- Quoted:
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UPDATE I picked up some 245 grain powerbelts today, after we finished butchering two pigs, we used their heads for target practice at 50 yards and I was hitting right where I should have been for being zeroed at 100. Thanks for all the tips guys! This site is great Do some research on the powerbelts. Atleast a few years ago they were not very popular or consistent performing when it came to actually killing an animal. J- Came here to post this.......Brother J beat me to it! Additionally, powerbelts were one of the many trials I did years ago when looking for my load. I was able to get them to group around 3" at 100 if memory serves......but then I started getting random fliers that were keyholing. Apparently the plastic cup on the end has a nasty habit of sometimes not separating or separating inconsistently which causes occasional tumble. Some people also claim the plastic cup doesn't engage he rifling very well and doesn't impart spin on the bullet......causing you to essentially be shooting a mini ball. I'm still old school for this year with the 777 pellets......but it's only because I've been building a house and haven't had the time to work up a load with black horn. After listening to JJC and his experience with it......there is no doubt that's what I'll be shooting next year. For now......my 777 load groups around 2" or slightly less at 100 which is more than good enough to kill deer or coyotes that piss me off on opening morning |
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You're doing it wrong. BLACKHORN 209. http://www.blackhorn209.com Read All Of It. All other BP subs are horseshit. Take 110vmu/77gr of BH209, 290gr BARNES T-EZ FB and CCI 209 Magnum primer and start shooting half dollar groups at 100yds. Now, get rid of the horseshit and quit worrying about swabbing the bore. Some of us live in states where pretty much everything you've advised is (for hunting) illegal. Yeah, sucks to be us. |
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Some of us live in states where pretty much everything you've advised is (for hunting) illegal. Yeah, sucks to be us. Quoted:
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You're doing it wrong. BLACKHORN 209. http://www.blackhorn209.com Read All Of It. All other BP subs are horseshit. Take 110vmu/77gr of BH209, 290gr BARNES T-EZ FB and CCI 209 Magnum primer and start shooting half dollar groups at 100yds. Now, get rid of the horseshit and quit worrying about swabbing the bore. Some of us live in states where pretty much everything you've advised is (for hunting) illegal. Yeah, sucks to be us. Illegal how? You can't use 209 primers? Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Exactly what this guy says, I have a TC Omega and had nothing but bad luck with anything else. I am now shooting 120 grains of Blackhorn 209 with a barnes EZ expander bullet. I can shoot 200 plus yards easily and accurately. Make sure you also get the magnum 209 primers as required for use with Blackhorn 209.
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You're doing it wrong. BLACKHORN 209. http://www.blackhorn209.com Read All Of It. All other BP subs are horseshit. Take 110vmu/77gr of BH209, 290gr BARNES T-EZ FB and CCI 209 Magnum primer and start shooting half dollar groups at 100yds. Now, get rid of the horseshit and quit worrying about swabbing the bore. |
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Some of us live in states where pretty much everything you've advised is (for hunting) illegal. Yeah, sucks to be us. Quoted:
Quoted:
You're doing it wrong. BLACKHORN 209. http://www.blackhorn209.com Read All Of It. All other BP subs are horseshit. Take 110vmu/77gr of BH209, 290gr BARNES T-EZ FB and CCI 209 Magnum primer and start shooting half dollar groups at 100yds. Now, get rid of the horseshit and quit worrying about swabbing the bore. Some of us live in states where pretty much everything you've advised is (for hunting) illegal. Yeah, sucks to be us. ?????????? Sure does I guess. But alas it really only matters if it legal in the state that the OP is hunting in correct? J- |