Posted: 6/15/2012 4:22:42 PM EDT
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http://www.idahostatesman.com/2012/06/14/2154426/exploding-targets-causing-fires.html
A new shooting craze has started range blazes and can make shooters liable for damages.
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This is complete and utter bullshit. I work as a wildlands firefighter here in Idaho in support of the IDARG on their firing ranges.
Recently, one of my co-workers who works at a well known sporting goods chain part time was at the gun counter when an "investigator" from the BLM came into his store the other day to ask about "exploding targets". He did everything in his power short of using a large bludgeoning object to get her to understand that the "exploding targets" sold in retail stores didn't produce flame when impacted by a projectile. She wouldn't acknowledge his information because "exploding targets" were found at the site of the fires, according to her. She was demanding that the store post signs that such targets were "illegal" to use on BLM land as part of their fire-prevention program. I couldn't believe it-as if the BLM now has authority to declare this or that item "illegal" by simply issuing an edict-Congress be damned. ETA: By "bullshit", I meant to say the story is true, but the situation is a load of crap. |
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It pains me to rain on any hate parades, but it IS entirely possible for binary exploding targets to start wildfires. I know this, because I've personally witnessed one occur on a public range in full view of several dozen individuals. This was a few years ago during a drought, and one of the shooters on the line had taped several of the small popper targets onto his cardboard backer on the rifle range. Once the range was hot and he began shooting, one of the poppers ignited the paper it was taped to. The cardboard burned at a modest clip, and once a piece of it detached itself and fell onto the ground, it managed to ignite the grass underneath the targets.
By the time the shooter noticed it and realized it wasn't going out on its own (and that he should prboably say something rather than run), it had already started spreading out from underneath the target frame. We called the line cold and ran downrange to stomp the fire out as best we could using our shoes and whatever was nearby. Thankfully it hadn't spread more than a dozen feet, allowing it to be rapidly quenched before it spread to any larger fuel sources on the edges of the grassy field. TL;DR: Don't shoot binary targets on top of flammable material in a drought, or you'll set shit on fire. |
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It pains me to rain on any hate parades, but it IS entirely possible for binary exploding targets to start wildfires. I know this, because I've personally witnessed one occur on a public range in full view of several dozen individuals. This was a few years ago during a drought, and one of the shooters on the line had taped several of the small popper targets onto his cardboard backer on the rifle range. Once the range was hot and he began shooting, one of the poppers ignited the paper it was taped to. The cardboard burned at a modest clip, and once a piece of it detached itself and fell onto the ground, it managed to ignite the grass underneath the targets. By the time the shooter noticed it and realized it wasn't going out on its own (and that he should prboably say something rather than run), it had already started spreading out from underneath the target frame. We called the line cold and ran downrange to stomp the fire out as best we could using our shoes and whatever was nearby. Thankfully it hadn't spread more than a dozen feet, allowing it to be rapidly quenched before it spread to any larger fuel sources on the edges of the grassy field. TL;DR: Don't shoot binary targets on top of flammable material in a drought, or you'll set shit on fire. I will say that I've put out several fires in a day on some of our ranges caused by linked ball munitions and NOT "4 in 1" ball / tracer. RH is generally low, with temps in the high '80s and higher with the ground covered in dry grass and sage brush fueled by significant breezes and / or wind gusts. That said, is it possible your binary targets weren't the cause, after all? |
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The shooting range near me caught on fire last summer from... - wait for it - BULLETS. I had several water bottles I was shooting that I handed out to other shooters to help put it out. Burned about 1 acre before we got it out.
Banning tannerite is phase one of the plan to ban shooting on BLM land. Fires can and will still occur once tannerite is banned. |
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The shooting range near me caught on fire last summer from... - wait for it - BULLETS. I had several water bottles I was shooting that I handed out to other shooters to help put it out. Burned about 1 acre before we got it out. Banning tannerite is phase one of the plan to ban shooting on BLM land. Fires can and will still occur once tannerite is banned. I saw someone shoot small propane bottles with tracers. The self-propelled can streaming a jet of flaming propane started the brush on fire. That was the last time I shot with that group of people. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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I don't live very far from where those retards started that fire on Wednesday night. I saw the flames from my house and was pissed that they did some dumb shit like that. I hope like hell we don't lose these areas to shoot in due to reckless shooters.
I also think the people responsible for this should get hammered for it as an example for other shooters. |
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It pains me to rain on any hate parades, but it IS entirely possible for binary exploding targets to start wildfires. I know this, because I've personally witnessed one occur on a public range in full view of several dozen individuals. This was a few years ago during a drought, and one of the shooters on the line had taped several of the small popper targets onto his cardboard backer on the rifle range. Once the range was hot and he began shooting, one of the poppers ignited the paper it was taped to. The cardboard burned at a modest clip, and once a piece of it detached itself and fell onto the ground, it managed to ignite the grass underneath the targets. By the time the shooter noticed it and realized it wasn't going out on its own (and that he should prboably say something rather than run), it had already started spreading out from underneath the target frame. We called the line cold and ran downrange to stomp the fire out as best we could using our shoes and whatever was nearby. Thankfully it hadn't spread more than a dozen feet, allowing it to be rapidly quenched before it spread to any larger fuel sources on the edges of the grassy field. TL;DR: Don't shoot binary targets on top of flammable material in a drought, or you'll set shit on fire. Those weren't binary targets. |
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Quoted: It pains me to rain on any hate parades, but it IS entirely possible for binary exploding targets to start wildfires. I know this, because I've personally witnessed one occur on a public range in full view of several dozen individuals. This was a few years ago during a drought, and one of the shooters on the line had taped several of the small popper targets onto his cardboard backer on the rifle range. Once the range was hot and he began shooting, one of the poppers ignited the paper it was taped to. The cardboard burned at a modest clip, and once a piece of it detached itself and fell onto the ground, it managed to ignite the grass underneath the targets. By the time the shooter noticed it and realized it wasn't going out on its own (and that he should prboably say something rather than run), it had already started spreading out from underneath the target frame. We called the line cold and ran downrange to stomp the fire out as best we could using our shoes and whatever was nearby. Thankfully it hadn't spread more than a dozen feet, allowing it to be rapidly quenched before it spread to any larger fuel sources on the edges of the grassy field. TL;DR: Don't shoot binary targets on top of flammable material in a drought, or you'll set shit on fire. Chemistry fail. The small popper targets are made with Flashpowder. (powdered aluminum with an oxidizer) It's pretty much the same stuff used in firecrackers and M-80's. It doesn't detonate, but it burns very rapidly. They can cause fires. Tannerite is ammonium nitrate with powdered aluminum. It detonates when impacted. The shockwave will actually extinguish fire. However, it will certainly cause a conflagration when combined with gasoline or propane and an open flame.  |
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It pains me to rain on any hate parades, but it IS entirely possible for binary exploding targets to start wildfires. I know this, because I've personally witnessed one occur on a public range in full view of several dozen individuals. This was a few years ago during a drought, and one of the shooters on the line had taped several of the small popper targets onto his cardboard backer on the rifle range. Once the range was hot and he began shooting, one of the poppers ignited the paper it was taped to. The cardboard burned at a modest clip, and once a piece of it detached itself and fell onto the ground, it managed to ignite the grass underneath the targets. By the time the shooter noticed it and realized it wasn't going out on its own (and that he should prboably say something rather than run), it had already started spreading out from underneath the target frame. We called the line cold and ran downrange to stomp the fire out as best we could using our shoes and whatever was nearby. Thankfully it hadn't spread more than a dozen feet, allowing it to be rapidly quenched before it spread to any larger fuel sources on the edges of the grassy field. TL;DR: Don't shoot binary targets on top of flammable material in a drought, or you'll set shit on fire. Chemistry fail. The small popper targets are made with Flashpowder. (powdered aluminum with an oxidizer) It's pretty much the same stuff used in firecrackers and M-80's. It doesn't detonate, but it burns very rapidly. They can cause fires. Tannerite is ammonium nitrate with powdered aluminum. It detonates when impacted. The shockwave will actually extinguish fire. However, it will certainly cause a conflagration when combined with gasoline or propane and an open flame.
Not always, my friend. We had a 1/2 pounder set a grass area on fire and it was on top of rocks and off the ground. Tannerite will start a fire just fine, thanks. |
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I don't live very far from where those retards started that fire on Wednesday night. I saw the flames from my house and was pissed that they did some dumb shit like that. I hope like hell we don't lose these areas to shoot in due to reckless shooters. I also think the people responsible for this should get hammered for it as an example for other shooters. Agreed...idiots should be heald accountable for their actions. Anyhow, that area is just south of me... |
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Wonder if this is another fabricated story targeting shooters. They've done it before. Who? You mean that website? Yeah, a few years ago they did one about "illegal shooting" where they photoshopped a shooter shooting behind a 'No Shooting beyond this sign' sign |
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I don't live very far from where those retards started that fire on Wednesday night. I saw the flames from my house and was pissed that they did some dumb shit like that. I hope like hell we don't lose these areas to shoot in due to reckless shooters. I also think the people responsible for this should get hammered for it as an example for other shooters. Agreed...idiots should be heald accountable for their actions. Anyhow, that area is just south of me... You damn kids quit burning the desert down!!! |
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We had a fire start at a range outting a few weeks ago.
Have video from a few angles also. T Quoted:
This is complete and utter bullshit. I work as a wildlands firefighter here in Idaho in support of the IDARG on their firing ranges. Recently, one of my co-workers who works at a well known sporting goods chain part time was at the gun counter when an "investigator" from the BLM came into his store the other day to ask about "exploding targets". He did everything in his power short of using a large bludgeoning object to get her to understand that the "exploding targets" sold in retail stores didn't produce flame when impacted by a projectile. She wouldn't acknowledge his information because "exploding targets" were found at the site of the fires, according to her. She was demanding that the store post signs that such targets were "illegal" to use on BLM land as part of their fire-prevention program. I couldn't believe it-as if the BLM now has authority to declare this or that item "illegal" by simply issuing an edict-Congress be damned. ETA: By "bullshit", I meant to say the story is true, but the situation is a load of crap. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Any bets as to how soon the Boise Cabelas gets pressured into pulling binary targets from the shelves? Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile I could see cabelas doing that ANYWHERE for ANY REASON. When it comes to citizen's rights, they fold like a lawn chair. Now, everywhere else in the gem state is a different story. Guns epitomize the culture here. The only motivation I can see for the statesman publishing the article is as a "be careful and donk fuck it up for the rest of us" statement. |
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I don't live very far from where those retards started that fire on Wednesday night. I saw the flames from my house and was pissed that they did some dumb shit like that. I hope like hell we don't lose these areas to shoot in due to reckless shooters. I also think the people responsible for this should get hammered for it as an example for other shooters. We saw the smoke from a range fairly close to MATES that late afternoon shortly after it started. We called it in and one of our trucks made it to the top of Christmas mountain on Range 1 and reported back to RC that the fire was on the other side of the Snake River. I thought for sure the fire was closer due to the smoke. On the way home that night after 2200, I saw it burn like hell off exit 64 and I actually thought the flames were less than a mile away from I-84. They were actually much further away than I thought. |
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I don't live very far from where those retards started that fire on Wednesday night. I saw the flames from my house and was pissed that they did some dumb shit like that. I hope like hell we don't lose these areas to shoot in due to reckless shooters. I also think the people responsible for this should get hammered for it as an example for other shooters. Agreed...idiots should be heald accountable for their actions. Anyhow, that area is just south of me... You damn kids quit burning the desert down!!! Last year a kid damned near burnt the neighborhood down by setting the field across the street from me on fire. Kid lit a smoke bomb in his hand...it got hot, so what did the little Einstein do? Tossed it in the dry brush on the other side of the road... Bucket brigade until the fire crew could make it to put the fire out... |
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Quoted: Quoted: It pains me to rain on any hate parades, but it IS entirely possible for binary exploding targets to start wildfires. I know this, because I've personally witnessed one occur on a public range in full view of several dozen individuals. This was a few years ago during a drought, and one of the shooters on the line had taped several of the small popper targets onto his cardboard backer on the rifle range. Once the range was hot and he began shooting, one of the poppers ignited the paper it was taped to. The cardboard burned at a modest clip, and once a piece of it detached itself and fell onto the ground, it managed to ignite the grass underneath the targets. By the time the shooter noticed it and realized it wasn't going out on its own (and that he should prboably say something rather than run), it had already started spreading out from underneath the target frame. We called the line cold and ran downrange to stomp the fire out as best we could using our shoes and whatever was nearby. Thankfully it hadn't spread more than a dozen feet, allowing it to be rapidly quenched before it spread to any larger fuel sources on the edges of the grassy field. TL;DR: Don't shoot binary targets on top of flammable material in a drought, or you'll set shit on fire. Chemistry fail. The small popper targets are made with Flashpowder. (powdered aluminum with an oxidizer) It's pretty much the same stuff used in firecrackers and M-80's. It doesn't detonate, but it burns very rapidly. They can cause fires. Tannerite is ammonium nitrate with powdered aluminum. It detonates when impacted. The shockwave will actually extinguish fire. However, it will certainly cause a conflagration when combined with gasoline or propane and an open flame. Chemistry note: Those two things you describe are essentially the same. Ammonium nitrate is...wait for it...an oxidizer. |
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The shooting range near me caught on fire last summer from... - wait for it - BULLETS. I had several water bottles I was shooting that I handed out to other shooters to help put it out. Burned about 1 acre before we got it out. Banning tannerite is phase one of the plan to ban shooting on BLM land. Fires can and will still occur once tannerite is banned. I saw someone shoot small propane bottles with tracers. The self-propelled can streaming a jet of flaming propane started the brush on fire. That was the last time I shot with that group of people. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Ha Ha. I'm totally doing that once winter comes. |
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Quoted: At all the turn offs to the west desert from I80 now there are signs that say $250 fine for using exploding targets here now. Never a problem before. New fire regulations: http://www.blm.gov/pgdata/etc/medialib/blm/ut/salt_lake_fo/fire/fire_management_documents.Par.55190.File.dat/Fire_Prevention_Order_2011.pdf Considering how dry it is this year, I'm not surprised. However, I was surprised at how few "no shooting" areas there are on BLM land: http://www.blm.gov/pgdata/etc/medialib/blm/ut/salt_lake_fo/recreation/target_shooting0.Par.48500.File.dat/target_shooting_closures.pdf |
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You absolutely can start a fire with binary explosives. I don't understand why anyone thinks you can't. It's a big release of energy in the form of heat, sound, and light.
I've detonated binary that's started some grass around it on fire. Ammonium nitrate and aluminum powder. That is binary. It absolutely is possible. |
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At all the turn offs to the west desert from I80 now there are signs that say $250 fine for using exploding targets here now. Never a problem before. New fire regulations: http://www.blm.gov/pgdata/etc/medialib/blm/ut/salt_lake_fo/fire/fire_management_documents.Par.55190.File.dat/Fire_Prevention_Order_2011.pdf Considering how dry it is this year, I'm not surprised. However, I was surprised at how few "no shooting" areas there are on BLM land: http://www.blm.gov/pgdata/etc/medialib/blm/ut/salt_lake_fo/recreation/target_shooting0.Par.48500.File.dat/target_shooting_closures.pdf Thanks. I have some reading to do. |
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You absolutely can start a fire with binary explosives. I don't understand why anyone thinks you can't. It's a big release of energy in the form of heat, sound, and light. I've detonated binary that's started some grass around it on fire. Ammonium nitrate and aluminum powder. That is binary. It absolutely is possible. 
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You absolutely can start a fire with binary explosives. I don't understand why anyone thinks you can't. It's a big release of energy in the form of heat, sound, and light. I've detonated binary that's started some grass around it on fire. Ammonium nitrate and aluminum powder. That is binary. It absolutely is possible.
Thiz guy.... he knows. 
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