Posted: 4/4/2011 1:00:32 AM EDT
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So there are so many topics related to class 3 and NFA guns it makes my head hurt reading all of it.
Can someone explain to me what the deal is? I know you have to trade with a class 3 through the NFA registry, buy a tax stamp, and register the firearm, along with all the other laws and regulations the ATF lists, but what kind of guns does that limit the individual to? From what I read anything made after 1986 is out for civilians? So we are all forced to pay the price of an old NFA weapon that's been shot to death? I personally want something newer to own and never trade, but I take it that's out? |
| You can still get brand new Suppressors, AOW's, Destructive Devices, Short Barrel Rifles, Short Barrel Shotguns. Only Machine Guns that are transferable and legal for us civilians are made before 1986. Since machine guns were banned and everyone wants them and there is a limited amount of them, well the prices have gone up a lot over the years, it's basic supply and demand. There are still mint condition machine guns for sale, just they are collectibles since they are rare and cost more. |
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So i could find an NFA older M16 type burst weapon and outfit the hell out of it legally to upgrade it to today's standards? So long as its registered.
Works for me. Just wish you could still buy them new off the shelf at a class 3 dealer direct from the factory. Silly laws, gun's are for everyone :-) |
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Quoted: Yes, the only part you need to keep original on a registered reciever M16 is the reciever itself.So i could find an NFA older M16 type burst weapon and outfit the hell out of it legally to upgrade it to today's standards? So long as its registered. Works for me. Just wish you could still buy them new off the shelf at a class 3 dealer direct from the factory. Silly laws, gun's are for everyone :-) |
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So i could find an NFA older M16 type burst weapon and outfit the hell out of it legally to upgrade it to today's standards? So long as its registered. Works for me. Just wish you could still buy them new off the shelf at a class 3 dealer direct from the factory. Silly laws, gun's are for everyone :-) If you buy a transferable M16, you are actually paying for the lower. You can put any upper on it including SBR uppers, because, the NFA lower is the "host gun." Suppressors are a separate Tax Stamp. |
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You don't necessarily have to go through a class 3 dealer, depending on the item. You can make a non-full auto NFA item yourself after receiving an approved Form 1 from ATF. I did my short barreled rifle this way. And if the NFA item is a curio/relic and you have a C&R license, it can be sent directly to you after ATF approves the transfer. |
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There are around 180,000 transferable machine guns out there. Prices start at around $3000 and go up from there. I have a friend who is a Class 3 dealer and he says his cost on a new full auto/burst is only a couple of hundred more than a semi. We could be buying full auto for about $1100-1300 if not for the Hughes Amendment. |
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There are around 180,000 transferable machine guns out there. Prices start at around $3000 and go up from there. I have a friend who is a Class 3 dealer and he says his cost on a new full auto/burst is only a couple of hundred more than a semi. We could be buying full auto for about $1100-1300 if not for the Hughes Amendment. Imagine if the 1968 "sporting clause" ban and the Hughes Amendment were gone. Full auto AK's for $300. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: There are around 180,000 transferable machine guns out there. Prices start at around $3000 and go up from there. I have a friend who is a Class 3 dealer and he says his cost on a new full auto/burst is only a couple of hundred more than a semi. We could be buying full auto for about $1100-1300 if not for the Hughes Amendment. Imagine if the 1968 "sporting clause" ban and the Hughes Amendment were gone. Full auto AK's for $300. and ammo prices range maintenance fees would skyrocket ETA: dont get me wrong i'm all for repealing those laws. My concern is people and handling of something fully automatics. incidents like the below video and that poor kid that was shot by the micro uzi.  |
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There are around 180,000 transferable machine guns out there. Prices start at around $3000 and go up from there. I have a friend who is a Class 3 dealer and he says his cost on a new full auto/burst is only a couple of hundred more than a semi. We could be buying full auto for about $1100-1300 if not for the Hughes Amendment. Depending on the manufacturer they can be less than the semi's. |
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Quoted:
So there are so many topics related to class 3 and NFA guns it makes my head hurt reading all of it. Can someone explain to me what the deal is? I know you have to trade with a class 3 through the NFA registry, buy a tax stamp, and register the firearm, along with all the other laws and regulations the ATF lists, but what kind of guns does that limit the individual to? From what I read anything made after 1986 is out for civilians? So we are all forced to pay the price of an old NFA weapon that's been shot to death? I personally want something newer to own and never trade, but I take it that's out? Let's clarify a few things in your post for you. You as a non NFA Dealer do not get a "Class III" license. Class III refers to the NFA Dealer's Special Occupational Tax (SOT). A Class III is a Dealer whereas a Class II is a manufaturer. There are other classes but most kikely you will deal with one of these two. As an individual you pay an excise tax and have the NFA item registered to you or your trust or your business. The cut off for registering transferable machine guns was 5/19/1986. You cannot under no circumstances own any machinegun that was not registered prior to that date. |
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There are around 180,000 transferable machine guns out there. Prices start at around $3000 and go up from there. I have a friend who is a Class 3 dealer and he says his cost on a new full auto/burst is only a couple of hundred more than a semi. We could be buying full auto for about $1100-1300 if not for the Hughes Amendment. Imagine if the 1968 "sporting clause" ban and the Hughes Amendment were gone. Full auto AK's for $300. and ammo prices range maintenance fees would skyrocket ETA: dont get me wrong i'm all for repealing those laws. My concern is people and handling of something fully automatics. incidents like the below video and that poor kid that was shot by the micro uzi. I think as long as NFA was still in place it wouldn't be THAT bad. |
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From what I read anything made after 1986 is out for civilians? Not all civilians. LEO get to use them, but I believe they are owned by their department. So we are all forced to pay the price of an old NFA weapon that's been shot to death?
At this point in time, yes. At the same time, as some have mentioned, you can pretty much mount any upper you want on it. |
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There are around 180,000 transferable machine guns out there. Prices start at around $3000 and go up from there. I have a friend who is a Class 3 dealer and he says his cost on a new full auto/burst is only a couple of hundred more than a semi. We could be buying full auto for about $1100-1300 if not for the Hughes Amendment. Depending on the manufacturer they can be less than the semi's. Not doubting you, but could you give an example? |
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Since the Second Amendment has been incorporated as an individual right, the taxes imposed by the NFA are now unconstitutional poll taxes; essentially, they're a tax on our ability to exercise a right. Additionally, the sporting purposes clause of the '68 GCA is unconstitutional since neither the wording, intent, nor the jurisprudence of the second amendment have anything to do with sport.
It's going to take time and money to push the issues through the courts and get it overturned. If you ever want to walk into Academy and buy a lightning link for $15, start donating to the NRAILA, Heller Foundation, and other gun rights groups. |
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The cut off for registering transferable machine guns was 5/19/1986. You cannot under no circumstances own any machinegun that was not registered prior to that date. Had to be MADE by that date. Many guns were registered after that date. You're right. |
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All i can say is.. It's pretty sorry.
There are many of us who have perfectly good reasons to desire shooting an automatic or burst weapon, and the process of getting one in this day and age is just a joke. Who has 15k lying around to pick up am M-16 receiver anyway. I would go to my local gun shop right now, and outfit every gun I have that's automatic capable if the law didn't stand. After all, we have to go through background checks anyway. I think if some idiot applies they will weed it out in the long run. Here's looking to the future, and new laws that let us save some money! After I saw the prices on the M-16 receivers, i pretty much abandoned the thought of owing one. Wish I could find something affordable that's automatic, and practical as well. |
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All i can say is.. It's pretty sorry. There are many of us who have perfectly good reasons to desire shooting an automatic or burst weapon, and the process of getting one in this day and age is just a joke. Who has 15k lying around to pick up am M-16 receiver anyway. I would go to my local gun shop right now, and outfit every gun I have that's automatic capable if the law didn't stand. After all, we have to go through background checks anyway. I think if some idiot applies they will weed it out in the long run. Here's looking to the future, and new laws that let us save some money! After I saw the prices on the M-16 receivers, i pretty much abandoned the thought of owing one. Wish I could find something affordable that's automatic, and practical as well. I can appreciate your frustration but if it's any consolation, I can tell you from experience mg's are way over rated. I have a full auto lower that I have taken to the range 3 times in the last 2.5 years. In the same timeframe I have taken my SBR to the range 100 times. The three trips to the range with the mg were at the request of my daughter and her college friends, a customer and my GF. IOW give someone else the experience of a mag dump(s). It get's old shooting FA and from a tactical training perspective I would rate them one step over useless. Like a boat, the best MG is OP. |