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Posted: 5/22/2002 9:51:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2002 10:00:25 AM EDT by urbankaos04]
I'm so fed up seeing our gun rights, along with the Bill of Rights, slowly slip away from us . It's getting to the point that it's making me sick to see how people are just letting this happen--even those here among us[:X*]. It's time to walk the walk, people. I've never really been active politically--till now. I've been trying to recruit fellow gun enthusiasts to join the NRA at work; I'm going to write my elected officials; I'm going to contact my local newspaper to see if they can run an article on the Campaign Finance Reform and it's effects; and I've sent as much money as I can to the NRA and NRA-ILA trying to walk the walk. I guess I'm just angry [:(!] at everything right now, because I see how uninformed everyone is and how apathetic they are to how how our rights are being slowly taken away from us. By the time people realize what has happened, it'll be too late. That is why I HOPE that everyone here, who KNOWS what is REALLY going on, is doing their PART. [soapbox]
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 10:33:29 AM EDT
This is my letter to the NRA after last nights Hannity and Colmes to the NRA: Sirs, As an NRA member I found it very disturbing and offensive to watch Wayne LaPierre on Hannity and Colmes make the statement that pilots should be armed but 'it is probably not a good idea for citizens to be armed' on planes. He made this statement several times during this interview. How can the NRA proclaim to fight for the right of self defense and the Bill of Rights when you are obviously afraid to make bold statements in defense of those rights? The government thinks that it is okay to make victims of airline passengers and deny pilots a second chance to save the aircraft, but it is okay to have the military shoot the plane down. How can the NRA and any clear-thinking airline passenger possibly agree with this?? I think it is time for bold new leadership to lead the NRA, and Mr. LePierre is not it! === I also support various pro-gun organizations at the national, state and local level, call/email/write my reps (even though it is a waste of time with the Dem's in office and the Republican in-name-only Mark Foley that represents my district) and I complain to other groups like AARP on their anti-gun stance. I send money to other state groups like Oregon and Chicago to help them fight there, hoping that their win will be our gain. I'm doin' all I can do to fight for my rights from the 'ballot box'. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. I am also disappointed with the apathy of most Americans and their willingness to give up our rights.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 10:39:44 AM EDT
I respect your enthusiasm Urban, but put your efforts and support into an organization or organizations that actually want to help win back our freedoms, rather than make constant compromises and frankly, sell us out, in order to maintain their well paying highly respected jobs. (just because an organization is non-profit doesn't mean it's executives and board members don't make a damn pretty penny.) As a start I would recommend Gun Owners of America, Jews for the preservation of Firearms Ownership (You don't need to be jewish) and Citizens of America. There are others I know, but these come to the forefront of my mind, feel free to interject other everyone. If gun rights were a country, the NRA would be guilty of treason. If they would stick solely to education and training they would be a great organization, that they do well. Mike
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:06:25 PM EDT
Thanks for responding fellas; I appreciate it. But I am disappointed that I only got 2 responses. I hope the lack of responses isn't indicative of the commitment this board has to "the cause." Oh well, so be it. DakotaKid--Where can I reach Gun Owner's of America? Thanks.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:14:33 PM EDT
Urban, I'm a life member of the NRA and contribute quarterly to the cause. I don't necessarily believe that the NRA is the defining organization as far a fighting for our rights nor do I let my commitment to the cause stop there. I'm in constant contact with elected representatives and I'm just as frustrated as you are that more people are not taking action. Ryan
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:36:44 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:40:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DakotaKid: I respect your enthusiasm Urban, but put your efforts and support into an organization or organizations that actually want to help win back our freedoms, rather than make constant compromises and frankly, sell us out, in order to maintain their well paying highly respected jobs. (just because an organization is non-profit doesn't mean it's executives and board members don't make a damn pretty penny.) As a start I would recommend Gun Owners of America, Jews for the preservation of Firearms Ownership (You don't need to be jewish) and Citizens of America. There are others I know, but these come to the forefront of my mind, feel free to interject other everyone. If gun rights were a country, the NRA would be guilty of treason. If they would stick solely to education and training they would be a great organization, that they do well. Mike
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I know how you feel but name one politician who has claimed one of these organizations cost them an election. They have admitted that the NRA has cost them some.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 3:50:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2002 3:51:31 PM EDT by antiUSSA]
Originally Posted By urbankaos04: Thanks for responding fellas; I appreciate it. But I am disappointed that I only got 2 responses. I hope the lack of responses isn't indicative of the commitment this board has to "the cause." Oh well, so be it.
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Are [b]YOU[/b] aware of a little gathering in the midwest called the Black Rifle Convention..? The purpose is to not only get several hundred like minded people together for fun, but to get everyone on the same page... The "Ducks Unlimited" guys have come together as one strong political body, so why shouldn't we..?
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:28:40 PM EDT
Yes, I know about the BRC, and I wish I could be there. Unfortunately, my schedule will not permit it. While it's fine that "like-minded" individuals will be gathering there, it's of no use if we don't start puttin' in some "work." I don't know, I just feel really disillusioned with what's going on. Maybe the BRC will build some more solidarity amongst us, but we need to have a louder voice so others will hear us and take notice. I guess time will till. Meanwhile, I'll be calling all my reps and doing all that I can to help. Sorry if I'm coming off as preaching, but I'm really disgusted with things, especially in California.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:43:52 PM EDT
Gun Owners Of America, Inc. 8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102 Springfield, VA 22151
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:47:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2002 4:53:37 PM EDT by antiUSSA]
Originally Posted By urbankaos04: While it's fine that "like-minded" individuals will be gathering there, [blue]it's of no use if we don't start puttin' in some "work".[/blue]
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If you had really been following the BRC threads, then you would not be making these comments... We have "worked" for several months with the State of Illinois, to receive special circumstances and waivers for this event. What this means, is that we have now set a precedent for the black rifle community, in one of the worst firearms states! This didn't happen overnight, it took numerous phone calls, faxes and letters to the Illinois State Police, as well as a hell of a lot of time... When I began "lobbying" for this waiver, most of you thought I was nuts and that I was pissing in the wind, but I got it done! Now, [b]YOU[/b] need to do this very same thing in [b]YOUR[/b] state, and then hopefully others will follow us both... You have seen the movie, "Pay It Forward" haven't you..?
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:54:41 PM EDT
Originally Posted By urbankaos04: Yes, I know about the BRC, and I wish I could be there. Unfortunately, my schedule will not permit it.
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Make plans for the 2nd Annual BRC, and take a friend! Volunteer at your local gun club. Teach people to shoot. Send money to your favorite Political Action Committee. There is no excuse for not contributing.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 4:59:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By urbankaos04: I'm so fed up seeing our gun rights, along with the Bill of Rights, slowly slip away from us . It's getting to the point that it's making me sick to see how people are just letting this happen--even those here among us[:X*]. It's time to walk the walk, people. I've never really been active politically--till now. I've been trying to recruit fellow gun enthusiasts to join the NRA at work; I'm going to write my elected officials; I'm going to contact my local newspaper to see if they can run an article on the Campaign Finance Reform and it's effects; and I've sent as much money as I can to the NRA and NRA-ILA trying to walk the walk. I guess I'm just angry [:(!] at everything right now, because I see how uninformed everyone is and how apathetic they are to how how our rights are being slowly taken away from us. By the time people realize what has happened, it'll be too late. That is why I HOPE that everyone here, who KNOWS what is REALLY going on, is doing their PART. [soapbox]
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First of all, you have to calm down; secondly, you are only one person. You had better get used to it. Not that many people, even firearms people see the great urgency as you and I, and probably a people on this board. I worked on the Geof Metcalf's effort to overturn Calif's SB23, you will be surprised at how many people that didn't want to get behind this effort, and they were gun people at the various gun shows. Many, many people refused to sign our petition because they didn't want to get on a list & involved etc. For the whole So. Calif., I keep on running into the same 100 people or so, how many gunowners are there in So Calif? and we can only muster 100 people max, acutally I think it is closeer to 50. Pretty sad. But for a starters, find a pro-gun candidate for '02 elections in your area, walk precints, help stuff envelopes. This is not going to change over night, it is going to take a LOT of sweat & tears. It took us years to get into this pickle, and its gonna take years to get out.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 5:16:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By urbankaos04: While it's fine that "like-minded" individuals will be gathering there, it's of no use if we don't start puttin' in some "work."
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I realize you are not trying to flame here and I am not trying to flame back. Do not underestimate what is going to happen next week. If you think that our 'little camping trip' hasn't drawn attention from the highest levels of several government bodies/organizations, the press & the antis, you are being naive. I will not be surprised if the press turnout is huge. Not to mention the protest groups that are, without a doubt, going to be present. I believe this event is going to go well. In fact, I hope and pray daily that it is hugely successful. For, when it is, we will have made a real unified statement and made it loudly 'from the mountain top'. We will show everyone that we are not the fire breathing, wife beating, innocence plundering, vile hell demons spawn from Satan's bosom that we are all too often made out to be. My point is, people who really do care don't always have time to come here and post on a Wednesday night. However, rest assured that we are making the time to take a stand together, doing what we love, defending what we believe in, for all the world to see. (I think the 'Guns & Peace' posters are just too perfect for this.) Sorry, I tripped and fell on my soapbox for a minute there but, I hope you get the point that we all try to do our part in some way.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 5:24:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By urbankaos04: I'm so fed up seeing our gun rights, along with the Bill of Rights, slowly slip away from us . It's getting to the point that it's making me sick to see how people are just letting this happen--even those here among us[:X*]. It's time to walk the walk, people. I've never really been active politically--till now. I've been trying to recruit fellow gun enthusiasts to join the NRA at work; I'm going to write my elected officials; I'm going to contact my local newspaper to see if they can run an article on the Campaign Finance Reform and it's effects; and I've sent as much money as I can to the NRA and NRA-ILA trying to walk the walk.
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I know how you feel. When I lived in CA, around the time SB23 was coming around. I shot off a whole bunch of e-mails and correspondence to just about every politicians whose address I could get a hold off. Imagine my dissapointment when at least half of them never responded and the other half gave me a canned answer. Then after all that effort 4 anti gun laws come into effect withing 14mos. SB23 being the worst. [:(] I believe the only way to turn things around in CA is to VOTE. And encourage everyone to VOTE a lot of these politicians out of office.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 5:32:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/22/2002 6:11:42 PM EDT by Gunbert]
Originally Posted By FL_BOY: This is my letter to the NRA after last nights Hannity and Colmes to the NRA: Sirs, As an NRA member I found it very disturbing and offensive to watch Wayne LaPierre on Hannity and Colmes make the statement that pilots should be armed but 'it is probably not a good idea for citizens to be armed' on planes. He made this statement several times during this interview. How can the NRA proclaim to fight for the right of self defense and the Bill of Rights when you are obviously afraid to make bold statements in defense of those rights? The government thinks that it is okay to make victims of airline passengers and deny pilots a second chance to save the aircraft, but it is okay to have the military shoot the plane down. How can the NRA and any clear-thinking airline passenger possibly agree with this?? I think it is time for bold new leadership to lead the NRA, and Mr. LePierre is not it! === I also support various pro-gun organizations at the national, state and local level, call/email/write my reps (even though it is a waste of time with the Dem's in office and the Republican in-name-only Mark Foley that represents my district) and I complain to other groups like AARP on their anti-gun stance. I send money to other state groups like Oregon and Chicago to help them fight there, hoping that their win will be our gain. I'm doin' all I can do to fight for my rights from the 'ballot box'. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. I am also disappointed with the apathy of most Americans and their willingness to give up our rights.
View Quote
FL_BOY, I wanted to address why LaPierre didn't answer about civilians carrying concealed on aircraft. He never said that people should not carry guns on aircraft... He just ducked the question and referred back to the topic at hand, that pilots should have a last ditch means of protecting the aircraft. Did you notice how the liberal guy kept asking very pointedly "Mr. LaPierre, should civilians carry guns on aircraft?"? It was obviously a ploy that the interviewer had prepared some belittling answer to, and LaPierre smartly avoided the trap. The Lib telegaphed his intentions all over the place; his body language and smirk as he goaded him repeatedly about civilians and guns on aircraft told that he was very prepared for the NRA spokesman to blurt "hell yeah, civvi's should have guns on planes!", and was all set to rip him a new one if he did. LaPierre, in my eyes, was fighting smart. Kinda like Tom Selleck on Rosie...she flipped out and he just kept his cool. She ended up looking like an ass. Same thing here.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 5:39:41 PM EDT
LaPierre outsmarted Commie again , to be honest I wouldn't trust most civilians to have guns on an airplane . Remember most pilots are vets and also former officers with more than a passing knowledge of firearms training . How many people you know would be able to calculate their field of fire in an enclosed space ? Or would think to load their weapon with prefrangible ammo before the flight .
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 5:45:07 PM EDT
What I am tired of.....is people feeding the..........[:K][frag]
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 7:51:31 PM EDT
I think terrorists would almost stop hijacking planes entirely if they knew they were looking at an armed crew along with God knows how many armed passangers. Terrorists would find other avenues to persue. Look at what happened to the flight that crashed in Pennsylvania with only unarmed resistance--mission failure. These jackoffs put alot of capital into their little ploys. I am sure that they would want their mission to go flawlessly. Onboard firearms are just too massive a variable.
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 8:43:40 PM EDT
I would like to see somebody on the plane armed,but in my way of thinking it would be short barreled riot guns with #8 load. No stray shots tearing up the plane,up close and personal the #8 shot would get the job done. No pistol or rifle rounds allowed,just would make you think about taking a box-knife to a gun fight. Bob [50]
Link Posted: 5/22/2002 10:26:13 PM EDT
First off, thanks for the posts, fellas. And I'm glad that no one was offended. I guess I was a bit upset. As for the BRC, I do admit that I don't know excactly what went into organizing this event. I didn't mean to minimize the efforts that went into this event. And I do hope that this even is hugely successful and that it garners some positive press (even though the media is incredibly anti-gun and "controlled"). At any rate, I guess this is my "I can't take it anymore, and I need to vent post." I think I need to go to the range, now....LOL.
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