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Posted: 9/13/2010 7:20:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 7:29:37 AM EDT by The_Macallan]

And by extremists he means, of course - US!

Americans who are opposed to him building a Mosque over the dust of Americans murdered in the name of Islam are now "extremists" who are equivalent to Al Qaeda.

Yep. This ASSHOLE is not a "moderate" Muslim - he is an antagonist.

He doesn't call on Muslims to unite against violent extremists in his own religion.

No, he calls on Muslims to unite against US Americans who believe he is a tone-deaf instigator who is denigrating the memories of those killed on 9-11.

Fuck this shitbag!



Saying America has let extremists "hijack the agenda," the imam behind a controversial proposal to place an Islamic community center and mosque near Manhattan's ground zero said Monday he wants to create a platform where the voice of moderate Muslims can be amplified.
"This is an opportunity that we must capitalize on, so those who teach moderation will have a megahorn," Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf told the Council on Foreign Relations.

"We come together at a time of great crisis and danger," he said. "What began as a dispute over a community center in lower Manhattan has spawned and grown into a much larger controversy about the relationship between my beloved religion and my beloved country, between Islam and America.

"The events of the past few weeks have really saddened me to my very core," he said. "I regret that some have misunderstood our intentions. I'm deeply distressed that in this heated political season, some have exploited this issue for their own agendas."

.

.

.
"The real battlefront, the real battle we must wage together today, is not between Muslims and non-Muslims, but it is between moderates of all faith traditions against the extremists of all the faith traditions.
.
.
.




Hey asshole - what other religion has its HIGHEST LEADERS calling for holy wars and extermination of entire populations!??

ONLY the MUSLIM RELIGION has so many of its highest religious leaders calling for war, murder, genocide, death and destruction.

ONLY the Muslims.


THAT is the problem with Islam - Even its so-called "moderates" can't correctly identify that they have a HUGE problem with murderous violent leaders in THEIR OWN religion.

NO OTHER RELIGION IN THE WORLD has followings like Al Qaeda, Hamas, Ayatollah Khameni, and on and on.











Link Posted: 9/13/2010 7:24:37 AM EDT
Isn't this the same clown who was making vieled threats of terrorism, if it wasn't allowed to be built?
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 7:28:04 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Jarhead08:
Isn't this the same clown who was making vieled threats of terrorism, if it wasn't allowed to be built?

Yep.

He's also the one who said USA was an "accessory" to 9-11 and that we "created" Osama Bin Laden.

He's also partners with another Muslim on this GZ Mosque who said 9-11 was an "inside job" and that Al Qaeda's only involvement was being used by the US as a patsy.



Link Posted: 9/13/2010 7:31:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 7:37:31 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 7:39:11 AM EDT by cluster]
stop spreading hate..

i learned right here that islam loves us..

and just cause overthis last week just about everyone of them said they would kill us.... that does not mean they are violent..

all you have to do to keep islam from turning violent is do and accept what they say is so,.,.

see how simple that is.. ?




now go and stop spreading hate..



Link Posted: 9/13/2010 8:13:31 AM EDT
And I was actually looking for some good news
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 8:27:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 8:29:49 AM EDT by DfnsTrnr]
And no one saw this coming?
They had a very clear picture painted this past weekend as to how far they can continue to push the line, all the while our .gov (and an amazingly large amount of our populous) continues the appeasement.


ETA: crap - seems I let the membership lapse
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 8:33:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 8:34:04 AM EDT by Shane333]
Originally Posted By RangeWarrior:


"Someone towed my car bomb!!!"

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 8:49:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Maryland_Shooter:
And I was actually looking for some good news


Me too. When i read the thread title, i was like "Fucking finally"



I took the bait.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 8:51:07 AM EDT
"Islam loves me
This I know.
Because ****_*
Told Me So."
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 8:53:28 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 9:04:21 AM EDT

in before the mosque defenders agree with the imam

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 9:12:08 AM EDT
It's all been ruse intended to polarize people and get the moderate Muslims off the bench.

He's using the Victory Mosque as a publicity stunt. He's doing it to specifically to stir up the emotions of patriotic Americans who are tired of rolling over for Islam. These reactions are forcing moderate Muslims to pick their side.

Crafty motherfucker. He's pretty much doing exactly what the Koran tells them to do when they move to a new country. Deal with those who will not submit first and then figure out to do with the compliant ones later.

This guy is a dangerous motherfucker.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 9:25:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
He's doing it to specifically to stir up the emotions of patriotic Americans who are tired of rolling over for Islam.


He's succeeding. Probably far better than he imagined.


This guy is a dangerous motherfucker.


Yes, he is. And it's not just Americans he's putting in danger. If his antics help elect a hardline, pro war government, both here and around the world, he's endangering everyone.

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 1:41:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It's all been ruse intended to polarize people and get the moderate Muslims off the bench.

He's using the Victory Mosque as a publicity stunt. He's doing it to specifically to stir up the emotions of patriotic Americans who are tired of rolling over for Islam. These reactions are forcing moderate Muslims to pick their side.

Crafty motherfucker. He's pretty much doing exactly what the Koran tells them to do when they move to a new country. Deal with those who will not submit first and then figure out to do with the compliant ones later.

This guy is a dangerous motherfucker.

Yep.

This asshole is clearly trying to stir up animosity and a persecution-complex among Muslims in America.

He's trying to hide behind "moderate Muslims" while he attacks American citizens who are simply opposed to his plan to build an "ISLAMIC" Center (so much for his bullshit about being an inter-faith center) on the dust of thousands of Americans who were killed by ISLAMIC extremists.

What this shitbag Imam is doing is absolutely no different than what the Mideast Arabs do in stirring up animosity and anger among the Palestinians against Israel.


Insidious, lowlife, shitstirring motherfucker!

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 1:59:49 PM EDT
I think I might now understand why this Imam chose build his mosque in such a controversial spot.

He wants the media attention.... he wants the whole country's attention... focused on his mosque. If it is true, as he says, that he wants it to serve as "a megaphone for Moderate Islam", it might make sense; creating such controversy might be the only way he is ever heard. The Radicals get all the press... it is their barbaric acts that get all the play on the networks, not moderate Islam.

If this is truly why he's building this mosque, then he's trying to use the pain surrounding 9-11 to get media attention for his message... to actually get covered.

I think that is incredibly wrong. It's the wrong way to go about it, and certainly counter-productive in the end. His message will get washed out by the anger caused by his insensitivity.


(Disclaimer: This assessment is based on taking his statements at face value. I can't know for certain what the Imam's true motivation is.)
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:04:46 PM EDT
WW III will lead to all religions being illegal and pushed underground.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:11:32 PM EDT
I think he just invited everyone to participate in jihad against us.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:12:26 PM EDT
Islam is winning.


Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:13:26 PM EDT
At least they don't have 155mm shit to string together along roadsides here.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:15:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By flyfishnepa:

in before the mosque defenders agree with the imam


So Islam is the only religeon that has extremists...

The fact is, the man IS right.

Granted, his faith's extremists are the most violent at present - but then again, he said ALL faiths, and ALL includes... Islam...

Of course, to the 'All Muslims are the Enemy' crowd, *all* doesn't mean *all*....
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:17:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It's all been ruse intended to polarize people and get the moderate Muslims off the bench.

He's using the Victory Mosque as a publicity stunt. He's doing it to specifically to stir up the emotions of patriotic Americans who are tired of rolling over for Islam. These reactions are forcing moderate Muslims to pick their side.

Crafty motherfucker. He's pretty much doing exactly what the Koran tells them to do when they move to a new country. Deal with those who will not submit first and then figure out to do with the compliant ones later.

This guy is a dangerous motherfucker.

Yep.

This asshole is clearly trying to stir up animosity and a persecution-complex among Muslims in America.

He's trying to hide behind "moderate Muslims" while he attacks American citizens who are simply opposed to his plan to build an "ISLAMIC" Center (so much for his bullshit about being an inter-faith center) on the dust of thousands of Americans who were killed by ISLAMIC extremists.

What this shitbag Imam is doing is absolutely no different than what the Mideast Arabs do in stirring up animosity and anger among the Palestinians against Israel.


Insidious, lowlife, shitstirring motherfucker!


Uh, no...

What he's doing is perfectly appropriate, and not meant to stir up shit...

Queda may claim Islam as their inspiration, but that doesn't make all Muslims responsible for - much less aligned with - the actions of Al Queda...

Like it or not, we need Muslim support in the war, this isn't 1940 and we don't have the luxury of letting the common fools 'get mad' & do stupid shit (like we did to japanese-Americans in the 40s) as a means of trying to get support for the war effort...
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:18:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 2:22:27 PM EDT by Dave_A]

Originally Posted By TexasDoubleTap:
WW III will lead to all religions being illegal and pushed underground.

WWIII won't happen any time soon...

Insufficient bad-guys...

If the news was talking about a Chinese-Russian alliance with designs on Eurasian-domination... Then we could credibly talk about WWIII... The even more idiotic view that Hamas, Fatah, Hezbollah, and Al Queda are all on the same team, fighting the same war... Still doesn't cut it...

A bunch of nut-balls who think their dear-leader should be King of Saudi does NOT make a credible threat of WWIII...

They don't have the numbers to take over the Muslim world (where most of the governments want them dead) much less do anything more than harass us here in the West, trying to force us to leave the Middle East...

The 'Islam vs the World' shit is pure idiocy...
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:18:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By flyfishnepa:

in before the mosque defenders agree with the imam


So Islam is the only religeon that has extremists...

The fact is, the man IS right.

Granted, his faith's extremists are the most violent at present - but then again, he said ALL faiths, and ALL includes... Islam...

Of course, to the 'All Muslims are the Enemy' crowd, *all* doesn't mean *all*....



see, i made it
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:22:17 PM EDT
Third world countries aren't as dependant on things like electricity, water, roads, phones, computers, etc, etc. All are easy targets, that would cause absolute chaos.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:22:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 2:23:53 PM EDT by shooter69]
If he's looking for extremists to unite against, perhaps Rauf can start with his partner Faiz Khan who believes 9-11 was an inside job:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/09/13/associate-nyc-mosque-imam-calls-attacks-inside-job/

Birds of a feather flock together.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:23:25 PM EDT
He said to go against all extremists... he didn't exclude muslims.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:28:05 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:32:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Sixpack595:
He said to go against all extremists... he didn't exclude muslims.


I'll jump on board when he starts calling them out by name rather than making a vague inclusion.

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:35:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 2:40:59 PM EDT by sixnine]
Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By TexasDoubleTap:
WW III will lead to all religions being illegal and pushed underground.

WWIII won't happen any time soon...

Insufficient bad-guys...

If the news was talking about a Chinese-Russian alliance with designs on Eurasian-domination... Then we could credibly talk about WWIII... The even more idiotic view that Hamas, Fatah, Hezbollah, and Al Queda are all on the same team, fighting the same war... Still doesn't cut it...

A bunch of nut-balls who think their dear-leader should be King of Saudi does NOT make a credible threat of WWIII...

They don't have the numbers to take over the Muslim world (where most of the governments want them dead) much less do anything more than harass us here in the West, trying to force us to leave the Middle East...

The 'Islam vs the World' shit is pure idiocy...


It is idiocy. As soon as they stop fucking with everybody they can live peacefully, like the rest of us. Face it, the number one cause of pain, hate, and discontent on this planet is islam.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 2:37:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 2:38:26 PM EDT by fxntime]
Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By flyfishnepa:

in before the mosque defenders agree with the imam


So Islam is the only religeon that has extremists...

The fact is, the man IS right.

Granted, his faith's extremists are the most violent at present - but then again, he said ALL faiths, and ALL includes... Islam...

Of course, to the 'All Muslims are the Enemy' crowd, *all* doesn't mean *all*....


Yep, pretty much DaveA, Islam does have the VAST majority of extremists. I'd hazard a guess that every other religions nutjobs added together doesn't even come close to the number of radical Muslims.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 3:42:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 3:44:24 PM EDT by The_Macallan]

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It's all been ruse intended to polarize people and get the moderate Muslims off the bench.

He's using the Victory Mosque as a publicity stunt. He's doing it to specifically to stir up the emotions of patriotic Americans who are tired of rolling over for Islam. These reactions are forcing moderate Muslims to pick their side.

Crafty motherfucker. He's pretty much doing exactly what the Koran tells them to do when they move to a new country. Deal with those who will not submit first and then figure out to do with the compliant ones later.

This guy is a dangerous motherfucker.

Yep.

This asshole is clearly trying to stir up animosity and a persecution-complex among Muslims in America.

He's trying to hide behind "moderate Muslims" while he attacks American citizens who are simply opposed to his plan to build an "ISLAMIC" Center (so much for his bullshit about being an inter-faith center) on the dust of thousands of Americans who were killed by ISLAMIC extremists.

What this shitbag Imam is doing is absolutely no different than what the Mideast Arabs do in stirring up animosity and anger among the Palestinians against Israel.


Insidious, lowlife, shitstirring motherfucker!






Uh, no...

What he's doing is perfectly appropriate, and not meant to stir up shit...

Queda may claim Islam as their inspiration, but that doesn't make all Muslims responsible for - much less aligned with - the actions of Al Queda...

Like it or not, we need Muslim support in the war, this isn't 1940 and we don't have the luxury of letting the common fools 'get mad' & do stupid shit (like we did to japanese-Americans in the 40s) as a means of trying to get support for the war effort...

Who are the "extremists in all faith traditions" - today - who are actively engaged in bombing innocent people on a daily basis in the name of their religion?

Who are the "extremists in all faith traditions" who celebrated on 9-11 as a great religious victory for them?

Who are the highest religious leaders "in all faith traditions" who are - today - openly and continuously calling for the extermination of an entire people in the name of their religion?

Are they Mormon extremists?

Maybe it's Jewish or Buddhist extremists?

Is it Catholic extremists?

Or maybe Hindi or Lutheran extremists?

Or maybe... Muslim extremists?

There is only one right answer there - and it's Muslim extremists.

So tell me just who in the holy hell of FUCK is that asshole "Imam" talking about when he equivocates Terry Jones with Osama Bin Laden in lumping EVERYONE who opposes his Islamo-centric mosque being placed over the dust of thousands of Americans killed in the name of HIS religion as all being "extremists in all faith traditions"!?

Who are the "extremists in all faith traditions" that we need to be so concerned about? Those who peacefully protest against his plans by burning a book - or those who threaten to KILL Americans if we dare protest him by burning a book!?









Link Posted: 9/13/2010 3:51:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 3:53:24 PM EDT by Dave_A]

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Originally Posted By motown_steve:
It's all been ruse intended to polarize people and get the moderate Muslims off the bench.

He's using the Victory Mosque as a publicity stunt. He's doing it to specifically to stir up the emotions of patriotic Americans who are tired of rolling over for Islam. These reactions are forcing moderate Muslims to pick their side.

Crafty motherfucker. He's pretty much doing exactly what the Koran tells them to do when they move to a new country. Deal with those who will not submit first and then figure out to do with the compliant ones later.

This guy is a dangerous motherfucker.

Yep.

This asshole is clearly trying to stir up animosity and a persecution-complex among Muslims in America.

He's trying to hide behind "moderate Muslims" while he attacks American citizens who are simply opposed to his plan to build an "ISLAMIC" Center (so much for his bullshit about being an inter-faith center) on the dust of thousands of Americans who were killed by ISLAMIC extremists.

What this shitbag Imam is doing is absolutely no different than what the Mideast Arabs do in stirring up animosity and anger among the Palestinians against Israel.


Insidious, lowlife, shitstirring motherfucker!






Uh, no...

What he's doing is perfectly appropriate, and not meant to stir up shit...

Queda may claim Islam as their inspiration, but that doesn't make all Muslims responsible for - much less aligned with - the actions of Al Queda...

Like it or not, we need Muslim support in the war, this isn't 1940 and we don't have the luxury of letting the common fools 'get mad' & do stupid shit (like we did to japanese-Americans in the 40s) as a means of trying to get support for the war effort...

Who are the "extremists in all faith traditions" - today - who are actively engaged in bombing innocent people on a daily basis in the name of their religion?

Well, to start, the Islamic terrorists are 'extremists' of *a* faith tradition, so they fit under that label...

Our own domestic terrorists who claim Christiantity are just about as Christian as OBL is Muslim - they fit....



Who are the "extremists in all faith traditions" who celebrated on 9-11 as a great religious victory for them?

Again, AQ is one... So was Jerry Fallwell, Westboro, and so on - who celebrated 'God's Judgement against America for our sin'....

Who are the highest religious leaders "in all faith traditions" who are - today - openly and continuously calling for the extermination of an entire people in the name of their religion?

<snip>

Or maybe... Muslims?

There is only one right answer there - and it's Muslims.

It's Muslim radicals. Not all Muslims... Hell, not even the Muslim radicals we're fighting, but a separate group, in a war we are only peripherally involved in....

And since he did not say 'Except Muslims', he's calling out his own faith's nutballs too...


So tell me just who in the holy hell of FUCK is that asshole "Imam" talking about when he equivocates Terry Jones with Osama Bin Laden in lumping EVERYONE who opposes his Islamo-centric mosque being placed over the dust of thousands of Americans killed in the name of HIS religion as all being "extremists in all faith traditions"!?

Most of the anti-mosque sentiment is good old-fashioned secular bigotry, not religious extremism...

And Terry Jones, while not a violent extremist, would be fairly categorized as 'extreme' by most Christians (based on what he did in Germany)...

And once again, where did he exclude Islamic extremists from condemnation?


Who are the "extremists in all faith traditions" that we need to be so concerned about? Those who peacefully protest against his plans by burning a book - or those who threaten to KILL Americans if we dare protest him by burning a book!?

The 'oh-so-peaceful' fucktard is aiding the enemy in producing propaganda... He's scum. Period.

This Imam is not.

The Imam actually came out and condemned Islamic Extremisim (with an all-inclusive statement, but all-inclusive is ALL inclusive), and you condemn him for it?

WTF, over? Muslims like him, are what we need out there, vice the radical fuck-wits who want us dead...


Link Posted: 9/13/2010 3:56:35 PM EDT

Consider this analogy:


Catholics had a terrible fringe of pedophiles in their priesthood. Not most priests, not even a large portion of them.

But enough - too many - kind of like how there is a supposed "small fraction" of militant violent Muslim clerics and other leaders in the Islamic religion.

Now the ONLY way the Catholic Church could HONESTLY deal with the problem of pedophile priests would be first and foremost ADMITTING that the problem was in THEIR priesthood and THEIR leadership of the Church.

And that's exactly what happened - the Church was forced to take responsibility for what it had been allowing or covering up and it admitted exactly where the fault was - with their own leadership and their own priests and bishops.


Now can you imagine if some Catholic bishop had come out and said "well the only way to fix the problem in the Catholic Church is to confront pedophiles in all faith traditions"!?

There would be such an outcry of righteous outrage against ANYONE who came out and tried to deflect responsibility for Catholic pedophile priests by saying the only way to deal with the problem is to deal with the "pedophiles in all faith traditions"

Well that is exactly what this "Imam" is doing - deflecting responsibility for the most violent extremists in the world AWAY from Islam - which is basically just covering up the responsibility that Muslims have for their own murderous terrorist-spawning religious leaders around the world.





Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:01:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 4:02:11 PM EDT by Dave_A]

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Consider this analogy:


Catholics had a terrible fringe of pedophiles in their priesthood. Not most priests, not even a large portion of them.

But enough - too many - kind of like how there is a supposed "small fraction" of militant violent Muslim clerics and other leaders in the Islamic religion.

Now the ONLY way the Catholic Church could HONESTLY deal with the problem of pedophile priests would be first and foremost ADMITTING that the problem was in THEIR priesthood and THEIR leadership of the Church.

And that's exactly what happened - the Church was forced to take responsibility for what it had been allowing or covering up and it admitted exactly where the fault was - with their own leadership and their own priests and bishops.


Now can you imagine if some Catholic bishop had come out and said "well the only way to fix the problem in the Catholic Church is to confront pedophiles in all faith traditions"!?

There would be such an outcry of righteous outrage against ANYONE who came out and tried to deflect responsibility for Catholic pedophile priests by saying the only way to deal with the problem is to deal with the "pedophiles in all faith traditions"

Well that is exactly what this "Imam" is doing - deflecting responsibility for the most violent extremists in the world AWAY from Islam - which is basically just covering up the responsibility that Muslims have for their own murderous terrorist-spawning religious leaders around the world.



I'll take the all-inclusive condemnation as a start...

Hadji will just as soon kill that Imam, as he would you or me... And like it or not, that does factor into what is said.....

The better the war goes for us, the more free-speaking non-radical Muslims there will be.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:15:26 PM EDT
I really believe that once that place is built.."Shit" is going to get in the red zone quick like..

That is exactly what they want too..It will unite the "moderates" and terrorist against the infidels (us)..

Just saying...
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:24:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 4:32:11 PM EDT by The_Macallan]

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

I'll take the all-inclusive condemnation as a start...

Hadji will just as soon kill that Imam, as he would you or me... And like it or not, that does factor into what is said.....

The better the war goes for us, the more free-speaking non-radical Muslims there will be.

That's a counterproductive deflection and a cop-out.

His "start" was when he immediately came out after 9-11 and said US was an "accessory" to 9-11 - and then he partners on this Mosque with another Muslim who is a truther who actually says the only responsibility Al Qaeda had for 9-11 was being a "patsy" of the US.


Fact is - he will NEVER assign responsibility for nearly all worldwide terrorism today to where it rightfully belongs - within HIS OWN "faith tradition".

Instead he constantly diffuses responsibility AWAY from his faith tradition.

IOW, he's an obfuscator - so fuck him.








Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:03:21 PM EDT


"Two Iranian grand ayatollahs issued fatwas calling for the killing of those who insult the Koran, including anyone who burns the Islamic holy book, the state-run Fars news agency reported."


Were there any Catholic Cardinals or the Pope calling for the death of anyone who puts a crucifix in a cup of piss?

No.

There's no comparison between Islamic and Catholic "faith traditions".


Islam is the problem.

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:08:45 PM EDT
[badfish]But he was selected by BOOOSH![/badfish]
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:11:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By woodsie:
Originally Posted By Sixpack595:
He said to go against all extremists... he didn't exclude muslims.


I'll jump on board when he starts calling them out by name rather than making a vague inclusion.



He's already came out in support of the Iranian Revolution and Hamas.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:14:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Dave_A:
The Imam actually came out and condemned Islamic Extremisim (with an all-inclusive statement, but all-inclusive is ALL inclusive), and you condemn him for it?

WTF, over? Muslims like him, are what we need out there, vice the radical fuck-wits who want us dead...
[/span]


Good god Dave. His all-inclusive statement means what? He refused to condemn Hamas, and he talked about how great the Iranian Revolution was. Get a clue.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:15:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By The_Macallan:

Consider this analogy:


Catholics had a terrible fringe of pedophiles in their priesthood. Not most priests, not even a large portion of them.

But enough - too many - kind of like how there is a supposed "small fraction" of militant violent Muslim clerics and other leaders in the Islamic religion.

Now the ONLY way the Catholic Church could HONESTLY deal with the problem of pedophile priests would be first and foremost ADMITTING that the problem was in THEIR priesthood and THEIR leadership of the Church.

And that's exactly what happened - the Church was forced to take responsibility for what it had been allowing or covering up and it admitted exactly where the fault was - with their own leadership and their own priests and bishops.


Now can you imagine if some Catholic bishop had come out and said "well the only way to fix the problem in the Catholic Church is to confront pedophiles in all faith traditions"!?

There would be such an outcry of righteous outrage against ANYONE who came out and tried to deflect responsibility for Catholic pedophile priests by saying the only way to deal with the problem is to deal with the "pedophiles in all faith traditions"

Well that is exactly what this "Imam" is doing - deflecting responsibility for the most violent extremists in the world AWAY from Islam - which is basically just covering up the responsibility that Muslims have for their own murderous terrorist-spawning religious leaders around the world.



I'll take the all-inclusive condemnation as a start...

Hadji will just as soon kill that Imam, as he would you or me... And like it or not, that does factor into what is said.....

The better the war goes for us, the more free-speaking non-radical Muslims there will be.

So we're supposed to fight their fight for them too? What do they think their all living here on welfare? They already have the attitude and MO down.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:17:56 PM EDT


Imagine the look of surprise on my face.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:17:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MK262:

(Disclaimer: This assessment is based on taking his statements at face value. I can't know for certain what the Imam's true motivation is.)

Al Taqiyyah says you'll never know.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:24:37 PM EDT
Some quotes from One Imam, Multiple Messages by Ibn Warraq .

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/246268/real-imam-rauf-ibn-warraq

On Sept. 30, 2001, 60 Minutes host Ed Bradley asked him if he thought the U.S. deserved the 9/11 attacks. Rauf replied, “I wouldn’t say that the United States deserved what happened, but the United States’ policies were an accessory to the crime that happened. . . . We have been an accessory to a lot of — of innocent lives dying in the world. In fact, it — in the most direct sense, Osama bin Laden is made in the U.S.A.”


Rauf praised the 1979 revolution: “The Iranian Revolution of 1979 was in part to depose the shah, who had come to power in 1953 after a CIA-sponsored coup overthrew democratically-elected Prime Minister Mohammad Mossaddeq. And in part it was an opportunity to craft an Islamic state with a legitimate ruler according to Shia political theory. . . . After the revolution, Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini took the Shiite concept of the Rightly Guided Imam and created the idea of Vilayet-i-faqih, which means the rule of the jurisprudent. This institutionalizes the Islamic rule of law. The Council of Guardians serves to ensure these principles.”

Then Rauf claims that the elections in Iran were a slow-but-sure step towards democracy: “[Obama’s] administration understands that what is going on now in Iran is an attempt by the Iranian people to live up to their own ideals. Just as American democracy developed over many years, the United States recognizes that this election is part of the process of an evolving democracy in Iran.”


Here is Rauf’s advice to the president: “He should say his administration respects many of the guiding principles of the 1979 revolution — to establish a government that expresses the will of the people; a just government, based on the idea of Vilayet-i-faqih, that establishes the rule of law.”


When asked if he considered Hamas a terrorist organization, as it is labeled by the State Department, Rauf ducked, weaved, and sidestepped: “Look, I’m not a politician. The issue of terrorism is a very complex question. There was an attempt in the ’90s to have the U.N. define what terrorism is and say who was a terrorist. There was no ability to get agreement on that.” The interviewer persisted. Rauf, clearly flustered, replied, “I am a peace builder. I will not allow anybody to put me in a position where I am seen by any party in the world as an adversary or as an enemy.”

This unwillingness to criticize Hamas is hardly surprising, given his views on Israel. In a letter published on Nov. 27, 1977, in the New York Times, he wrote, “In a true peace it is impossible that a purely Jewish state of Palestine can endure. . . . In a true peace, Israel will, in our lifetimes, become one more Arab country, with a Jewish minority.”


Rauf wrote, “People asked me right after the 9/11 attacks as to why do movements with political agendas carry [Islamic] religious names? Why call it ‘Muslim Brotherhood’ or ‘Hezbollah (Party of Allah)’ or ‘Hamas’ or ‘Islamic Resistance Movement’? I answer them this — that the trend towards Islamic law and justice begins in religious movements, because secularism has failed to deliver what the Muslim wants, which is life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. . . . The only law that the Muslim needs exists already in the Koran and the Hadith.” A state based on the Koran and Hadith could only be called a theocracy.


Rauf writes, “The addition of Sharia law to ‘the law of the land’, in this case British law, complements, rather than undermines, existing legal frameworks. The Archbishop was right. It is time for Britain to integrate aspects of Islamic Law.”
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