[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Botulism? (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 7/31/2013 7:08:24 PM EDT
| Hey ARFcom docs, need your input. My neighbor came over and brought a homemade jar of pickled carrots. We opened it and I took a bite of one and chewed once and noticed it was spoiled so I spit it out and rinsed my mouth with water and then gargled with vodka. Think I'll get botulism? Dibs on guns? Or don't worry about it? |
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Hey ARFcom docs, need your input. My neighbor came over and brought a homemade jar of pickled carrots. We opened it and I took a bite of one and chewed once and noticed it was spoiled so I spit it out and rinsed my mouth with water and then gargled with vodka. Think I'll get botulism? Dibs on guns? Or don't worry about it? How far down your throat did the carrot travel? |
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Pickled carrots? Did he add vinegar and/or brine to it before canning? High salt content and acid both prevent botulism growth -- which is why pickling and salting have been used to preserve food for thousands of years. If the seal was still good and the can wasn't bulged it's probably not botulism -- more likely some type of mold, which generally can tolerate acid and low-water conditions better than bacteria. If not, then here's some reading material on the disease so you'll know what to expect:  http://www.cdc.gov/nczved/divisions/dfbmd/diseases/botulism/ |
That quote is great when taken out of context.
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I dont think the jar was sealed properly, lid popped off pretty easy. It didn't taste like salt or vinegar. I guess they were originally pickled in vinegar but the carrots were soggy and tasted like dog shit and old socks Fuck it. Drink some beer and relax. You'll be ok. You didn't swallow that crap, so it won't sit in your intestinal track setting you up for the Big Surprise a week later. I'm not a doctor BTW. I just drink beer every night and assume you'll benefit from it too. |
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Quoted: Eat some strong dill pickles. The vinegar will help kill any bad stuff that got into your stomach.  Botulinum toxin is the most deadly substance on a per gram basis known to man; ingesting even a small amount can be fatal if not treated. If the OP has good reason to believe there was botulinum toxin in the carrots then he should go seek out Canada's Free Health Care System immediately. Not joking. |
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Confirmed. Dibs on ammo. Quoted:
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I dont think the jar was sealed properly, lid popped off pretty easy. It didn't taste like salt or vinegar. I guess they were originally pickled in vinegar but the carrots were soggy and tasted like dog shit and old socks Confirmed. Dibs on ammo. It's your lucky day. I just got another 1200 round crate of norinco 5.56 in the mail today. So who wants the guns? I'll just wait it out. If my face gets paralyzed I will go to the ER. |
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Quoted: http://i30.tinypic.com/2nu13qs.jpg Botulinum toxin is the most deadly substance on a per gram basis known to man; ingesting even a small amount can be fatal if not treated. If the OP has good reason to believe there was botulinum toxin in the carrots then he should go seek out Canada's Free Health Care System immediately. Not joking. Quoted: Quoted: Eat some strong dill pickles. The vinegar will help kill any bad stuff that got into your stomach. http://i30.tinypic.com/2nu13qs.jpg Botulinum toxin is the most deadly substance on a per gram basis known to man; ingesting even a small amount can be fatal if not treated. If the OP has good reason to believe there was botulinum toxin in the carrots then he should go seek out Canada's Free Health Care System immediately. Not joking. |
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Quoted: It's your lucky day. I just got another 1200 round crate of norinco 5.56 in the mail today. So who wants the guns? I'll just wait it out. If my face gets paralyzed I will go to the ER. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I dont think the jar was sealed properly, lid popped off pretty easy. It didn't taste like salt or vinegar. I guess they were originally pickled in vinegar but the carrots were soggy and tasted like dog shit and old socks Confirmed. Dibs on ammo. It's your lucky day. I just got another 1200 round crate of norinco 5.56 in the mail today. So who wants the guns? I'll just wait it out. If my face gets paralyzed I will go to the ER. |
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I'll take the guns. Quoted:
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I dont think the jar was sealed properly, lid popped off pretty easy. It didn't taste like salt or vinegar. I guess they were originally pickled in vinegar but the carrots were soggy and tasted like dog shit and old socks Confirmed. Dibs on ammo. It's your lucky day. I just got another 1200 round crate of norinco 5.56 in the mail today. So who wants the guns? I'll just wait it out. If my face gets paralyzed I will go to the ER. Boiled or non-boiled? |
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Quoted: Boiled or non-boiled? Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I dont think the jar was sealed properly, lid popped off pretty easy. It didn't taste like salt or vinegar. I guess they were originally pickled in vinegar but the carrots were soggy and tasted like dog shit and old socks Confirmed. Dibs on ammo. It's your lucky day. I just got another 1200 round crate of norinco 5.56 in the mail today. So who wants the guns? I'll just wait it out. If my face gets paralyzed I will go to the ER. Boiled or non-boiled? |
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Quoted: I'm partially serious. My grandpa eats food that has mold growing on it; he scrapes the green off and goes to town. He eats pickles afterword, and has only gotten sick (from any cause) twice in my lifetime. No idea how it works, but apparently it does. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Eat some strong dill pickles. The vinegar will help kill any bad stuff that got into your stomach. http://i30.tinypic.com/2nu13qs.jpg Botulinum toxin is the most deadly substance on a per gram basis known to man; ingesting even a small amount can be fatal if not treated. If the OP has good reason to believe there was botulinum toxin in the carrots then he should go seek out Canada's Free Health Care System immediately. Not joking. It would be interesting to see his SGOT/SGPT levels (indicators of liver damage). In any case, the reason he's not getting sick (yet) from ingesting mold is probably because he removes most of the contamination beforehand, not because he eats pickles afterwards. That, or he has Superman's liver.  In any case, botulinum toxin is a protein which can only be deactivated by cooking. Home-canned non-acid foods like carrots are vulnerable because the canning process might not be strong enough to kill the bacterial spores, and since botulism bacteria can grow quite well without oxygen this leaves them to grow uninhibited inside the can. Home canners can prevent this by adding more salt or vinegar or both to prevent the growth, but with many people home canning is an inexact science, so to speak, and the quality control is often lacking. |
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Quoted: I'm partially serious. My grandpa eats food that has mold growing on it; he scrapes the green off and goes to town. He eats pickles afterword, and has only gotten sick (from any cause) twice in my lifetime. No idea how it works, but apparently it does. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Eat some strong dill pickles. The vinegar will help kill any bad stuff that got into your stomach. http://i30.tinypic.com/2nu13qs.jpg Botulinum toxin is the most deadly substance on a per gram basis known to man; ingesting even a small amount can be fatal if not treated. If the OP has good reason to believe there was botulinum toxin in the carrots then he should go seek out Canada's Free Health Care System immediately. Not joking. |
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It would be interesting to see his SGOT/SGPT levels (indicators of liver damage). In any case, the reason he's not getting sick (yet) from ingesting mold is probably because he removes most of the contamination beforehand, not because he eats pickles afterwards. That, or he has Superman's liver.
In any case, botulinum toxin is a protein which can only be deactivated by cooking. Home-canned non-acid foods like carrots are vulnerable because the canning process might not be strong enough to kill the bacterial spores, and since botulism bacteria can grow quite well without oxygen this leaves them to grow uninhibited inside the can. Home canners can prevent this by adding more salt or vinegar or both to prevent the growth, but with many people home canning is an inexact science, so to speak, and the quality control is often lacking. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Eat some strong dill pickles. The vinegar will help kill any bad stuff that got into your stomach. http://i30.tinypic.com/2nu13qs.jpg Botulinum toxin is the most deadly substance on a per gram basis known to man; ingesting even a small amount can be fatal if not treated. If the OP has good reason to believe there was botulinum toxin in the carrots then he should go seek out Canada's Free Health Care System immediately. Not joking. It would be interesting to see his SGOT/SGPT levels (indicators of liver damage). In any case, the reason he's not getting sick (yet) from ingesting mold is probably because he removes most of the contamination beforehand, not because he eats pickles afterwards. That, or he has Superman's liver.
In any case, botulinum toxin is a protein which can only be deactivated by cooking. Home-canned non-acid foods like carrots are vulnerable because the canning process might not be strong enough to kill the bacterial spores, and since botulism bacteria can grow quite well without oxygen this leaves them to grow uninhibited inside the can. Home canners can prevent this by adding more salt or vinegar or both to prevent the growth, but with many people home canning is an inexact science, so to speak, and the quality control is often lacking. Thanks for the input. I read the CDC link you provided and if I notice any symptoms I will go to the ER ASAP. But I don't think I should go right now because what would they even do? Pump my stomach? That would be a complete waste of two rum&cokes and seven pickles. |
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Quoted: Thanks for the input. I read the CDC link you provided and if I notice any symptoms I will go to the ER ASAP. But I don't think I should go right now because what would they even do? Pump my stomach? That would be a complete waste of two rum&cokes and seven pickles. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Eat some strong dill pickles. The vinegar will help kill any bad stuff that got into your stomach. http://i30.tinypic.com/2nu13qs.jpg Botulinum toxin is the most deadly substance on a per gram basis known to man; ingesting even a small amount can be fatal if not treated. If the OP has good reason to believe there was botulinum toxin in the carrots then he should go seek out Canada's Free Health Care System immediately. Not joking. It would be interesting to see his SGOT/SGPT levels (indicators of liver damage). In any case, the reason he's not getting sick (yet) from ingesting mold is probably because he removes most of the contamination beforehand, not because he eats pickles afterwards. That, or he has Superman's liver. In any case, botulinum toxin is a protein which can only be deactivated by cooking. Home-canned non-acid foods like carrots are vulnerable because the canning process might not be strong enough to kill the bacterial spores, and since botulism bacteria can grow quite well without oxygen this leaves them to grow uninhibited inside the can. Home canners can prevent this by adding more salt or vinegar or both to prevent the growth, but with many people home canning is an inexact science, so to speak, and the quality control is often lacking. Thanks for the input. I read the CDC link you provided and if I notice any symptoms I will go to the ER ASAP. But I don't think I should go right now because what would they even do? Pump my stomach? That would be a complete waste of two rum&cokes and seven pickles. If they thought you had botulism they'd shoot you up with the antitoxin -- which being made from horse serum would probably hurt like crazy.  |
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It's your lucky day. I just got another 1200 round crate of norinco 5.56 in the mail today. So who wants the guns? I'll just wait it out. If my face gets paralyzed I will go to the ER. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I dont think the jar was sealed properly, lid popped off pretty easy. It didn't taste like salt or vinegar. I guess they were originally pickled in vinegar but the carrots were soggy and tasted like dog shit and old socks Confirmed. Dibs on ammo. It's your lucky day. I just got another 1200 round crate of norinco 5.56 in the mail today. So who wants the guns? I'll just wait it out. If my face gets paralyzed I will go to the ER. Botox on the cheap. |
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Quoted: I will swing by the ER tomorrow then. Why would it hurt because it's horse serum? Will I still be able to go the cabin this weekend to go shooting, dirt biking etc? Because being mostly antibodies, it's made up of very large proteins suspended in solution. Unlike, say, penicillin or some other type of drug, which is much, much smaller. Think about how peanut butter would flow through a small needle, as opposed to salt water.... I would be very surprised if you have it, but then again I'm not a doctor and I'm not there to diagnose you, so just pay close attention to any symptoms which show up in the next 24-36 hours. |
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I don't know man, but, when I was a teen, one of my friends had a collie dog named Botch ( for Botulism ), and the story was, that somehow it got Botchulism when it was about 9 years old , was taken to the vet and treated, still nearly died.
The dog didn't get around real good at all, ( of course by this time it was about 11 years old ), and nearly every step it took, a clump of fur would fall off revealing a new patch of skin, which they rubbed some sort of salve, or lotion on. It lived til it was 12, and nearly without fur. They were gonna just shoot it, but , they just couldn't. It really acted like it wanted to live. It would waddle haphazardly to the school bus when my friends little sister would come home, little pieces of fur falling as it went. It was an arduous trip, about 15 yards, and it took nearly 5 minutes to get there, due to it's almost circular path, ( think Family Circus, but drunk and lumbering ). The fact that it was nearly blind in one eye from the disease, and completely missing the other one probably had something to do with it too. But, it was still a loyal dog. It would move in your general direction if you called it. Usually, if it heard you. Old Botch's hearing was almost completely gone. It did still love to go hunting. We'd get there real early before daylight and get our guns and all ready to head to the woods. Old Botch would be patiently waiting on us. Well, it would be asleep. Then Scott, the owner, my friend, would call it , and occasionally it would open it's good eye and signal us that he wanted to be lifted to his feet so he could hunt. Sometimes you just had to shake it though to wake it up, and then pick it up so it could get moving. Early mornings were tough. We'd head to the woods, with Botch following sort of right behind us. Sort of. It's two good legs were on one side and the two bad ones, nearly paralyzed from the disease were on the other. So , it really didn't move in a straight line. This worked well for bird hunting, as the birds never could figure out exactly which direction the dog was coming from, and basically Botch was inadvertently circling around on them. Since it couldn't hear, gunshots really didn't bother it. so it could stay out with the birds as long as we were really careful not to hit it. We figured, well, if we did hit it, at least it was doing what it loved. The only really bad thing, was that it smelled terrible. It couldn't sneak up on a person. You could smell it 50 feet away, plus, it made a funny noise when it was breathing, sort of a squeaky sound, but it sounded happy. I think the odor actually helped cover our scent when we went deer hunting. It certainly helped draw in predators when coyote hunting. Sadly, Botch died, while doing what he loved not long after the last time I got to go over there and hunt with them. You know, Scott said if he hadn't let him get in his mom's old canned vegetables that they were gonna throw out, the dog probably would have never gotten sick. OP, I hope you feel better. |
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I don't know man, but, when I was a teen, one of my friends had a collie dog named Botch ( for Botulism ), and the story was, that somehow it got Botchulism when it was about 9 years old , was taken to the vet and treated, still nearly died. The dog didn't get around real good at all, ( of course by this time it was about 11 years old ), and nearly every step it took, a clump of fur would fall off revealing a new patch of skin, which they rubbed some sort of salve, or lotion on. It lived til it was 12, and nearly without fur. They were gonna just shoot it, but , they just couldn't. It really acted like it wanted to live. It would waddle haphazardly to the school bus when my friends little sister would come home, little pieces of fur falling as it went. It was an arduous trip, about 15 yards, and it took nearly 5 minutes to get there, due to it's almost circular path, ( think Family Circus, but drunk and lumbering ). The fact that it was nearly blind in one eye from the disease, and completely missing the other one probably had something to do with it too. But, it was still a loyal dog. It would move in your general direction if you called it. Usually, if it heard you. Old Botch's hearing was almost completely gone. It did still love to go hunting. We'd get there real early before daylight and get our guns and all ready to head to the woods. Old Botch would be patiently waiting on us. Well, it would be asleep. Then Scott, the owner, my friend, would call it , and occasionally it would open it's good eye and signal us that he wanted to be lifted to his feet so he could hunt. Sometimes you just had to shake it though to wake it up, and then pick it up so it could get moving. Early mornings were tough. We'd head to the woods, with Botch following sort of right behind us. Sort of. It's two good legs were on one side and the two bad ones, nearly paralyzed from the disease were on the other. So , it really didn't move in a straight line. This worked well for bird hunting, as the birds never could figure out exactly which direction the dog was coming from. Since it couldn't hear, gunshots really didn't bother it. so it could stay out with the birds as long as we were really careful not to hit it. We figure, well, if we did, at least it was doing what it loved. The only really bad thing, was that it smelled terrible. It couldn't sneak up on a person. You could smell it 50 feet away, plus, it made a funny noise when it was breathing, sort of a squeaky sound, but it sound happy. I think the odor actually helped cover our scent when we went deer hunting. It certainly helped draw in predators when coyote hunting. Sadly, Botch died, while doing what he loved not long after the last time I got to go over there and hunt with them. You know, Scott said if he hadn't let him get in his mom's old canned vegetables that they were gonna throw out, the dog probably would have never gotten sick. OP, I hope you feel better. Fuck. That's not the shit I want to hear right now. I feel great otherwise. |
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I don't know man, but, when I was a teen, one of my friends had a collie dog named Botch ( for Botulism ), and the story was, that somehow it got Botchulism when it was about 9 years old , was taken to the vet and treated, still nearly died. The dog didn't get around real good at all, ( of course by this time it was about 11 years old ), and nearly every step it took, a clump of fur would fall off revealing a new patch of skin, which they rubbed some sort of salve, or lotion on. It lived til it was 12, and nearly without fur. They were gonna just shoot it, but , they just couldn't. It really acted like it wanted to live. It would waddle haphazardly to the school bus when my friends little sister would come home, little pieces of fur falling as it went. It was an arduous trip, about 15 yards, and it took nearly 5 minutes to get there, due to it's almost circular path, ( think Family Circus, but drunk and lumbering ). The fact that it was nearly blind in one eye from the disease, and completely missing the other one probably had something to do with it too. But, it was still a loyal dog. It would move in your general direction if you called it. Usually, if it heard you. Old Botch's hearing was almost completely gone. It did still love to go hunting. We'd get there real early before daylight and get our guns and all ready to head to the woods. Old Botch would be patiently waiting on us. Well, it would be asleep. Then Scott, the owner, my friend, would call it , and occasionally it would open it's good eye and signal us that he wanted to be lifted to his feet so he could hunt. Sometimes you just had to shake it though to wake it up, and then pick it up so it could get moving. Early mornings were tough. We'd head to the woods, with Botch following sort of right behind us. Sort of. It's two good legs were on one side and the two bad ones, nearly paralyzed from the disease were on the other. So , it really didn't move in a straight line. This worked well for bird hunting, as the birds never could figure out exactly which direction the dog was coming from, and basically Botch was inadvertently circling around on them. Since it couldn't hear, gunshots really didn't bother it. so it could stay out with the birds as long as we were really careful not to hit it. We figured, well, if we did hit it, at least it was doing what it loved. The only really bad thing, was that it smelled terrible. It couldn't sneak up on a person. You could smell it 50 feet away, plus, it made a funny noise when it was breathing, sort of a squeaky sound, but it sounded happy. I think the odor actually helped cover our scent when we went deer hunting. It certainly helped draw in predators when coyote hunting. Sadly, Botch died, while doing what he loved not long after the last time I got to go over there and hunt with them. You know, Scott said if he hadn't let him get in his mom's old canned vegetables that they were gonna throw out, the dog probably would have never gotten sick. OP, I hope you feel better. Ya know, that shot of horse semen don't sound so bad after all... |
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Ya know, that shot of horse semen don't sound so bad after all... Quoted:
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I don't know man, but, when I was a teen, one of my friends had a collie dog named Botch ( for Botulism ), and the story was, that somehow it got Botchulism when it was about 9 years old , was taken to the vet and treated, still nearly died. The dog didn't get around real good at all, ( of course by this time it was about 11 years old ), and nearly every step it took, a clump of fur would fall off revealing a new patch of skin, which they rubbed some sort of salve, or lotion on. It lived til it was 12, and nearly without fur. They were gonna just shoot it, but , they just couldn't. It really acted like it wanted to live. It would waddle haphazardly to the school bus when my friends little sister would come home, little pieces of fur falling as it went. It was an arduous trip, about 15 yards, and it took nearly 5 minutes to get there, due to it's almost circular path, ( think Family Circus, but drunk and lumbering ). The fact that it was nearly blind in one eye from the disease, and completely missing the other one probably had something to do with it too. But, it was still a loyal dog. It would move in your general direction if you called it. Usually, if it heard you. Old Botch's hearing was almost completely gone. It did still love to go hunting. We'd get there real early before daylight and get our guns and all ready to head to the woods. Old Botch would be patiently waiting on us. Well, it would be asleep. Then Scott, the owner, my friend, would call it , and occasionally it would open it's good eye and signal us that he wanted to be lifted to his feet so he could hunt. Sometimes you just had to shake it though to wake it up, and then pick it up so it could get moving. Early mornings were tough. We'd head to the woods, with Botch following sort of right behind us. Sort of. It's two good legs were on one side and the two bad ones, nearly paralyzed from the disease were on the other. So , it really didn't move in a straight line. This worked well for bird hunting, as the birds never could figure out exactly which direction the dog was coming from, and basically Botch was inadvertently circling around on them. Since it couldn't hear, gunshots really didn't bother it. so it could stay out with the birds as long as we were really careful not to hit it. We figured, well, if we did hit it, at least it was doing what it loved. The only really bad thing, was that it smelled terrible. It couldn't sneak up on a person. You could smell it 50 feet away, plus, it made a funny noise when it was breathing, sort of a squeaky sound, but it sounded happy. I think the odor actually helped cover our scent when we went deer hunting. It certainly helped draw in predators when coyote hunting. Sadly, Botch died, while doing what he loved not long after the last time I got to go over there and hunt with them. You know, Scott said if he hadn't let him get in his mom's old canned vegetables that they were gonna throw out, the dog probably would have never gotten sick. OP, I hope you feel better. Ya know, that shot of horse semen don't sound so bad after all... You know, the sad thing is that only about 10% of that story is bullshit. Mostly the age of the dog, and the canned vegetables. It ate something, and it got the disease. I don't remember for sure if the dog was 9-12 or what, or exactly how many years it lived. All the rest, pretty much true. Sadly. |
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Thanks for the input. I read the CDC link you provided and if I notice any symptoms I will go to the ER ASAP. But I don't think I should go right now because what would they even do? Pump my stomach? That would be a complete waste of two rum&cokes and seven pickles. Quoted:
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Eat some strong dill pickles. The vinegar will help kill any bad stuff that got into your stomach. http://i30.tinypic.com/2nu13qs.jpg Botulinum toxin is the most deadly substance on a per gram basis known to man; ingesting even a small amount can be fatal if not treated. If the OP has good reason to believe there was botulinum toxin in the carrots then he should go seek out Canada's Free Health Care System immediately. Not joking. It would be interesting to see his SGOT/SGPT levels (indicators of liver damage). In any case, the reason he's not getting sick (yet) from ingesting mold is probably because he removes most of the contamination beforehand, not because he eats pickles afterwards. That, or he has Superman's liver.
In any case, botulinum toxin is a protein which can only be deactivated by cooking. Home-canned non-acid foods like carrots are vulnerable because the canning process might not be strong enough to kill the bacterial spores, and since botulism bacteria can grow quite well without oxygen this leaves them to grow uninhibited inside the can. Home canners can prevent this by adding more salt or vinegar or both to prevent the growth, but with many people home canning is an inexact science, so to speak, and the quality control is often lacking. Thanks for the input. I read the CDC link you provided and if I notice any symptoms I will go to the ER ASAP. But I don't think I should go right now because what would they even do? Pump my stomach? That would be a complete waste of two rum&cokes and seven pickles. Too many quotable moments in this thread... |