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Posted: 11/29/2002 1:04:10 PM EDT
Ok, here is a little something that happened to me the other day. I had the day after the elections off (I was up late and only got 862 votes but what the hell) so I go into Old Navy with mmy .45 as usuall and they have no problem with this what so ever. I had it in a SOB holster. So I buy some shirts and a pair of pants and leave. I then go down the street to the Movies. I stow my weapon because it is illegal to carry in theater here in NC. I get about half way through my movie and two cops come in a light up the theater. They ask me at gunpoint if I had been to Old Navy. I said yes. they then asked me to stand up and they take me out of the theater. I am put in the position frisked and asked why I had not told them that I was carring a gun. I told them that I wasn't carring a gun so the point was moot. I was then asked to leave the theater. I asked them why was I detained and they said Loomis Fargo (armored car company) had said they saw me go in the theater with a gun. So I finally got the 911 tape and low and behold they called into 911 that they saw me carring a 9mm or .40 cal Beretta into Old Navy and the theater concealled in the small of my back. One of those statments is true the other is false. BTW I was carring a Wilson CQB in Green into Old Navy apperantly this guy can't identify weapons well. He also states that he followed my from Old Navy to the theater and gave a description of my car. Now here is the deal he committed two Mistameanors when he lied to the cops. Slander and making a false statement to a Law Agency. So what should I do? Get an attorney a sue? File charges? let it go? I am really pissed but unsure of how to proceed. So what would you do???
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:09:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/29/2002 1:10:48 PM EDT by bunghole]
I would definitely pursue legal options. The Loomis guys were probably jealous because they are "rent-a-cops". [:D]
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:10:15 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:12:01 PM EDT
Shoot his nuts off.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:13:57 PM EDT
Do not let it pass. If he gets a way with it no other leagal carrier is prtected from his slander. Bobwrench
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:16:29 PM EDT
I would think that the contents of the armored car would be sufficient compensation.[50]
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:17:55 PM EDT
To make matters worse I am just starting a political carrer I ran for NC Senate and got hosed, but I have a real shot at the County Commision in the next election. I really don't need to be seen being taken out of e movie theater by the Cops.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:18:09 PM EDT
Time to play "Show me the money!" sue their asses off.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:22:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:30:48 PM EDT
Sue the bastards. Sue them back to the stone age.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:43:21 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:49:48 PM EDT
The reason they say the weapon was that I was "open Carry" while at Old Navy. I go that way most of the time. It causes some hassles but often leads to some good conversations and the more people see guns in the hands of Law abiding Citizens the less of a problem it is.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 1:55:57 PM EDT
Sure, sue them. Just make sure that you then NEVER complain about how all the lawyers have screwed things up for the rest of us, or bitch about "sue-happy" *anybody* ever again. Or, you could try this in the court of public opinion, which seems to be the second option favored by many these days, particularly politicians. Make a big case about this treatment in the media, pressing the need for education and training among LE and rent-a-cops alike. It'd be a great opportunity to further a positive agenda for gun rights. You do make guna rights a part of your political platform don't you? Again, though, if you take this approach, I'd suggest you then abrogate any right to complain about how the media is misused by those with a particular ax to grind. On the horns of a dilemma... [;D]
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 2:14:10 PM EDT
I'd defiantly make them squirm. Not sure what your chances are of winning anything since A) You didn't suffer any monetary loss over the incident. B) No damage was done to your reputation that resulted in financial or professional repercussions. C) I'm not sure if 'Good Samaritan' type laws apply here. The security guards could argue that they had reasonable suspicion that a firearms law was being broken. The police acted on good faith on that information and had an obligation to check it out. At least you weren't careless, lazy or unconcerned about bringing your gun into the theater (and I'd be reasonably certain that some CCW holders wouldn't have bothered stashing the gun in their car). Then you really would have been screwed.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 2:14:31 PM EDT
Take a stand Man... Too often we don't push the subject. Consult with a lawyer and take it to the limit.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 2:31:58 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 2:39:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Big_Bear:
Originally Posted By Paul: I would make sure that Loomis Fargo bought me a year long pass to the theater.
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Ditto, or compensates with $$$. Consult an attorney, preferably a pro-gun attorney. If you have a good case (and it appears to me you do) he may take your case pro-bono. Shake 'em up and Loomis will probably offer to settle. We're not just talking about a movie fare here, your political career is possibly at stake. You never know, things like this can come back to haunt you, even if you were in the right. At the very least, the Loomis guard should be fired, if not charged for giving a false statement to the police.
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Pursue both avenues. Civil cases: The theatre Loomis-Faggo The Police Department Criminal case: [b]PUSH[/b] for the charges against the man who committed the crimes by lying about you to the police. The rent-a-cops were obviously playing "police" thinking they were even responsible to follow around a law-abiding citizen waitign for you to "break" the law. Useless wannabes..... Scott
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 2:58:26 PM EDT
aces and eights has a good point about potential damages. i think a written apology from the rentacop is in order, but what else? were the (real) cops dicks about it?
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 3:47:46 PM EDT
Kick him in the cunt. AB
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 3:49:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ADTECHARMS: To make matters worse I am just starting a political carrer I ran for NC Senate and got hosed, but I have a real shot at the County Commision in the next election. I really don't need to be seen being taken out of e movie theater by the Cops.
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Well, that's politics for ya. AB
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 3:58:32 PM EDT
I would definately at least talk to a Lawyer and see if you have a case. If they say yeah, then I would go after them. If we let people get away with this it will just get worse.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 4:19:25 PM EDT
I can't see a reason to carry openly these days, unless you live in a really small town or something. Was it one of Ayoob's rules for carrying that said "Show your gun, go to jail"?
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 6:09:08 PM EDT
Stand up and make the bastards pay for what they did. You followed the law and got hassled in public (not to mention the possible damage to your political aspirations). They broke the law by filing a false report. You did nothing wrong, they did. Don't let this stand unchallenged.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 6:42:16 PM EDT
I'd definately get a lawyer. They fucked with you, now fuck with them back. Even if you aren't going get a million dollars out of it, it's a good bet that they would pay out enough to at least cover the lawyer just to get you off their back. It would be worth it to me even if I didn't get any money just to prove a point to them, "Just carry around you little bags of change and leave the detective work to the detectives". Just the fact that he followed you around proves that he wasn't just being a good samaritan reporting a crime that he saw. He was investigating for a crime. [b]Sue 'em all, just remember to say punitive damages a lot.[/b]
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 6:52:59 PM EDT
I second putting a crew together.
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 6:56:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SNorman: I can't see a reason to carry openly these days, unless you live in a really small town or something. Was it one of Ayoob's rules for carrying that said "Show your gun, go to jail"?
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i think open carrying is great get people used to seeing them
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 6:59:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 1_153_370_371_407:
Originally Posted By SNorman: I can't see a reason to carry openly these days, unless you live in a really small town or something. Was it one of Ayoob's rules for carrying that said "Show your gun, go to jail"?
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i think open carrying is great get people used to seeing them
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Open carry is just a polite way of saying, "Don't fuck with me today".
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 7:22:09 PM EDT
STOP lying, and post honest shit. Thats what I would do...........
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 7:23:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Hotrod: STOP lying, and post honest shit. Thats what I would do...........
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huh?
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 7:28:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 1_153_370_371_407:
Originally Posted By Hotrod: STOP lying, and post honest shit. Thats what I would do...........
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huh?
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Read ADTECHARMS post it is full of discrepancies. I will explain it to you if you want me to............
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 7:29:42 PM EDT
Just for the fun of it......
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 7:33:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 7:34:34 PM EDT
I think it is definitely to your advantage to NOT let people know you are carrying. Open carry may be symbolic, being able to say yeah I got a gun what are you going to do about it? But really, what is the tactical advantage of open carry?
Link Posted: 11/29/2002 7:39:23 PM EDT
How did you get a copy of the 911 tape?
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 7:02:50 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Aces-and-Eights: I'd defiantly make them squirm. Not sure what your chances are of winning anything since A) You didn't suffer any monetary loss over the incident. Actually I did but they where small, I bought a ticket, candy, soda and popcorn which I had to leave in the theater when I was asked to leave. B) No damage was done to your reputation that resulted in financial or professional repercussions. I won't kn ow this until the 2004 election cycle. C) I'm not sure if 'Good Samaritan' type laws apply here. The security guards could argue that they had reasonable suspicion that a firearms law was being broken. The police acted on good faith on that information and had an obligation to check it out. How could they have reasonably believed that a firearms law was being broken when I was unarmed going into the theater which they specifically said I was? At least you weren't careless, lazy or unconcerned about bringing your gun into the theater (and I'd be reasonably certain that some CCW holders wouldn't have bothered stashing the gun in their car). Then you really would have been screwed.
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As stupid as some of the carry laws are here I do try to obey them as best I can.
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 7:15:00 AM EDT
Originally Posted By MisterGreens: I think it is definitely to your advantage to NOT let people know you are carrying. Open carry may be symbolic, being able to say yeah I got a gun what are you going to do about it? But really, what is the tactical advantage of open carry?
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Yeah, if it's not hidden, and a gunman comes in, YOU'RE the first target. But it is neat that you can. Just keep an eye out for gunmen. Here in Texas, you can carry but no one can be able to see or identify it.
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 8:49:29 AM EDT
Originally Posted By SNorman: I can't see a reason to carry openly these days, unless you live in a really small town or something. Was it one of Ayoob's rules for carrying that said "Show your gun, go to jail"?
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Not in places that have open carry..... Scott
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 9:38:10 AM EDT
From a political future point of view, [b]make[/b] the law work, charges for the ‘false statement to a Law Agency’. 1. Charges filed and a conviction, you win. The system can work, sometimes. 2. Charges filed and no conviction, you win, you now have an issue to add to you political life. The system is setup to screw law-abiding citizens and reward liars. Civil actions can be viewed as or turned into (by media or opponents) as a crybaby event (only for those with a political life). Although you must get a victory out of this, even if you have to go with civil actions, should a criminal case fail. Without a victory of some type this has more downsides for your political future than up. SSD
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 9:49:20 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Hotrod:
Originally Posted By 1_153_370_371_407:
Originally Posted By Hotrod: STOP lying, and post honest shit. Thats what I would do...........
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huh?
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Read ADTECHARMS post it is full of discrepancies. I will explain it to you if you want me to............
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What discrepancies are you referring to? Please explain them...
Link Posted: 11/30/2002 12:37:11 PM EDT
I would sure love to know how exactly I am lying also. Especially from someone who was in ND and not there.
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