[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Traffic Camera Tickets (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 5/27/2011 8:47:12 AM EDT
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I read an article in yetserday's paper saying it is NOT mandatory that they be paid. In other words, if you don't pay them no legal / criminal action can be taken against you, such as an attatchment for your arrest, flagged DL etc... I recently got a couple near where I live as they conveniently lowered the speed limit by 10 mph the day before they set up a radar trailer that snaps a picture of your vehicle going and coming. I paid mine as I just don't feel like dealing with the hassle or taking a chance but when I called the phone number on the "ticket" I asked the guy if I didn't pay all of it by the "due date" if I would have an attatchment for my arrest incase I needed more time. He said "No, but there will be a late fee." Weren't these things deemed unconstitutional awhile back? Then they "reversed" the decision or some bullshit like that? I fucking hate them and they seem like they're everyfuckingwhere now. |
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The method of administration of the things was tossed out in NOLA due to it having been handled by DPW instead of NOPD, while JP got rid of theirs after it came to light that people were getting kickbacks from to company. I view them as being illegal under LA R.S. 32:365.B, which specifies that a LEO cannot record a traffic violation then mail a citation out later. Given that, and given that traffic citations should only be issued by LE in person, or by school bus drivers via mailed citation, or by anyone else via sworn statement and affidavit at traffic court, the traffic cameras would appear to invalid. If they are LE, then by law they cannot mail you a ticket, if they are a school bus driver, they can, but since both the traffic camera itself, and the person mailing the citation, are demonstrably not school bus drivers, this route seems to be out, and since no one is making a sworn affidavit at traffic court, it all seems bogus.
That said, they claim to get around any of that (not that I've heard of anyone actually challenging them in this fashion,) by asserting that the camera tickets are civil in nature rather than criminal, and by not reporting said tickets to insurance companies. In NOLA, at least, failure to pay one will result in your car getting put on the list used by the meter nazis who drive around in those little scanner vans, and your vehicle will be booted for non-payment. |
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So I have a right to face my accuser in court?  Technically yes. It's why the traffic control cameras were deemed unconstitutional here in Minnesota. The State of Minnesota even had to send an apology with the check for the money they robbed from those that got their picture taken. They're currently going to get around this by making the ticket a non criminal ticket and treating it the same as a parking ticket, for $300!!! They've got to try to milk revenue out of the commoners any way they can. |
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I had a Sunpass that ran under the balance. Fuckers took away the ones that showed the balance, I don't know what the fucking beeps and all that shit mean.
It went to a collections agency, not the state, and no $100 fines for each time I blew through it not realizing. The bill was for like $32. |
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So I have a right to face my accuser in court? Technically yes. It's why the traffic control cameras were deemed unconstitutional here in Minnesota. The State of Minnesota even had to send an apology with the check for the money they robbed from those that got their picture taken. They're currently going to get around this by making the ticket a non criminal ticket and treating it the same as a parking ticket, for $300!!! They've got to try to milk revenue out of the commoners any way they can. Of course––never let that pesky Constitution get in the way. Rotten bastards! 
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Look at what these horrible vandals have done.
http://www.speedcam.co.uk/gatso2.htm |
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I had a Sunpass that ran under the balance. Fuckers took away the ones that showed the balance, I don't know what the fucking beeps and all that shit mean. It went to a collections agency, not the state, and no $100 fines for each time I blew through it not realizing. The bill was for like $32. What is a sunpass? |
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Oh... How terrible. I really feel for the poor, poor government types that won't be getting their much needed revenue from these sacms. |
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Quoted: Oh... How terrible. I really feel for the poor, poor government types that won't be getting their much needed revenue from these sacms. Classic! |
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Quoted: The method of administration of the things was tossed out in NOLA due to it having been handled by DPW instead of NOPD, while JP got rid of theirs after it came to light that people were getting kickbacks from to company. I view them as being illegal under LA R.S. 32:365.B, which specifies that a LEO cannot record a traffic violation then mail a citation out later. Given that, and given that traffic citations should only be issued by LE in person, or by school bus drivers via mailed citation, or by anyone else via sworn statement and affidavit at traffic court, the traffic cameras would appear to invalid. If they are LE, then by law they cannot mail you a ticket, if they are a school bus driver, they can, but since both the traffic camera itself, and the person mailing the citation, are demonstrably not school bus drivers, this route seems to be out, and since no one is making a sworn affidavit at traffic court, it all seems bogus. That said, they claim to get around any of that (not that I've heard of anyone actually challenging them in this fashion,) by asserting that the camera tickets are civil in nature rather than criminal, and by not reporting said tickets to insurance companies. In NOLA, at least, failure to pay one will result in your car getting put on the list used by the meter nazis who drive around in those little scanner vans, and your vehicle will be booted for non-payment. Yeah. The ground level Westbank Expressway in Gretna is where they lowered it from 45 to 35 the day before they set-up that trailer camer radar. They move it to a different location of the expressway everyday. I know Gretna is hurting for money right now but scamming people going to and coming from work is pretty low in my opinion. |
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Oh... How terrible. I really feel for the poor, poor government types that won't be getting their much needed revenue from these sacms. Classic! I don't know how they're burning the tires. I remember when it was a first happening hearing that they were dumping a quart of motor oil in the tire to get it started. I've never tried to burn motor oil. I'm assuming it lights and burns at the surface similar to lamp oil. |
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Oh... How terrible. I really feel for the poor, poor government types that won't be getting their much needed revenue from these sacms. Classic! I don't know how they're burning the tires. I remember when it was a first happening hearing that they were dumping a quart of motor oil in the tire to get it started. I've never tried to burn motor oil. I'm assuming it lights and burns at the surface similar to lamp oil. If you scroll down in that link a ways you will find pics of burning boxes. It says they put a tire over it, then fill the tire with petrol (gasoline), then light it. Motor oil smokes too much and draws more attention. *I've heard. 
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Here in Texas if you do not pay the civil citation they can report your vehicle and make it so you can't renew your registration until it's paid. Jim License under the auspices of safety and then use it as a compliance pressure point ... as the Founding Fathers intended. |
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Here in Texas if you do not pay the civil citation they can report your vehicle and make it so you can't renew your registration until it's paid. Jim Which is why you go and register your vehicle elsewhere, taking your $$$ with it. 
Fuck them back. Register it where? Oklahoma? They check the DPS database. Jim |
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My wife got one. She runs a pediatric OR and is on call- basically all the time. I guess she was on her way in for an emergency and busted a light. The lights where there are cameras seem to have shorter yellow cycles around here. I know it isn't a legitimate excuse to run a red light but when a 3 year old is having a tonsil bleed or has a foreign object lodged in an airway or esophagus the surgical team tends to bend a few traffic laws to get there quick.
She gave me the letter too late for me to challenge it in time. I didn't even think about it again until I tried to renew her license tags several months later. They did whatever they do so that I had to pay the "fine" before I could renew the tags. The main thing that pisses me off is that the letter was addressed to both of us, as that is how the vehicle is registered. I guess they think I had her in my lap and we were both driving. If a cop had pulled her over he would have identified the driver- not send out a letter to "resident". I don't like them.If they want to write tickets do it the old fashioned way with a cop. Keeping a registered owner from being able to renew the license tags is almost blackmail. They are only about money- they can't be doing anything else. If a cop stops someone it might make them not do it again and other drivers tend to be a little more careful when they see someone getting a ticket. Red light cameras don't deter anything. They have reduced running a red light to the level of not paying a toll. Jim |
About 2 years ago, I got a $100+ ticket in the mail for doing 26 in a 20. 
I threw it in the garbage. A few months later I got some letter from some company in Arizona saying if i don't pay up it will go to collections. I scribled "I dispute this bill in its entirety" on it and mailed it back. Never heard from then again. A few months later I did one of those free annual credit checks and the speeding ticket was on there. I filed a dispute and the credit people removed it a few days later. Also turns out that here in WA, the maximum fine for these things is supposed to be about $55.  They're doing a class action lawsuit because the .gov and the camera companies have been ripping people off with fines higher than allowed by state law.
They should all get thrown in jail and have their cameras shoved up their asses and set on fire. |
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The red light cameras in Albuquerque have been off for a little while now. They can't come to an agreement because the city is losing money on them and the company running them is making a huge profit. Plus nobody is paying them. Now that a win if I ever saw one. Ha 
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Oh... How terrible. I really feel for the poor, poor government types that won't be getting their much needed revenue from these sacms. Classic! I don't know how they're burning the tires. I remember when it was a first happening hearing that they were dumping a quart of motor oil in the tire to get it started. I've never tried to burn motor oil. I'm assuming it lights and burns at the surface similar to lamp oil. If you scroll down in that link a ways you will find pics of burning boxes. It says they put a tire over it, then fill the tire with petrol (gasoline), then light it. Motor oil smokes too much and draws more attention. *I've heard. Burning tires smoke like hell too (note third world road blocks). Easiest way to light one is to drop a road flare in it. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Oh... How terrible. I really feel for the poor, poor government types that won't be getting their much needed revenue from these sacms. Classic! I don't know how they're burning the tires. I remember when it was a first happening hearing that they were dumping a quart of motor oil in the tire to get it started. I've never tried to burn motor oil. I'm assuming it lights and burns at the surface similar to lamp oil. If you scroll down in that link a ways you will find pics of burning boxes. It says they put a tire over it, then fill the tire with petrol (gasoline), then light it. Motor oil smokes too much and draws more attention. *I've heard. When they first started with those, the electronics and optics were contained in an aluminium box, as they say. Well, aluminium is amphoteric, meaning it acts as both a proton donor or acceptor. An acid or base. Which means it is very rapidly corroded by sodium hydroxide. Lye. Which is deliquescent, drawing moisture from the air. And of course, the electronics don't like sodium hydroxide either. "Just dump a spot of lye on it and let it rot in peace, no need for fire". That is what I heard  . |
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It's not valid unless you get served. They will try to serve you. If they don't serve you in 90 days then its dropped. If you get it in the mail then throw it away. That may work in AZ, but I assure you, it will not in LA. It does work in AZ,the only crappy thing about it is ducking the servers for 3 months.Red light cameras are a different story,but for the speed traps they mail you a notice to pay a fine or appear in court,without papers being served,the case is always thrown out. |
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Quoted: I'm PISSED Florida has made these things legal. Only police should be issuing tickets. Not some camera. And no, I've never been issued a red light ticket. I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday, red light cameras in my little small town. There are four traffic lights in the entire county of 20,000 people and they all have cameras now. |
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Quoted: Quoted: I'm PISSED Florida has made these things legal. Only police should be issuing tickets. Not some camera. And no, I've never been issued a red light ticket. I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday, red light cameras in my little small town. There are four traffic lights in the entire county of 20,000 people and they all have cameras now. Are you sure those were red light cameras though? A lot of the cameras put up in Florida are there just to monitor traffic. |
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Quoted: Who gives a crap. Big brother is an abomination no matter what form. Quoted: Quoted: I'm PISSED Florida has made these things legal. Only police should be issuing tickets. Not some camera. And no, I've never been issued a red light ticket. I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday, red light cameras in my little small town. There are four traffic lights in the entire county of 20,000 people and they all have cameras now. Are you sure those were red light cameras though? A lot of the cameras put up in Florida are there just to monitor traffic. There is no reason to monitor citizens via live video recording or photography. NONE. |
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Solar powered radar stations are popping up all over the interstates around Birmingham.
Per one of the guys working on one they can sense speed, vehicle class (size) and send this info wirelessly to some database in Montgomery. He stated they are replacing the old in-pavement car counters. I imagine it would be childs play to add cameras. |
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the only people bitching about traffic lights are folks that get busted running lights, which is assanine and should be dealt with by beatings.
arguing that you can get busted even though you were not driving the car is like arguing about abortion being for rape and incest even though it accounts for less than three percent of the procedures... makes ya sound kinda stupid... we convict folks purely on video evidence all the time, when a burgerlary is caught on a security camera, so it cant possibly be that is the problem... it gets old fast hearing folks that drive like idiots complain about a red light ticket... no different than the knob bitchin cus he got a 50 in a 30 zone. pull yer head outa yur ass and stop at the light. even though EVERY TIME somebody here gets a ticket he made a FULL stop and the camera is rigged to hose ya... dipshites |
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I'm PISSED Florida has made these things legal. Only police should be issuing tickets. Not some camera. And no, I've never been issued a red light ticket. I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday, red light cameras in my little small town. There are four traffic lights in the entire county of 20,000 people and they all have cameras now. Are you sure those were red light cameras though? A lot of the cameras put up in Florida are there just to monitor traffic. There is another type of camera that is becoming very common. We use them to trigger the light to change instead of the coil under the pavement. This makes it a lot simpler when we have to repair the street- especially concrete. Jim |
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Quoted: the only people bitching about traffic lights are folks that get busted running lights, which is assanine and should be dealt with by beatings. arguing that you can get busted even though you were not driving the car is like arguing about abortion being for rape and incest even though it accounts for less than three percent of the procedures... makes ya sound kinda stupid... we convict folks purely on video evidence all the time, when a burgerlary is caught on a security camera, so it cant possibly be that is the problem... it gets old fast hearing folks that drive like idiots complain about a red light ticket... no different than the knob bitchin cus he got a 50 in a 30 zone. pull yer head outa yur ass and stop at the light. even though EVERY TIME somebody here gets a ticket he made a FULL stop and the camera is rigged to hose ya... dipshites Soooo, I guess the law about only a police officer can issue a citation has no bearing at all huh? Do you work for one of these camera monitoring companies? Just askin'.... |
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Quoted: Quoted: Who gives a crap. Big brother is an abomination no matter what form. Quoted: Quoted: I'm PISSED Florida has made these things legal. Only police should be issuing tickets. Not some camera. And no, I've never been issued a red light ticket. I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday, red light cameras in my little small town. There are four traffic lights in the entire county of 20,000 people and they all have cameras now. Are you sure those were red light cameras though? A lot of the cameras put up in Florida are there just to monitor traffic. There is no reason to monitor citizens via live video recording or photography. NONE. Actually there is, but you or I probably won't like nor agree with it. |
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Quoted: the only people bitching about traffic lights are folks that get busted running lights, which is assanine and should be dealt with by beatings. arguing that you can get busted even though you were not driving the car is like arguing about abortion being for rape and incest even though it accounts for less than three percent of the procedures... makes ya sound kinda stupid... we convict folks purely on video evidence all the time, when a burgerlary is caught on a security camera, so it cant possibly be that is the problem... it gets old fast hearing folks that drive like idiots complain about a red light ticket... no different than the knob bitchin cus he got a 50 in a 30 zone. pull yer head outa yur ass and stop at the light. even though EVERY TIME somebody here gets a ticket he made a FULL stop and the camera is rigged to hose ya... dipshites The percentage of people who are out right just running the re light because they are assholes is probably extremely low. A lot of time people are heading into a yellow and they can run the yellow or possibly get rear ended by the guy behind them. Its an easy choice to make in my opinion, run the yellow. I just can't agree with people having to pay 200+ dollars for making a mistake in traffic. I really don't think people are out there purposefully running reds I've been driving for a long time and the amount of times I have seen that happen I can count on one hand. I also can't morally agree with prosecuting someone over a victimless crime. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Who gives a crap. Big brother is an abomination no matter what form. Quoted: Quoted: I'm PISSED Florida has made these things legal. Only police should be issuing tickets. Not some camera. And no, I've never been issued a red light ticket. I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday, red light cameras in my little small town. There are four traffic lights in the entire county of 20,000 people and they all have cameras now. Are you sure those were red light cameras though? A lot of the cameras put up in Florida are there just to monitor traffic. There is no reason to monitor citizens via live video recording or photography. NONE. The cameras allow them to track accidents and stuff. There are all kinds of cameras along interstates here in Florida which can help rescuers and police help locate problems and accidents. That is a perfectly valid reason to have them. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I'm PISSED Florida has made these things legal. Only police should be issuing tickets. Not some camera. And no, I've never been issued a red light ticket. I couldn't believe my eyes yesterday, red light cameras in my little small town. There are four traffic lights in the entire county of 20,000 people and they all have cameras now. Are you sure those were red light cameras though? A lot of the cameras put up in Florida are there just to monitor traffic. There is another type of camera that is becoming very common. We use them to trigger the light to change instead of the coil under the pavement. This makes it a lot simpler when we have to repair the street- especially concrete. Jim Ok, that is probably what I'm seeing all over the place. I just assumed they were there to help monitor things at certain intersections. 
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the only people bitching about traffic lights are folks that get busted running lights, which is assanine and should be dealt with by beatings. arguing that you can get busted even though you were not driving the car is like arguing about abortion being for rape and incest even though it accounts for less than three percent of the procedures... makes ya sound kinda stupid... we convict folks purely on video evidence all the time, when a burgerlary is caught on a security camera, so it cant possibly be that is the problem... it gets old fast hearing folks that drive like idiots complain about a red light ticket... no different than the knob bitchin cus he got a 50 in a 30 zone. pull yer head outa yur ass and stop at the light. even though EVERY TIME somebody here gets a ticket he made a FULL stop and the camera is rigged to hose ya... dipshites my girlfriend got a ticket in New Orleans from one of these things for making a right turn on red where you arent supposed to. at the time, an ambulance had come up behind her with lights and siren on. she was in the right lane, obviously, and the other lanes were full. the ambulance was not going to make it past her without some sort of move on her part. so she turned. when she called and told them what happened, they said that they review the video before and after the time of the infraction, and if no extenuating circumstances are present, they issue the ticket. mind you, they didnt review the tape again, they just gave out the canned response. they also spelled out the process required to appeal the ticket, which is absolutely ridiculous. she was a student at Tulane at the time, and her schedule would not allow the process, or at least not make it cost effective to do so. so she paid it. she had no choice. summer was coming up, she wanted to go home, and Tulane doesnt issue grades anymore if you have one of these fines on record with the city. so, would your opinion of the cameras be the same if it could be proven to you that they have a higher rate of inaccuracy than you originally thought? what if they are authorized, maintained, and operated by an incompetent organization (NOLA city works and its sub contractor)? if it were you in that ambulance, would you expect someone to do the right thing, or cover their own ass? should someone be fined by the government for doing the right thing? even if the the government, through laziness or corruption, issues fines without completing their own due diligence? i agree that if you break the law, you and you alone are responsible. but what if you didnt? why should you have to go through a 60-90 day period of review? |
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The thing is, a red light isn't exactly a black and white, or red and yellow thing. Texas law says, or at least said back when I was a cop, to stop if it is safe to do so. There are circumstances where it is not safe to stop- such as someone coming up on you too fast to stop in time, or weather conditions like ice, or like the ambulance posted above. in each case a cop on the scene can make a judgement call and either stop or not stop- write a ticket or not write, etc.
Since I left the cop shop in 90 I have been stopped a couple of times for running a red light- once right in front of a cop at the intersection waiting to turn. He asked me why I ran the light and I explained it to him. I didn't even get a verbal warning. If I had tried I would have slid to a stop in the middle of the intersection. The intersection and light was in a 50mph zone and the yellow cycle was very short. I was doing 50 when I approached the intersection and the light changed to yellow. I maintained my speed but the red light caught me. A camera would have issued me a ticket- the cop didn't. Jim |
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In Britain, they light the things on fire with old tires and gasoline.
In the US, we have devices designed to propel small, metallic objects at a very high rate of speed, which would penetrate the shroud around these cameras quite effectively, from several hundred yards away. |