Posted: 2/15/2015 3:25:33 PM EDT
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I'm setting up my AR for coyote and deer hunting. Currently it has a PA micro dot on it. I want to replace that with a scope in the 4-12x range(with a BDC), and offset mount the PA micro dot on the rail or scope tube(need fast non-magnified optic for hunting wooded areas). The micro dot was great for hunting deer up north in the woods where I had 20-50 yard shots max, not so good for coyotes down here in open fields past 100 yards. Budget is $500 for optic & mount, although having left over would be nice for other things.
Scopes I've looked at... Vortex Crossfire II 4-12x40AO Vortex Diamondback 4-12x40AO Vortex Viper 4-12x40 PA Nikon 4-12x40 ProStaff Nikon 3.5-14x40 ProStaff 5 Nikon 4-12x40 P-223 Nikon 4-16x42 M-223 Nikon 4-12x40 Active Target Special Not really sure how to determine if the difference between the Crossfire II for example and the Diamondback or Viper is worth the price difference for my uses. Part of that is I don't know enough about the construction/features of scopes and I don't have any way to "test" the majority of these out. Can anybody help? |
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting.
I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. |
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My dad has Nikon glass on a heavy AR. Was making hits on prairie dogs out to 475 yards. Good glass for the money.
I have the Pentax version of this scope (same thing, different badge) Also a good value. the Ballistiplex is handy: http://www.opticsplanet.com/burris-45-14x42mm-fullfield-ii-rifle-scope.html Sighted in a 100, it's just about dead on at 200 and 300 with the next two sets of crosshairs. |
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. |
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Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. Quoted:
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. I thought the DB HP glass was a fairly noticeable step up from the Crossfire. Last I checked, the HP was the same glass used in the Vipers. That, along wit the features gives you a heck of a scope at the price point. I got mine at Cameralandny on a supposed open box special for $259. It came brand new. Needless to say, I was stoked. |
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I found the Leupold AR Mod 1 3x9x40 mildot on sale and freaking love it.
I did the same offset red dot set up you are thinking of, and to be honest I'm not really happy with it. Hard to get used to and really not faster then just shooting the scope even at short ranges. I may just stick the PA red dot on a .22 pistol. And practice a little more with the scope. When it's dialed all the way down my field of view is still pretty good on short ranges. Edited for fixing autocorrect stuff. |
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Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. Quoted:
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. the viper is lighter, has better turrets, erectors and glass. You can also get custom turrets. If you plan to hunt at night the better glass is worth extra $ IMO. Falling down at night can be hard on scope innards too. I have the crossfire on a fun gun, and want the 2-8 for a minimauser I bought. the crossfire has never gotten any abuse so I cant say how well it holds up but it is a good glass. |
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the viper is lighter, has better turrets, erectors and glass. You can also get custom turrets. If you plan to hunt at night the better glass is worth extra $ IMO. Falling down at night can be hard on scope innards too. I have the crossfire on a fun gun, and want the 2-8 for a minimauser I bought. the crossfire has never gotten any abuse so I cant say how well it holds up but it is a good glass. Quoted:
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. the viper is lighter, has better turrets, erectors and glass. You can also get custom turrets. If you plan to hunt at night the better glass is worth extra $ IMO. Falling down at night can be hard on scope innards too. I have the crossfire on a fun gun, and want the 2-8 for a minimauser I bought. the crossfire has never gotten any abuse so I cant say how well it holds up but it is a good glass. looking at that diamondback HP 3-12, that is pretty nice. Seems like everything the viper is for $100 less. |
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looking at that diamondback HP 3-12, that is pretty nice. Seems like everything the viper is for $100 less. Quoted:
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. the viper is lighter, has better turrets, erectors and glass. You can also get custom turrets. If you plan to hunt at night the better glass is worth extra $ IMO. Falling down at night can be hard on scope innards too. I have the crossfire on a fun gun, and want the 2-8 for a minimauser I bought. the crossfire has never gotten any abuse so I cant say how well it holds up but it is a good glass. looking at that diamondback HP 3-12, that is pretty nice. Seems like everything the viper is for $100 less. Still $259 http://www.cameralandny.com/optics/vortex.pl?page=vortex_diamondback_hp_3-12x42 |
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looking at that diamondback HP 3-12, that is pretty nice. Seems like everything the viper is for $100 less. Quoted:
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. the viper is lighter, has better turrets, erectors and glass. You can also get custom turrets. If you plan to hunt at night the better glass is worth extra $ IMO. Falling down at night can be hard on scope innards too. I have the crossfire on a fun gun, and want the 2-8 for a minimauser I bought. the crossfire has never gotten any abuse so I cant say how well it holds up but it is a good glass. looking at that diamondback HP 3-12, that is pretty nice. Seems like everything the viper is for $100 less. You could get a good mount for 100 or so you save. Maybe a mount for your scope and dot. If you dont throw it down the drive way it will probably work good for you. |
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I've got the Nikon P-223 on one of my rifles, and when I got it the factory mount was free. Carbine BDC reticle, a little different from the M-series.
But I've never been a fan of variable scopes anyway. More moving parts, heavier, bulkier. And most people I've shot with over the years tend to leave their variables on one setting anyway, at least after the novelty wears off. And some variables, especially if they get dropped, can have the point of impact shift as the power is changed. With something like the P-series, you could have the scope and rings for about $300 combined, if you catch a good sale. I realize my opinion is in the minority. But I've had nothing but fixed power scopes for several decades, and don't feel handicapped by them, especially for hunting at ranges < 200 yds. |
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Seems like a great deal on this Nikon Buckmaster BDC Riflescope - 3-9 40mm - $129 and $5 shipping. http://www.cabelas.com/product/Nikon-Buckmaster-BDC-Riflescope/1926337.uts?productVariantId=4049640&srccode=cii_5784816&cpncode=45-28555978-2&WT.tsrc=CSE&WT.mc_id=pricegrabber&WT.z_mc_id1=04060557&rid=20 |
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http://www.vortexoptics.com/uploads/rzr-hd-g2_1-6x24_16003_f-t.jpg Vortex Razor HD Gen II 1-6x24 Rifle Scope - JM-1 BDC 
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I thought the DB HP glass was a fairly noticeable step up from the Crossfire. Last I checked, the HP was the same glass used in the Vipers. That, along wit the features gives you a heck of a scope at the price point. I got mine at Cameralandny on a supposed open box special for $259. It came brand new. Needless to say, I was stoked. Quoted:
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. I thought the DB HP glass was a fairly noticeable step up from the Crossfire. Last I checked, the HP was the same glass used in the Vipers. That, along wit the features gives you a heck of a scope at the price point. I got mine at Cameralandny on a supposed open box special for $259. It came brand new. Needless to say, I was stoked. By brand new do you mean in a box or just no visible signs of use? |
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By brand new do you mean in a box or just no visible signs of use? Quoted:
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. I thought the DB HP glass was a fairly noticeable step up from the Crossfire. Last I checked, the HP was the same glass used in the Vipers. That, along wit the features gives you a heck of a scope at the price point. I got mine at Cameralandny on a supposed open box special for $259. It came brand new. Needless to say, I was stoked. By brand new do you mean in a box or just no visible signs of use? Brand new. And shipped direct from Vortex. Edit: Cameralandny was moving to another store at the time, not sure if that had anything to do with it. |
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Brand new. And shipped direct from Vortex. Edit: Cameralandny was moving to another store at the time, not sure if that had anything to do with it. Quoted:
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The Viper 4-12x40 PA offers alot and is right around a pound. I'd probably go with it. the diamond back 3-12 looks good to. Either one of those would be good for yotes and general hunting. I have a crossfire 1-4, really nice scope for the money. I want a 2-8x32 diamondback. Why would you choose the Viper if you're wanting a diamondback and you like your crossfire? Just curious how you justify the increased cost. I thought the DB HP glass was a fairly noticeable step up from the Crossfire. Last I checked, the HP was the same glass used in the Vipers. That, along wit the features gives you a heck of a scope at the price point. I got mine at Cameralandny on a supposed open box special for $259. It came brand new. Needless to say, I was stoked. By brand new do you mean in a box or just no visible signs of use? Brand new. And shipped direct from Vortex. Edit: Cameralandny was moving to another store at the time, not sure if that had anything to do with it. Either way I'm not worried about it with Vortex's warranty. |
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Seems like a great deal on this Nikon Buckmaster BDC Riflescope - 3-9 40mm - $129 and $5 shipping. http://www.cabelas.com/product/Nikon-Buckmaster-BDC-Riflescope/1926337.uts?productVariantId=4049640&srccode=cii_5784816&cpncode=45-28555978-2&WT.tsrc=CSE&WT.mc_id=pricegrabber&WT.z_mc_id1=04060557&rid=20 |
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Just for size reference here's my Nikon Prostaff 4-12x mounted on a carbine. It's very good glass but as you can see it's freakin' huge for that rifle. http://i.imgur.com/dlPZ8qr.jpg Doesn't look too big. Mine is a midlength gas with a 11" rail so I'm sure that would look a little less out of place. |
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If you're only looking to go 100 yards, I would look at smaller scopes. At a lower price point, 3-9x40 is still a bit overkill for 100 yards, but will serve you well if you end up needing to go out farther. I'm looking for something that will be useful past 100 yards, probably would only shoot to 500 max. My red dot I have now I only consider good for below 100 yards for "hunting precision". |