[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Draco vs Bear (Page 1 of 3)
Posted: 8/23/2011 9:39:58 AM EDT
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Who wins?
Alaskan brown vs 7.62 out of a Draco. Considering slinging this vs a bolt gun next time I'm fishing there. I understand that 7.62 is not a one shot stopper but a magazine has been known to stop rhinos in Africa so.... |
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Who wins? Alaskan brown vs 7.62 out of a Draco. Considering slinging this vs a bolt gun next time I'm fishing there. I understand that 7.62 is not a one shot stopper but a magazine has been known to stop rhinos in Africa so.... LOL i am IN me too! |
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Pay a reloader to bake up some custom 7.62 rounds using the most heavy solid pill you can find. Try to push the bullet as fast as possibe, within reason.
Actually not a bad idea at all, considering you'll get a ton of chuckelheads here say the .45 1911 is the only way to go... (or a glock 10mm). Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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I did some a couple sumers in Alaska building trail. The first year i just had the pump mossberg pistol gripped with slugs.
Then i saw how big the fucking bears are. Second summer took the AK. Never had to use it so i don't know about that, but i felt safer. Seems like a worthy idea to me. |
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It's in the ready position so it be fired instantly. Time and space are the best defense on a bear. If you are caught at less then 30 yards you are fucked no matter what IMO We walked up on an 8ft grizzly once. Got 10' away from it before we realized it was in front of us behind a large bush––we were lucky and it ran for it, by the time we got our rifles up, it had already cleared about 30ft. |
| The problem with the draco is that it is near impossible to put multiple rounds down range with any sort of accuracy. So with lack of control you bascially negate the benefit of speed. I'm sure the 7.62x39 would kill a bear. People here say .44 Mag is a min and that has less energy than the 7.62x39. |
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In for the super bears and bullets are ineffective... Personal experiance? a .308 took out a black bear quick as hell...i know its not a grizzly but arfcom makes it out that bears are tanks with legs Oh, I have no doubt that 7.62x39 will kill a bear, with good bullets. I have some doubt that the OP, or 99% of people, could put more than 1 round from an AK pistol into a moving, aggressive, snarling ball of hate full of bad intentions, or that 1 round would be enough from that caliber to effect any kind of stop. |
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Problem #1) for any kind of accuracy under stress, you should really use something with a buttstock. Problem #2) the "selector lever" on an AK is worse than terrible and the charging handle isn't in a very helpful location. I don't think it's a good idea to walk through the woods carrying a rifle on "fire" with one in the chamber, either. You should consider the Vz58, a Cold War era "battle rifle," or maybe a heavy hitting lever gun.
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The bear would probably die from it's wounds. After it killed the guy with the draco. This. It all depends on where you are from the bear.. Under 10 feet? you are dead.. 100 yards in a large tree it cant climb or knock over.. i think you are good to go. |
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In for the super bears and bullets are ineffective... Personal experiance? a .308 took out a black bear quick as hell...i know its not a grizzly but arfcom makes it out that bears are tanks with legs Not the same critter.. http://www.hunteracademy.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/canada-black-bear-hunting.jpg http://www.biggamehunt.net/graphics/photos_talltales/brown_bear1_2005.jpg I know but we don't have them down here. so we can't try to hunt them. I would love to go up north and hunt some of those monster animals y'all have up there the only thing i've done is moose. And its still scary when a bear moves towards you black or grizzly. its still a bear 
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Who wins? Alaskan brown vs 7.62 out of a Draco. Considering slinging this vs a bolt gun next time I'm fishing there. I understand that 7.62 is not a one shot stopper but a magazine has been known to stop rhinos in Africa so.... I spent 4 years in Alaska and saw everything from 9mm handguns to pump shotguns with slugs to .458 Win mag bolt action rifles. Hell one old guy I ran into carried a US GI M1 Garand with AP ammo and two spare clips hanging off of the sling! Most people do not realize how big a large Brown bear male is! A really big salmon fed male can go 1500lbs. Likewise, they are incredibly fast for their size. They can susposedly reach 40mph for short bursts!! So if you are charged by a brown bear, I hope you do not have that rifle slinged. There is simply not enough reaction time to get off many shots, semi-auto or otherwise. For what it's worth, the one guy I knew while I was in Alaska who was charged by a female sow brown bear used a Ruger P85 9mm successfully. The guy was extremely lucky in that he hit the bear in the eye with his first shot. He said he continued a 15 rd mag dump scoring hits in the neck and chest. Guaranteed had hit first shot not been to the bears brain, he would have been mauled and probably killed. |
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Pay a reloader to bake up some custom 7.62 rounds using the most heavy solid pill you can find. Try to push the bullet as fast as possibe, within reason. Actually not a bad idea at all, considering you'll get a ton of chuckelheads here say the .45 1911 is the only way to go... (or a glock 10mm). Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Heck, go a step further. Have the reloader make compressed loads with heavy bullets on top of some wildly inappropriate powder. Those damn bears aren't going to learn to leave people alone until they see a few guys explode in a bright flash, a cloud of red mist, and a painful shower of shrapnel when they try to charge them. 
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Do people know what ready slung on an assault weapon means. I'm not talking about across my back folks.
Sling is used as a buttstock to provide stablity. If u master it you can rapid fire center I mass on a human sized target at 25 yards no problem. As for the miss of a big rifle it was referring to missing under stress of a charging brown. Having a quick follow up shot capable rig I think outweighs a single shot killer. One reason pump slug guns and big bore revolvers are popular up there with locals |
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The problem with the draco is that it is near impossible to put multiple rounds down range with any sort of accuracy. So with lack of control you bascially negate the benefit of speed. I'm sure the 7.62x39 would kill a bear. People here say .44 Mag is a min and that has less energy than the 7.62x39. Anyone who's shot a Draco or similar rifle-derived pistol using reverse sling pressure knows this isn't true. Especially on brown bear-sized head and vitals. And with some practice, it can be aimed quicker than more traditional handguns can be drawn from a holster, or a full-sized rifle could be unslung, and shouldered. And you'll have a longer sight radius and three points of support (sling tension and two hands) than most any other handgun as well. And as stated above, 7.62x39 is going to be well over 1000ft/lbs of energy at any distance you're justified at shooting a bear with defensively and it's spitzer profile will give you a flatter trajectory and better penetration than most any of the magnum revolver cartridges that are common for brown bear defense. The only downside to the Draco would be that the AK style safety lever cannot be manipulated while keeping your shooting hand on the grip and trigger,. |
| After living in Alasaka and having several encounters with bears, thankfully I never had to shoot one. Get a large caliber revolver like a 454 casul. 7.62X39 will kill a brown bear and is suitable for hunting at range but in a up close and personal altercation i would say go with a larger calber pistol or a large cal carbine like a 45-70 lever action. In the thicket and brush which is where I have had several encounters you want a quick draw shorter weapon with a lot of punch. |
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Quoted: If you think you have enough time to unsling and put a magazine into a charging bear––and kill it before it reaches you, then sure. Pack a Draco. About as much time as you do to unsling a bolt gun and find it in the scope and then get 1 shot off............. Personally my ass would be running and maybe fireing a round or 2 hoping to scare it off till I'm up a tree...... then IT'S ON CUZ! |
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In for the super bears and bullets are ineffective... Personal experiance? a .308 took out a black bear quick as hell...i know its not a grizzly but arfcom makes it out that bears are tanks with legs I killed my first two black bears with a .30-.30. Two shots each. Black bears are not impossible to kill. But, they are a bitch to sneak up on. |
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After living in Alasaka and having several encounters with bears, thankfully I never had to shoot one. Get a large caliber revolver like a 454 casul. 7.62X39 will kill a brown bear and is suitable for hunting at range but in a up close and personal altercation i would say go with a larger calber pistol or a large cal carbine like a 45-70 lever action. In the thicket and brush which is where I have had several encounters you want a quick draw shorter weapon with a lot of punch. Having never been to Alaska, and never encountered a Brown Bear, I agree. I would not feel under-equipped hunting bear with a 30-06 or .308, and 7.62x39 can probably get the job done as well. If I'm not hunting though, and am liable to be caught by surprise at close range, a long slow rifle is not what I really want, and a 'small caliber' pistol is not what I really want either. |
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The problem with the draco is that it is near impossible to put multiple rounds down range with any sort of accuracy. So with lack of control you bascially negate the benefit of speed. I'm sure the 7.62x39 would kill a bear. People here say .44 Mag is a min and that has less energy than the 7.62x39. Anyone who's shot a Draco or similar rifle-derived pistol using reverse sling pressure knows this isn't true. Especially on brown bear-sized head and vitals. And with some practice, it can be aimed quicker than more traditional handguns can be drawn from a holster, or a full-sized rifle could be unslung, and shouldered. And you'll have a longer sight radius and three points of support (sling tension and two hands) than most any other handgun as well. And as stated above, 7.62x39 is going to be well over 1000ft/lbs of energy at any distance you're justified at shooting a bear with defensively and it's spitzer profile will give you a flatter trajectory and better penetration than most any of the magnum revolver cartridges that are common for brown bear defense. The only downside to the Draco would be that the AK style safety lever cannot be manipulated while keeping your shooting hand on the grip and trigger,. Yeah, I'll have to remember that reverse sling pressure thingy the next time I have my Draco strapped across my front over my chest waders, backpack, gear box and fishing pole in one hand all the while bear charging me through 6’ willows so thick you can barely move through it. Not to mention when the bear is charging you don’t exactly see anything other than a massive forehead and gaping jaws full of teeth. 
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Who wins? Alaskan brown vs 7.62 out of a Draco. Considering slinging this vs a bolt gun next time I'm fishing there. I understand that 7.62 is not a one shot stopper but a magazine has been known to stop rhinos in Africa so.... I spent 4 years in Alaska and saw everything from 9mm handguns to pump shotguns with slugs to .458 Win mag bolt action rifles. Hell one old guy I ran into carried a US GI M1 Garand with AP ammo and two spare clips hanging off of the sling! Most people do not realize how big a large Brown bear male is! A really big salmon fed male can go 1500lbs. Likewise, they are incredibly fast for their size. They can susposedly reach 40mph for short bursts!! So if you are charged by a brown bear, I hope you do not have that rifle slinged. There is simply not enough reaction time to get off many shots, semi-auto or otherwise. For what it's worth, the one guy I knew while I was in Alaska who was charged by a female sow brown bear used a Ruger P85 9mm successfully. The guy was extremely lucky in that he hit the bear in the eye with his first shot. He said he continued a 15 rd mag dump scoring hits in the neck and chest. Guaranteed had hit first shot not been to the bears brain, he would have been mauled and probably killed. I remember taking a train ride from Anchorage to some town i cant remember the name of, and the train going full speed went by a brown bear, the bear started running next to the train and kept up no problem. I always wondered how bears could catch dear and other quick prey until i saw how fast the sucker could move. |
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Quoted: The problem with the draco is that it is near impossible to put multiple rounds down range with any sort of accuracy. So with lack of control you bascially negate the benefit of speed. I'm sure the 7.62x39 would kill a bear. People here say .44 Mag is a min and that has less energy than the 7.62x39. That's really not true - the Draco is quite accurate, surprisingly so.  |