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Posted: 4/30/2002 11:34:26 AM EDT
On CNN (commie news network) They are talking about an apartment complex in NY that is going to tell you that you can not smoke in you apartment. What do you think?
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 11:39:18 AM EDT
if it's private property, the owner can pretty much dictate his terms.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 11:42:36 AM EDT
Good for them. I lived in an apartment next to a smoker and had the stinking shit coming through the walls. I had to run multiple air cleaners all the time just to live there. Got a brand new house now and breathe just fine. Kudos to the apartment owner!! Bill3508
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 11:43:09 AM EDT
I stand corrected, these are condos that you buy.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 11:43:39 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 11:48:26 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ar10er: I stand corrected, these are condos that you buy.
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i'd like to say that at the moment the purchasers name appears on the title anything goes, but many subdivisions have covenants that limit your rights. my guess is when you sign the contract you give up some of your rights.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 11:50:13 AM EDT
Originally Posted By bill3508: Good for them. I lived in an apartment next to a smoker and had the stinking shit coming through the walls. I had to run multiple air cleaners all the time just to live there. Got a brand new house now and breathe just fine. Kudos to the apartment owner!! Bill3508
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Do you still feel this way even if the are purchasing it?
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 11:52:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By lurker:
Originally Posted By ar10er: I stand corrected, these are condos that you buy.
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i'd like to say that at the moment the purchasers name appears on the title anything goes, but many subdivisions have covenants that limit your rights. my guess is when you sign the contract you give up some of your rights.
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How about cars or a piece of property you buy in the woods? Where do you stop?
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 11:58:26 AM EDT
It all depends what is written into the lease/condo agreement that you sign. If you sign it, you have to abide by it. If you don't want to abide by it, rent/buy elsewhere. It's no different from not being able to have pets, erect outside antennas, or the extreme "adult" communities who don't allow kids.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:12:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ar10er:
Originally Posted By lurker:
Originally Posted By ar10er: I stand corrected, these are condos that you buy.
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i'd like to say that at the moment the purchasers name appears on the title anything goes, but many subdivisions have covenants that limit your rights. my guess is when you sign the contract you give up some of your rights.
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How about cars or a piece of property you buy in the woods? Where do you stop?
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i stop by reading everything i sign, and if i cant live with the terms, i walk away. life in human society is a balancing act, my rights against the rights of the rest of the world. my rights are paramount to me, but there have been times when i put the well-being of others above my own. i dont see a single objective rule about where to draw the line, so i have to handle it on a case-by-case basis. how much does it cost, and who must pay the price?
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:18:14 PM EDT
These condos are still private property if the owners was to put this condition in his lease/agreement then good for him. It decreases upkeep on the condo and will allow for quicker resale. As far as second hand smoke being a joke, that just bs. If you are a non-smoker who has lived next to someone for a substantial amount of time you know the problems that come of it. I could barely go in my neighbors apartment, and his paint and blinds had turned grey due to the ash. That neighbor now has lung cancer by the way, hes only 40, and several other distant family members of mine have cancer or have died from it. Oh, also the neighbors dog who is trapped in the apartment day after day has some mysterious illness and can barely run without becoming quickly exhausted. Interesting isnt it. Bill3508
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:22:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ar10er:
Originally Posted By lurker:
Originally Posted By ar10er: I stand corrected, these are condos that you buy.
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i'd like to say that at the moment the purchasers name appears on the title anything goes, but many subdivisions have covenants that limit your rights. my guess is when you sign the contract you give up some of your rights.
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How about cars or a piece of property you buy in the woods? Where do you stop?
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It's the same as zoning, only your agreement is with your fellow neighborhood property owners instead of the city/county/state. Think of it as an easement. You agreed to it when you bought the place, you factored it into the value. If you didn't like it, you shouldn't have bought it. This is why I rejected buying a really sweet chunk of land a few years ago -- the CC&R's on it would have prevented me from clearing any of it out, aside from one limited house site. The rest would have to lie undisturbed. So, after long and careful consideration, I skipped it -- it didn't suit what I wanted. Same thing here. If you want to smoke in your condo, buy in a different building.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:24:09 PM EDT
I seem to recall a few months ago we were all up in arms about a former marine that was told he couldnt have a flag pole in his yard in Florida. How is this any different than that other than there are some people who are rabid anti-smokers? Sounds like an all for freedom as long as it isnt offending me situation going on here.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:30:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2002 12:31:47 PM EDT by Jarhead_22]
It's a tough call to make. Are they uptight, prickly busybodies, or are they targeting a niche market? As long as it's up front and well-known before the purchase agreement is signed, I guess you can't really complain. I can't build a giant purple dinosaur in my front yard out of old wrecked cars, but I knew there were CC&Rs in my neighborhood before I bought. Not for nothing, but I saw on the news the other day that a lot of Texas restaurants are doing away with smoking sections. In the absence of laws to that effect, I would guess that they are responding to pressure from their customer base.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:31:16 PM EDT
I think it's ok. If you're stinking up your air, that's fine, but in an apartment, unless you can keep your stink from getting into my apartment, then you're in the wrong. When a neighbor's carcinogenic smoke is coming into my apartment, his right to smoke there stops. If it doesn't, more power to him. Imagine if someone ran a small time butchering operation next to you, and left meat out to rot, and your apartment started stinking. You can do what you want to, as long as it does not impact anyone else. M@
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:35:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By garheadjr: I seem to recall a few months ago we were all up in arms about a former marine that was told he couldnt have a flag pole in his yard in Florida. How is this any different than that other than there are some people who are rabid anti-smokers? Sounds like an all for freedom as long as it isnt offending me situation going on here.
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us 'rabid anti smoking' people are just trying to preserve our quality of air. If you smoke, that's all fine and dandy. You smoke in your house/apartment, that's all fine and dandy. You're within your rights. However, when your smoke comes into my apartment and pollutes my air, you are infringing MY rights, thus you are in the wrong. That's the logic. I have a right to life, which also would mean clean air. Thus, you do not have the right to make me breathe your smoke. M@
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:36:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By garheadjr: I seem to recall a few months ago we were all up in arms about a former marine that was told he couldnt have a flag pole in his yard in Florida. How is this any different than that other than there are some people who are rabid anti-smokers? Sounds like an all for freedom as long as it isnt offending me situation going on here.
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Someone who gets it!!! I don't drink, but I am soooooo against "sobriety checks" it's not funny. It is about freedom. You don't like smoking, get it outlawed, but didn't we try that with booze?
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:43:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ar10er:
Originally Posted By garheadjr: I seem to recall a few months ago we were all up in arms about a former marine that was told he couldnt have a flag pole in his yard in Florida. How is this any different than that other than there are some people who are rabid anti-smokers? Sounds like an all for freedom as long as it isnt offending me situation going on here.
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Someone who gets it!!! I don't drink, but I am soooooo against "sobriety checks" it's not funny. It is about freedom. You don't like smoking, get it outlawed, but didn't we try that with booze?
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The flagpole thing was about freedom of expression. The smoking issue is about my right to breathe clean air. At least in my own home. If your smoking pollutes the air in my apartment, then you're infringing my rights. It's as simple as that.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 12:43:37 PM EDT
Granted, my smoke should not infilterate your residence as you have the same freedoms as I, I just found it odd that we were all in agreement about the flagpole on a private residence but not about smoking. Cracking a window will draw the some out and not let it seep into your apartment. I am pretty sure we were all in agreement about the policy in some suburbs where you had to build all new homes to be handicap accessible too. It just seems to naturaly fall into the same catagory. By the way, dont take "rabid anti-smoker" as a bad thing, I am rabidly pro-gun and I dont see it as an insult, just that I am fanatical about it.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 1:01:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2002 1:12:30 PM EDT by M1QJ]
Originally Posted By garheadjr: Granted, my smoke should not infilterate your residence as you have the same freedoms as I, I just found it odd that we were all in agreement about the flagpole on a private residence but not about smoking. Cracking a window will draw the some out and not let it seep into your apartment. I am pretty sure we were all in agreement about the policy in some suburbs where you had to build all new homes to be handicap accessible too. It just seems to naturaly fall into the same catagory. By the way, dont take "rabid anti-smoker" as a bad thing, I am rabidly pro-gun and I dont see it as an insult, just that I am fanatical about it.
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Ahh, I wouldn't take 'rabid anti smoker' as bad. I smoke occasionally.. but just couldn't do it habitually. I have a stomach problem that causes me some pretty bad heartburn, and often times, cigarette smoke irritates it. Like I mentioned, you have the right to do what you want to, but I disagree about me having to open a window to dispel your smoke in my home. That's making me have to go out of my way to avoid something that you're responsible for. Thus, it's an infringement on my rights. To me, that's the same thing as telling me to drive on the side of the road to avoid drunk drivers. I shouldn't have to. The flagpole thing is entirely different. A flagpole in the guy's yard in no way infringes anyone else's rights.
Link Posted: 4/30/2002 2:15:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2002 2:44:56 PM EDT by guardian855]
Originally Posted By M1QJ: The flagpole thing is entirely different. A flagpole in the guy's yard in no way infringes anyone else's rights.
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I don't know enough about the flagpole issue, but did he know that the rules forbade putting up a flagpole? I heard that it wasn't strictly forbidden by the Homeowner's Assoc. and that they are using a vague rule to try to have him take it down. If they clearly and without a doubt told him that he could not put up a flagpole in his front yard then he shouldn't be able to do it, he agreed to it when he moved in. If he wanted to raise a flagpole, he should not have moved in. Now if they told him no structures in the front yard, which is what I think they did, then a flagpole is not a structure and therefore since they didn't tell him he couldn't do it, he should be able too. Before I get flamed, I am a proud American and I serve in the Guard so I like our flag. Also please note, I personally do not like Homeowner's Assoc. I think they nitpick too much and infringe on my rights. Therefore I don't live in a neighborhood with a Homeowner's Assoc.
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