[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Subaru Outback? (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 9/10/2012 6:44:02 AM EDT
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Looking to get some opinions here.
I currently drive a 95 F150 Lightning. The truck has 98K on it and it is in fantastic shape. No rot or rust, and it runs amazing. Has a few mods done to it. I know I can get 6500-7K for it. I have only had it for a year. However she is a fucking pig on gas. I am talking 12 at best in city and 15 highway. I have started to do a lot more driving. Starting up on my shooting league again and with gas just hitting 4 a gallon yesterday I am starting to consider getting something else. Not to mention this truck is just scary in the snow. I mean, its a lot of fun as far as just being sideways all the time but when they don't plow (which is often as my state is damn near bankrupt) I am always worried about getting actually stuck with it. Luckily last year we had a super light winter, but I am getting this feeling that this year is not going to be the same. But for the 6 years before I had this truck I drove a lifted, locked, armored, and trail beaten 97 Cherokee on 35's. So snow was NEVER a concern to me. So my budget would be what I can get for the truck. If I had 6500 to spend I have found some Outbacks that I like. I want to go drive one later on today just to see them in person but online they look nice. They average about 23mpg, have AWD, TONS of room, and from what I know Subaru seems to be reliable. Anyone here know anything about these cars? Are they good cars? Is the auto reliable? I don't really care if it is an auto or a standard, but I am finding almost all of them to be autos. Is this a dumb move? Assuming the Outback is perfectly reliable, I feel its a way more convenient vehicle to have. I cant go straight gay and get like a Corolla or something. I need something that is at least somewhat interesting to drive. So the outback gets about 23mpg which is a LOT better than my truck and I think I can deal with that. I also like the Imprezas but the outback has a lot more room. However I never have passengers in the back, so an Impreza may not be a bad idea as well.. What do you think? And here is my truck: 
Here is what I am looking into. Like 2002-2005 ish is in my price range. (Just some random pics off google. But I do like the blue gold colors) 
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Quoted: Well I am not a lesbian as far as I know. However, my girl is sitting here telling me they are "fucking ugly and stupid looking". I am trying to find something that is more function over form and this is kind of a bitch. They are no dumber than a performance pickup truck... I knew someone with an very early one that had the AT kaboom before the 5,000 mile mark. Except for that one issue, I've never heard of another issue, but I'm no expert. |
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They're solid cars. We've had two. Didn't really need to get rid of the first as it was chugging along without any problems, but we traded it in anyway.
Function over form? They've got it in spades. Great snow cars, too. I think that the model years you're looking at are superior to the current model, FWIW. ETA: Go for it, OP. We need a few more Subbies out there sporting BFLs. To counteract the ones with Coexist stickers. 
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I owned a 2008 Subaru outback, with the 4 cyl non-turbo engine. The auto tranmisson was real slow pig and we did not like it wen we tried it. We opted for the manual transmission. The ability to run the rpm a bit higher meant we had more 'power' when needed.
This was the best winter vehicle ever. Combined with good snow/ice tires (Michelin X Ice) this car woul go anywhere. If the tires arestil making contact with teh ground, you can still drive, steer, brake etc. Add little niceties like heated seats, heated mirrors, etc an you have a winter car without equal. I'd run various four lanes at 70-72 mph. If held a steady speed I'd get over 30 MPG. My best ever was 33 mpg. I live in a rural area, with combined stop and go in traffic and modest 2 lane 55-60 mph driving. average MPG was about 27-28 MPG. Bad news: I liked the car but it was in te shop more often than the hondas, toyotas or fords we have owned. It was absolute hell on tires, and ate up brakes at an amazing speed (and we are not hard on brakes!). I do remember that I had to have the cruise control fixed and the head gaskets replaced due to leaking both under warranty at under 36,000 miles. At the same time I have to completely replace the brakes (rotors, pads, the works). In contrast, our corolla went to over 105,000 miles before needed brake work. The subaru ran okay until about 90,000 miles. Between 90 and 93,000 miles it came unglued. Electrical sytems went to shit. Driver sidewindow woul work itermittenty. Electric door locks fr rea hatch would fuck up. Door would be closed but thecircuits read as open and lights would stay open. Doors could be closed,lights off, but suddenly the switches for doorsensors would falsely sense an open door, turn the lghts on, and start honking with alarm system. All kindsof bugs in the electrical systems. Started leaing oil again, needing anothergasket/seal replacement, and brakes were totally fubar again. In short, the car looked good. And it rode okay. But it was waaaaaaayyyyy to expensive to maintain. I owned one and will not buy another. I replaced it with a toyota rav4 4x4 with the six cyl engine. no issues. 55,000 miles and I have done nothing but put tires on it and do regular maint (oil, filters, etc). Only 25.6 MPG but way more power, more towing, and the $1000 saved in repairs vs the subaru) more than paysfor the couple MPG lost. |
We are on our second one. The current one is 1999 and the only problem was a timing belt and brakes. Some of that came from when we were living off the grid and all that fine dust and crap getting into every inch of it. They have become a lot more expensive but are still rated well. Somehow I ended up with what was my wife's suburu. I butched it up with couple of NRA stickers and it helps that my gsd rides in the back too. 
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I have one of those (looks almost exactly like that). The photo looks like a 2001, not a 2002. Make absolutely damn sure you have one that had the head gaskets re-done already or pass it up. Or it will cost you 6k or whatever, plus 2500 for a gasket job. The "recall treatment" is not good enough, that just delayed the problem until the vehicle was out of warranty. If it's making exhaust noises at all, it'll need a new set of tubes shortly too. That said, mine is reliable, is great in winter, is decently fun to drive, plus has enough "utility" that stuff like camping, hauling firewood, etc. is ok. I like it so much, I am in the market for a brand new one. Carefully inspect the tires, they need to be replaced all four at once so if there's any differential wear or damage you are looking at a tire bill right away too. 23 mpg depends on your driving. I get closer to 21 / 22 and I drive like grandpa. On the highway it'll get 26 maybe 27. |
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My Dad had one he hunted the Texas panhandle with. He ticked off his buds when he kept up with their Suburbans and pickups in the back country. We did have to get out and lift it out of the ruts a couple of times.
I'm looking at a new vehicle in a few years. The head gasket problem I see mentioned and the 4 for 1 tire deal are issues for me. Plus, I have no local dealer for service, if needed. IIRC, on a NEW model it seems the base version is semi-reasonable, but start adding features and they get pricy. As for reliability, 
This is based on the 2012 models and I have no idea what criteria they use, just throwing it out there. I'll probably go with Toyota if nothing changes in the next few years. |
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How much driving do you do per year? As in, how much does gas cost you?
Assuming you get the 23MPG from the Outback, yes that is 50% better than your current ride. Think about this, if you currently drive 12,000 miles/year, that is 800 gallons in the F150 or $3,200 at current gas prices. The Subaru would cost you $2,100/year in gas costs, so you're saving $1,100 in gas, but you've spent $6,500 alone on the car, plus yearly gas. So, it takes you almost 6 years to get your return on investment in the Subaru Outback purchase. I'd say keep the current truck and wait until it falls apart to replace it. |
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Quoted:
My Dad had one he hunted the Texas panhandle with. He ticked off his buds when he kept up with their Suburbans and pickups in the back country. We did have to get out and lift it out of the ruts a couple of times. I'm looking at a new vehicle in a few years. The head gasket problem I see mentioned and the 4 for 1 tire deal are issues for me. Plus, I have no local dealer for service, if needed. IIRC, on a NEW model it seems the base version is semi-reasonable, but start adding features and they get pricy. I'll probably go with Toyota if nothing changes in the next few years. The head gasket issue was supposed to have been fixed after the 04 model year. |
AWESOME all weather car. As said above, make sure the head gaskets have been replaced. I didn't know about that issue until it was too late and ended up having to replace the entire engine.  .
You can go just about anywhere in a good outback. Just about anywhere a standard (non-lifted) 4x4 pickup can go, you can go. It beats the pants off any pickup for snow/sleet/rain highway driving. You'll get better mileage with a manual transmission. Auto trans with the 2.5l non-turbo gets about 20mpg city driving. |
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Quoted:
How much driving do you do per year? As in, how much does gas cost you? Assuming you get the 23MPG from the Outback, yes that is 50% better than your current ride. Think about this, if you currently drive 12,000 miles/year, that is 800 gallons in the F150 or $3,200 at current gas prices. The Subaru would cost you $2,100/year in gas costs, so you're saving $1,100 in gas, but you've spent $6,500 alone on the car, plus yearly gas. So, it takes you almost 6 years to get your return on investment in the Subaru Outback purchase. I'd say keep the current truck and wait until it falls apart to replace it. Good plan if he wants to sit home every time it snows. Driving down the road sideways is not very relaxing. |
| We bought a 2010 brand new for my wife. The thing has been bulletproof for 35000 miles. It absolutely embarasses my 4x4s in thr snow,until it gets to be about a foot deep. Our model year has more ground clearance than an Explorer 4x4,gets great gas mileage,and has lots of room for four adults. Hell,there are even pictures on here of a deer I killed in the back,and the wife has brought it to elk camp several times. It wont be our last one, for sure. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
How much driving do you do per year? As in, how much does gas cost you? Assuming you get the 23MPG from the Outback, yes that is 50% better than your current ride. Think about this, if you currently drive 12,000 miles/year, that is 800 gallons in the F150 or $3,200 at current gas prices. The Subaru would cost you $2,100/year in gas costs, so you're saving $1,100 in gas, but you've spent $6,500 alone on the car, plus yearly gas. So, it takes you almost 6 years to get your return on investment in the Subaru Outback purchase. I'd say keep the current truck and wait until it falls apart to replace it. Good plan if he wants to sit home every time it snows. Driving down the road sideways is not very relaxing. Chains? |
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My Dad had one he hunted the Texas panhandle with. He ticked off his buds when he kept up with their Suburbans and pickups in the back country. We did have to get out and lift it out of the ruts a couple of times. I'm looking at a new vehicle in a few years. The head gasket problem I see mentioned and the 4 for 1 tire deal are issues for me. Plus, I have no local dealer for service, if needed. IIRC, on a NEW model it seems the base version is semi-reasonable, but start adding features and they get pricy. I'll probably go with Toyota if nothing changes in the next few years. The head gasket issue was supposed to have been fixed after the 04 model year. That's encouraging. Tires I can handle. 
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Quoted:
My Dad had one he hunted the Texas panhandle with. He ticked off his buds when he kept up with their Suburbans and pickups in the back country. We did have to get out and lift it out of the ruts a couple of times. I'm looking at a new vehicle in a few years. The head gasket problem I see mentioned and the 4 for 1 tire deal are issues for me. Plus, I have no local dealer for service, if needed. IIRC, on a NEW model it seems the base version is semi-reasonable, but start adding features and they get pricy. As for reliability, http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a288/callgood/jdpowercomp.png This is based on the 2012 models and I have no idea what criteria they use, just throwing it out there. I'll probably go with Toyota if nothing changes in the next few years. That's bullshit first year JD powers crap. It means nothing. |
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Rotate your tires religiously and buy quality snow tires and a set of summer passenger tires and you are golden , buy 2 sets of tires and rims, do it in your driveway. As for brakes well I have done them at 65k and again at 110K, and that is mostly city driving. but if you get one flat yo uhave to get either the same tire back on the rig, OR a whole set of 4 new ones, the tire warrenty is awesome for that. If your tire shop doesn't like it you can call a dealer and say" they want to put one new tire and 3 old ones on my car won't this destroy the differential". and you get 4 new tires. (got a brand new set of blizzak tires cuz 2 got slashed by a vandal, I had to buy valve stems though... 8 bucks). Quality tires are a must if you are going to drive like a bat out of hell in a snow storm through 6 inches of powder. (just saying blizzak, or toyo observes are AWESOME).
My only issues has been a voltage regulator doohicky that is built into the alternator, so I had to buy a whole new alternator(100 bucks? + install( I dont have a garage and it was -30) and my emissions computer went out 2 years ago, the system still works great, just the computer control doesn't so the check engine light stays on(I refuse to spend 600 bucks to get it to turn off, because NOTHING is wrong with it). Also the seat warmer indicator lights went out, so I can get an unexpected hotseat if I bump the button. Yeah I know big complaints for a 11 year old car that has lived in Interior AK for 7 years(think - 50 mornings, and -40 days) and here in Anchorage for 4. |
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How much driving do you do per year? As in, how much does gas cost you? Assuming you get the 23MPG from the Outback, yes that is 50% better than your current ride. Think about this, if you currently drive 12,000 miles/year, that is 800 gallons in the F150 or $3,200 at current gas prices. The Subaru would cost you $2,100/year in gas costs, so you're saving $1,100 in gas, but you've spent $6,500 alone on the car, plus yearly gas. So, it takes you almost 6 years to get your return on investment in the Subaru Outback purchase. I'd say keep the current truck and wait until it falls apart to replace it. He's looking to sell the truck and buy the car. If he can buy the car for what he makes on the truck sale, he would be coming out ahead every year. Even if he has to pay the difference he would be ahead in a year or two, and wouldn't be sliding off the road. OP, don't buy anything from between 1999 and 2004 with a 2.5 liter motor. They are the ones with head gasket problems. |
| I have an '03 Outback w/ a 2.5l and 5 speed transmission. I get between 23-25 mpg. Other than a bad AC compressor it has been dead reliable. It is a beast in the snow, comfortable, lots of cargo room, but a little tight for four adults. It's perfect for two adults and two kids. |
| I have a 2011 outback and so far, my overall average is about 29 mpg. On the highway, I get about 37 mpg. I drive it instead of my Nissan Titan. If you are looking, go for one with the continuous variable transmission. That is what I have, and they supposedly get around 5 mpg better then the standard transmission, or so I was told. |
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Thanks for the replies guys!
I am going to go check one out in person in the next few days. I would be selling my truck to get one, so price of it would just be a wash. We shall see. I don't care about rear legroom as I hate passengers other than in the front. Bird is the word! |
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You're mean! Just to say that there are those of us who drive Foresters who don't look like quaterbacks for the Detroit Lakers! So what does my Forester look like? Dinged and no bumper stickers.....I left those back with my first undergrad. No college decals either. It does often do bike duty 
and even without them mounted, having the rack there is a good thing. Got rear ended once and the impact on the rack transferred the shock to the towing rig. The rear seat is often folded down and the cargo area filled 
Even if it isn't stuffed 
it is still carrying tools, kitty litter, shopping bags, water, etc.. Lots of room to live a life of being prepared.........to say nothing of the 
It's a lifestyle for sure.....but not necessarily one lives in bed. ________________________________________________________ ("Wow. Prenatal yoga this morning, and now you want to crash a stranger's funeral? You really do need friends."––Piper "You're mean."––Paige, (w,stte), Charmed, "The Eyes Have It") |
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Great if you're a lesbian who likes to appear adventurous. No, that's the Forester.  No, it's the Outback.. 
The Forester is #2. |
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Quoted: How would I know if the head gaskets have been replaced if the seller does not know? I am very mechanically inclined just not with Subaru. Is an 01 with 200k with a 5 speed for 2800 a bad deal if its in immaculate shape? It might be evident by wrench marks on parts of the motor, I think there's some big bolts that hold the heads on. No reason to have marks on those if the motor wasn't taken apart. If they don't know though.... is this a dealer? or private party? Another sign of problems is frequent 02 sensor failures, ask about that. Mine went through three of them in a short period of time before the gasket leak got bad enough to notice.
That's a decent deal. They go for 1800 at auction in "rough" shape. Good shape, that's at or below auction price. (edmunds.com) Look up the methods for looking for gasket leaks, then do them, and if you find anything fishy take it to a mechanic to get the question asked specifically. It might not suffer the head gasket issue. Every one I know from that period did though, so it's not like it wasn't a common problem. |
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I've got an 03 Legacy sedan, and other than being slow as balls it's an awesome car. I bought it since I drive to matches that are a good distance away, and I was tired of dealing with shitty mileage in my Jeep, as well as poor handling and just general being miserable to drive. The Legacy with decent tires (I'm using Conti Extreme Contact DWS) handles surprisingly well, with decent transitions and a shockingly high level of absolute grip. I don't offroad it in any sort of hardcore manner, but I've also taken it up many logging roads to get to shooting areas and never had any problems, often having to slow down and wait for whoever is following me in a truck. In the snow it's amazing, last year we had a pretty good storm and I drove around the whole time, while many vehicles were useless.
The earlier EJ251 motors did have the head gasket issues, but if you can find something 2003 or newer you should not have any problems. 
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I'm picking up a brand new one this week. The newer ones have an ugly front ends but the interior space is amazing. For me, the win is being able to get sissy options like heated seats yet still being able to have a manual transmission and it still being less expensive then any domestic branded AWD vehicle.
If looking at 2001-2005 models, I will also caution you about the head gaskets. They are pretty solid cars with the exception of that issue. Also check the rear sub-frame for severe rust as a couple people have had issues with that in rust belt states. Finally, I'd suggest a manual transmission over the automatic. Subaru automatic transmissions make gutless cars feel even more gutless (the exception being the new CVT's, if you trust CVT's). ETA: The biggest problem of owning an Outback is the stigma associated with it. It seems like at least 90% of Outbacks have either a peace sticker, an Obama sticker, a rainbow sticker, a tree hugger type sticker, or a combination of those stickers. |
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Well I am not a lesbian as far as I know. However, my girl is sitting here telling me they are "fucking ugly and stupid looking". I am trying to find something that is more function over form and this is kind of a bitch. Yeah, I'd be looking for a new girl too! |
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Quoted: I'm picking up a brand new one this week. The newer ones have an ugly front ends but the interior space is amazing. For me, the win is being able to get sissy options like heated seats yet still being able to have a manual transmission and it still being less expensive then any domestic branded AWD vehicle. If looking at 2001-2005 models, I will also caution you about the head gaskets. They are pretty solid cars with the exception of that issue. Also check the rear sub-frame for severe rust as a couple people have had issues with that in rust belt states. Finally, I'd suggest a manual transmission over the automatic. Subaru automatic transmissions make gutless cars feel even more gutless (the exception being the new CVT's, if you trust CVT's). ETA: The biggest problem of owning an Outback is the stigma associated with it. It seems like at least 90% of Outbacks have either a peace sticker, an Obama sticker, a rainbow sticker, a tree hugger type sticker, or a combination of those stickers. Which model are you getting? I've been looking at the Outback also, but I can't decide between the highend or low end. Manual or Auto. Is the 3.6 engine available with the Manual transmission? |
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Any info on the CVT the newer ones are using? Been thinking about a Forester or Outback myself, but leery of the transmission. I've been watching the Outback forums pretty good. There hasn't been any reports of the CVT's needing repairs. The biggest issue that I've heard of is the 2010-2012's (the first gen CVT's) cannot back over something over a few inches in height (like a curb) unless you have momentum. The second gen CVT in the 2013 Outback has fixed this issue. The CVT's are supposed to get slightly better gas mileage then the manual transmission and judging by the Outback forums, both get very good gas mileage for an AWD vehicle. The Forester still has a traditional 4 speed automatic transmission. Keep in mind that the new generation of Forester is being released in a year so the value of the current generation will likely tank once the new one is released. With that being said, the Forester is a good value right now so you are still getting a decent deal even if the value goes down in a year. |