Posted: 3/15/2012 6:55:35 AM EDT
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I was listening to a local talk radio guy this morning, and he was talking about concealed carry. Specifically he was talking about concealed carry on college campuses. Someone called into the show who claimed to be a cop and made the argument that carrying is a bad idea because these days cops are trained to shoot anyone with a gun. They were both talking about how the days of cops saying "freeze drop the gun" are over and the way it is today, anyone that the police see with a gun is going to get shot. Um, is this true? Have the police gone to 'shoot anyone with a gun' policies? So now, if I cap someone in self defense, call the police to report a shooting and cover the the guy that I just shot, the police are gonna come and shoot me because they're trained to shoot anyone with a gun? |
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I was listening to a local talk radio guy this morning, and he was talking about concealed carry. Specifically he was talking about concealed carry on college campuses. Someone called into the show who claimed to be a cop and made the argument that carrying is a bad idea because these days cops are trained to shoot anyone with a gun. They were both talking about how the days of cops saying "freeze drop the gun" are over and the way it is today, anyone that the police see with a gun is going to get shot. Um, is this true? Have the police gone to 'shoot anyone with a gun' policies? So now, if I cap someone in self defense, call the police to report a shooting and cover the the guy that I just shot, the police are gonna come and shoot me because they're trained to shoot anyone with a gun? 
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That guy was not a cop.
If I saw someone shooting a gun into a crowd of hippies, I would make sure to assess the situation before shooting a good guy. I mean, he isn't aiming at me. You aim a gun at me, or even come close to it, and you're dead. ...if I were a cop. |
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No secret. The alleged cop who called in is paranoid and maybe so. That does not translate to the rest of us in LE.
If we tell you to "Stop" "Freeze" "Dont move" it would be a good idea to listen to us if you have a gun in your hand. Surely you would not want to turn and point it at us. Having said all of that, it always depends on the call for service and what the officer encounters when they get there. Despite our best efforts, lots of training, and a heavy dose of reality, sometimes Off duty cops are shot and killed because of identity issues, not just citizens. It is the nature of the beast. Cop bashers, flame on. |
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I've never heard of such a thing.
My agency has specifically conducted situational training which had scenarios where you responded to a shots fired call and were met by an off duty officer in plain clothes and/or legal CCW'er covering a person they had just shot. Pretty easy - barring an active shooter situation - verbal commands first. Compliance or non-compliance determines the course of action from there. |
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I was listening to a local talk radio guy this morning, and he was talking about concealed carry. Specifically he was talking about concealed carry on college campuses. Someone called into the show who claimed to be a cop and made the argument that carrying is a bad idea because these days cops are trained to shoot anyone with a gun. They were both talking about how the days of cops saying "freeze drop the gun" are over and the way it is today, anyone that the police see with a gun is going to get shot. Um, is this true? Have the police gone to 'shoot anyone with a gun' policies? So now, if I cap someone in self defense, call the police to report a shooting and cover the the guy that I just shot, the police are gonna come and shoot me because they're trained to shoot anyone with a gun? First reply nails it again. This thread is already full of F***. |
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Quoted: That guy was not a cop. If I saw someone shooting a gun into a crowd of hippies, I would make sure to assess the situation before shooting a good guy. I mean, he isn't aiming at me. You aim a gun at me, or even come close to it, and you're dead. ...if I were a cop. Hmmm. I wasn't entirely focused on the show, but I turned it of when they started saying that by the time the police showed up you should be on your knees with your hands behind your head, weapon cleared, mag out, action open, gun on the ground and screaming 'I'M A GOOD GUY! I'M A GOOD GUY!'. |
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Not all police officers are pro gun. I had one tell me if I went to a gunstore, bought a firearm, put it in my car trunk, and then drive home with it locked in my trunk I would be breaking the law.
If a police officer who doesn't think the average person should be armed notices you have a concealed gun on you, there's a chance the officer will have his weapon out and pointed at you. At that point you're only a fraction of an inch away from having a really bad day. |
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I was listening to a local talk radio guy this morning, and he was talking about concealed carry. Specifically he was talking about concealed carry on college campuses. Someone called into the show who claimed to be a cop and made the argument that carrying is a bad idea because these days cops are trained to shoot anyone with a gun. They were both talking about how the days of cops saying "freeze drop the gun" are over and the way it is today, anyone that the police see with a gun is going to get shot. Um, is this true? Have the police gone to 'shoot anyone with a gun' policies? So now, if I cap someone in self defense, call the police to report a shooting and cover the the guy that I just shot, the police are gonna come and shoot me because they're trained to shoot anyone with a gun? Only in a fucking police state! 
The police have to have a legal reason to shoot. Last I checked they cannot just shoo a person with gun unless they are committing a crime. |
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Quoted: Quoted: I was listening to a local talk radio guy this morning, and he was talking about concealed carry. Specifically he was talking about concealed carry on college campuses. Someone called into the show who claimed to be a cop and made the argument that carrying is a bad idea because these days cops are trained to shoot anyone with a gun. They were both talking about how the days of cops saying "freeze drop the gun" are over and the way it is today, anyone that the police see with a gun is going to get shot. Um, is this true? Have the police gone to 'shoot anyone with a gun' policies? So now, if I cap someone in self defense, call the police to report a shooting and cover the the guy that I just shot, the police are gonna come and shoot me because they're trained to shoot anyone with a gun? Only in a fucking police state! The police have to have a legal reason to shoot. Last I checked they cannot just shoo a person with gun unless they are committing a crime. 'As I approached the scene, I witnessed a particular individual with a firearm pointed at a second particular individual who was laying on the ground bleeding. At that point I exited my vehicle and assessed that the particular individual with the firearm had shot the particular individual who had been shot, and therefore fired on the particular individual with the firearm." |
Birmingham had a case where a cop shot and killed a guy holding down an insane guy with a barbeque fork. The cop told the guy with the fork multiple times to let the guy up and the guy with the fork told him that the guy on the ground was insane. The cop then shot and killed the guy with the fork. The cop then had to fight off and nearly kill the insane guy that got up and attacked the cop.
Impeach Obama for the Good of the Children.
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I was listening to a local talk radio guy this morning, and he was talking about concealed carry. Specifically he was talking about concealed carry on college campuses. Someone called into the show who claimed to be a cop and made the argument that carrying is a bad idea because these days cops are trained to shoot anyone with a gun. They were both talking about how the days of cops saying "freeze drop the gun" are over and the way it is today, anyone that the police see with a gun is going to get shot. Um, is this true? Have the police gone to 'shoot anyone with a gun' policies? So now, if I cap someone in self defense, call the police to report a shooting and cover the the guy that I just shot, the police are gonna come and shoot me because they're trained to shoot anyone with a gun? Only in a fucking police state!
The police have to have a legal reason to shoot. Last I checked they cannot just shoo a person with gun unless they are committing a crime. 'As I approached the scene, I witnessed a particular individual with a firearm pointed at a second particular individual who was laying on the ground bleeding. At that point I exited my vehicle and assessed that the particular individual with the firearm had shot the particular individual who had been shot, and therefore fired on the particular individual with the firearm." So the cop shot a guy that was no longer shooting? WTF. |
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Quoted: Quoted: 'As I approached the scene, I witnessed a particular individual with a firearm pointed at a second particular individual who was laying on the ground bleeding. At that point I exited my vehicle and assessed that the particular individual with the firearm had shot the particular individual who had been shot, and therefore fired on the particular individual with the firearm." Where did this come from? |
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OP- I heard the same show. I'm guessing your local is the same as mine. 570 KLIF?
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I've never heard of such a thing. My agency has specifically conducted situational training which had scenarios where you responded to a shots fired call and were met by an off duty officer in plain clothes and/or legal CCW'er covering a person they had just shot. Pretty easy - barring an active shooter situation - verbal commands first. Compliance or non-compliance determines the course of action from there. My dad (retired cop) told me of this scenario he once saw: detective searching for a fugitive goes to the suspect's parents' house and gets shot at- retreats from the door and calls for backup. Patrol officer responding to the call screeches to a halt, jumps out of the patrol car and shoots the detective who is taking cover behind a vehicle -no warning or attempt to ID; he had a gun in his hand and he got shot. |
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OP- I heard the same show. I'm guessing your local is the same as mine. 570 KLIF? Quoted:
I've never heard of such a thing. My agency has specifically conducted situational training which had scenarios where you responded to a shots fired call and were met by an off duty officer in plain clothes and/or legal CCW'er covering a person they had just shot. Pretty easy - barring an active shooter situation - verbal commands first. Compliance or non-compliance determines the course of action from there. My dad (retired cop) told me of this scenario he once saw: detective searching for a fugitive goes to the suspect's parents' house and gets shot at- retreats from the door and calls for backup. Patrol officer responding to the call screeches to a halt, jumps out of the patrol car and shoots the detective who is taking cover behind a vehicle -no warning or attempt to ID; he had a gun in his hand and he got shot. It's happened plenty, don't get me wrong. But for the caller to make the claim that it's standard LEO SOP to immediately shoot any armed person on sight is total BS. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: 'As I approached the scene, I witnessed a particular individual with a firearm pointed at a second particular individual who was laying on the ground bleeding. At that point I exited my vehicle and assessed that the particular individual with the firearm had shot the particular individual who had been shot, and therefore fired on the particular individual with the firearm." Where did this come from? I made it up...but the 'particular individual' is movie reference. |
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WI LE is having to get used to the changes of people having CCW. WI also passed a law saying that rifles and shotguns don't have to be encased in a vehicle either. They just cannot be loaded.
LEOs are getting more training on how to deal with the new situations they will be coming into. WI LEOs are not taught to shoot whoever has a gun in their had. They are trained to shoot to stop a threat, of GBH or death, to themselves or a 3rd party. |
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I was debating whether to use the straight face smiley or the weird eye guy smiley. I am really torn here. Because answering the question is just plain unthinkable? Are you legitimately under the impression that cops are trained to shoot people when they see a gun? |
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I was debating whether to use the straight face smiley or the weird eye guy smiley. I am really torn here. Because answering the question is just plain unthinkable? Are you legitimately under the impression that cops are trained to shoot people when they see a gun? I can't imagine anyone thinks that. Don't cops frequently give people a chance to drop a weapon unless it's pointed right at them? |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I was debating whether to use the straight face smiley or the weird eye guy smiley. I am really torn here. Because answering the question is just plain unthinkable? Are you legitimately under the impression that cops are trained to shoot people when they see a gun? No, I don't really know. I know that there is a lot of new training and new policies going around with all of this "active shooter" nonsense, so I have no idea what the current procedures and training is. I'm not a cop, I almost never deal with cops and I have no idea what cops are and aren't trained to do. I don't know if cops are or aren't being trained to shoot first when they see a gun...but it wouldn't shock me to learn that they are. |
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OP- I heard the same show. I'm guessing your local is the same as mine. 570 KLIF? Quoted:
I've never heard of such a thing. My agency has specifically conducted situational training which had scenarios where you responded to a shots fired call and were met by an off duty officer in plain clothes and/or legal CCW'er covering a person they had just shot. Pretty easy - barring an active shooter situation - verbal commands first. Compliance or non-compliance determines the course of action from there. My dad (retired cop) told me of this scenario he once saw: detective searching for a fugitive goes to the suspect's parents' house and gets shot at- retreats from the door and calls for backup. Patrol officer responding to the call screeches to a halt, jumps out of the patrol car and shoots the detective who is taking cover behind a vehicle -no warning or attempt to ID; he had a gun in his hand and he got shot. It's happened plenty, don't get me wrong. But for the caller to make the claim that it's standard LEO SOP to immediately shoot any armed person on sight is total BS. I understand. I think there may be a difference between 'policy/procedure' and what happens in the real world. Of course, cops get excited and act hastily- that does not mean that it's a standard practice or policy. I know several college police officers, and ...well... I don't know that they're the best, most well-trained police officers around. |
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So now, if I cap someone in self defense, call the police to report a shooting and cover the the guy that I just shot, the police are gonna come and shoot me because they're trained to shoot anyone with a gun? All you need is........ 
...........and.......... 
Then you're covered! |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I was debating whether to use the straight face smiley or the weird eye guy smiley. I am really torn here. Because answering the question is just plain unthinkable? Are you legitimately under the impression that cops are trained to shoot people when they see a gun? I can't imagine anyone thinks that. Don't cops frequently give people a chance to drop a weapon unless it's pointed right at them? Yeah... Except for all those cases where the cop shot a guy through a window because he thought he saw a gun but it was a Coke can, or shot a guy at a Halloween party (also through a window) who had a toy gun. There are lots of questionable cases and lots of examples. I'm not here to rag on the police, but I don't think it's unrealistic or outside the realm of possibility to wonder if police are being trained to address active shooter situations by shooting anyone who's armed. Maybe they figure it'll be easier to explain one dead CHL guy than it will be to explain a dead cop and 5 more dead innocents. I don't know. |
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I was debating whether to use the straight face smiley or the weird eye guy smiley. I am really torn here. Because answering the question is just plain unthinkable? Are you legitimately under the impression that cops are trained to shoot people when they see a gun? The conversation was in the context of discussing a response to an active shooter on a college campus, where cops are the only ones legally armed. Perhaps some police officers/agencies would assume is that anyone who isn't in uniform, and is armed, is a threat. We're going off of 3rd hand information, so there's plenty of room for mis-communication, but I can imagine this as a possibility. |
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I was debating whether to use the straight face smiley or the weird eye guy smiley. I am really torn here. Because answering the question is just plain unthinkable? Are you legitimately under the impression that cops are trained to shoot people when they see a gun? I can't imagine anyone thinks that. Don't cops frequently give people a chance to drop a weapon unless it's pointed right at them? Yeah... Except for all those cases where the cop shot a guy through a window because he thought he saw a gun but it was a Coke can, or shot a guy at a Halloween party (also through a window) who had a toy gun. There are lots of questionable cases and lots of examples. I'm not here to rag on the police, but I don't think it's unrealistic or outside the realm of possibility to wonder if police are being trained to address active shooter situations by shooting anyone who's armed. Maybe they figure it'll be easier to explain one dead CHL guy than it will be to explain a dead cop and 5 more dead innocents. I don't know. It may be more a case of what's done in actuality vs what is taught. I can't imagine anyone going on record as saying shoot anyone with a gun. Well, except the FBI admin idiots who gave Horiuchi's team Carte Blanche |
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So now, if I cap someone in self defense, call the police to report a shooting and cover the the guy that I just shot, the police are gonna come and shoot me because they're trained to shoot anyone with a gun? All you need is........ http://spinstage.http.internapcdn.net/Spinstage/userdocs/skus/p_080000833_2.jpg ...........and.......... http://www.popguns.com/badge/badge%20images/heavybadge.jpg Then you're covered! can I get one with a BFL? |
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'As I approached the scene, I witnessed a particular individual with a firearm pointed at a second particular individual who was laying on the ground bleeding. At that point I exited my vehicle and assessed that the particular individual with the firearm had shot the particular individual who had been shot, and therefore fired on the particular individual with the firearm." Where did this come from? It came from the psychic squad because they can tell that the guy with the gun isn't a detective or plainclothes officer. |
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I've never heard of such a thing. My agency has specifically conducted situational training which had scenarios where you responded to a shots fired call and were met by an off duty officer in plain clothes and/or legal CCW'er covering a person they had just shot. Pretty easy - barring an active shooter situation - verbal commands first. Compliance or non-compliance determines the course of action from there. |
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Quoted: Quoted: I took an armed security qualification class from a retired police instructor/SWAT cop. The command to fire was him yelling "GUN". Make your own conclusions. All the LEO instructors and range masters I've shot with use the term "threat".  Tiger Valley uses buzzers. I thought everyone used buzzers. |
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I took an armed security qualification class from a retired police instructor/SWAT cop. The command to fire was him yelling "GUN". Make your own conclusions. All the LEO instructors and range masters I've shot with use the term "threat".
Ditto. Even the Blackwater guys used that. I have taken two classes that used the buzzer. Massad Ayoob's class and Spartan Tactical Training Group. |
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It might pay to dress like a good guy if you CCW, like an undercover FBI agent. I generally go for this look when I'm chilling at the crib. http://www.thuglaws.com/Thug%20Dress%20Code.jpg I wonder what scent those candles are. I'm guessing vanilla and pumpkin pie. |
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It might pay to dress like a good guy if you CCW, like an undercover FBI agent. I generally go for this look when I'm chilling at the crib. http://www.thuglaws.com/Thug%20Dress%20Code.jpg I wonder what scent those candles are. I'm guessing vanilla and pumpkin pie. Haa!!! I missed that. 
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