Posted: 3/28/2014 10:06:48 PM EDT
| I was thinking of a new idea for a muzzle loader. It would use smokeless powder, and the chamber where your put the powder in would be fixed, However it would use an insert that would hold any standard jacketed bullet. As well as having an electronic ignition system. This way you could vary the powder charge, The type of bullet used, and would have instant lock time. The idea is that due to the "cartridge" being the chamber, it would eliminate variances in brass from affecting the accuracy of the rifle, You could also go from a 150gr FMJ to a 168 match bullet, to a heavy weight subsonic bullet pretty quickly, while eliminating most of the cost of buying loaded ammunition in those calibers. Just wondering why it hasnt been tried yet. |
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Would you still ram the jacketed bullet down the bore, or would it use a sabot, or is the "insert" you're talking about something you'd place in the breech?
If the first, I feel like it'd be really hard to beat a spitzer bullet down the bore of a rifle. If the last, wouldn't you have, like, little gaps at the front and the back of the "insert" that you'd have to deal with? ETA: and if the middle one, you'd have to have a wicked bad-ass sabot to put up with smokeless powder pressures, wouldn't you? ETA2: Nine nine nine nine |
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An electronic ignition system does not sound particularly reliable to me. The propellant would have to be in direct contact with an electrode at all times. This is a problem given the fact that a cartridge should always have enough free space within to allow safe pressures.
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Would you still ram the jacketed bullet down the bore, or would it use a sabot, or is the "insert" you're talking about something you'd place in the breech? If the first, I feel like it'd be really hard to beat a spitzer bullet down the bore of a rifle. If the last, wouldn't you have, like, little gaps at the front and the back of the "insert" that you'd have to deal with? ETA: and if the middle one, you'd have to have a wicked bad-ass sabot to put up with smokeless powder pressures, wouldn't you? ETA2: Nine nine nine nine I was thinking the insert ould pretty much be placed in the breech. perhaps with a sliding cover or some other type of lock. |
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I was thinking the insert ould pretty much be placed in the breech. perhaps with a sliding cover or some other type of lock. Quoted:
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Would you still ram the jacketed bullet down the bore, or would it use a sabot, or is the "insert" you're talking about something you'd place in the breech? If the first, I feel like it'd be really hard to beat a spitzer bullet down the bore of a rifle. If the last, wouldn't you have, like, little gaps at the front and the back of the "insert" that you'd have to deal with? ETA: and if the middle one, you'd have to have a wicked bad-ass sabot to put up with smokeless powder pressures, wouldn't you? ETA2: Nine nine nine nine I was thinking the insert ould pretty much be placed in the breech. perhaps with a sliding cover or some other type of lock. Then it is no longer a muzzleloader, but a breech loader. |
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A muzzleloader with electronic ignition has already been done, by CVA. It didn't sell well. A short article from 2007 about the CVA Electra. |
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Dangerous? No. Popularity to a niche market is what killed it. Wish I'd bought one from their last run. Quoted:
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Savage made a muzzleloader that used smokeless powder. It was dangerous and discontinued. Dangerous? No. Popularity to a niche market is what killed it. Wish I'd bought one from their last run. Still available from their custom shop. Used ones are expensive! |
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Still available from their custom shop. Used ones are expensive! Quoted:
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Savage made a muzzleloader that used smokeless powder. It was dangerous and discontinued. Dangerous? No. Popularity to a niche market is what killed it. Wish I'd bought one from their last run. Still available from their custom shop. Used ones are expensive! I kind of got the bug last fall after MZ season ended. Natchez had been listing the 10ML-II in their catalog, but they were out of stock when I called. I've got a friend in IL who is big into the whole smokeless MZ thing. He looked for a while, but like you say, the used market was just too much money for me. He tried to talk me into either converting my Pro Hunter barrel into smokeless or trying to find an old Remington 700ML to convert, but I don't really want it that bad. Shooting 100 gr. of Blackhorn 209 under a 250 gr. spirepoint bullet gives me enough velocity to hold dead on at 150, guess that's all I need. 
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Quoted: Dangerous? No. Popularity to a niche market is what killed it. Wish I'd bought one from their last run. Quoted: Quoted: Savage made a muzzleloader that used smokeless powder. It was dangerous and discontinued. Dangerous? No. Popularity to a niche market is what killed it. Wish I'd bought one from their last run. Edit I remember most sabots not being up to the task and accuracy was iffy, but maybe there are better sabots now
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Yeah I regret not getting one Edit I remember most sabots not being up to the task and accuracy was iffy, but maybe there are better sabots now Quoted:
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Savage made a muzzleloader that used smokeless powder. It was dangerous and discontinued. Dangerous? No. Popularity to a niche market is what killed it. Wish I'd bought one from their last run. Edit I remember most sabots not being up to the task and accuracy was iffy, but maybe there are better sabots now Very finicky with sabots from what I've read. But once you found that perfect combo, very accurate and clean. |
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I think someone was Making "harder"sabots that would not deform with smokeless, I forget who. Just something I read https://www.harvestermuzzleloading.com/index.php?page=shop.browse&category_id=7&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=3&vmcchk=1&Itemid=3 Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Heckler & Koch tried it and it failed.
http://www.hkpro.com/image/g11k2.jpg What you are mentioning is caseless ammunition. |